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American Morning

Head of the Class

Aired April 22, 2003 - 09:45   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: To say that 14-year-old Angela Lipsman is an excellent student does not begin to describe what this New York City teenager has achieved already academically.
Angela has enough credits for a college degree at her age. Forgot about high school. She skipped right over it, never even enrolled in fact. She's been taking college courses since she was 11 years old, and now she's, almost, ready to graduate. Here's the rub, though, to get her college degree, Angela needs a high school diploma, or the equivalent, to graduate, and she's too young to get one. Angela's father claims his daughter is a victim of age discrimination.

He is now taking this matter to state court in New York. This morning, Daniel Lipsman and Angela Lipsman join us now live here at the Time Life studios.

Good to see both you.

I'm curious to know, as you were going through this education process, did you know what this law said in New York?

DANIEL LIPSMAN, FATHER OF ANGELA LIPSMAN: I had some idea of what the law was, but there are many provisions to the section of the state education law relating to high school equivalency diplomas.

HEMMER: So what did they tell you as Angela was getting further and further along in her education?

LIPSMAN: We had gotten information from two officials from the state education department, or two officials actually, which indicated that all she had to do basically was complete her work, and she would qualify for the diploma, and apparently, that it would be issued. This was the thrust of the letters.

However, apparently they reneged, because there was a higher official that said we're not going to allow that.

HEMMER: In terms of your daughter's education, you're in community college, is that right, hoping to go to a four-year college, or even more than that.

ANGELA LIPSMAN, SUING NEW YORK STATE FOR AGE DISCRIMINATION: Well, right now, I am going to be in CCNFIT, and next year I will continue with the MCC.

HEMMER: Those are schools here in New York, just so our viewers know. How are you held up? How are you impeded right now in terms of your education?

A. LIPSMAN: I'm still being able to take the classes, but I'm not able to actually get the equivalency diploma or the degree.

HEMMER: So your father's lawsuit, and yours, too, will do what at one point?

D. LIPSMAN: What we hope it will do, Bill, is to win Angela her high -- I don't like to use the word "win," because she's earned the high school equivalency diploma, but we're hoping a court in Albany now will order that the diploma be issued forthwith, and the recommendations of the commissioner of education of New York State, as they relate to minimum age for receipt of a high school equivalency diploma will be struck down as unconstitutional.

HEMMER: What is your chance of winning right now?

D. LIPSMAN: Well, Bill, I wish I could answer that. I think the best answer is that I take a cynical view that law is whatever the judge says it is, and what's constitutional or not is whatever the judges say it is. But it really is up to a judge. If we have a judge that reads the 14th Amendment, equal protection clause. as applying to a case like this, then we have a good shot.

HEMMER: What I'm wondering right now in the year 2003, Angela, with home schooling so prevalent across the country, with Internet education really springing to life in many parts of the country, do you feel this is a bit old-fashioned?

A. LIPSMAN: No, I don't think it's old-fashioned. It's different, but I enjoy it.

HEMMER: Do you think you're too good, and too young?

A. LIPSMAN: I wouldn't say that. I know I am younger than most students, but I don't think that's really much of a factor.

HEMMER: In the meantime, though, as you wait for this to play out in the courts, you do what?

A. LIPSMAN: Well, I just continue with my classes and go on with my life.

HEMMER: Good luck to you on that. I wish you the best of luck. I got to think, though, I'm sure your daughter is a smart woman. I don't want to take anything away from the young lady.

D. LIPSMAN: Smarter than I am.

HEMMER: Me, too, I'll tell you that, too.

But I have to think over the course of the state of New York, cases like these have come up before. How have they been handled? D. LIPSMAN: The interesting thing about that, Bill, is I think that the reason that we're having problems, is that we are seeking a high school diploma, an equivalency diploma, prior to getting the associate degree. I think in many of the other cases they declined to seek to get a high school diploma or didn't go for an equivalency diploma.

HEMMER: And therein lies the issue. Thank you, Daniel. Good luck to you all right. You'll be 15 in July. Keep studying.

I don't think that's an issue with her.

