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American Morning
Rebuilding Iraq
Aired July 16, 2003 - 09:44 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Let's go to Iraq now for a non- military look at the country's rebuilding effort.
Elizabeth Rubin is a contributor to "The New York Times" magazine, and she's live in Baghdad, where she's been reporting on the war and on reconstruction as well.
Elizabeth, good morning. Thanks for joining us.
ELIZABETH RUBIN, CONTRIBUTOR, "THE NEW YORK TIMES" MAGAZINE: Good morning.
O'BRIEN: The new governing council is now in place. Give me a sense of how Iraqi citizens feel about it?
RUBIN: There's really a mixed feeling right now. Depending on who you talk to, a lot of people are very excited by it, you know, especially among the intellectuals and the quiet majority who are staying at home, where you don't see that much out on the streets. They do feel a sense of something's changed.
But a lot of people also feel, knowing that Bremer has a veto over anything that's decided upon by the governing council, they feel that in a way it's -- that Iraqis are still really not in control of their fate.
O'BRIEN: One of the first moves by this governing council was to set up a special court that will try Saddam Hussein and members of his regime for war crimes. Give me a sense if among the people in Baghdad, that this court will have any teeth, and how critical it was that this court was established?
RUBIN: Well, I think there's two things, really. The first is that people really just want electricity and security, and the court is sort of -- seems like a very abstract and wonderful thing, you know, down the line. But right now, really, everybody you talk to, it's the first thing out of everybody's mouth, no matter what you go to talk to them about.
But the thing that is good about the court is, it addresses this issue of individual responsibility and accountability, and I think because so many people were forced to be members of the Baath Party, or felt compelled to in order to survive, the idea that it's not an across-the-board judgment against everybody in the country and that there will be individuals who are tried and held accountable makes a huge difference to people. O'BRIEN: You say people just want electricity, they just want security. Draw us a picture of what the daily life is like right now for Iraqi citizens when it comes to morale and food and electricity.
RUBIN: Well, you know, average temperature every day is about 120 to 125 degrees. There's about two hours of electricity in most houses. In many neighborhoods, people have set up generators, but you know, they come on, they come off. To get fuel for the generators you have to wait on line for an hour, sometimes two hours. If you wait online, it's five dinars. If you don't wait on line and you buy it on the black market, it's 250 dinars a liter.
So you know, daily life, just to make things work in your house, to get to work, to get out is really, really difficult. And tensions under this kind of heat are explosive. People are just reaching a limit, and they can't understand what the Americans are doing that they haven't been able to put together, you know, even just to get generators in a neighborhood. You can explain to them why it's difficult, but it really doesn't make any sense to people.
And as far as security, parents are afraid to leave their children alone for going to school. There's been a lot of cases of girls getting picked up. The shooting at night has definitely died down a bit. But there's really no sense of security at all in the city.
O'BRIEN: Here in the U.S., of course, there's been a big debate over those 16 words that came from the president's State of the Union Address. It's getting a lot of attention. Is information about the speech and sort of the firestorm about that speech here making its way to Baghdad? and what do Iraqi citizens feel about that?
RUBIN: I assume you're talking about the weapons of mass destruction, is that right?
O'BRIEN: That is correct.
RUBIN: Yes. Generally, again, it depends on who you talk to, but for the most part, people feel -- people who were in favor of getting rid of Saddam Hussein, people who suffered under the regime say, why couldn't it have been an honest reason for this war? Whether it's for oil, whether it's for American interests, whether it's to get rid of a tyrant, to say it's the 21st century, people can't live like this anymore, why not have been honest about the reasons behind it? Because even the people in favor of the war, like the vast majority of the Shiites in the south and things will tell you there are no weapons of mass destruction left here.
Now, it may turn out, who knows what's going to happen? But that's the general sentiment.
