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American Morning

Interview with Thomas O'Neill

Aired December 03, 2002 - 08:35   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Boston's Roman Catholic archdiocese, faced with the prospect of more lawsuits alleging sexual abuse by priests right now considering bankruptcy. What would that then mean for the church and the alleged victims of clergy abuse?
Let's talk about it -- from Boston this morning, Thomas O'Neill is the former lieutenant governor of Massachusetts, and a former adviser to Boston's cardinal, Bernard Law.

Good morning to you, Mr. O'Neill. Good to have you. Want to emphasize...

THOMAS O'NEILL, FORMER ADVISER, CARDINAL BERNARD LAW: Good morning, Bill...

HEMMER: ... right now you no longer advise the cardinal. Just want to make that clear up front. What is the strategy right now for the church on this approach of bankruptcy?

O'NEILL: Well, I'm quite sure what they are trying to do is create a settlement between lawyers for the victims as well as the insurance companies to get them to come to the table and to agree on what the settlement ought to be. That aside, I think what we ought to be not losing thought about or our thinking should be focused on the victims, and the scandals of this church, and how those scandals have been swept under the rug, and how they have brought us to where we are today.

I think the side effects are terrible in that the traditional sources of giving to the church and its missions have subsided, and have dwindled dramatically, and even the sources of money giving that once have come into the church, there's been a straight arm by the hierarchy of this archdiocese, and this church in America to stop that from coming. The missions...

HEMMER: But you understand the law, though -- you understand the law, and you understand how the church will try and protect itself. You look back in August, you had -- what, 86 plaintiffs settling in August for about $10 million. If you don't go this route, does the church go bankrupt?

O'NEILL: Well, I think the church has to make a business decision, but a business decision in the face of hundreds of victims who have been scandalized by priests in our church, and they cannot be forgotten.

HEMMER: Let's look at the benefits of bankruptcy. I think you know this quite well. I just want to get a perspective here from the church's position, if this is what they are pursuing.

All legal action in the Boston area essentially, the civil cases, all that would cease. No new lawsuits could be filed. You essentially lump about 450 claimants into one class, increasing the chances for a settlement. I take your point. Legally it might be smart, but in terms of reflection on the community and trying to reinstill the faith in so many people who have essentially lost it right now for the church in Boston, how do you do it? How do you balance the two?

O'NEILL: I don't know how they balance the two, to be very honest with you. I think the church is in a predicament. On the one hand, they are trying to make a business decision. On the other, they are trying to maintain the moral persuasion and leadership of its community, and they are finding an awful difficult time in doing so.

HEMMER: Now, you say the church is suffering right now from spiritual bankruptcy. You live in that area. Tell us how.

O'NEILL: Well, I think that the forgiveness that has been asked for by Cardinal Law here in the archdiocese of Boston, I'm sure he means it, and I'm sure it's heartfelt. The fact of the matter is that there has not been a settlement with the victims, and that means that there's no resolve there. There is monies that have really shied away from coming into the church coffers in this arch diocese for its missions, and so we are bankrupt there, and there's no resolve.

Thirdly, the reason for these scandals being caused in the first place has to do, at least in part a dysfunctional priesthood, and questions looming about what the future of the priesthood in the catholic church is going to be, or the future rolls of the laity are going to be, and the future roles of women in the church are going to be as well. To ask...

HEMMER: Two questions -- go ahead, sorry. I apologize.

O'NEILL: To ask for forgiveness on the one hand is OK, to see unfulfilled and unresolved so many issues outstanding, I think stands in the way of people giving forgiveness to this cardinal in this diocese.

HEMMER: In a word, right now, Mr. O'Neill, do you think bankruptcy is the preferred path right now?

O'NEILL: I think, in a word, it's a ploy on the part of this archdiocese to get the lawyers for the victims together with the insurance companies to see if they can't settle, and I think that is a threat that the church has thrown in front of them.

HEMMER: And let me dovetail my next question off of that. Would it not be better to get a settlement, to keep the church solvent. It has tremendous assets, we all know that, but so many of those assets go to help so many charities, not only in the Boston area, but across the country. Would it not be better to keep the church healthy financially to make sure a lot of other people don't suffer down the line? O'NEILL: Absolutely. I think the missions of the church are all important, especially in this diocese, for all of the good that they do for so many hundreds of thousands of people, on the one hand. On the other hand, we can't lose sight of the fact that there are hundreds of victims in the scandals created by priests in this church over the last 20, 30, and 40 years and they can't be forgotten either.

HEMMER: We will see about 11,000 pages being released later today. We'll see what is contained in them at that point as well. Thomas O'Neill, former lieutenant governor in the state of Massachusetts -- the commonwealth of Massachusetts, I should say. Thanks for your time, sir.

