Return to Transcripts main page

American Morning

Elizabeth Smart Kidnapping Case

Aired December 01, 2003 - 07:36   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


ANDERSON COOPER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, in Utah today, the judge in the Elizabeth Smart kidnapping case will hear arguments on whether Wanda Barzee is competent to stand trial. Barzee and her co- defendant, Brian David Mitchell, face six felony counts in connection with the alleged abduction last year.
Now, reporters Maggie Haberman and Jeane MacIntosh talked with the families of both suspects in researching their book.

It's titled "Held Captive: The Kidnapping and Rescue of Elizabeth Smart."

Maggie Haberman and Jeane MacIntosh are with us now.

Thanks for being with us.

MAGGIE HABERMAN, CO-AUTHOR, "HELD CAPTIVE": Thanks for having us.

COOPER: Jeane, let me start off with you. Is there -- what is the defense going to be for this woman, Wanda Barzee?

JEANE MACINTOSH, CO-AUTHOR, "HELD CAPTIVE": Chances are that if she's found competent to stand trial, chances are that she's going to say she was his first victim, Brian David Mitchell's first victim, that he is so...

COOPER: That she was, what, brainwashed in some?

MACINTOSH: That she was brainwashed and she followed him and he was calling the shots. That will be her defense, most likely.

COOPER: And, Maggie, it is likely today that she will be found competent to stand trial, you believe.

HABERMAN: I believe that only because the bar for being declared competent is very, very low. Now, Wanda Barzee's family has told us, when we were researching our book, that she had a history of problems and mental illness. But there is a big difference between being mentally ill and being mentally incompetent to get into the courtroom.

COOPER: And what did, in the course of researching your book, Jeane, what did you learn about Wanda Barzee that you hadn't known before and that a lot of people perhaps don't know?

MACINTOSH: Well, what was really interesting is when we put all the pieces together of her life after speaking to people, the similarities that she bears to Elizabeth Smart were really pretty shocking because...

COOPER: In what way?

MACINTOSH: She was a talented musician.

Go ahead, too.

HABERMAN: She was extremely sort of pliable, deeply religious, best friends with her sister. These are all the descriptions of Elizabeth Smart from everyone who knew her while she was missing.

Go ahead.

MACINTOSH: And, in fact, I was going to say that her mom said when, that she started to hear about Elizabeth and when Elizabeth came home, Wanda's mother said that -- Wanda's mother said that the resemblances and the similarities are really just startling.

COOPER: But, I mean, if the defense is going to argue some sort of brainwashing, let's talk about Mitchell a little bit. I mean what sort of a power did he have over Wanda Barzee, if any?

HABERMAN: It's pretty clear from talking to her family that she was deeply devoted to him. We were told by a friend of hers that early on in their marriage, she started seeing a change in him. She thought she was marrying this sort of nice caretaker. And within weeks, within months he was sort of abusive, changing. And yet she stayed with him and consciously (UNINTELLIGIBLE)...

COOPER: And she stayed with him going from sort of a middle class life to being homeless, wandering the streets...

(CROSSTALK)

MACINTOSH: And they chose, yes, voluntarily. They just decided, you know what? We've had enough of living here, we don't like our families, they don't know what, you know, they don't know anything, we know everything and we're going to go off and live in the woods.

HABERMAN: And this is a better way to serve our god, to (UNINTELLIGIBLE) ourselves.

MACINTOSH: Yes.

COOPER: A lot of people just look at them and say look, they're crazy.

HABERMAN: Um-hmm.

MACINTOSH: There's crazy and there's crazy like a fox, you know?

HABERMAN: Right.

MACINTOSH: You know, I'm there's -- there are people who can do crazy things, but, you know, to go out and allegedly kidnap a kid and sexually assault this kid, this child, takes some planning, some thought and some -- you have to have your wits about you in order to do it.

HABERMAN: That's going to be part of the issue, also, is that they -- the prosecutors say that Brian David Mitchell and Wanda Barzee spent months planning this, building this elaborate camp site up in the woods, in the hills above Elizabeth Smart's home. So it's going to be hard to argue that, yes, they were crazy, but they also did this meticulous planning. And that is really, I think, what prosecutors are going to be banking on.

MACINTOSH: Yes.

COOPER: Well, we'll be watching later today.

MACINTOSH: Thanks.

HABERMAN: OK.

COOPER: Maggie Haberman, Jeane MacIntosh, thanks very much.

HABERMAN: Thanks a lot for having us.