O'BRIEN: Elizabeth Rubin is a contributor to "The New York Times Magazine." Thanks for joining us, Elizabeth. Appreciate it.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired July 16, 2003 - 09:44 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Let's go to Iraq now for a non- military look at the country's rebuilding effort.
Elizabeth Rubin is a contributor to "The New York Times" magazine, and she's live in Baghdad, where she's been reporting on the war and on reconstruction as well.
Elizabeth, good morning. Thanks for joining us.
ELIZABETH RUBIN, CONTRIBUTOR, "THE NEW YORK TIMES" MAGAZINE: Good morning.
O'BRIEN: The new governing council is now in place. Give me a sense of how Iraqi citizens feel about it?
RUBIN: There's really a mixed feeling right now. Depending on who you talk to, a lot of people are very excited by it, you know, especially among the intellectuals and the quiet majority who are staying at home, where you don't see that much out on the streets. They do feel a sense of something's changed.
But a lot of people also feel, knowing that Bremer has a veto over anything that's decided upon by the governing council, they feel that in a way it's -- that Iraqis are still really not in control of their fate.
O'BRIEN: One of the first moves by this governing council was to set up a special court that will try Saddam Hussein and members of his regime for war crimes. Give me a sense if among the people in Baghdad, that this court will have any teeth, and how critical it was that this court was established?
RUBIN: Well, I think there's two things, really. The first is that people really just want electricity and security, and the court is sort of -- seems like a very abstract and wonderful thing, you know, down the line. But right now, really, everybody you talk to, it's the first thing out of everybody's mouth, no matter what you go to talk to them about.
But the thing that is good about the court is, it addresses this issue of individual responsibility and accountability, and I think because so many people were forced to be members of the Baath Party, or felt compelled to in order to survive, the idea that it's not an across-the-board judgment against everybody in the country and that there will be individuals who are tried and held accountable makes a huge difference to people. O'BRIEN: You say people just want electricity, they just want security. Draw us a picture of what the daily life is like right now for Iraqi citizens when it comes to morale and food and electricity.
RUBIN: Well, you know, average temperature every day is about 120 to 125 degrees. There's about two hours of electricity in most houses. In many neighborhoods, people have set up generators, but you know, they come on, they come off. To get fuel for the generators you have to wait on line for an hour, sometimes two hours. If you wait online, it's five dinars. If you don't wait on line and you buy it on the black market, it's 250 dinars a liter.
So you know, daily life, just to make things work in your house, to get to work, to get out is really, really difficult. And tensions under this kind of heat are explosive. People are just reaching a limit, and they can't understand what the Americans are doing that they haven't been able to put together, you know, even just to get generators in a neighborhood. You can explain to them why it's difficult, but it really doesn't make any sense to people.
And as far as security, parents are afraid to leave their children alone for going to school. There's been a lot of cases of girls getting picked up. The shooting at night has definitely died down a bit. But there's really no sense of security at all in the city.
O'BRIEN: Here in the U.S., of course, there's been a big debate over those 16 words that came from the president's State of the Union Address. It's getting a lot of attention. Is information about the speech and sort of the firestorm about that speech here making its way to Baghdad? and what do Iraqi citizens feel about that?
RUBIN: I assume you're talking about the weapons of mass destruction, is that right?
O'BRIEN: That is correct.
RUBIN: Yes. Generally, again, it depends on who you talk to, but for the most part, people feel -- people who were in favor of getting rid of Saddam Hussein, people who suffered under the regime say, why couldn't it have been an honest reason for this war? Whether it's for oil, whether it's for American interests, whether it's to get rid of a tyrant, to say it's the 21st century, people can't live like this anymore, why not have been honest about the reasons behind it? Because even the people in favor of the war, like the vast majority of the Shiites in the south and things will tell you there are no weapons of mass destruction left here.
Now, it may turn out, who knows what's going to happen? But that's the general sentiment.
O'BRIEN: Elizabeth Rubin is a contributor to "The New York Times Magazine." Thanks for joining us, Elizabeth. Appreciate it.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
