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American Morning
CIA Facing Demands, Challenges Few Imagined Before 09/11
Aired October 10, 2003 - 07:34 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: In the wake, in the war on terror, in the wake of 9/11, the CIA is facing demands and challenges that few imagined before those attacks.
There's a new book out. Investigative journalist Ronald Kessler says the CIA has already redefined itself in the face of these new threats. It's called "The CIA At War."
And Ron Kessler is our guest now in D.C.
Good to see you.
Good morning to you.
RONALD KESSLER, AUTHOR, "THE CIA AT WAR": Good to be with you, Bill.
HEMMER: Welcome back to AMERICAN MORNING.
Part of your book reports about the cash payments given out to al Qaeda leaders, Taliban leaders, to be more specific, in Afghanistan. A lot of that was known during the war two years ago.
What's new in your book that you found out?
KESSLER: About the cash payments in the Iraq war, to make sure that wells were not blown up, to actually pay off commanders not to fight, that helped a lot in the military success.
HEMMER: What about the CIA paying these moderate Muslim clerics to fall in line and essentially give a positive spin on U.S. P.R.? What did you find out about that?
KESSLER: Well, we all recognize that there's a need for a more moderate message out there in the Arab world. And there are overt methods, such as Radio Sawah (ph). But the CIA has long engaged in covert propaganda, as they call it, and that's what this is. It's paying off mullahs and actually creating fake mullahs to spread a more moderate message in the Arab world and...
HEMMER: Is that working?
KESSLER: ... and actually to support the war in Iraq, would you believe?
Yes, in many cases we have seen these fatwas issued which were very moderate, which supported the war, which supported the U.S. And that helps to some degree.
HEMMER: On Osama bin Laden, you report that media reports allowed him to gain knowledge not to use his cell phone and be detected. What are the facts on that?
KESSLER: You know, I week we're all aware that bin Laden's -- or the interception of bin Laden's cell phone was compromised and that therefore we were not able to continue monitoring his conversations. It turned out it was very difficult to find out what media report or what public disclosure led to that. And what I found out was that in the opinion of the CIA it was a story in the "Washington Post" which said that Vince Cannistraro, a former CIA officer in counter- terrorism, said that, in fact, the CIA was monitoring bin Laden's calls. And a day or two after that, bin Laden stopped using that cell phone.
The "Washington Post," where I used to work, is very responsible and I'm quite sure if they were really paying attention and aware of what they were running there, they wouldn't have run it. But it was by a reporter who doesn't cover intelligence and that was the result.
HEMMER: So your suggestion in there is that the press helped Osama bin Laden?
KESSLER: Yes, I think it was something that was unintentional but on the part of the "Washington Post." I know that they are very responsible. But, yes, that is what the CIA believes.
HEMMER: Let's move back to Iraq. You've alluded to it in your first answer, talking about oil wells, etc., prior to the war breaking out there back in mid-March. There are some who suggest that even after, in the early days after the attacks of 9/11, that the White House was putting pressure on the CIA to find the evidence that ties Saddam Hussein with al Qaeda. There's a small terrorist training camp outside Kandahar in Afghanistan known as Tarnac Farms. In the early days of that war, they were scouring this area, trying to find the clues that would tie Saddam Hussein in.
Based on everything we knew at the time, and even now, they never found that connection there in Afghanistan. Did you find it in your book?
KESSLER: No, I didn't. But, you know, the idea that we shouldn't have gone into Iraq because we should have won the war on terror first is like saying the FBI should win the war against organized crime and wipe out the mafia before it goes after kidnappers or people who defrauded the public at Enron.
The fact is that even during the Iraq war, the CIA had rolled up, with the help of other countries, people like Khalid Shaikh Mohammed, and, in fact, a total of about two thirds of the al Qaeda leadership. So there's a great deal of success and obviously there were -- there are a number of threats out there. You can't just focus on one.
HEMMER: A lot to consider in your book. It's called "The CIA At War." Ronald Kessler is the author.
Thanks for talking.
KESSLER: Thank you, Bill.
