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American Morning

The Politics of Race

Aired January 15, 2003 - 10:15   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


LEON HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: Race and politics are taking center stage at the White House, as President Bush prepares to weigh in on the most far-reaching affirmative action case in a generation.
CNN has learned that the president is likely to file a brief with the Supreme Court tomorrow, opposing the University of Michigan's affirmative action program.

White House spokesman Ari Fleischer addressed this issue on Monday.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ARI FLEISCHER, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECY.: The president, as I indicated, as governor of Texas, is very sensitive and very aware of the pros and the cons of issues involving race. This case is a particularly important case, because it will -- as the Supreme Court has accepted it, it could potentially lead to a definition across the nation about what standards are allowable in terms of society dealing with questions about admissions and race. These are issues that are terribly important to all people in the United States, black and white and all Americans.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARRIS: The Supreme Court case has major implications for president bush as he tries to reach out to minority voters, at least in word, also while pleasing his conservative base. With a look at the political stakes is our senior political analyst Bill Schneider, who is here in Atlanta with us for once.

Good to see you.

WILLIAM SCHNEIDER, CNN SR. ANALYST: Good to see you.

HARRIS: Very interesting. What I've been hearing since the word came out that the president may be weighing in finally on this, because many people were waiting to see which side he'd go, it's interesting in this administration that it considers even coming out against the University of Michigan program, in the wake of what we've seen happen with the Trent Lott affair, as well as all of the conversation about Judge Pickering as well.

What do you make of all of this?

SCHNEIDER: What I make of it is that the administration is under lot of pressure to show that when it talks about inclusion of minorities, when it talks about outreach, particularly to African- Americans, that it's not just talk, that they have -- they are really going to change their policy or accommodate their policy so they show that the Republican Party is really on the side of minorities. And they're under pressure to do that here.

The problem is, for conservatives, this case is cut and dry. This is a case of preferential treatment, not simply outreach, preferential treatment, quotas, and they say there's no other position the president can take.

HARRIS: So if what we're hearing is true about which side the president is going to take on this, he's been given the choice of reaching out to minorities or reaching out to his conservative base, he's choosing the conservative base.

SCHNEIDER: Well, he's going, apparently, with what the conservatives want him to do, which is to oppose the program at University of Michigan's program. But I'm sure that when he explains his position, he's going to argue that that this program goes too far, that this program sets up a quota. It awards points to minority groups when they compete for admission to the University of Michigan Law School, and he's going to say that really is too far, because he believes, like most Americans, in fact, with the idea of affirmative action as outreach, that you should help disadvantaged groups meet the prevailing standards of competition. That's fair. But you don't change the standards of competition by saying to certain applicants you don't have to meet the standards as other people, you can meet lower standards. That's where most Americans and the president will draw the line.

HARRIS: But you know, for the critics of his on racial issues, and I've talked to a number of them over the last couple of years, to hear him just say that is not going to be enough.

SCHNEIDER: That's right.

HARRIS: Do you expect, should we expect the president to come out and say, no, that shouldn't happen, but here is what should happen? Does the administration cop come up with a suggestion of what would be an acceptable program?

SCHNEIDER: Yes, I'm sure they well. They can't simply oppose the University of Michigan's program simply without saying we have another way of dealing with minority issues, we have another way of supporting affirmative action in such a way that it doesn't involve quotas or preferences. They have to do that. There will be an immediate outcry that the president is all talk, no action, in the end, when the chips are down, he opposed minority interests.

He has to say, no, I don't, I have an alternative way of dealing witness. He can point to a program that he supported in Texas for admission to the University of Texas college system, whereby what they said was the top 10 percent of every graduating class in Texas, no matter the background, they will be admitted to the college.

HARRIS: As I read it, what happened with that program, it resulted in immediate decreases in the levels of minorities that showed up in medical schools and law schools in Texas.

Let me ask you this, what does this administration do, or what can it do, then, to appease those critics then, particularly in the majority community, who say still what we're seeing is saying one thing and doing another. You say one thing, you show them one thing by including Colin Powell in your cabinet, Condoleezza Rice. But all of a sudden you're like Helen Keller when it comes to the rebel flag, whether in Texas or in South Carolina, going to Bob Jones University to campaign taking eight days to speak out against Trent Lott. There are critics who have been saying, you know what, we hear what you say, but we're also watch what you do here.

SCHNEIDER: What you have to do is come up with a program of action, and we haven't seen it yet. And simply by opposing the University of Michigan, it's going to raise those suspicions higher, that he really has nothing to say, that he has no program on civil rights or minorities. His father vetoed a civil rights bill when he was president, and there was a tremendous backlash against that. This president has got to say, there is a problem there, I acknowledge a problem, there is not equality of opportunity in this country, and the government has to could something to make sure there is equality of opportunity. He's got to make sure he has a program.

At the moment, the whole country is waiting to see what the country is. Simply, saying no, we oppose the University of Michigan, that isn't a program.

HARRIS: That's not enough. Exactly. Bill Schneider, thank you. It's going to an interesting debate in the next 48 hours or so.

