Return to Transcripts main page
American Morning
Interview with Dan Rather
Aired February 28, 2003 - 09:07 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
PAULA ZAHN, CNN ANCHOR: Dan Rather joins me now to talk about the interview and his time with Saddam Hussein and some of the reaction, both positive and negative to the interview.
Good to see you. Congratulations.
DAN RATHER, CBS NEWS ANCHOR: Thank you, Paula.
ZAHN: Even your competitors in the very vicious evening news circle have called this a great get.
RATHER: Well, they're classic, and I really appreciate that.
ZAHN: Let's talk a little bit about what Saddam Hussein told you specifically about the Al Samoud II missiles. Iraq now saying it will plan to destroy them after some meetings are being held about exactly how to do that perhaps with inspections on hand. Here's what Saddam Hussein told but those missiles.
Let's listen:
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RATHER: So you do not intend to destroy these missiles?
SADDAM HUSSEIN, IRAQI PRESIDENT (through translator): Which missiles are you talking about? We do not have missiles that go beyond the prescribed ranges by the U.N.?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ZAHN: How much of what he told you did you actually believe?
RATHER: Well, that's up for each person to make a decision for themselves. I'm always skeptical. I try hard to not let my skepticism harden into cynicism at any point. But skeptical attitude is necessary for journalism, so I'm skeptical about anything in a political issue tells me.
But on the Al Samoud missiles, it was very clear what they do in Texas called the old sidestep. He basically said I don't have missiles with the range that the U.N. says that I have. And I thought he strongly indicated that at that moment he was trying to convince the world that he wasn't going to destroy these missiles. I don't think you read it any other way. Somebody said, well, he didn't strongly indicate he had it. But this is Saddam Hussein, a cornered leader, fighting for his survival at his best or worst, depending on your point of view. Certainly from President Bush's point of view and the American point of view, he's at his worst doing this.
He's a cornered fox, that he's -- it's essential to understand that he's a survivor. He sees himself as the ultimate survivor. So when pressed about these missiles, he's going to do the old sidestep, he's going to say, well, I don't really have these missiles, and three or four days later, he's going to say, well, while I don't have missiles of the range they say I have, as a gesture toward peace, I'll destroy them maybe. That's where we are today. And that's why you heard Prime Minister Blair say, look, this is just more games playing. It's all in the doing. We'll see. On missiles blown up and plowed into the ground this weekend, I'm skeptical, but I'm on a show-me basis.
ZAHN: If he lied to you, though, when he answered that question? I know you're saying he did the sidestep.
RATHER: Well, it certainly dealt insofestry (ph). I'm not here to judge whether somebody lied or didn't lie. You take a loot at it. He never said, I won't destroy them or I will destroy them. What he said is I don't have missiles with that range.
But in a way, Paula, I think this is a classic example of keeping the focus on something that President Bush, Tony Blair and others who are convinced that we have to do a lot more, they must get frustrated, because when you talk about 360 tons of weapons grades chemicals, which the American administration, the British believe he has, when you talk about anthrax and VX, these are terrible, terrible weapons.
So in a way, the focus has been on this short-range to medium- ranged missiles. There is widespread belief he has other missiles, the Al Hussein missile, which is a missile that does have the range to reach Israel, and nobody is talking about the possibility he has, though.
My point is this, in addition to being a sidestep, it's putting the focus on something that may not matter that much.
But I think it's important for people to know, we're at war with Iraq in some ways now. We have some of our best fighting men in Iraq, special forces at the moment. We've stepped up our aerial campaign in this house with the idea that while we may be going to war with Iraq, I think it's very important for us to realize in some ways, we're already at war with Iraq. When we talk about war, now we're talking about, are we going to unload a full frontal attack sometime in mid to late March? And by any reasonable analysis, we're still headed toward that.
ZAHN: It didn't take long for the white house to react to this interview once it aired on "60 Minutes II." Let's listen to Ari Fleischer for a moment for his characterization of the interview.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ARI FLEISCHER, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECY.: The way I sum up last night's show, it was 60 minutes of lies, propaganda and deception.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ZAHN: Dan, you knew going into this interview, that there were going to be folks out there with a perception, no matter what you did, you were getting used by Saddam Hussein. Were you?
