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American Morning

Powell Says Hussein Won't Stop Until Something Stops Him

Aired February 06, 2003 - 07:34   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


PAULA ZAHN, CNN ANCHOR: Colin Powell says Saddam Hussein won't stop until something stops him. And the secretary of state says war may be the only way to do it. Powell revealed evidence yesterday to show the U.N. Security Council that Iraq is hiding banned weapons from inspectors.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

COLIN POWELL, SECRETARY OF STATE: Everything we have seen and heard indicates that instead of cooperating actively with the inspectors to ensure the success of their mission, Saddam Hussein and his regime are busy doing all they possibly can to ensure that inspectors succeed in finding absolutely nothing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ZAHN: Response to Colin Powell's speech is trickling in from all over the world.

Let's get some Arab world reaction now from Rula Amin, who joins us from Amman, Jordan -- good morning, Rula.

RULA AMIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Paula.

Colin Powell's case was simply not convincing in most of the Arab world. Across Arab capitals, Arabic newspapers described the evidence as no proof. I'll give you one example. This is a Jordanian newspaper. It's called "The Arab Ilian (ph)." It says that Colin Powell presented excuses to launch war. It didn't say evidence. And this is something that's been echoed in most of the newspapers. We spoke to people also on the street who were more blunt. They used words like "silly," "ridiculous." They said the evidence was fabricated. The only convincing part in that speech, it seems, for the people here in the Arab world was that the U.S. is set to launch this war and people here are not convinced that this war is justifiable.

On an official level, government officials have not made any comment. It seems that they have rather to be silent. They're having a hard time supporting this speech while they know that there's a lot of skepticism in the street. However, there are attempts by Arab governments to try to find kind of last minute compromise. We know that the president of Egypt, Hosni Mubarak, is going to come here to Amman to meet with King Abdullah of Jordan on Saturday.

The Saudis, Saudi Foreign Minister Saud al-Faisal, had been making comments, saying that the Saudis are trying to come up with some kind of compromise. They will present it to the Security Council, saying that they will try to guarantee some kind of amnesty to all government officials in Iraq. In return, Iraq has to open up to some kind of an international force. In his words, they are trying to preserve the administration in Iraq that is present now. At the same time, avoid war -- Paula.

ZAHN: Rula Amin, thank you very much for that update from Jordan this morning.

Was Secretary Powell's presentation strong enough to win over other skeptics?

Joining us now from Washington, Ambassador Joseph Wilson, former U.S. charge d'affairs in Iraq, currently the adjunct scholar at the Middle East Institute.

Welcome back, Ambassador.

AMB. JOSEPH WILSON, FORMER U.S. CHARGE D'AFFAIRS: Good morning, Paula.

I'm back from the West and walking on two feet.

ZAHN: Well, I'm happy to hear that.

Let's talk about the secretary of state's speech yesterday. Do you think he built a convincing case that Iraq is hiding weapons of mass destruction?

WILSON: Well, let me say, first of all, Paula, I certainly do not consider myself to be a skeptic in all of this. Colin Powell is a man of unimpeachable integrity and he made a compelling case yesterday. But that case, essentially on the disarmament part of it, has been made by the Iraqis themselves since their bogus declaration of December.

The question is not whether or not the Iraqis are bad guys or whether or not they need to be disarmed. The question is whether or not it requires a total ground invasion, conquest of the country, violent deaths to thousands of Iraqis and a subsequent 10 year occupation in order to achieve that objective. And that hasn't been discussed and that certainly was not in his speech yesterday.

With respect to the terrorism part, I must say I was struck by the links that he drew between al Qaeda, Iraq and certainly the death of our embassy official, our AID official in Jordan. The president has often said that ties between al Qaeda and countries hosting them makes the countries subject to U.S. retribution.

So I, that case, it seems to me, is one that doesn't require any other U.N. approval. The United States would be well within its rights to act under legitimate self-defense if the administration is as convinced as Secretary Powell suggested in his presentation yesterday.

