Return to Transcripts main page
American Morning
Monument in Alabama Supreme Court's Rotunda Will Have to Go
Aired July 02, 2003 - 08:08 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR:. A two and a half ton monument in the Alabama Supreme Court's rotunda will have to go. That's the decision from a federal appeals court. It ruled that the granite block doesn't belong because it displays the Ten Commandments. The court said the state's chief justice, Roy Moore, acted above the law when he placed it there.
Joining us to discuss the ruling, our legal analyst, once again, Jeffrey Toobin.
So, hey, you know, the federal courts were pretty hard on this judge, saying this monument is completely unconstitutional.
Any surprise here?
JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST:. Not really. I mean this has been a long running story in Alabama. Judge Moore was a completely obscure trial level judge a couple of years ago when he put up the Ten Commandments in his courtroom. That got, created a big controversy, but it created such a power such a positive reaction in the state that because of that, he was elected chief justice of the Alabama Supreme Court, where he installed the two and a half ton Ten Commandments there.
So he's known as the Ten Commandments judge.
COLLINS:. Right. But what's his argument for having it there at all?
TOOBIN:. I mean it's really an argument that is completely legally without any merit at all. He basically says he is the supervisor of the Alabama Supreme Court and the federal courts have no jurisdiction over it. It's very much reminiscent of George Wallace's argument, and other governors in the '60s who were resisting segregation who were resisting desegregation. And the Court of Appeals in the 11th Circuit, which is no liberal court, told him in no uncertain terms yesterday you get that thing out of the courthouse and make sure you do it, because the rule of law here says that the federal courts have the ultimate word.
COLLINS:. And we'll get a look at that, exactly what they said, in just a minute. But there are some people who support that Ten Commandments monument being there.
TOOBIN:. There are a lot of them. I mean, in fact, clearly a majority of Alabamans support it. That's why he got elected chief justice. He didn't, he wasn't known for anything else except being the Ten Commandments judge. You know, the mixture of religion and public life is a popular cause, but it's one that the Supreme Court has consistently, you know, kept a line pretty clear about it. And this, this isn't one of those gray areas. This isn't a crash. This isn't a prayer at a football game. You know, putting the Ten Commandments in the main courthouse for the State of Alabama is obviously unconstitutional, as it's judge as the three judge panel ruled yesterday.
COLLINS:. Right. Let's go ahead quickly and take a look at that, the 11th Circuit of Appeals had this to say about the order to remove it:. "The chief justice of a state supreme court, of all people, should be expected to abide by that principle. When the time comes, Chief Justice Moore will obey that order. If necessary, the court order will be enforced. The rule of law will prevail."
Again, coming from the 11th Circuit Court of Appeals.
So, the question is who removes it? I mean it's two and a half tons. Who pays for that?
TOOBIN:. Well, he the state is supposed to, but if the chief justice refuses to, they'll send federal marshals in there to take the thing out.
COLLINS:. And that would be quite a scene, I'm sure.
TOOBIN:. That's true.
COLLINS:. Jeffrey Toobin, our CNN legal analyst. Thanks so much.
TOOBIN:. Sure. See you.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800 CNN NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Go>
Aired July 2, 2003 - 08:08 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR:. A two and a half ton monument in the Alabama Supreme Court's rotunda will have to go. That's the decision from a federal appeals court. It ruled that the granite block doesn't belong because it displays the Ten Commandments. The court said the state's chief justice, Roy Moore, acted above the law when he placed it there.
Joining us to discuss the ruling, our legal analyst, once again, Jeffrey Toobin.
So, hey, you know, the federal courts were pretty hard on this judge, saying this monument is completely unconstitutional.
Any surprise here?
JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST:. Not really. I mean this has been a long running story in Alabama. Judge Moore was a completely obscure trial level judge a couple of years ago when he put up the Ten Commandments in his courtroom. That got, created a big controversy, but it created such a power such a positive reaction in the state that because of that, he was elected chief justice of the Alabama Supreme Court, where he installed the two and a half ton Ten Commandments there.
So he's known as the Ten Commandments judge.
COLLINS:. Right. But what's his argument for having it there at all?
TOOBIN:. I mean it's really an argument that is completely legally without any merit at all. He basically says he is the supervisor of the Alabama Supreme Court and the federal courts have no jurisdiction over it. It's very much reminiscent of George Wallace's argument, and other governors in the '60s who were resisting segregation who were resisting desegregation. And the Court of Appeals in the 11th Circuit, which is no liberal court, told him in no uncertain terms yesterday you get that thing out of the courthouse and make sure you do it, because the rule of law here says that the federal courts have the ultimate word.
COLLINS:. And we'll get a look at that, exactly what they said, in just a minute. But there are some people who support that Ten Commandments monument being there.
TOOBIN:. There are a lot of them. I mean, in fact, clearly a majority of Alabamans support it. That's why he got elected chief justice. He didn't, he wasn't known for anything else except being the Ten Commandments judge. You know, the mixture of religion and public life is a popular cause, but it's one that the Supreme Court has consistently, you know, kept a line pretty clear about it. And this, this isn't one of those gray areas. This isn't a crash. This isn't a prayer at a football game. You know, putting the Ten Commandments in the main courthouse for the State of Alabama is obviously unconstitutional, as it's judge as the three judge panel ruled yesterday.
COLLINS:. Right. Let's go ahead quickly and take a look at that, the 11th Circuit of Appeals had this to say about the order to remove it:. "The chief justice of a state supreme court, of all people, should be expected to abide by that principle. When the time comes, Chief Justice Moore will obey that order. If necessary, the court order will be enforced. The rule of law will prevail."
Again, coming from the 11th Circuit Court of Appeals.
So, the question is who removes it? I mean it's two and a half tons. Who pays for that?
TOOBIN:. Well, he the state is supposed to, but if the chief justice refuses to, they'll send federal marshals in there to take the thing out.
COLLINS:. And that would be quite a scene, I'm sure.
TOOBIN:. That's true.
COLLINS:. Jeffrey Toobin, our CNN legal analyst. Thanks so much.
TOOBIN:. Sure. See you.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800 CNN NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Go>
