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American Morning
State, Federal Prosecutors Meeting Today
Aired October 25, 2002 - 09:17 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
TUCKER CARLSON, CNN ANCHOR: With the sniper suspects now in custody, state and federal prosecutors are meeting today to determine what charges to bring against John Allen Muhammad and John Lee Malvo. CNN legal analyst Jeffrey Toobin joins us now to talk about what they could be facing. What could they be facing?
JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: All sorts of bad things. I mean, there is going to be a prosecutorial turf battle to end all turf battles perhaps, unless everybody decides to behave like grown-ups. But, I mean, there are very different situations in Virginia, in the federal court, in Maryland and don't forget Alabama, which might have a claim on these guys too.
CARLSON: Now, is it possible they could wind up facing federal charges?
TOOBIN: You know, it is possible. Remember, they are in federal court now. The federal government now has become more much aggressive in bringing violent crime into the federal courts, but historically that has not been the case at all. There is no federal law against murder. You would have to sort of shoehorn these sniper attacks into perhaps a racketeering prosecution, into a continuing criminal enterprise prosecution. It's not clear to me how you could get this into federal court, but they have a lot of creative lawyers down there in Washington and they may be able to figure out a way.
CARLSON: Lawyers by definition are creative.
TOOBIN: That's what we do, make things up.
CARLSON: I've noticed. So when the charges are brought, we will find out who the government believes actually pulled the trigger, right?
TOOBIN: Maybe. That might not necessarily be evident in the initial indictment, because you could just charge them both with murder. You can get executed in this country even if you just drive the get-away car. It's called felony murder. If you're a co- conspirator, you can be executed even if you're not the triggerman, although juries tend to want to hear what the government's theory is of who actually did it. And as far as I know, it's not entirely clear. Remember, obviously, John Muhammad is older; he's the one with marksman training, but we don't know for sure that he was the one who pulled the trigger or either of them for that matter?
CARLSON: Now, at what point do we hear the details? When does the government essentially give its case over to the press so we can report it?
TOOBIN: Well, it's interesting. It depends on how they decide to frame the case. Certainly, within 30 days, the government has -- having arrested these guys in federal court, there is a 30-day clock that starts where they have to announce some further charges or dismiss the case, which, obviously, they are not going to do. Whether they file what is called a speaking indictment, which is an indictment that sort of explains how the government thinks it happened, or they could just do a very bare bones indictment, which would leave it until the trial for the government to spell out exactly how they feel the case happened. Don't know what they'll do.
CARLSON: Let's just quickly put you in the conjecture business. How likely do you think it is, if they are tried in Maryland, that they could wind up being executed in Maryland?
TOOBIN: I think it's highly unlikely that they would be executed there, because, remember, we are only talking about who files the case first. Virginia would certainly eventually file a case, and given the speed at which these cases move, it is highly likely even if Virginia went second, the execution might happen there first. But that's getting a ways ahead.
CARLSON: It's going to be a long process we will be covering carefully. Jeffrey Toobin, thanks, thanks for joining us.
Paula?
PAULA ZAHN, CNN ANCHOR: You can only imagine, Tucker, what Jeff's doing in the months to come.
TOOBIN: All sniper all the time.
CARLSON: Guaranteed employment. All right.
TOOBIN: You said it, not me, but the thought did occur to me..
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired October 25, 2002 - 09:17 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
TUCKER CARLSON, CNN ANCHOR: With the sniper suspects now in custody, state and federal prosecutors are meeting today to determine what charges to bring against John Allen Muhammad and John Lee Malvo. CNN legal analyst Jeffrey Toobin joins us now to talk about what they could be facing. What could they be facing?
JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: All sorts of bad things. I mean, there is going to be a prosecutorial turf battle to end all turf battles perhaps, unless everybody decides to behave like grown-ups. But, I mean, there are very different situations in Virginia, in the federal court, in Maryland and don't forget Alabama, which might have a claim on these guys too.
CARLSON: Now, is it possible they could wind up facing federal charges?
TOOBIN: You know, it is possible. Remember, they are in federal court now. The federal government now has become more much aggressive in bringing violent crime into the federal courts, but historically that has not been the case at all. There is no federal law against murder. You would have to sort of shoehorn these sniper attacks into perhaps a racketeering prosecution, into a continuing criminal enterprise prosecution. It's not clear to me how you could get this into federal court, but they have a lot of creative lawyers down there in Washington and they may be able to figure out a way.
CARLSON: Lawyers by definition are creative.
TOOBIN: That's what we do, make things up.
CARLSON: I've noticed. So when the charges are brought, we will find out who the government believes actually pulled the trigger, right?
TOOBIN: Maybe. That might not necessarily be evident in the initial indictment, because you could just charge them both with murder. You can get executed in this country even if you just drive the get-away car. It's called felony murder. If you're a co- conspirator, you can be executed even if you're not the triggerman, although juries tend to want to hear what the government's theory is of who actually did it. And as far as I know, it's not entirely clear. Remember, obviously, John Muhammad is older; he's the one with marksman training, but we don't know for sure that he was the one who pulled the trigger or either of them for that matter?
CARLSON: Now, at what point do we hear the details? When does the government essentially give its case over to the press so we can report it?
TOOBIN: Well, it's interesting. It depends on how they decide to frame the case. Certainly, within 30 days, the government has -- having arrested these guys in federal court, there is a 30-day clock that starts where they have to announce some further charges or dismiss the case, which, obviously, they are not going to do. Whether they file what is called a speaking indictment, which is an indictment that sort of explains how the government thinks it happened, or they could just do a very bare bones indictment, which would leave it until the trial for the government to spell out exactly how they feel the case happened. Don't know what they'll do.
CARLSON: Let's just quickly put you in the conjecture business. How likely do you think it is, if they are tried in Maryland, that they could wind up being executed in Maryland?
TOOBIN: I think it's highly unlikely that they would be executed there, because, remember, we are only talking about who files the case first. Virginia would certainly eventually file a case, and given the speed at which these cases move, it is highly likely even if Virginia went second, the execution might happen there first. But that's getting a ways ahead.
CARLSON: It's going to be a long process we will be covering carefully. Jeffrey Toobin, thanks, thanks for joining us.
Paula?
PAULA ZAHN, CNN ANCHOR: You can only imagine, Tucker, what Jeff's doing in the months to come.
TOOBIN: All sniper all the time.
CARLSON: Guaranteed employment. All right.
TOOBIN: You said it, not me, but the thought did occur to me..
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
