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American Morning
Interview With Kiron Skinner, Ivo Daalder
Aired December 26, 2003 - 08:17 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Historians may well look back on 2003 as a turning point, when the United States decided to go it alone in its stance toward the world. The year began with the Bush administration trying to persuade the international community that Iraq posed a threat too great to ignore. The United Nations was unconvinced and the U.S. led a preemptive invasion that toppled Saddam Hussein.
With us this morning to look back on America's foreign policies this year is Kiron Skinner of Carnegie Mellon University. She's the editor of "Reagan: A Life In Letters," and she joins us from Pittsburgh this morning. Also, Ivo Daalder. He is of the Brookings Institution. He is the author of "America Unbound: The Bush Revolution In Foreign Policy." And he joins us from Washington, D.C.
Good morning to both of you.
Thanks for being with us.
KIRON SKINNER, CARNEGIE MELLON UNIVERSITY, AUTHOR, "REAGAN: A LIFE IN LETTERS": Thank you.
IVO DAALDER, BROOKINGS INSTITUTION: Good morning.
O'BRIEN: When we look at a list of sort of what was accomplished in the year, if you just look at these things, Saddam Hussein is nabbed; Russia agrees to forgive some of its foreign debt for Iraq; Colonel Moammar Gadhafi opens his weapons programs to inspectors; Iran agrees to surprise U.N. inspections of nuclear facilities. That's just November and December alone.
How significant do you think these accomplishments are?
SKINNER: I think the events are extremely important because they're a buildup of resolve and credibility and deliberate policies by the Bush administration. I don't think that these things happened by surprise. Not that they're fully due to what the Bush administration has done. But insofar as American casualty is relevant, I think the policies of this year, especially staying the course despite the background and foreground noise in terms of opposition to what the administration was doing in Iraq and elsewhere.
O'BRIEN: Mr. Daalder, to what degree do you think President Bush gets credit for these accomplishments?
DAALDER: Well, he gets quite a lot of it, and particularly for ousting Saddam Hussein. He virtually did it single-handedly with the U.S. military. He didn't have many allies. So clearly that is an accomplishment that Mr. Bush has created himself.
Some of the other ones I would say the U.S. has been the major player, but clearly Moammar Qaddafi, a turnaround on the weapons of mass destruction, is a result of a, almost a decade long effort that both Republican and Democrats have been trying to pursue, and, most importantly, by the steadfast leadership of Tony Blair.
The same on Iran, where you have seen it wasn't the United States that got the turnaround. It was, in fact, the three major European countries -- France, Germany and Great Britain that did the diplomacy that got us there.
Of course, American power behind the scene is important and it's part of what makes the world go turn around. But it isn't the only thing.
O'BRIEN: Do you think it's fair, Mr. Daalder, to call this year, then, a turning point? Is it that important, that significant?
DAALDER: Well, we'll have to find out how it turns. I mean this was clearly Mr. Bush's year when it comes to foreign policy, in part because of the dominance of the Iraq war. But there are problems with that kind of turning point, perhaps. One is that the fact about how we went into the war and what we have done since has left us virtually alone. Ninety percent of the troops, 90 percent of the casualties and well over 90 percent of the money being spent in Iraq is American.
And, more importantly, I would think, there are other issues that are out there that were not resolved. We saw the bombing in Pakistan, which reminds us of how fragile that country is, after all, a country with nuclear weapons. We have seen North Korea acquire the material to produce not just one or two, but perhaps six to eight nuclear weapons. And as we are facing an orange alert here at home. In what Mr. Ridge has said is the worst threat we're facing since 9/11, we're reminded that the war on terror, and in particular al Qaeda, is still out there in a major, major and grave danger to our country.
So there are many things going on that are certainly worrisome when it comes to looking to 2004, let alone about what happened in 2003.
O'BRIEN: So, Ms. Skinner, then, pick up on what we're hearing from Mr. Daalder, which is essentially the U.S. may have succeeded in Iraq, but now the United States has cordoned itself off from everybody else. We're essentially alone and we've irreparably damaged our relationships with Germany and France, and that matters.
SKINNER: Well, you know, I think that's one way to look at it. But there's something that you didn't mention, Soledad, that I think is extremely important at the end of the year, that some -- that's being overlooked a little bit in the media. And that's the November 25th announcement by President Bush authorizing the global posture review. And I think that that's one of the most significant American foreign policy events of this year. And it is a buildup of really deliberate policy. It is an attempt to be incredibly multilateral in reviving U.S. strategic doctrine. It has the potential to be the most sweeping revision of U.S. military and political strategy since the beginning of the cold war. And it speaks directly to America's allies abroad in Europe, in Asia and elsewhere.
Immediately after that announcement, Secretaries Rumsfeld and Powell began to consult with allies, and they continue, on revising our doctrine, repositioning our troops in concert with what our allies do. And I think that that's going to have a major imprint on the international scene. And for the Bush administration, I think it gets a lot of credit, because it's the first major attempt to revise strategic doctrine since the ending of the cold war.
O'BRIEN: Kiron Skinner of Carnegie Mellon University joining us this morning.
Also, Ivo Daalder joining us from the Brookings Institution.
To both of you, thank you so much.
Appreciate it.
SKINNER: Thank you.
