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American Morning

Interview with Jason Burke

Aired September 16, 2002 - 09:14   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

PAULA ZAHN, CNN ANCHOR: For more now on the expanding terror investigation in upstate New York. A sixth man, Mokhtar al-Bakri, was apprehended in Bahrain. He joins five other suspects held in a federal detention center near Buffalo.
Jeff Flock has more from Buffalo this morning -- good morning, Jeff.

JEFF FLOCK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Paula, good morning to you. Indeed, in the federal courthouse behind me, that is where Mr. al- Bakri is expected to make an initial appearance. You know, you had a question earlier about how far this may go beyond what we already now know.

I talked back with Mike Battle a little more extensively, and he told he that all of the people on U.S. soil have now been arrested. So they are done here in Buffalo and Lackawanna, although he indicates there are three unnamed coconspirators in the criminal complaint. They are overseas, however, so there may still be more arrests overseas. One other question, and that is on the question, to use Secretary Powell's term over weekend, how big a fish are these?

CNN's Suzanne Candiotti has developed law enforcement sources which indicate these men are not big fish. Despite that, Mike Battle says that he will argue later in the week that these men are a flight risk, there are a danger to the community. Of course, members of the community say they have been born and raised here, and they are a danger to no one.

One final note, and that is Governor Pataki will be here to talk to members of the community in Lackawanna, to the south of us in Buffalo, at 1:15 local time -- that is Eastern -- today.

That is the latest from Buffalo -- Paula, back to you.

ZAHN: Appreciate the update. Thanks, Jeff -- Bill.

BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Colin Powell is describing one man as a pretty big fish. The words from the secretary of state describing Ramzi Binalshibh, captured last Wednesday in Karachi.

He was nabbed after a fierce gun battle in Karachi that netted about 10 other al Qaeda suspects. Could Binalshibh be one of the few people still alive with firsthand knowledge not only of the plot and the attacks last September, but also the whereabouts of bin Laden, if, indeed, he is still alive today. Jason Burke is the chief correspondent with the "Observer of London." He is there now and joins us as our guest. Good to have you with us, Jason. I think you said some rather interesting things. One of which included the possibility that several al Qaeda members actually carry a picture of Binalshibh with them. Why is that, and what is the significance?

JASON BURKE, CHIEF CORRESPONDENT, "OBSERVER": ... pictures of Binalshibh. There have been pictures of him that have been picked up among the possession of Taliban -- young Taliban, particularly, who have been arrested in last six months. What it shows, I think, is the status of Binalshibh -- it is pretty clear that he is not a major al Qaeda figure, he is not a top notch, elite, aide of bin Laden or Zawahiri, or -- that is Dr. Ayman al-Zawahiri, bin Laden's deputy, if you like. He is not close to any of these guys. What he is is a rising star in al Qaeda, the head of a -- the captain of a youth team, if you like.

HEMMER: What do you think, Jason, what do you think he would know, then, in terms of knowledge, if indeed he is not top tier, but he is essentially up there, as you describe him?

BURKE: What we think he knows is more about the September 11 hijackings and the processes that led to them than anybody else who is alive. He has confessed in a interview with Al-Jazeera TV about three months ago that was broadcast last week to being intimately involved in the coordination of that attack. That is of enormous value to investigators who are still trying to find out how the details of the plot were developed.

He may know whether, indeed, as German prosecutors have suggested, Atta and his coconspirators originated the plot themselves, and then went to Afghanistan, to bin Laden, with their idea and then received funding. He will know whether the idea came from bin Laden, and people close to him. He will know how it worked, he will know who received what money, he'll know who went where, whether there were meetings in Malaysia as has been suggested. That seems likely. He will also have, almost certainly, the definitive response to the idea that Mohamed Atta met some Iraqi agents in Prague. That is now widely believe isn't the case, and he'll be able to get us a final answer on that too.

HEMMER: And ultimately only if he is willing to answer those questions upon interrogation. Take me to Karachi, Pakistan. Knowing that this gun battle lasted well over four hours, is that the new breeding ground, in your estimation right now to be watched for al Qaeda?

BURKE: Absolutely. There are two sorts of al Qaeda at the moment. There is the old al Qaeda, if you like, inside Afghanistan, talking about people like bin Laden and those close to him. Then there are the people who have fled Afghanistan in the last six to nine months. Many of them, the most of them, will have gone through Karachi as they have tried to get back to their home -- their home countries in the Gulf or elsewhere. Karachi is a city of 12 million people. A seventh of them are of Pashtun tribes, the tribes who were largely loyal to the Taliban. It is a city of poverty, endemic violence. Even the police, one police officer told me last week, don't know where most of their own officers are, let alone the terrorists. So if you want a base to run modern terrorism from, that is a great place to be.

HEMMER: All right. Thank you, Jason. Jason Burke, "London Observer," sharing his thoughts on what we all watched go down last week. Thank you, Jason.

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