ZAHN: So you raised a lot of questions right now about what the ramifications of war would be. Short of what you said would be a broad military strike, what else do you think it will take to get Saddam Hussein to comply?

WILSON: Well, I think we need to ratchet up the inspection regime. It'll be interesting to see what Mr. Blix and Mr. ElBaradei are able to get from Saddam this weekend. At a minimum, we've got to have oversight. And I think we probably need to have an enhanced enforcement mechanism, one that's clearly understood by the international community and by Iraq, so that when we see these tactics employed by the Iraqis of moving stuff out the back door as the inspectors are coming in the front door, we can take the appropriate action so that they don't succeed in further defying the inspection regime.

Again...

ZAHN: So you really believe that allowing an extended period of inspections will yield more information than we've got now?

WILSON: We certainly, at the last inspection regime, people talk about four years it took to get all the information, but those were four years well spent and a lot of material was found. What I do believe is that if, you ought to consider total war in the context of the next best alternative. And if the next best alternative is better than total war, then at a minimum it ought to be considered. Ken Pollack, who is often on your show, posits four questions in his book that need to be answered before we consider war. Two of those are the American people need to understand what the cost to our treasury and to our soldiers and to our international prestige are going to be of a lengthy occupation. And, two, that we just need to understand that we're talking about a lengthy occupation in a country that is fiercely nationalistic and may well come to resent our presence rather than continue to welcome it.

ZAHN: Some points you raised in an "L.A. Times" editorial that we don't have time to go into, but I'm going to share a little bit of it will Bill now.

Ambassador Joseph Wilson, as always, good to have you on the air with us.

WILSON: It's nice to be you, Paula.

Read the editorial.

ZAHN: Yes, I have. He had a line here. He said, "He reminded me," referring to Saddam Hussein, "of a big cat at the watering hole with the zebra and the antelope wondering whether he is there to drink or to eat."

And then he goes on to say that he believes that Saddam Hussein would not hesitate to use weapons of mass destruction if attacked.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com







Aired February 6, 2003 - 07:34   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
PAULA ZAHN, CNN ANCHOR: Colin Powell says Saddam Hussein won't stop until something stops him. And the secretary of state says war may be the only way to do it. Powell revealed evidence yesterday to show the U.N. Security Council that Iraq is hiding banned weapons from inspectors.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

COLIN POWELL, SECRETARY OF STATE: Everything we have seen and heard indicates that instead of cooperating actively with the inspectors to ensure the success of their mission, Saddam Hussein and his regime are busy doing all they possibly can to ensure that inspectors succeed in finding absolutely nothing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ZAHN: Response to Colin Powell's speech is trickling in from all over the world.

Let's get some Arab world reaction now from Rula Amin, who joins us from Amman, Jordan -- good morning, Rula.

RULA AMIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Paula.

Colin Powell's case was simply not convincing in most of the Arab world. Across Arab capitals, Arabic newspapers described the evidence as no proof. I'll give you one example. This is a Jordanian newspaper. It's called "The Arab Ilian (ph)." It says that Colin Powell presented excuses to launch war. It didn't say evidence. And this is something that's been echoed in most of the newspapers. We spoke to people also on the street who were more blunt. They used words like "silly," "ridiculous." They said the evidence was fabricated. The only convincing part in that speech, it seems, for the people here in the Arab world was that the U.S. is set to launch this war and people here are not convinced that this war is justifiable.

On an official level, government officials have not made any comment. It seems that they have rather to be silent. They're having a hard time supporting this speech while they know that there's a lot of skepticism in the street. However, there are attempts by Arab governments to try to find kind of last minute compromise. We know that the president of Egypt, Hosni Mubarak, is going to come here to Amman to meet with King Abdullah of Jordan on Saturday.