RATHER: Well, no. I think the American people are pretty sophisticated about this, and I think they understand that for whatever else I am or not, I'm a straight up reporter. I've been in the craft for more than 50 years. I went to Baghdad hoping to drive to the heart of the story, get the closest I could get to the decisionmaker, hopefully to put him on the screen so Americans can do two things: one, make their own judgments of who this man is, what he stands for, and what he's likely to do.
And then, number two, and perhaps more importantly, to understand why it is that we are losing the information at war on the streets of one Arab country after the other and, in many ways in the Muslim world, and people like Saddam Hussein, for many people, not everybody, but many people, in those worlds, he is charismatic. I think it's important for Americans to see and hear him so at least they can understand why do so many Arab young people admire Saddam Hussein, to say nothing of Osama bin Laden?
So if an interview such as this can do nothing more than to show us what it is we're up against, then I think there's value in doing it.
Now...
ZAHN: But you know going in you're not going to satisfy everybody. Do you understand why some folks out there would view it as unpatriotic if you did anything short of taking Saddam's, you know, fancy silk tie and grabbing it during the interview and saying, "you're lying to me, you're lying to me!"
RATHER: I certainly understand that, and think the American people understand it. Look, we're in a competitive business, and sometimes, competitors are going to take shots. Also, I've been envious of other journalists of time to time. I will say this, I'm confident any journalist worthy of the name would have walked into the Baghdad palace to do an interview with Saddam Hussein, and any journalist who did it would come out and find other journalists say, well, he should have asked him this, he should done this.
You know, I've learned again, Paula, that there are three things that every in every man in America thinks they can do better than any other man, one is judge a Miss America contest, the other is coach the local football team, and the third is do an interview of Saddam Hussein.
ZAHN: There going to give me a hard cue here. I've got 15 seconds left. You know how to do cues.
Is there one question you didn't ask that you wish you had?
RATHER: No, there were about a hundred. ZAHN: We should all feel that way after an interview, right, and we do that on a daily basis here. Thank you again for dropping by. I know you haven't had any sleep in days and thank you for adding to your long day to spend a little time with us. Continued good luck to you, Dan.
RATHER: Thank you, Paula.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired February 28, 2003 - 09:07 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
PAULA ZAHN, CNN ANCHOR: Dan Rather joins me now to talk about the interview and his time with Saddam Hussein and some of the reaction, both positive and negative to the interview.
Good to see you. Congratulations.
DAN RATHER, CBS NEWS ANCHOR: Thank you, Paula.
ZAHN: Even your competitors in the very vicious evening news circle have called this a great get.
RATHER: Well, they're classic, and I really appreciate that.
ZAHN: Let's talk a little bit about what Saddam Hussein told you specifically about the Al Samoud II missiles. Iraq now saying it will plan to destroy them after some meetings are being held about exactly how to do that perhaps with inspections on hand. Here's what Saddam Hussein told but those missiles.
Let's listen:
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RATHER: So you do not intend to destroy these missiles?
SADDAM HUSSEIN, IRAQI PRESIDENT (through translator): Which missiles are you talking about? We do not have missiles that go beyond the prescribed ranges by the U.N.?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ZAHN: How much of what he told you did you actually believe?
RATHER: Well, that's up for each person to make a decision for themselves. I'm always skeptical. I try hard to not let my skepticism harden into cynicism at any point. But skeptical attitude is necessary for journalism, so I'm skeptical about anything in a political issue tells me.
But on the Al Samoud missiles, it was very clear what they do in Texas called the old sidestep. He basically said I don't have missiles with the range that the U.N. says that I have. And I thought he strongly indicated that at that moment he was trying to convince the world that he wasn't going to destroy these missiles. I don't think you read it any other way. Somebody said, well, he didn't strongly indicate he had it. But this is Saddam Hussein, a cornered leader, fighting for his survival at his best or worst, depending on your point of view. Certainly from President Bush's point of view and the American point of view, he's at his worst doing this.
He's a cornered fox, that he's -- it's essential to understand that he's a survivor. He sees himself as the ultimate survivor. So when pressed about these missiles, he's going to do the old sidestep, he's going to say, well, I don't really have these missiles, and three or four days later, he's going to say, well, while I don't have missiles of the range they say I have, as a gesture toward peace, I'll destroy them maybe. That's where we are today. And that's why you heard Prime Minister Blair say, look, this is just more games playing. It's all in the doing. We'll see. On missiles blown up and plowed into the ground this weekend, I'm skeptical, but I'm on a show-me basis.
