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American Morning
Interview with Gladys van den Berg, Marisa Al-Othman, Dan Wolf
Aired September 25, 2002 - 09:02 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
PAULA ZAHN, CNN ANCHOR: The U.S. has frozen Iraq's assets as a way of putting pressure on Saddam Hussein's government, but that is causing a problem for some people who were held hostage by Iraq and used as human shields during the Gulf War. They have already won a lawsuit against Iraq. Now, they have to win a suit against the U.S. government to actually collect the money.
Gladys van Den Berg and Marisa Al-Othman, both former hostages, join us from Orlando, Florida along with their attorney, Dan Wolf, who is with me in New York this morning.
Thank you all for being with us.
GLADYS VAN DEN BERG, FORMER IRAQI HOSTAGE: Thank you.
ZAHN: Gladys, can you describe to us what happened to you and your daughter and the rest of the family in those days leading up to Desert Storm?
VAN DEN BERG: We were on our way out on vacation the 2nd of August, and my husband, who was -- ex-husband, who was Kuwaiti tried to get us out of the country, and we couldn't, and my daughter and I both went with our family to his mother's residence.
I remained there for three and a half months under, you know, basically, house arrest, couldn't leave or go anywhere.
And, we were there for three and a half months. We suffered raids into the house. We were told by the Iraqi authorities when they called for the Americans to come out, we knew where they were going, and we certainly didn't trust the Iraqis or their word, so we decided to stay inside Kuwait in hiding, and, so, finally, we were asked to leave because we posed a threat to the family. We were found out, and they didn't really care how we left at the time. They were greatly threatened by our presence there as Americans, and we left through Baghdad.
ZAHN: Marisa, were you ever physically mistreated during that several-month period?
MARISA AL-OTHMAN, FORMER IRAQ HOSTAGE: No, but I did actually witness members of my family being mistreated. My father, as well as some of my family members.
ZAHN: What happened to your dad?
AL-OTHMAN: Well, during one of the raids, when the Iraqi officers and their men came into our house, my father was detained, and questioned about certain events that had happened, and when he didn't answer the way that they wanted him to, they hit him with -- butt of one of their rifles.
ZAHN: Did you ever fear they were going to kill him?
AL-OTHMAN: Yes, I did.
ZAHN: Why do you think, Gladys, you were spared at all? They needed you to be used as human shields?
VAN DEN BERG: Well, I think the family tried to protect us as long as they could, but, I think when they finally found out that I was an American, because we had hidden or concealed my identity, it was a final raid, and it was the Republican Guard who came in at the time, in early November, who came and questioned us, and when the family was taken for questioning, there were four women left in the house, alone.
My daughter, myself, and then my two sisters in law. We didn't know what would happen, but they came back, all of family came back, including my mother in law had been taken in. They all came back teeth chattering, they had been physically abused and tortured. When they came back, they said you have to go, and you have to go now. Not only are we suspect for harboring you now that they know you are an American, I don't know why I stayed there so long except that I was in hiding for three and a half months.
ZAHN: Gladys, as you look back on that chapter of your life, what is the thing to this day that remains the most painful for you to deal with or endure?
VAN DEN BERG: I would say the failure of being able to protect my own daughter. I -- she was taught, in those three and a half months to be a victim, and I will spend the rest of my adult life helping her to amend that.
ZAHN: Dan, let's talk about the legal ramifications of this case. J.P. Morgan and the Treasury Department are not commenting on the lawsuit. In your opinion, why does the State Department oppose the use of frozen Iraqi assets to be used in this case?
DAN WOLF, ATTORNEY: Well, that is a bit of a mystery. I mean, U.S. policy as articulated by the president in his speech before the United Nations is to demand that Iraq adhere to all of the U.N. resolutions, including resolutions calling for reparations to Kuwaiti nationals who had been victimized, or face the consequences.
Here we have a situation where American nationals were terrorized, held hostage, used as human shields. They had gone to U.S. court, they have done what they are supposed to do under our law. They have obtained judgments, and Iraqi assets are held in U.S. accounts, and for reasons that are really difficult to fathom, the State Department has taken the position that they should not be able to collect against Saddam's money.
ZAHN: So what is your expectation?
WOLF: My expectation is that we will continue to fight this battle in U.S. court. Congress has spoken, Paula, very clearly on this issue, and has indicated in legislation that was adopted in 1998, and amended in 2000, that it wants Americans to be able to hold terrorists accountable -- terrorist states accountable for their crimes, and wants those American citizens to be able to collect from frozen assets of foreign states. So Congress is strongly on the side of the victims, and legislation has been introduced to clarify the previous legislation, and if that is not successful, I believe that we will ultimately prevail in court.
ZAHN: You do think you will win ultimately then.
WOLF: Well, I'm hopeful.
ZAHN: All right. We will leave there it, Dan Wolf, represent Gladys and Marisa. Thank you for sharing your story with us this morning. We really appreciate your time.
VAN DEN BERG: Thank you.