O'NEILL: Thanks, Bill.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com







Aired December 3, 2002 - 08:35   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Boston's Roman Catholic archdiocese, faced with the prospect of more lawsuits alleging sexual abuse by priests right now considering bankruptcy. What would that then mean for the church and the alleged victims of clergy abuse?
Let's talk about it -- from Boston this morning, Thomas O'Neill is the former lieutenant governor of Massachusetts, and a former adviser to Boston's cardinal, Bernard Law.

Good morning to you, Mr. O'Neill. Good to have you. Want to emphasize...

THOMAS O'NEILL, FORMER ADVISER, CARDINAL BERNARD LAW: Good morning, Bill...

HEMMER: ... right now you no longer advise the cardinal. Just want to make that clear up front. What is the strategy right now for the church on this approach of bankruptcy?

O'NEILL: Well, I'm quite sure what they are trying to do is create a settlement between lawyers for the victims as well as the insurance companies to get them to come to the table and to agree on what the settlement ought to be. That aside, I think what we ought to be not losing thought about or our thinking should be focused on the victims, and the scandals of this church, and how those scandals have been swept under the rug, and how they have brought us to where we are today.

I think the side effects are terrible in that the traditional sources of giving to the church and its missions have subsided, and have dwindled dramatically, and even the sources of money giving that once have come into the church, there's been a straight arm by the hierarchy of this archdiocese, and this church in America to stop that from coming. The missions...

HEMMER: But you understand the law, though -- you understand the law, and you understand how the church will try and protect itself. You look back in August, you had -- what, 86 plaintiffs settling in August for about $10 million. If you don't go this route, does the church go bankrupt?

O'NEILL: Well, I think the church has to make a business decision, but a business decision in the face of hundreds of victims who have been scandalized by priests in our church, and they cannot be forgotten.

HEMMER: Let's look at the benefits of bankruptcy. I think you know this quite well. I just want to get a perspective here from the church's position, if this is what they are pursuing.

All legal action in the Boston area essentially, the civil cases, all that would cease. No new lawsuits could be filed. You essentially lump about 450 claimants into one class, increasing the chances for a settlement. I take your point. Legally it might be smart, but in terms of reflection on the community and trying to reinstill the faith in so many people who have essentially lost it right now for the church in Boston, how do you do it? How do you balance the two?

O'NEILL: I don't know how they balance the two, to be very honest with you. I think the church is in a predicament. On the one hand, they are trying to make a business decision. On the other, they are trying to maintain the moral persuasion and leadership of its community, and they are finding an awful difficult time in doing so.

HEMMER: Now, you say the church is suffering right now from spiritual bankruptcy. You live in that area. Tell us how.

O'NEILL: Well, I think that the forgiveness that has been asked for by Cardinal Law here in the archdiocese of Boston, I'm sure he means it, and I'm sure it's heartfelt. The fact of the matter is that there has not been a settlement with the victims, and that means that there's no resolve there. There is monies that have really shied away from coming into the church coffers in this arch diocese for its missions, and so we are bankrupt there, and there's no resolve.

Thirdly, the reason for these scandals being caused in the first place has to do, at least in part a dysfunctional priesthood, and questions looming about what the future of the priesthood in the catholic church is going to be, or the future rolls of the laity are going to be, and the future roles of women in the church are going to be as well. To ask...

HEMMER: Two questions -- go ahead, sorry. I apologize.

O'NEILL: To ask for forgiveness on the one hand is OK, to see unfulfilled and unresolved so many issues outstanding, I think stands in the way of people giving forgiveness to this cardinal in this diocese.

HEMMER: In a word, right now, Mr. O'Neill, do you think bankruptcy is the preferred path right now?

O'NEILL: I think, in a word, it's a ploy on the part of this archdiocese to get the lawyers for the victims together with the insurance companies to see if they can't settle, and I think that is a threat that the church has thrown in front of them.

HEMMER: And let me dovetail my next question off of that. Would it not be better to get a settlement, to keep the church solvent. It has tremendous assets, we all know that, but so many of those assets go to help so many charities, not only in the Boston area, but across the country. Would it not be better to keep the church healthy financially to make sure a lot of other people don't suffer down the line? O'NEILL: Absolutely. I think the missions of the church are all important, especially in this diocese, for all of the good that they do for so many hundreds of thousands of people, on the one hand. On the other hand, we can't lose sight of the fact that there are hundreds of victims in the scandals created by priests in this church over the last 20, 30, and 40 years and they can't be forgotten either.

HEMMER: We will see about 11,000 pages being released later today. We'll see what is contained in them at that point as well. Thomas O'Neill, former lieutenant governor in the state of Massachusetts -- the commonwealth of Massachusetts, I should say. Thanks for your time, sir.

O'NEILL: Thanks, Bill.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com