ZAHN: If he lied to you, though, when he answered that question? I know you're saying he did the sidestep.
RATHER: Well, it certainly dealt insofestry (ph). I'm not here to judge whether somebody lied or didn't lie. You take a loot at it. He never said, I won't destroy them or I will destroy them. What he said is I don't have missiles with that range.
But in a way, Paula, I think this is a classic example of keeping the focus on something that President Bush, Tony Blair and others who are convinced that we have to do a lot more, they must get frustrated, because when you talk about 360 tons of weapons grades chemicals, which the American administration, the British believe he has, when you talk about anthrax and VX, these are terrible, terrible weapons.
So in a way, the focus has been on this short-range to medium- ranged missiles. There is widespread belief he has other missiles, the Al Hussein missile, which is a missile that does have the range to reach Israel, and nobody is talking about the possibility he has, though.
My point is this, in addition to being a sidestep, it's putting the focus on something that may not matter that much.
But I think it's important for people to know, we're at war with Iraq in some ways now. We have some of our best fighting men in Iraq, special forces at the moment. We've stepped up our aerial campaign in this house with the idea that while we may be going to war with Iraq, I think it's very important for us to realize in some ways, we're already at war with Iraq. When we talk about war, now we're talking about, are we going to unload a full frontal attack sometime in mid to late March? And by any reasonable analysis, we're still headed toward that.
ZAHN: It didn't take long for the white house to react to this interview once it aired on "60 Minutes II." Let's listen to Ari Fleischer for a moment for his characterization of the interview.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ARI FLEISCHER, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECY.: The way I sum up last night's show, it was 60 minutes of lies, propaganda and deception.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ZAHN: Dan, you knew going into this interview, that there were going to be folks out there with a perception, no matter what you did, you were getting used by Saddam Hussein. Were you?
RATHER: Well, no. I think the American people are pretty sophisticated about this, and I think they understand that for whatever else I am or not, I'm a straight up reporter. I've been in the craft for more than 50 years. I went to Baghdad hoping to drive to the heart of the story, get the closest I could get to the decisionmaker, hopefully to put him on the screen so Americans can do two things: one, make their own judgments of who this man is, what he stands for, and what he's likely to do.
And then, number two, and perhaps more importantly, to understand why it is that we are losing the information at war on the streets of one Arab country after the other and, in many ways in the Muslim world, and people like Saddam Hussein, for many people, not everybody, but many people, in those worlds, he is charismatic. I think it's important for Americans to see and hear him so at least they can understand why do so many Arab young people admire Saddam Hussein, to say nothing of Osama bin Laden?
So if an interview such as this can do nothing more than to show us what it is we're up against, then I think there's value in doing it.
Now...
ZAHN: But you know going in you're not going to satisfy everybody. Do you understand why some folks out there would view it as unpatriotic if you did anything short of taking Saddam's, you know, fancy silk tie and grabbing it during the interview and saying, "you're lying to me, you're lying to me!"
RATHER: I certainly understand that, and think the American people understand it. Look, we're in a competitive business, and sometimes, competitors are going to take shots. Also, I've been envious of other journalists of time to time. I will say this, I'm confident any journalist worthy of the name would have walked into the Baghdad palace to do an interview with Saddam Hussein, and any journalist who did it would come out and find other journalists say, well, he should have asked him this, he should done this.
You know, I've learned again, Paula, that there are three things that every in every man in America thinks they can do better than any other man, one is judge a Miss America contest, the other is coach the local football team, and the third is do an interview of Saddam Hussein.
ZAHN: There going to give me a hard cue here. I've got 15 seconds left. You know how to do cues.
Is there one question you didn't ask that you wish you had?
RATHER: No, there were about a hundred. ZAHN: We should all feel that way after an interview, right, and we do that on a daily basis here. Thank you again for dropping by. I know you haven't had any sleep in days and thank you for adding to your long day to spend a little time with us. Continued good luck to you, Dan.
RATHER: Thank you, Paula.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
