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American Morning

Iran Saying It Could Use Some Help in Finding Al Qaeda and Taliban Fighters

Aired February 06, 2002 - 07:32   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
PAULA ZAHN, CNN ANCHOR: Only days after President Bush named Iran as one of three nations in what he called the "axis of evil," Iran is now saying it could use some help in finding al Qaeda and Taliban fighters, who may have fled there. Why the apparent change in tone? Well, for his insights, we turn to Richard Butler, our ambassador-in-residence -- good morning. How are you doing this morning?

RICHARD BUTLER, FORMER UNITED NATIONS CHIEF WEAPONS INSPECTOR: Good morning, Paula. I am fine.

ZAHN: There continues to be concern about President Bush's axis of evil speech. Yesterday, Secretary of State Colin Powell had to answer some very tough questions from legislatures in that regard. How did he do?

BUTLER: He did pretty well, Paula. If one of his key objectives, and of course it was, was to stay real close to the president, no daylight between the two of them, he said the president meant what he said. There is problems for the United States out there in these three countries. He said maybe also in some other countries that, you know, he didn't name. So he defended the party line.

But he came under some very, very tough questioning as well, and in that context, you know, maybe in reaction to some of this European concern about the axis of evil concept, certainly concern in Iran, which we might come to in a moment. But in that context, he said something extremely interesting, which I think we should listen to.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

COLIN POWELL, SECRETARY OF STATE: Actions are going to be required. It doesn't mean the war is going to start tomorrow, or that we are going to invade anybody. In fact, it may mean in the short term, focus on the policies that we have in place with respect to each of the three countries he mentioned and other countries that might have been mentioned.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ZAHN: So is the secretary of state basically saying that people were reaching conclusions that were inappropriate? Because within days of that speech, everybody, pundits at least, were speculating when the first strike was going to happen and where.

BUTLER: That's right. So we've got to get inside this. What actually was he saying? He was saying the president used a rhetorical flourish. The president went for popularity in the situation, where this war is very popular, and maybe it should be. But that truly the three countries at issue are something we know to be true. They are all different. They all present different problems. They each deserve their own policy, and maybe that's far more important than some overarching concept of axis of evil...

ZAHN: Don't lump them all together.

BUTLER: That's right. And interestingly, Paula, I mean, you and I could have been forgiven if last week we thought the United States was going to go off and invade Iraq any moment now. OK? And here is the secretary of state saying we're not going to do that anytime soon. We are going to pursue what we were doing in the past with respect to each of the three named countries, and maybe some unnamed ones. And in that context, Paula, we still need to know what are these policies? What is the Iraq policy?

ZAHN: Well, when it came to Iraq, he made very clear that the inspections must continue.

BUTLER: That was clear. That was very clear, and I thought he was great, if I may say so, when he...

ZAHN: Well, yes, you were the guy that used to conduct those inspections.

BUTLER: Well, that's right. When he said this conversation with the Iraqis at the U.N. could be real short, because there is only one thing at issue, which is getting those inspectors back there. And of course, he is quite right. I hope it is short, and I hope it results in those inspectors going back. Don't hold your breath. But I thought that was very clear.

On this other point though, three policies are what we need, an Iraq policy, an Iran policy and a policy towards Korea. I'm not sure what the Iraq policy is. The Iran policy, again, we were doing not badly in trying to get things back on track with Iran. The foreign minister of Iran yesterday tried to put them further back on track.

ZAHN: Well, essentially saying we need your help. We can't control our 560 mile border with Afghanistan. Come in and help us find where these al Qaeda leaders are.

BUTLER: Exactly. And I thought that was...

ZAHN: That's pretty encouraging, correct?

BUTLER: That was encouraging, and...

ZAHN: But what does it mean? What are the implications of that?

BUTLER: The implications... ZAHN: That we'll send agents in to assist them in trying to find these al Qaeda leaders?

BUTLER: Maybe, but I think what it means is that we've got to walk back from this gross concept of axis of evil and deal with each of these countries in their terms. And in this case, yes, we should take the Iranian offer and go help them and try and see that their long and porous border with Afghanistan is not something through which al Qaeda terrorists can pass and get safe haven. We should get back on track in an intrinsic way with each of these countries.

ZAHN: And the other thing Secretary Powell make quite clear is the United States would not contribute to a peacekeeping force...

BUTLER: That's right.

ZAHN: ... in Afghanistan.

BUTLER: That's right.

ZAHN: Now, you've got a bunch of senators out there that are pretty unhappy about this, basically saying you're going to win the war but lose the peace.

BUTLER: Paula, dead right, I mean, to put it that way. We have been there before. We were there in the Gulf War. We won the war, but we kind of lost the peace. That's why we are still dealing with Saddam Hussein today. We have won the war in the military sense in Afghanistan, but there is a peace to be built. And senators from both sides, Biden, Democrat, chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, Lugar, Republican, distinguished man, saying to Colin Powell, "Come on. Is it really so unthinkable that we could have American boots on the ground to help rebuild Afghanistan?"

There is this ideological hang-up in this administration that we don't do that thing. The world...

ZAHN: The nation-building thing.

BUTLER: That's right. The world has been calling for that, pointing out the 2,500 British troops around Kabul is not enough. There is a whole country to rebuild and to keep safe. You know, these warlords are fighting in various parts of the country. Can we please have some American troops? And both sides of politics are asking for that. This administration is saying we don't go there. What do we do? We fight video wars from the sky. We send to the Congress this massive defense budget, but we are not going to put American troops on the ground, as you say rightly so, not just to win the war, but to secure and win the peace. I think it's a matter of concern.

ZAHN: Well, it's something we will continue to debate here at A.M. Richard Butler, as always, thanks for your insights.

BUTLER: Good.

ZAHN: See you tomorrow morning. BUTLER: Thank you.

ZAHN: Same time, same place.

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