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American Morning

Interview with James Stokes, David Rimmer

Aired September 09, 2002 - 08:10   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: There is yet another twist this morning in the case of the King brothers, convicted of murder. And a friend tried separately and then cleared of the same crime. On Friday, a jury in Pensacola, Florida found Derek and Alex King, ages 13 and 14, guilty of murdering their father. The jurors say, though, they were betrayed by the judge and the prosecutor, who kept them in the dark about the other trial involving Ricky Chavis, age 40. He's been acquainted. That verdict had been sealed.
Let's talk about it with James Stokes, defense attorney for Alex King. He is our guest live this morning on Pensacola. So, too, is the prosecutor, David Rimmer.

I want to start with you, James.

I understand there are some developments that you're hearing right now about some of these jurors who issued the verdict on Friday regarding the two boys, ages 13 and 14.

What are they telling you now based on what they have heard since that verdict was made public?

JAMES STOKES, ALEX KING'S DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, what they're telling us now is that they are willing to join the defense in a motion for a new trial, as the boys were convicted of being principals to a crime or Ricky Chavis, and they were never tried for that and Alex was never allowed to present a defense to the charge for which they have been convicted.

And we're afraid that if this goes forward on October 17, we're going to be sentencing Alex to what could be the rest of his life for a crime that we know that he was never given the opportunity...

HEMMER: Back up just a little bit here, just because many of these facts can be completely confusing, for lack of a better word. The jurors apparently now have knowledge that at least the judge told the attorneys involved what the verdict for Ricky Chavis was before the deliberation -- actually, during the trial of the two young boys. Is that what problem they have right now?

STOKES: I believe it's more a problem of them thinking that there was two people that were being charged with having swung the bat and that caused the confusion in our jury's mind.

HEMMER: OK. So at this point, then, what can jurors do, knowing the case has already been tried, the verdict has already been issued? What happens in a legal sense? STOKES: Well, based upon what the jury has done, is they found Alex guilty as a principal to Ricky Chavis' murder. That was never a charge in the indictment that they faced and we feel that we want the jurors -- we have two of them -- we would like all the jurors to join Alex in his motion for a new trial so he can defend himself against whatever version of events the state puts forward.

HEMMER: Let's bring in the state now, the prosecutor, David Rimmer. Try and make heads and tails of this. And as we get into this, sir, there were legal analysts who have suggested that you were essentially laying bets on two horses in the same race. How do you defend yourself, knowing that there was one murder and two trials that ran consecutively for that same murder?

DAVID RIMMER, PROSECUTOR: Well, I think there's a misunderstanding amongst a lot of people. My position all along has been that Derek King is the one who swung the bat. I never suggested in either trial that Ricky Chavis swung the bat. I argued vigorously that Alex King was a principal, and I explained the difference between principal and perpetrator during the Alex and Derek King trial.

In the Chavis trial, I was also proceeding under the theory that he was a principal. That means that he helped or encouraged the boys. But I was not allowed to argue that to the jury, so thorough I made no argument, because I wasn't going to argue to the jury that he was the perpetrator. I never told his jury that he was the one who swung the bat. I left it up to them to decide because it was my position that he did not swing the bat, that Derek King swung the bat, that Alex encouraged him and also that Chavis was involved. I believe all three of them were involved, but I've always taken the position that it was Derek King who swung the bat.

HEMMER: Tell us this, though. The case as it stands right now, if, indeed, you and the other attorneys had knowledge -- first of all, did you have knowledge of what the Chavis verdict was while the trial of the two boys was ongoing?

RIMMER: Yes, we all did. All of us did.

HEMMER: OK. And knowing that...

RIMMER: And we were...

HEMMER: ... though, do you think you were prejudiced because you had that information?

RIMMER: No. We weren't prejudiced. I mean we all knew what the outcome was. But we can't, we were under orders not to disclose it to anybody. And the, either jury is not supposed to know what the other jury does anyway. They're supposed to base their verdict on the evidence that's presented to them and the law, not on any outside information.

HEMMER: Sir, I only have a limited time left here, but knowing that the case played out the way it did -- and no one has ever seen anything like this before -- is an appeal all but certain right now, which essentially throws all the work of the past few months out the window?

RIMMER: Well, there's always an appeal, but I don't think that it's going to throw anything out. I mean I think that the verdicts will stand. Like I said, you know, I was not allowed to argue to Chavis' jury that he was the one who motivated and encouraged the boys to do what they did. That was my position. I could not argue that. So therefore I did not argue that he was the perpetrator.

In the King trial, I argued very vigorously that Alex was a principal and that Derek was the perpetrator who swung the bat. And I don't think that's going to make any difference on appeal.

HEMMER: Well, listen, gentlemen, thank you. It's a fascinating case and there are still many more twists and turns forthcoming in this case.

David Rimmer is the prosecutor from Pensacola and James Stokes the defense attorney for Alex King, one of the boys.

Thank you, men.

RIMMER: Thank you.

STOKES: Thank you.

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