DAALDER: Thank you.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired December 26, 2003 - 08:17 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Historians may well look back on 2003 as a turning point, when the United States decided to go it alone in its stance toward the world. The year began with the Bush administration trying to persuade the international community that Iraq posed a threat too great to ignore. The United Nations was unconvinced and the U.S. led a preemptive invasion that toppled Saddam Hussein.
With us this morning to look back on America's foreign policies this year is Kiron Skinner of Carnegie Mellon University. She's the editor of "Reagan: A Life In Letters," and she joins us from Pittsburgh this morning. Also, Ivo Daalder. He is of the Brookings Institution. He is the author of "America Unbound: The Bush Revolution In Foreign Policy." And he joins us from Washington, D.C.
Good morning to both of you.
Thanks for being with us.
KIRON SKINNER, CARNEGIE MELLON UNIVERSITY, AUTHOR, "REAGAN: A LIFE IN LETTERS": Thank you.
IVO DAALDER, BROOKINGS INSTITUTION: Good morning.
O'BRIEN: When we look at a list of sort of what was accomplished in the year, if you just look at these things, Saddam Hussein is nabbed; Russia agrees to forgive some of its foreign debt for Iraq; Colonel Moammar Gadhafi opens his weapons programs to inspectors; Iran agrees to surprise U.N. inspections of nuclear facilities. That's just November and December alone.
How significant do you think these accomplishments are?
SKINNER: I think the events are extremely important because they're a buildup of resolve and credibility and deliberate policies by the Bush administration. I don't think that these things happened by surprise. Not that they're fully due to what the Bush administration has done. But insofar as American casualty is relevant, I think the policies of this year, especially staying the course despite the background and foreground noise in terms of opposition to what the administration was doing in Iraq and elsewhere.
O'BRIEN: Mr. Daalder, to what degree do you think President Bush gets credit for these accomplishments?
DAALDER: Well, he gets quite a lot of it, and particularly for ousting Saddam Hussein. He virtually did it single-handedly with the U.S. military. He didn't have many allies. So clearly that is an accomplishment that Mr. Bush has created himself.
Some of the other ones I would say the U.S. has been the major player, but clearly Moammar Qaddafi, a turnaround on the weapons of mass destruction, is a result of a, almost a decade long effort that both Republican and Democrats have been trying to pursue, and, most importantly, by the steadfast leadership of Tony Blair.
The same on Iran, where you have seen it wasn't the United States that got the turnaround. It was, in fact, the three major European countries -- France, Germany and Great Britain that did the diplomacy that got us there.
Of course, American power behind the scene is important and it's part of what makes the world go turn around. But it isn't the only thing.
O'BRIEN: Do you think it's fair, Mr. Daalder, to call this year, then, a turning point? Is it that important, that significant?
DAALDER: Well, we'll have to find out how it turns. I mean this was clearly Mr. Bush's year when it comes to foreign policy, in part because of the dominance of the Iraq war. But there are problems with that kind of turning point, perhaps. One is that the fact about how we went into the war and what we have done since has left us virtually alone. Ninety percent of the troops, 90 percent of the casualties and well over 90 percent of the money being spent in Iraq is American.
And, more importantly, I would think, there are other issues that are out there that were not resolved. We saw the bombing in Pakistan, which reminds us of how fragile that country is, after all, a country with nuclear weapons. We have seen North Korea acquire the material to produce not just one or two, but perhaps six to eight nuclear weapons. And as we are facing an orange alert here at home. In what Mr. Ridge has said is the worst threat we're facing since 9/11, we're reminded that the war on terror, and in particular al Qaeda, is still out there in a major, major and grave danger to our country.
So there are many things going on that are certainly worrisome when it comes to looking to 2004, let alone about what happened in 2003.
O'BRIEN: So, Ms. Skinner, then, pick up on what we're hearing from Mr. Daalder, which is essentially the U.S. may have succeeded in Iraq, but now the United States has cordoned itself off from everybody else. We're essentially alone and we've irreparably damaged our relationships with Germany and France, and that matters.
SKINNER: Well, you know, I think that's one way to look at it. But there's something that you didn't mention, Soledad, that I think is extremely important at the end of the year, that some -- that's being overlooked a little bit in the media. And that's the November 25th announcement by President Bush authorizing the global posture review. And I think that that's one of the most significant American foreign policy events of this year. And it is a buildup of really deliberate policy. It is an attempt to be incredibly multilateral in reviving U.S. strategic doctrine. It has the potential to be the most sweeping revision of U.S. military and political strategy since the beginning of the cold war. And it speaks directly to America's allies abroad in Europe, in Asia and elsewhere.
Immediately after that announcement, Secretaries Rumsfeld and Powell began to consult with allies, and they continue, on revising our doctrine, repositioning our troops in concert with what our allies do. And I think that that's going to have a major imprint on the international scene. And for the Bush administration, I think it gets a lot of credit, because it's the first major attempt to revise strategic doctrine since the ending of the cold war.
O'BRIEN: Kiron Skinner of Carnegie Mellon University joining us this morning.
Also, Ivo Daalder joining us from the Brookings Institution.
To both of you, thank you so much.
Appreciate it.
SKINNER: Thank you.
DAALDER: Thank you.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