HEMMER: You've got it.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired October 10, 2003 - 07:34 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: In the wake, in the war on terror, in the wake of 9/11, the CIA is facing demands and challenges that few imagined before those attacks.
There's a new book out. Investigative journalist Ronald Kessler says the CIA has already redefined itself in the face of these new threats. It's called "The CIA At War."
And Ron Kessler is our guest now in D.C.
Good to see you.
Good morning to you.
RONALD KESSLER, AUTHOR, "THE CIA AT WAR": Good to be with you, Bill.
HEMMER: Welcome back to AMERICAN MORNING.
Part of your book reports about the cash payments given out to al Qaeda leaders, Taliban leaders, to be more specific, in Afghanistan. A lot of that was known during the war two years ago.
What's new in your book that you found out?
KESSLER: About the cash payments in the Iraq war, to make sure that wells were not blown up, to actually pay off commanders not to fight, that helped a lot in the military success.
HEMMER: What about the CIA paying these moderate Muslim clerics to fall in line and essentially give a positive spin on U.S. P.R.? What did you find out about that?
KESSLER: Well, we all recognize that there's a need for a more moderate message out there in the Arab world. And there are overt methods, such as Radio Sawah (ph). But the CIA has long engaged in covert propaganda, as they call it, and that's what this is. It's paying off mullahs and actually creating fake mullahs to spread a more moderate message in the Arab world and...
HEMMER: Is that working?
KESSLER: ... and actually to support the war in Iraq, would you believe?
Yes, in many cases we have seen these fatwas issued which were very moderate, which supported the war, which supported the U.S. And that helps to some degree.
HEMMER: On Osama bin Laden, you report that media reports allowed him to gain knowledge not to use his cell phone and be detected. What are the facts on that?
KESSLER: You know, I week we're all aware that bin Laden's -- or the interception of bin Laden's cell phone was compromised and that therefore we were not able to continue monitoring his conversations. It turned out it was very difficult to find out what media report or what public disclosure led to that. And what I found out was that in the opinion of the CIA it was a story in the "Washington Post" which said that Vince Cannistraro, a former CIA officer in counter- terrorism, said that, in fact, the CIA was monitoring bin Laden's calls. And a day or two after that, bin Laden stopped using that cell phone.
The "Washington Post," where I used to work, is very responsible and I'm quite sure if they were really paying attention and aware of what they were running there, they wouldn't have run it. But it was by a reporter who doesn't cover intelligence and that was the result.
HEMMER: So your suggestion in there is that the press helped Osama bin Laden?
KESSLER: Yes, I think it was something that was unintentional but on the part of the "Washington Post." I know that they are very responsible. But, yes, that is what the CIA believes.
HEMMER: Let's move back to Iraq. You've alluded to it in your first answer, talking about oil wells, etc., prior to the war breaking out there back in mid-March. There are some who suggest that even after, in the early days after the attacks of 9/11, that the White House was putting pressure on the CIA to find the evidence that ties Saddam Hussein with al Qaeda. There's a small terrorist training camp outside Kandahar in Afghanistan known as Tarnac Farms. In the early days of that war, they were scouring this area, trying to find the clues that would tie Saddam Hussein in.
Based on everything we knew at the time, and even now, they never found that connection there in Afghanistan. Did you find it in your book?
KESSLER: No, I didn't. But, you know, the idea that we shouldn't have gone into Iraq because we should have won the war on terror first is like saying the FBI should win the war against organized crime and wipe out the mafia before it goes after kidnappers or people who defrauded the public at Enron.
The fact is that even during the Iraq war, the CIA had rolled up, with the help of other countries, people like Khalid Shaikh Mohammed, and, in fact, a total of about two thirds of the al Qaeda leadership. So there's a great deal of success and obviously there were -- there are a number of threats out there. You can't just focus on one.
HEMMER: A lot to consider in your book. It's called "The CIA At War." Ronald Kessler is the author.
Thanks for talking.
KESSLER: Thank you, Bill.
HEMMER: You've got it.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