Good luck.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com







Aired April 22, 2003 - 09:45   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: To say that 14-year-old Angela Lipsman is an excellent student does not begin to describe what this New York City teenager has achieved already academically.
Angela has enough credits for a college degree at her age. Forgot about high school. She skipped right over it, never even enrolled in fact. She's been taking college courses since she was 11 years old, and now she's, almost, ready to graduate. Here's the rub, though, to get her college degree, Angela needs a high school diploma, or the equivalent, to graduate, and she's too young to get one. Angela's father claims his daughter is a victim of age discrimination.

He is now taking this matter to state court in New York. This morning, Daniel Lipsman and Angela Lipsman join us now live here at the Time Life studios.

Good to see both you.

I'm curious to know, as you were going through this education process, did you know what this law said in New York?

DANIEL LIPSMAN, FATHER OF ANGELA LIPSMAN: I had some idea of what the law was, but there are many provisions to the section of the state education law relating to high school equivalency diplomas.

HEMMER: So what did they tell you as Angela was getting further and further along in her education?

LIPSMAN: We had gotten information from two officials from the state education department, or two officials actually, which indicated that all she had to do basically was complete her work, and she would qualify for the diploma, and apparently, that it would be issued. This was the thrust of the letters.

However, apparently they reneged, because there was a higher official that said we're not going to allow that.

HEMMER: In terms of your daughter's education, you're in community college, is that right, hoping to go to a four-year college, or even more than that.

ANGELA LIPSMAN, SUING NEW YORK STATE FOR AGE DISCRIMINATION: Well, right now, I am going to be in CCNFIT, and next year I will continue with the MCC.

HEMMER: Those are schools here in New York, just so our viewers know. How are you held up? How are you impeded right now in terms of your education?

A. LIPSMAN: I'm still being able to take the classes, but I'm not able to actually get the equivalency diploma or the degree.

HEMMER: So your father's lawsuit, and yours, too, will do what at one point?

D. LIPSMAN: What we hope it will do, Bill, is to win Angela her high -- I don't like to use the word "win," because she's earned the high school equivalency diploma, but we're hoping a court in Albany now will order that the diploma be issued forthwith, and the recommendations of the commissioner of education of New York State, as they relate to minimum age for receipt of a high school equivalency diploma will be struck down as unconstitutional.

HEMMER: What is your chance of winning right now?

D. LIPSMAN: Well, Bill, I wish I could answer that. I think the best answer is that I take a cynical view that law is whatever the judge says it is, and what's constitutional or not is whatever the judges say it is. But it really is up to a judge. If we have a judge that reads the 14th Amendment, equal protection clause. as applying to a case like this, then we have a good shot.

HEMMER: What I'm wondering right now in the year 2003, Angela, with home schooling so prevalent across the country, with Internet education really springing to life in many parts of the country, do you feel this is a bit old-fashioned?

A. LIPSMAN: No, I don't think it's old-fashioned. It's different, but I enjoy it.

HEMMER: Do you think you're too good, and too young?

A. LIPSMAN: I wouldn't say that. I know I am younger than most students, but I don't think that's really much of a factor.

HEMMER: In the meantime, though, as you wait for this to play out in the courts, you do what?

A. LIPSMAN: Well, I just continue with my classes and go on with my life.

HEMMER: Good luck to you on that. I wish you the best of luck. I got to think, though, I'm sure your daughter is a smart woman. I don't want to take anything away from the young lady.

D. LIPSMAN: Smarter than I am.

HEMMER: Me, too, I'll tell you that, too.

But I have to think over the course of the state of New York, cases like these have come up before. How have they been handled? D. LIPSMAN: The interesting thing about that, Bill, is I think that the reason that we're having problems, is that we are seeking a high school diploma, an equivalency diploma, prior to getting the associate degree. I think in many of the other cases they declined to seek to get a high school diploma or didn't go for an equivalency diploma.

HEMMER: And therein lies the issue. Thank you, Daniel. Good luck to you all right. You'll be 15 in July. Keep studying.

I don't think that's an issue with her.

Good luck.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com