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American Morning
Clear From Osama Bin Laden Videotape That Terror Attacks on America Exceeded His Expectations
Aired December 14, 2001 - 07:53 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
PAULA ZAHN, CNN ANCHOR: The audio may be muddy and the picture grainy, but it's clear from the Osama bin Laden videotape that the terror attacks on America exceeded his expectations.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OSAMA BIN LADEN: (...INAUDIBLE...) we calculated in advance the number of casualties from the enemy, who would be killed based on the position of the tower. We calculated that the floors that would be hit would be three or four floors. I was the most optimistic of them all.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ZAHN: This morning, Americans are expressing moral outrage as they watch bin Laden brag about the extent of the destruction and how it benefited Islam. How are bin Laden's words and actions being received in the Arab and Muslim world? Bernard Haykel is a professor of Islamic studies at New York University, and in Washington, Mamoun Fandy is with the National Defense University -- welcome both of you.
MAMOUN FANDY, NATIONAL DEFENSE UNIVERSITY: Welcome.
BERNARD HAYKEL, NEW YORK UNIVERSITY: Thank you.
ZAHN: So, Mr. Fandy, we should, for starters, make it clear that the CIA claims that it ran tests to make sure that the tape wasn't altered in any way, and to determine whether the voice seen on this tape actually matched the voice we've heard of Osama bin Laden in the past, and they did. So based on that, and your ability to understand Arabic, are you arriving at the same sort of interpretation?
FANDY: Paula, I followed bin Laden and his tapes since 1985. These tapes are real and authentic. They are classic bin Laden tapes. The al Qaeda may know how to shoot guns, but they do not know how to shoot video. The difference is, is that when bin Laden teamed up with the Al-Jazeera boys in Kabul, he was producing very good tapes, but now he's on his own and went back to what he used to produce from 1985 until now.
ZAHN: Bernard, I want to replay another small part of that tape now to see if you share the same view that this is, in fact, the interpretation. Let's roll that tape right now. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UBL: The brothers, who conducted the operation, all they knew was that they have a martyrdom operation and we asked each of them to go to America but they didn't know anything about the operation, not even one letter. But they were trained and we did not reveal the operation to them until they are there and just before they boarded the planes.
UBL: (...inaudible...) then he said: Those who were trained to fly didn't know the others. One group of people did not know the other group. (...inaudible...)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ZAHN: Bernard, what's your take on what we just listened to there?
HAYKEL: I think it's very clear that he had organized and planned this operation. I don't think he was making fun of the individuals who didn't know the exact details of the operation. In fact, I think he's quite proud that they all died martyrs. He's very respectful to them.
And it's often been said that he didn't respect them or somehow made fun of his own people. I don't think that's true. It's clear that he is incriminating himself here in the very details that he mentions. And this shows clearly, again, that this is an authentic tape. And as native speaker of Arabic and Mamoun is the same, I mean it's very clear that the idioms used, the expressions, the hand gestures, all go to prove this.
ZAHN: Mamoun, you get the final thought and whether that's your interpretation, because some people, particularly some of the senators who had seen this tape, said that they felt he was quite cynical about the fate of the hijackers, many of whom didn't know that they were on martyrdom mission until they boarded the planes.
FANDY: I'm not sure if I heard that on the tape myself. I think, as Barnard said, it is very clear that he organized this operation. He knew the guys knew that they are in a martyrdom operation, as he sees it. This is the -- this is classic bin Laden. The bottom line is that, really, it is very clear for anybody who had doubts about whether he did the September 11 attack, now this doubt is laid to rest. Of course, there is always the 10 percent in the Arab world that watch Al-Jazeera, they will never believe us, no matter what we do.
ZAHN: Mamoun Fandy, Bernard Haykel -- thank you both for your time -- have a good weekend, gentlemen.
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