Certainly will be.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com






Aired January 15, 2003 - 10:15   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
LEON HARRIS, CNN ANCHOR: Race and politics are taking center stage at the White House, as President Bush prepares to weigh in on the most far-reaching affirmative action case in a generation.
CNN has learned that the president is likely to file a brief with the Supreme Court tomorrow, opposing the University of Michigan's affirmative action program.

White House spokesman Ari Fleischer addressed this issue on Monday.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ARI FLEISCHER, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECY.: The president, as I indicated, as governor of Texas, is very sensitive and very aware of the pros and the cons of issues involving race. This case is a particularly important case, because it will -- as the Supreme Court has accepted it, it could potentially lead to a definition across the nation about what standards are allowable in terms of society dealing with questions about admissions and race. These are issues that are terribly important to all people in the United States, black and white and all Americans.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARRIS: The Supreme Court case has major implications for president bush as he tries to reach out to minority voters, at least in word, also while pleasing his conservative base. With a look at the political stakes is our senior political analyst Bill Schneider, who is here in Atlanta with us for once.

Good to see you.

WILLIAM SCHNEIDER, CNN SR. ANALYST: Good to see you.

HARRIS: Very interesting. What I've been hearing since the word came out that the president may be weighing in finally on this, because many people were waiting to see which side he'd go, it's interesting in this administration that it considers even coming out against the University of Michigan program, in the wake of what we've seen happen with the Trent Lott affair, as well as all of the conversation about Judge Pickering as well.

What do you make of all of this?

SCHNEIDER: What I make of it is that the administration is under lot of pressure to show that when it talks about inclusion of minorities, when it talks about outreach, particularly to African- Americans, that it's not just talk, that they have -- they are really going to change their policy or accommodate their policy so they show that the Republican Party is really on the side of minorities. And they're under pressure to do that here.

The problem is, for conservatives, this case is cut and dry. This is a case of preferential treatment, not simply outreach, preferential treatment, quotas, and they say there's no other position the president can take.

HARRIS: So if what we're hearing is true about which side the president is going to take on this, he's been given the choice of reaching out to minorities or reaching out to his conservative base, he's choosing the conservative base.

SCHNEIDER: Well, he's going, apparently, with what the conservatives want him to do, which is to oppose the program at University of Michigan's program. But I'm sure that when he explains his position, he's going to argue that that this program goes too far, that this program sets up a quota. It awards points to minority groups when they compete for admission to the University of Michigan Law School, and he's going to say that really is too far, because he believes, like most Americans, in fact, with the idea of affirmative action as outreach, that you should help disadvantaged groups meet the prevailing standards of competition. That's fair. But you don't change the standards of competition by saying to certain applicants you don't have to meet the standards as other people, you can meet lower standards. That's where most Americans and the president will draw the line.

HARRIS: But you know, for the critics of his on racial issues, and I've talked to a number of them over the last couple of years, to hear him just say that is not going to be enough.

SCHNEIDER: That's right.

HARRIS: Do you expect, should we expect the president to come out and say, no, that shouldn't happen, but here is what should happen? Does the administration cop come up with a suggestion of what would be an acceptable program?

SCHNEIDER: Yes, I'm sure they well. They can't simply oppose the University of Michigan's program simply without saying we have another way of dealing with minority issues, we have another way of supporting affirmative action in such a way that it doesn't involve quotas or preferences. They have to do that. There will be an immediate outcry that the president is all talk, no action, in the end, when the chips are down, he opposed minority interests.

He has to say, no, I don't, I have an alternative way of dealing witness. He can point to a program that he supported in Texas for admission to the University of Texas college system, whereby what they said was the top 10 percent of every graduating class in Texas, no matter the background, they will be admitted to the college.

HARRIS: As I read it, what happened with that program, it resulted in immediate decreases in the levels of minorities that showed up in medical schools and law schools in Texas.

Let me ask you this, what does this administration do, or what can it do, then, to appease those critics then, particularly in the majority community, who say still what we're seeing is saying one thing and doing another. You say one thing, you show them one thing by including Colin Powell in your cabinet, Condoleezza Rice. But all of a sudden you're like Helen Keller when it comes to the rebel flag, whether in Texas or in South Carolina, going to Bob Jones University to campaign taking eight days to speak out against Trent Lott. There are critics who have been saying, you know what, we hear what you say, but we're also watch what you do here.

SCHNEIDER: What you have to do is come up with a program of action, and we haven't seen it yet. And simply by opposing the University of Michigan, it's going to raise those suspicions higher, that he really has nothing to say, that he has no program on civil rights or minorities. His father vetoed a civil rights bill when he was president, and there was a tremendous backlash against that. This president has got to say, there is a problem there, I acknowledge a problem, there is not equality of opportunity in this country, and the government has to could something to make sure there is equality of opportunity. He's got to make sure he has a program.

At the moment, the whole country is waiting to see what the country is. Simply, saying no, we oppose the University of Michigan, that isn't a program.

HARRIS: That's not enough. Exactly. Bill Schneider, thank you. It's going to an interesting debate in the next 48 hours or so.

Certainly will be.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com