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American Morning

Interview With Robin Cook on Clonaid Controversy

Aired January 07, 2003 - 07:16   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: It appears that no confirmation is now forthcoming from Clonaid -- that's the company that claims to have created the first human clone. Almost from the moment the announcement was made, the world was left wondering whether or not this was a monumental event or rather this was an elaborate hoax.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BRIGETTE BOISSELIER, SCIENTIFIC DIRECTOR, CLONAID: I am very, very pleased to announce that the first baby clone is born.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HEMMER: December 27, Clonaid, an organization linked to the Raelian religious sect, claims it's created the first human clone, a 7 pound baby girl delivered by C-section and dubbed Baby Eve.

At the press conference, Clonaid's founder says science journalist Michael Guillen, along with an independent team of experts, would evaluate the company's claim and determine if the baby was indeed a clone of its mother.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MICHAEL GUILLEN, SCIENCE JOURNALIST: And I have accepted on behalf of the world's press on two conditions: That the invitation be given with no strings attached whatsoever, and No. 2, that the tests be conducted by a group of independent world-class experts.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HEMMER: A few days later, December 30, Clonaid says the baby and her unidentified parents are back home in the U.S.

Brigette Boisselier promises that DNA testing on the cloned baby would provide the proof the world is waiting for, but the parents apparently decide against any testing.

Then, January 4, just a week after their initial announcement, Clonaid announces another delivery, a second cloned baby. This one allegedly born to a same-sex couple in The Netherlands.

But with still no proof to support their claims, Michael Guillen now says he's suspending his review. In a statement yesterday, Guillen says: "The team of scientists cannot verify first-hand the claim that a human baby has been cloned. It's still entirely possible Clonaid's announcement is part of an elaborate hoax intended to bring publicity to the Raelian movement."

Let's talk about more about the Clonaid controversy right now. Our guest, the author of many best-selling medical thrillers, Dr. Robin Cook is in Boston with us this morning.

Dr. good morning to you -- good to see you.

DR. ROBIN COOK, AUTHOR: Good morning.

HEMMER: Was all of this a fallacy? Was it all a lie? Would you go that far?

COOK: I'd have to say that was my first response when I heard it, and -- but it doesn't surprise me in the certain sense that these people might make such a claim, because I suppose it advances their agenda in some sort of form or fashion. Cloning is part of their dogma, if you will.

But you know what? This episode does raise two kind of disturbing points, and that is, the media seems to be willing to jump onto situations like this, involving stories about cloning, more than they would about something else. And it kind of makes me think that whether the media is being duped in some respects.

The other thing that this disturbs me about is the fact that this might very well add to the ongoing debate that's going on right now about cloning, because unfortunately, cloning has become politicized in this country. And there are two sides to this story. There's reproductive cloning, which is what this story would be about, but there's also therapeutic cloning, which is in a sense cloning cells.

HEMMER: Let me stop you there, Doctor.

COOK: And a lot of times...

HEMMER: Do you believe right now there is a Baby Eve?

COOK: No, I don't. I really don't. I think that if there were, that they would have presented some sort of documentation, along with the announcement.

HEMMER: Certainly, and can't argue with...

COOK: That's what happens...

HEMMER: And can't argue with that. But why then go public and create the publicity that you mention here, even if it's bad publicity, bad publicity that is even misleading if the individual doesn't even exist on this planet?

COOK: Well, as I said earlier, I think that there is some way that this type of publicity advances the agenda of these people, the Raelians. Cloning is part of their dogma, and maybe it's some way that they think can advance their cause, to get them more people, to get more interest in their group and whatever.

HEMMER: Yes...

COOK: I don't know for sure.

HEMMER: Yes, and I understand that, though. But I'm just trying to take it a step further here and understand, why do it if it's not true? Why do it if you're going to have the whole world come down on you and say, you guys were a farce to begin with? You came out publicly, you told the world you had this baby, and at this point, there is no proof..

COOK: Well, that's true. And -- but this group presents itself as a religion, and people with religious beliefs do things that other people might not understand. And yet, in some respects, I think you can see how it could advance their agenda in some form or fashion.

HEMMER: Yes, just about 15 seconds left here. How -- give us a layman's perspective for how easy or how difficult it is at this point to clone a human being.

COOK: Well, the technique is not that difficult. It's not that hard to learn how to do, and there are a lot of people that can do it. It's called nuclear transfer. And any center that does in vitro fertilization could learn this technique and could have a cell, a pre- embryo if you will, that could be implantable. And the same techniques would be used as are used with in vitro fertilization. So, it is possible.

The problem is, if there are a lot of unaffiliated infertility centers that are doing this kind of thing without any oversight.

HEMMER: Got it. We've got to run. Dr. Robin Cook live in Boston this morning -- thanks for talking. The Raelian movement again, more on this throughout the morning here.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com.







