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American Morning
Sound Off: Who Is Getting What Out of Carter Cuba Trip?
Aired May 14, 2002 - 09:19 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
PAULA ZAHN, CNN ANCHOR: "The Big Question" at this hour: Who is getting the most mileage out of the Cuba trip? Is it President Bush or former President Carter or is it Fidel Castro? Let's go right to Bob Beckel and Cliff May for "Sound Off."
Cliff, good morning.
CLIFF MAY, FORMER RNC COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR: Good morning.
ZAHN: Bob, good morning.
BOB BECKEL, DEMOCRATIC POLITICAL STRATEGIST: Good morning, Paula.
ZAHN: So in the end, Cliff, what -- how does this Cuba trip play out? You have a former president defending himself; essentially saying that no one in the Bush administration warned him that there was any suggestion that Cuba had bioterror capabilities. And then you have the administration sort of backing off some of the charges made last week.
MAY: You know, as Reagan said to Carter a long time ago, "There he goes again." Look, I hope President Carter speaks tonight. He will talk very strongly about the need for human rights in Cuba, the fact that there have been no elections in 43 years, one dictator in the only non-democracy in South America. I hope he does all that. Otherwise, this is kind of a meddlesome trip, and Carter has a long history of this.
Keep in mind that during the Clinton administration he annoyed Clinton several times by going off to various places: North Korea, the Sudan, Haiti. He accomplished nothing on any of those trips. These were vanity diplomacy missions, not a good idea. And worse, if you remember during the first Bush administration, he wrote on the eve of the Gulf War to every member of the Security Council urging them not to support the U.S. war in the Gulf. Carter really needs a hobby, and it shouldn't be diplomacy.
ZAHN: Bob Beckel, you were rolling your eyes when Cliff said, "There he goes again." "It's a vanity mission."
BECKEL: Yes, well you know what -- yes, it's typical where most Republicans get out of the presidency and go and cash in and make millions of dollars. Before you say Jimmy Carter takes a vanity mission, let's remember this is a guy that eradicated the Guinea Worm of Africa, probably saved hundreds of thousands of lives. He's built more houses himself than all presidents put together. This guy went to the Sudan, Cliff, and let me tell you something...
ZAHN: Hey, hey, hey. Wait, Bob, what about North Korea? What about Haiti? Can you point to any accomplishment there?
BECKEL: Well, in Haiti they worked a deal out, we didn't have to land (ph). And North Korea could be arguable. But the idea that somebody like Cliff May would attack a great man like Jimmy Carter, when he's had such boos on their side as president -- but let me get back to the scene in Cuba.
Wait a second, you started by saying 42 years of a dictatorship. Your administration coddles up to the red Chinese communists, you do business with them, you trade with them. They're real thugs, they're a real danger to the United States, and you're obsessed with this little island -- wait a second, this little island 90 miles off the shore of south Florida. And why? Because you bit into that right- wing Cuban mob down in Miami who are thugs.
MAY: A couple of quick things. One is if you're talking about China, Clinton called the Chinese our "strategic partners," you'll recall. If you're talking about the Sudan, right now Christians are being massacred by that same regime and literally enslaved. It is a scandal that is way, way underreported.
As far as the biological weapons, do you really think that when Jimmy Carter goes into some plant that Castro shows him he'll be able to determine whether or not germ weapons are being constructed there? I really don't think so.
Look, the guy should build houses, the guy should go on missions about the Guinea Worm. What he shouldn't do is play the role of super ambassador. President Bush does not really want him to do that. Clinton didn't want him to do that, Reagan didn't want him to do it. It's a very expensive hobby for the American people. He's a nice man. He's making a big mistake by meddling.
ZAHN: Bob Beckel, is President Carter getting duped by Fidel Castro? We had ...
(CROSSTALK)
BECKEL: No, I don't think he is getting -- I don't think he is getting duped.
ZAHN: ... of the "New York Times." She's done extensive research on this, and she said, you know, it's very easy with dual-use technology to hide the intent at its very source.
BECKEL: Paula, it may be. But let's remember the person that exposed this was a guy named Bolton at the State Department, who has been an anti-Castro -- on a rage on this thing for years. And the second thing is Castro can't afford a can of Raid, let alone putting together a biological weapons base. Will these guys let it go? It's like to us -- my party with Social Security. You guys have been on this Castro thing -- let it go. Put a baseball team down there, this thing is over.
MAY: They sent $1 billion on these...
BECKEL: Oh, come on, Cliff.
MAY: ... on biotechnology, and I don't know what for. And, secondly, Bob, I really am disturbed by the anti Cuban-American feeling that pervades, frankly, a lot of people on your side of the aisle. Cuban-Americans, I know that what they have done that's unforgivable is they've been successes in this country, they've worked hard and they've achieved something. They have as much right as Jewish Americans or Irish Americans or anybody else to talk about what is going on in the country they fled from because of the dictatorship.
Listen, let Jimmy Carter just do this tonight. Let him tell Castro to free the political prisoners, let them out of the prisons right now, to stop working with terrorists, to hold elections and to get into the 21st century already. Let him just do that tonight. And maybe he will. By the way...
ZAHN: Bob, you know what I want to remind everybody of? When Under Secretary Bolton was in Iran, he quoted Castro at Tehran University essentially saying that Iran and Cuba could bring America to its knees.
BECKEL: Yes, and that's the same...
ZAHN: You're not going to make light of that, are you?
BECKEL: I'd make light of anything Bolton says when it comes to Cuba. He is not impartial. This guy has been on a mission.
And let me say one thing. You jumped on the Sudan, Cliff. Where's your boy Bush on the Sudan, when half a million of people are dying? He's nowhere.
Where is he? He goes to China and cuts deals with people who murder people by the hundreds of thousands a year. So would you get off of this thing with Jimmy Carter? He is a great man who is trying his best, while your administration is flacking (ph) for a bunch of Cuban-Americans who were friends of Batistas, who left there with a lot of money, and brought that money to south Florida and spent it on politics. And if you want to defend that crowd, you go ahead. It is chicken game and it's gutless.
MAY: I think when Carter does this to President Bush or to President Clinton or to the other President Bush or President Reagan it's wrong. But you're right. We need to do more on the Sudan, where an Islamic militant regime is killing and enslaving black Christians, and almost nobody is taking notice of it.
ZAHN: Oh, Bob, did he see the light there at the end on one issue? BECKEL: Well, he saw the light on one issue.
MAY: No one is going to...
BECKEL: He laid out the problem. But when you say, who should do something about it, it is under their watch. What is George Bush doing about it? Absolutely nothing.
MAY: There's plenty of blame to go around.
BECKEL: Jimmy Carter went there...
MAY: There's plenty of blame to go around. Clinton did nothing about it, Bush is not doing enough. We need to do something about the regime in Sudan, which is committing terrible atrocities. I'm glad to have a chance to discuss it.
BECKEL: Cliff, I'm going to talk to President Carter when he gets back and ask him to pray for you, because, man, you need a lot. I mean, I'm telling you.
MAY: I welcome it.
ZAHN: On that note of prayer, we will end our "Sound Off" this morning. Bob Beckel, Cliff May, always good to have the two of you tango on the air.
BECKEL: Thank you, Paula.
MAY: Thank you.
ZAHN: Appreciate your time.
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