AL-OTHMAN: Thank you.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Wolf>
Aired September 25, 2002 - 09:02 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
PAULA ZAHN, CNN ANCHOR: The U.S. has frozen Iraq's assets as a way of putting pressure on Saddam Hussein's government, but that is causing a problem for some people who were held hostage by Iraq and used as human shields during the Gulf War. They have already won a lawsuit against Iraq. Now, they have to win a suit against the U.S. government to actually collect the money.
Gladys van Den Berg and Marisa Al-Othman, both former hostages, join us from Orlando, Florida along with their attorney, Dan Wolf, who is with me in New York this morning.
Thank you all for being with us.
GLADYS VAN DEN BERG, FORMER IRAQI HOSTAGE: Thank you.
ZAHN: Gladys, can you describe to us what happened to you and your daughter and the rest of the family in those days leading up to Desert Storm?
VAN DEN BERG: We were on our way out on vacation the 2nd of August, and my husband, who was -- ex-husband, who was Kuwaiti tried to get us out of the country, and we couldn't, and my daughter and I both went with our family to his mother's residence.
I remained there for three and a half months under, you know, basically, house arrest, couldn't leave or go anywhere.
And, we were there for three and a half months. We suffered raids into the house. We were told by the Iraqi authorities when they called for the Americans to come out, we knew where they were going, and we certainly didn't trust the Iraqis or their word, so we decided to stay inside Kuwait in hiding, and, so, finally, we were asked to leave because we posed a threat to the family. We were found out, and they didn't really care how we left at the time. They were greatly threatened by our presence there as Americans, and we left through Baghdad.
ZAHN: Marisa, were you ever physically mistreated during that several-month period?
MARISA AL-OTHMAN, FORMER IRAQ HOSTAGE: No, but I did actually witness members of my family being mistreated. My father, as well as some of my family members.
ZAHN: What happened to your dad?
AL-OTHMAN: Well, during one of the raids, when the Iraqi officers and their men came into our house, my father was detained, and questioned about certain events that had happened, and when he didn't answer the way that they wanted him to, they hit him with -- butt of one of their rifles.
ZAHN: Did you ever fear they were going to kill him?
AL-OTHMAN: Yes, I did.
ZAHN: Why do you think, Gladys, you were spared at all? They needed you to be used as human shields?
VAN DEN BERG: Well, I think the family tried to protect us as long as they could, but, I think when they finally found out that I was an American, because we had hidden or concealed my identity, it was a final raid, and it was the Republican Guard who came in at the time, in early November, who came and questioned us, and when the family was taken for questioning, there were four women left in the house, alone.
My daughter, myself, and then my two sisters in law. We didn't know what would happen, but they came back, all of family came back, including my mother in law had been taken in. They all came back teeth chattering, they had been physically abused and tortured. When they came back, they said you have to go, and you have to go now. Not only are we suspect for harboring you now that they know you are an American, I don't know why I stayed there so long except that I was in hiding for three and a half months.
ZAHN: Gladys, as you look back on that chapter of your life, what is the thing to this day that remains the most painful for you to deal with or endure?
VAN DEN BERG: I would say the failure of being able to protect my own daughter. I -- she was taught, in those three and a half months to be a victim, and I will spend the rest of my adult life helping her to amend that.
ZAHN: Dan, let's talk about the legal ramifications of this case. J.P. Morgan and the Treasury Department are not commenting on the lawsuit. In your opinion, why does the State Department oppose the use of frozen Iraqi assets to be used in this case?
DAN WOLF, ATTORNEY: Well, that is a bit of a mystery. I mean, U.S. policy as articulated by the president in his speech before the United Nations is to demand that Iraq adhere to all of the U.N. resolutions, including resolutions calling for reparations to Kuwaiti nationals who had been victimized, or face the consequences.
Here we have a situation where American nationals were terrorized, held hostage, used as human shields. They had gone to U.S. court, they have done what they are supposed to do under our law. They have obtained judgments, and Iraqi assets are held in U.S. accounts, and for reasons that are really difficult to fathom, the State Department has taken the position that they should not be able to collect against Saddam's money.
ZAHN: So what is your expectation?
WOLF: My expectation is that we will continue to fight this battle in U.S. court. Congress has spoken, Paula, very clearly on this issue, and has indicated in legislation that was adopted in 1998, and amended in 2000, that it wants Americans to be able to hold terrorists accountable -- terrorist states accountable for their crimes, and wants those American citizens to be able to collect from frozen assets of foreign states. So Congress is strongly on the side of the victims, and legislation has been introduced to clarify the previous legislation, and if that is not successful, I believe that we will ultimately prevail in court.
ZAHN: You do think you will win ultimately then.
WOLF: Well, I'm hopeful.
ZAHN: All right. We will leave there it, Dan Wolf, represent Gladys and Marisa. Thank you for sharing your story with us this morning. We really appreciate your time.
VAN DEN BERG: Thank you.
AL-OTHMAN: Thank you.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Wolf>
