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American Morning

Interview with James Lineberger

Aired September 02, 2002 - 08:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Some rather tense moments for passengers on board a Delta flight from Atlanta to Philly this weekend. Armed sky marshals restrained an unruly passenger, and then, we are told, pointed guns at the other passengers for about 30 minutes on board that plane. Transportation safety officials defending the response of the air marshals saying people on board the plane ignored orders to remain in their seats.
Judge James Lineberger was on board the Delta flight. He is live in Philly this morning. Judge, good to see you. Good morning sir.

JAMES LINEBERGER, DELTA PASSENGER: Good morning, how are you, sir?

HEMMER: I am doing just fine, thank you. Happy Labor Day to you. But listen, you were on board that plane. Where were you sitting in relation to the man who was considered unruly?

LINEBERGER: I was in seat 31, and he was across the aisle in seat 30.

HEMMER: So he was just a few feet away from you. And then what happened when, apparently, he got out of his seat and went toward the front of the plane? That is my understanding.

LINEBERGER: That's correct. He got out of the seat, went to the front of the plane -- in the direction of the front of the plane, and then turned around and came back down the aisle beyond me and was in -- toward the back of the plane. Something happened that triggered the air marshal to respond to his activity. So they rushed back and apprehended him, carried him back to the first class section, where they restrained him and a few minutes later, they then drew their weapons, semi-automatic weapons, and leveled them on those of us who were passengers in the vehicle and held us that way for about 25 or 30 minutes.

HEMMER: What do you mean they were pointing their assault weapons? Give me a better description of that. I have this image in my head right now of two men on board the plane...

LINEBERGER: You see this? Can you see me?

HEMMER: Yes, sir.

LINEBERGER: This is the manner in which they were both pointing their weapons, which meant to me that they had identified a target and they were -- all they had to do was squeeze the trigger in order to fire. I assumed that there was some terrorist or someone in the rear of the plane that they were aiming at, and was somewhat torn with ambivalence when we arrived at Philadelphia...

HEMMER: Judge, were they saying something while they were pointing those weapons?

LINEBERGER: There were individuals looking to see what they were pointing at and they were yelling, Get down, get out -- get your head out of the isle, et cetera, and that was it.

HEMMER: What did the passengers do? We've been told through the TSA, the Transportation Security Association, that some people did not obey the orders of the air marshals. What was the response that you witnessed?

LINEBERGER: Well, I was looking forward rather than back, so I have no idea what was happening behind me, but those individuals who were in seats that I could see did nothing remarkable, other than hid behind their respective seats in front of them.

HEMMER: When you landed, what happened?

LINEBERGER: Well, when we landed, I asked the people who were on the seat closest to the window beside me to look out and see if there was a SWAT team from the Philadelphia Police Department out there, and they said no. Shortly thereafter, some traffic police officers from Philadelphia came onto the plane, and I was torn with ambivalence then, realizing that if traffic police were coming in there, there obviously was no major threat.

HEMMER: We understand, judge, just for the sake of our viewers, that two people were apprehended. They were questioned at great length and later released on the ground in Philadelphia. Take me back on the plane, though. In your estimation, was this an overreaction, or was this just two air marshals doing the job that they have been essentially hired and trained to do?

LINEBERGER: I would say that the initial apprehension was excellent. They were doing the job as they were trained to do. There was an individual acting out and they apprehended that person. But when they drew their weapons and pointed them at us, it placed us in a situation where it was life-threatening, and since no one was arrested, since no one else had a weapon, it seemed to me it was an overreaction.

HEMMER: Do you then feel more safe or less safe when boarding an aircraft from this day forward?

LINEBERGER: Well, I would hope that this would be something that only happened because of lack of training on the part of those two individuals and it wouldn't happen. I look forward to knowing that there are, in fact, individuals on the aircraft to protect us.

HEMMER: Then you would agree that essentially the experience you had could cut both ways? It may frighten some people, but it also may save some lives ultimately if you get into a situation that is much more serious than you experienced in the skies over Philadelphia?

LINEBERGER: Well, that's true. The saying is it's better safe than to be sorry is one thing. There is no doubt in my mind that these two individuals overreacted, and for the national safety administration to suggest that they were acting according to the standard operating procedure is irresponsible. And, in my opinion, is -- it borders on malfeasance.

HEMMER: A flight you will not soon forget. James Lineberger, a judge in Philadelphia. Thank you, sir, for sharing your experience with us.

LINEBERGER: Thank you very much.

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