MACINTOSH: Thank you.

COOPER: All right.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com







Aired December 1, 2003 - 07:36   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, in Utah today, the judge in the Elizabeth Smart kidnapping case will hear arguments on whether Wanda Barzee is competent to stand trial. Barzee and her co- defendant, Brian David Mitchell, face six felony counts in connection with the alleged abduction last year.
Now, reporters Maggie Haberman and Jeane MacIntosh talked with the families of both suspects in researching their book.

It's titled "Held Captive: The Kidnapping and Rescue of Elizabeth Smart."

Maggie Haberman and Jeane MacIntosh are with us now.

Thanks for being with us.

MAGGIE HABERMAN, CO-AUTHOR, "HELD CAPTIVE": Thanks for having us.

COOPER: Jeane, let me start off with you. Is there -- what is the defense going to be for this woman, Wanda Barzee?

JEANE MACINTOSH, CO-AUTHOR, "HELD CAPTIVE": Chances are that if she's found competent to stand trial, chances are that she's going to say she was his first victim, Brian David Mitchell's first victim, that he is so...

COOPER: That she was, what, brainwashed in some?

MACINTOSH: That she was brainwashed and she followed him and he was calling the shots. That will be her defense, most likely.

COOPER: And, Maggie, it is likely today that she will be found competent to stand trial, you believe.

HABERMAN: I believe that only because the bar for being declared competent is very, very low. Now, Wanda Barzee's family has told us, when we were researching our book, that she had a history of problems and mental illness. But there is a big difference between being mentally ill and being mentally incompetent to get into the courtroom.

COOPER: And what did, in the course of researching your book, Jeane, what did you learn about Wanda Barzee that you hadn't known before and that a lot of people perhaps don't know?

MACINTOSH: Well, what was really interesting is when we put all the pieces together of her life after speaking to people, the similarities that she bears to Elizabeth Smart were really pretty shocking because...

COOPER: In what way?

MACINTOSH: She was a talented musician.

Go ahead, too.

HABERMAN: She was extremely sort of pliable, deeply religious, best friends with her sister. These are all the descriptions of Elizabeth Smart from everyone who knew her while she was missing.

Go ahead.

MACINTOSH: And, in fact, I was going to say that her mom said when, that she started to hear about Elizabeth and when Elizabeth came home, Wanda's mother said that -- Wanda's mother said that the resemblances and the similarities are really just startling.

COOPER: But, I mean, if the defense is going to argue some sort of brainwashing, let's talk about Mitchell a little bit. I mean what sort of a power did he have over Wanda Barzee, if any?

HABERMAN: It's pretty clear from talking to her family that she was deeply devoted to him. We were told by a friend of hers that early on in their marriage, she started seeing a change in him. She thought she was marrying this sort of nice caretaker. And within weeks, within months he was sort of abusive, changing. And yet she stayed with him and consciously (UNINTELLIGIBLE)...

COOPER: And she stayed with him going from sort of a middle class life to being homeless, wandering the streets...

(CROSSTALK)

MACINTOSH: And they chose, yes, voluntarily. They just decided, you know what? We've had enough of living here, we don't like our families, they don't know what, you know, they don't know anything, we know everything and we're going to go off and live in the woods.

HABERMAN: And this is a better way to serve our god, to (UNINTELLIGIBLE) ourselves.

MACINTOSH: Yes.

COOPER: A lot of people just look at them and say look, they're crazy.

HABERMAN: Um-hmm.

MACINTOSH: There's crazy and there's crazy like a fox, you know?

HABERMAN: Right.

MACINTOSH: You know, I'm there's -- there are people who can do crazy things, but, you know, to go out and allegedly kidnap a kid and sexually assault this kid, this child, takes some planning, some thought and some -- you have to have your wits about you in order to do it.

HABERMAN: That's going to be part of the issue, also, is that they -- the prosecutors say that Brian David Mitchell and Wanda Barzee spent months planning this, building this elaborate camp site up in the woods, in the hills above Elizabeth Smart's home. So it's going to be hard to argue that, yes, they were crazy, but they also did this meticulous planning. And that is really, I think, what prosecutors are going to be banking on.

MACINTOSH: Yes.

COOPER: Well, we'll be watching later today.

MACINTOSH: Thanks.

HABERMAN: OK.

COOPER: Maggie Haberman, Jeane MacIntosh, thanks very much.

HABERMAN: Thanks a lot for having us.

MACINTOSH: Thank you.

COOPER: All right.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com