The Saudis, Saudi Foreign Minister Saud al-Faisal, had been making comments, saying that the Saudis are trying to come up with some kind of compromise. They will present it to the Security Council, saying that they will try to guarantee some kind of amnesty to all government officials in Iraq. In return, Iraq has to open up to some kind of an international force. In his words, they are trying to preserve the administration in Iraq that is present now. At the same time, avoid war -- Paula.

ZAHN: Rula Amin, thank you very much for that update from Jordan this morning.

Was Secretary Powell's presentation strong enough to win over other skeptics?

Joining us now from Washington, Ambassador Joseph Wilson, former U.S. charge d'affairs in Iraq, currently the adjunct scholar at the Middle East Institute.

Welcome back, Ambassador.

AMB. JOSEPH WILSON, FORMER U.S. CHARGE D'AFFAIRS: Good morning, Paula.

I'm back from the West and walking on two feet.

ZAHN: Well, I'm happy to hear that.

Let's talk about the secretary of state's speech yesterday. Do you think he built a convincing case that Iraq is hiding weapons of mass destruction?

WILSON: Well, let me say, first of all, Paula, I certainly do not consider myself to be a skeptic in all of this. Colin Powell is a man of unimpeachable integrity and he made a compelling case yesterday. But that case, essentially on the disarmament part of it, has been made by the Iraqis themselves since their bogus declaration of December.

The question is not whether or not the Iraqis are bad guys or whether or not they need to be disarmed. The question is whether or not it requires a total ground invasion, conquest of the country, violent deaths to thousands of Iraqis and a subsequent 10 year occupation in order to achieve that objective. And that hasn't been discussed and that certainly was not in his speech yesterday.

With respect to the terrorism part, I must say I was struck by the links that he drew between al Qaeda, Iraq and certainly the death of our embassy official, our AID official in Jordan. The president has often said that ties between al Qaeda and countries hosting them makes the countries subject to U.S. retribution.

So I, that case, it seems to me, is one that doesn't require any other U.N. approval. The United States would be well within its rights to act under legitimate self-defense if the administration is as convinced as Secretary Powell suggested in his presentation yesterday.

ZAHN: So you raised a lot of questions right now about what the ramifications of war would be. Short of what you said would be a broad military strike, what else do you think it will take to get Saddam Hussein to comply?

WILSON: Well, I think we need to ratchet up the inspection regime. It'll be interesting to see what Mr. Blix and Mr. ElBaradei are able to get from Saddam this weekend. At a minimum, we've got to have oversight. And I think we probably need to have an enhanced enforcement mechanism, one that's clearly understood by the international community and by Iraq, so that when we see these tactics employed by the Iraqis of moving stuff out the back door as the inspectors are coming in the front door, we can take the appropriate action so that they don't succeed in further defying the inspection regime.

Again...

ZAHN: So you really believe that allowing an extended period of inspections will yield more information than we've got now?

WILSON: We certainly, at the last inspection regime, people talk about four years it took to get all the information, but those were four years well spent and a lot of material was found. What I do believe is that if, you ought to consider total war in the context of the next best alternative. And if the next best alternative is better than total war, then at a minimum it ought to be considered. Ken Pollack, who is often on your show, posits four questions in his book that need to be answered before we consider war. Two of those are the American people need to understand what the cost to our treasury and to our soldiers and to our international prestige are going to be of a lengthy occupation. And, two, that we just need to understand that we're talking about a lengthy occupation in a country that is fiercely nationalistic and may well come to resent our presence rather than continue to welcome it.

ZAHN: Some points you raised in an "L.A. Times" editorial that we don't have time to go into, but I'm going to share a little bit of it will Bill now.

Ambassador Joseph Wilson, as always, good to have you on the air with us.

WILSON: It's nice to be you, Paula.

Read the editorial.

ZAHN: Yes, I have. He had a line here. He said, "He reminded me," referring to Saddam Hussein, "of a big cat at the watering hole with the zebra and the antelope wondering whether he is there to drink or to eat."

And then he goes on to say that he believes that Saddam Hussein would not hesitate to use weapons of mass destruction if attacked.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com