Aired January 7, 2003 - 07:16   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: It appears that no confirmation is now forthcoming from Clonaid -- that's the company that claims to have created the first human clone. Almost from the moment the announcement was made, the world was left wondering whether or not this was a monumental event or rather this was an elaborate hoax.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BRIGETTE BOISSELIER, SCIENTIFIC DIRECTOR, CLONAID: I am very, very pleased to announce that the first baby clone is born.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HEMMER: December 27, Clonaid, an organization linked to the Raelian religious sect, claims it's created the first human clone, a 7 pound baby girl delivered by C-section and dubbed Baby Eve.

At the press conference, Clonaid's founder says science journalist Michael Guillen, along with an independent team of experts, would evaluate the company's claim and determine if the baby was indeed a clone of its mother.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MICHAEL GUILLEN, SCIENCE JOURNALIST: And I have accepted on behalf of the world's press on two conditions: That the invitation be given with no strings attached whatsoever, and No. 2, that the tests be conducted by a group of independent world-class experts.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HEMMER: A few days later, December 30, Clonaid says the baby and her unidentified parents are back home in the U.S.

Brigette Boisselier promises that DNA testing on the cloned baby would provide the proof the world is waiting for, but the parents apparently decide against any testing.

Then, January 4, just a week after their initial announcement, Clonaid announces another delivery, a second cloned baby. This one allegedly born to a same-sex couple in The Netherlands.

But with still no proof to support their claims, Michael Guillen now says he's suspending his review. In a statement yesterday, Guillen says: "The team of scientists cannot verify first-hand the claim that a human baby has been cloned. It's still entirely possible Clonaid's announcement is part of an elaborate hoax intended to bring publicity to the Raelian movement."

Let's talk about more about the Clonaid controversy right now. Our guest, the author of many best-selling medical thrillers, Dr. Robin Cook is in Boston with us this morning.

Dr. good morning to you -- good to see you.

DR. ROBIN COOK, AUTHOR: Good morning.

HEMMER: Was all of this a fallacy? Was it all a lie? Would you go that far?

COOK: I'd have to say that was my first response when I heard it, and -- but it doesn't surprise me in the certain sense that these people might make such a claim, because I suppose it advances their agenda in some sort of form or fashion. Cloning is part of their dogma, if you will.

But you know what? This episode does raise two kind of disturbing points, and that is, the media seems to be willing to jump onto situations like this, involving stories about cloning, more than they would about something else. And it kind of makes me think that whether the media is being duped in some respects.

The other thing that this disturbs me about is the fact that this might very well add to the ongoing debate that's going on right now about cloning, because unfortunately, cloning has become politicized in this country. And there are two sides to this story. There's reproductive cloning, which is what this story would be about, but there's also therapeutic cloning, which is in a sense cloning cells.

HEMMER: Let me stop you there, Doctor.

COOK: And a lot of times...

HEMMER: Do you believe right now there is a Baby Eve?

COOK: No, I don't. I really don't. I think that if there were, that they would have presented some sort of documentation, along with the announcement.

HEMMER: Certainly, and can't argue with...

COOK: That's what happens...

HEMMER: And can't argue with that. But why then go public and create the publicity that you mention here, even if it's bad publicity, bad publicity that is even misleading if the individual doesn't even exist on this planet?

COOK: Well, as I said earlier, I think that there is some way that this type of publicity advances the agenda of these people, the Raelians. Cloning is part of their dogma, and maybe it's some way that they think can advance their cause, to get them more people, to get more interest in their group and whatever.

HEMMER: Yes...

COOK: I don't know for sure.

HEMMER: Yes, and I understand that, though. But I'm just trying to take it a step further here and understand, why do it if it's not true? Why do it if you're going to have the whole world come down on you and say, you guys were a farce to begin with? You came out publicly, you told the world you had this baby, and at this point, there is no proof..

COOK: Well, that's true. And -- but this group presents itself as a religion, and people with religious beliefs do things that other people might not understand. And yet, in some respects, I think you can see how it could advance their agenda in some form or fashion.

HEMMER: Yes, just about 15 seconds left here. How -- give us a layman's perspective for how easy or how difficult it is at this point to clone a human being.

COOK: Well, the technique is not that difficult. It's not that hard to learn how to do, and there are a lot of people that can do it. It's called nuclear transfer. And any center that does in vitro fertilization could learn this technique and could have a cell, a pre- embryo if you will, that could be implantable. And the same techniques would be used as are used with in vitro fertilization. So, it is possible.

The problem is, if there are a lot of unaffiliated infertility centers that are doing this kind of thing without any oversight.

HEMMER: Got it. We've got to run. Dr. Robin Cook live in Boston this morning -- thanks for talking. The Raelian movement again, more on this throughout the morning here.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com.