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American Morning

Exploring the Role of Caves in Afghanistan

Aired November 15, 2001 - 09:14   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
PAULA ZAHN, CNN ANCHOR: With Taliban forces on the run from many of the major cities in Afghanistan, caves could become more important than cities as the U.S. tries to zero in on Osama bin Laden and the rest of the Al Qaeda leadership.

Leon Harrin -- Harris, that is, Leon is his first name. He's standing by at the big board with a look inside the caves of Afghanistan.

Good morning again, Leon.

LEON HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning. Paula, from you I will answer to anything. How's that?

Paula: Oh, good. Thank you very much.

HARRIS: Good morning folks. Joining us to talk some more about this cave warfare idea in Afghanistan, is Retired Air Force Major General Don Shepperd, who is our analyst. General Shepperd, thank you once again for joining us.

Now, we've been talking here off and on, quite a bit, about caves and the roles that they've been playing in here and the advantage that they lend the Taliban. Let's go to the animation and give you an idea of some of the areas that we believe the caves are in. You see here, we're zooming into Kandahar and the mountains just above Kandahar, the north of it. And as we get down closer here, you get a look at what the caves might actually look like on the inside. And, as you can tell, these a bit more sophisticated than the kind Yogi Bear might be using.

General, here you see the -- let's go to the first room you might find in one of these cave complexes. This would be where the troops would be sleeping, their quarters here. Probably just blankets on a dirt floor. But the question is, how big would an area like this be? And how many people could be inside?

MAJ. GEN. DON SHEPPERD (RET)., CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Some of these are as large as a room for hundreds of people under the ground. This is not your mother's cave, as we think of a cave. This is a fortified underground military bunker, and some of them are really big, Leon.

HARRIS: All right. All right, let's get a look at the next room in here. Now this is the ammunition storage room inside this cave complex. Stockpiles here might be built up to stage any guerrilla- style attacks. What about -- are there any, any particular wrists -- risks, rather, by having this ammunition here next to your sleeping quarters? Is that how most these are arranged, you think?

SHEPPERD: Yeah, rocket-propelled grenades, machine gun ammunition, personal ammunition, hand grenades, that type of thing. Of course, there's a risk sleeping next to it, but they can't keep it outside because it will be found and hit.

HARRIS: All right, and once again, how big is a room like this? How much could it hold, possibly?

SHEPPERD: It could hold as much as you want to put in there. It just depends on how big the cave is. But think of this as a -- you know, a couple, three or four living room style in this particular animation.

HARRIS: All right. (UNINTELLIGIBLE) Looking further into this cave complex here, we see a room that would be used to store fuel, perhaps, also perhaps weapons in there as well. And here is the -- the room that would be housing any ventilation systems that might be there. Now, wouldn't these ventilation systems be observable from outside of the mountain at all, general?

SHEPPERD: They would, and they tie to last picture you showed, which is the fuel. You -- in all of these things, for electricity, you have to have generators, and the ventilation systems you have to have air from the outside. The air emanates heat. You can't do anything on the surface of the earth these days without emanating a signal of some type -- either heat, visual, electronic -- and we're listening and watching for all of that.

HARRIS: All right. Come on over here to the telestrator, because you're the -- you're the master of this. I want you to show us exactly where you think all of these caves are in Afghanistan.

SHEPPERD: Remember this is the Hindu Kush, coming out of the Kashmir area here, into Afghanistan. Caves in this area between Kabul and Kandahar. Caves also northwest of Kabul, in this particular area; north of Jalalabad, right here, and then in the far northeastern area, up here, in the Ta -- Konduz, Taloqan area. All those are likely places where bin Laden and his Al Qaeda could be. Remember, we're looking for him. And lots of other people looking for him. And there's a price all their heads. We sure hope to find him.

HARRIS: All right. Thank you very much, Major General Don Shepperd. Appreciate the advice as always.

SHEPPERD: Thank you.

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