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American Morning
Interview with Professor Jonathan Turley
Aired December 31, 2003 - 07:16 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: A special prosecutor has now been appointed to head the investigation into who leaked the name of a CIA operative to newspaper columnist Robert Novak. Attorney General John Ashcroft removed himself from that case yesterday.
Jonathan Turley today, a professor at George Washington University Law School, is here to talk about it.
Nice to see you, Professor. Good morning to you.
JONATHAN TURLEY, GEORGE WASHINGTON UNIVERSITY LAW SCHOOL: Hi, Bill.
HEMMER: What do you make of this?
TURLEY: Well, it's getting curiouser and curiouser, as they say. I mean, we have a sudden announcement that the attorney general has an appearance of a conflict of interest based upon facts learned over the course of this investigation. That's not too surprising. Since September, many people have said that a conflict of interest or an appearance of a conflict exists, because, after all, reporters have stated publicly that they received calls from the Bush White House trying to reveal the name of this covert CIA operative.
But what's curious is the response. Instead of appointing an independent prosecutor, someone outside the Justice Department, the attorney general has shifted the control of the investigation to the U.S. attorney in Chicago. That's going to create a real logistical issue. I mean, that person is 400 miles away of an investigation that is centered here in Washington, D.C.
HEMMER: Yes, you're suggesting that the integrity is still compromised here, aren't you?
TURLEY: Well, frankly, Bill, I just don't understand why they did this. I mean, you can go to any corner in D.C., throw a stick and hit half a dozen former special prosecutors or their deputies. I mean, this is a city that -- this is almost a cottage industry. So, I don't know why they didn't just appoint someone here in D.C.
HEMMER: Here's what I'm hearing, though. Charles Schumer, a Democratic senator from New York, a strong critic all along on this ordeal, says he's now 95 percent satisfied. Do the detractors now pick up the same theme and say, OK, they took another step and that we are happy?
TURLEY: Well, I'm surprised that they would say that, in that you still have the appointment of a political appointee, a very high political appointee in the Justice Department, taking an investigation where the White House is really at ground zero.
I mean, you know, Robert Novak was the one who released the name, but many reporters said they got calls trying to get them to release this name. And they've identified people in the White House.
Now, this is something of a live torpedo in the water. It's going to hit someone, and, you know, just taking out the attorney general shifting the appearance of a conflict to another Justice Department official.
Now, having said that, it's good that Ashcroft removed himself -- there's no question about that. But why they didn't take the whole step, why they took this half measure is a bit curious.
HEMMER: Bottom line, though, is this tough to prove? When was the last time somebody was prosecuted and actually found guilty of a leak?
TURLEY: Well, there have only been a couple of prosecutions for leaks to the media, and really this specific law was designed for one case. The difference, Bill, in this case is that, as you know, this city floats on a sea of leaks. And, you know, so it's -- that's not strange.
But what is strange is how many people got these calls. Usually, a Washington, D.C. leak by someone who knows how to do it makes one call to one reporter. They rarely call two people to protect themselves. Here, as many as a half a dozen reporters were called, and that makes it a little more serious. I mean, there's a real chance that this torpedo could hit.
HEMMER: Jonathan Turley, have a happy new year. Nice to chat with you.
TURLEY: Have a happy new year, too. Thank you, Bill.
HEMMER: All right.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com.
Aired December 31, 2003 - 07:16 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: A special prosecutor has now been appointed to head the investigation into who leaked the name of a CIA operative to newspaper columnist Robert Novak. Attorney General John Ashcroft removed himself from that case yesterday.
Jonathan Turley today, a professor at George Washington University Law School, is here to talk about it.
Nice to see you, Professor. Good morning to you.
JONATHAN TURLEY, GEORGE WASHINGTON UNIVERSITY LAW SCHOOL: Hi, Bill.
HEMMER: What do you make of this?
TURLEY: Well, it's getting curiouser and curiouser, as they say. I mean, we have a sudden announcement that the attorney general has an appearance of a conflict of interest based upon facts learned over the course of this investigation. That's not too surprising. Since September, many people have said that a conflict of interest or an appearance of a conflict exists, because, after all, reporters have stated publicly that they received calls from the Bush White House trying to reveal the name of this covert CIA operative.
But what's curious is the response. Instead of appointing an independent prosecutor, someone outside the Justice Department, the attorney general has shifted the control of the investigation to the U.S. attorney in Chicago. That's going to create a real logistical issue. I mean, that person is 400 miles away of an investigation that is centered here in Washington, D.C.
HEMMER: Yes, you're suggesting that the integrity is still compromised here, aren't you?
TURLEY: Well, frankly, Bill, I just don't understand why they did this. I mean, you can go to any corner in D.C., throw a stick and hit half a dozen former special prosecutors or their deputies. I mean, this is a city that -- this is almost a cottage industry. So, I don't know why they didn't just appoint someone here in D.C.
HEMMER: Here's what I'm hearing, though. Charles Schumer, a Democratic senator from New York, a strong critic all along on this ordeal, says he's now 95 percent satisfied. Do the detractors now pick up the same theme and say, OK, they took another step and that we are happy?
TURLEY: Well, I'm surprised that they would say that, in that you still have the appointment of a political appointee, a very high political appointee in the Justice Department, taking an investigation where the White House is really at ground zero.
I mean, you know, Robert Novak was the one who released the name, but many reporters said they got calls trying to get them to release this name. And they've identified people in the White House.
Now, this is something of a live torpedo in the water. It's going to hit someone, and, you know, just taking out the attorney general shifting the appearance of a conflict to another Justice Department official.
Now, having said that, it's good that Ashcroft removed himself -- there's no question about that. But why they didn't take the whole step, why they took this half measure is a bit curious.
HEMMER: Bottom line, though, is this tough to prove? When was the last time somebody was prosecuted and actually found guilty of a leak?
TURLEY: Well, there have only been a couple of prosecutions for leaks to the media, and really this specific law was designed for one case. The difference, Bill, in this case is that, as you know, this city floats on a sea of leaks. And, you know, so it's -- that's not strange.
But what is strange is how many people got these calls. Usually, a Washington, D.C. leak by someone who knows how to do it makes one call to one reporter. They rarely call two people to protect themselves. Here, as many as a half a dozen reporters were called, and that makes it a little more serious. I mean, there's a real chance that this torpedo could hit.
HEMMER: Jonathan Turley, have a happy new year. Nice to chat with you.
TURLEY: Have a happy new year, too. Thank you, Bill.
HEMMER: All right.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com.
