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American Morning

Rose Comes Clean

Aired January 05, 2004 - 09:17   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: They say confession is good for the soul. For baseball great Pete Rose, there could be an even bigger benefit, maybe a ticket to the Baseball Hall of Fame in Cooperstown. Rose was banned from the sport 14 years ago, in 1989. He has always denied that he bet on baseball while managing the Cincinnati Reds in the 1990s. Now, though, in his new autobiography, Rose comes clean about gambling on the game, in part. Excerpts of that book, entitled "My Prison Without Bars," appears now in "Sports Illustrated."
"SI" writer Tom Verducci is here, the only print reporter to have read this book in its entirety.

Nice to see you, Tom. Good morning.

A couple clips want to pull from the book here. Go to the full screen and show our viewers. Mr. Selig, this is the baseball commissioner, who has this meeting with Pete Rose apparently in November of 2002, so about 14 months ago: "Mr. Selig looked at me and said, 'I want to know one thing, did you bet on baseball?' I looked him in the eye, 'Sir, my daddy taught me two things in life -- how to play baseball and how to take responsibility for my actions. I learned the first one pretty well. The other, I've had some trouble with. Yes, sir, I did bet on baseball.'"

Is that as detailed as it gets?

TOM VERDUCCI, "SPORTS ILLUSTRATED": He goes into more detail. More importantly, Bill, he bet on the Reds while managing the team. Rule 21d posted in every single clubhouse, if you bet on a game in which you have a duty to perform, you are placed on the permanent ineligible list. That's the list he's on now. He does goes into further detail. He was betting on as many eight or nine games per day, $2,000 a game, three or four times a week. So it's very detailed in terms of how much he got involved in betting.

O'BRIEN: If he's admitting as manager he bet on baseball, bet on the Cincinnati Reds, did he differentiate between betting the Reds to win or lose?

VERDUCCI: He does, but the rule has no differentiation at all.

O'BRIEN: What does he say then, whether you bet for or against?

VERDUCCI: He says, hey, I always bet on my team to win, I would never do such a thing as bet against them.

O'BRIEN: Because there's a theory that says if he bet his team to lose, then he'd be trying to fix the games. But if he bet the team to win, then therefore, he was always trying to be a competitor, whether it was gambling or managing?

VERDUCCI: Right, and I understand the difference, but the rule does not differentiate. I mean, if you have a manager betting on his team to win, is that singular game more important for him to win now that he has money on it? In other words, say you had a relief pitcher scheduled to have a day off. If you have money on that game and want to win that game that badly, does it become that important for you to win that game?

O'BRIEN: Back to the book and a quote again: "A part of me was still looking for ways to recapture the high I got from winning batting titles and World Series. If I couldn't get the high from playing baseball, then I needed a substitute to keep from feeling depressed. I was driven, in gambling as well as in baseball. Enough was never enough. I had huge appetites, and I was always hungry."

What was your take away from that book after you read it?

VERDUCCI: Well, my take, Bill, was that he was definitely addicted to gambling. I mean, this was around the clock, around the year, in terms of college basketball, NFL football, and when it got to baseball, he could not stop. At that point, you're telling me you have a problem. He had six-figure debts in baseball, got in trouble with a couple different professional bookies.

To me, it was a problem that he had not entirely addressed in terms of the depth of the problem. He did go to Gamblers Anonymous meetings immediately after being suspended. It doesn't sound, reading from the book, that he got a whole lot out of those meetings.

O'BRIEN: What is his motivation now, 14 years later?

VERDUCCI: Well, I think there's a couple of things. I think he realized, with the help of Mike Schmidt, his former teammate, he was never coming back unless he made some sort of confession.

O'BRIEN: Never had chance in the Hall of Fame.

VERDUCCI: Never had a chance.

O'BRIEN: He said he wanted to manage again.

VERDUCCI: And that's the other thing. I think he does want to manage again. And also don't forget how important the Hall of Fame is to Pete Rose, and the clock is ticking there. He has to be reinstated by December '05 in order to get on the baseball writers' ballot. I think he's got a good shot of getting in if he's on the writers' ballot. Now if he's not reinstated by then, his candidacy then bumps to the veterans committee. That's comprised mostly of Hall of Fame players. Many of those people have said, privately and publicly, they don't want him in the Hall.

O'BRIEN: So he's watching the clock and he's trying read the signs also. These sportswriters in America today, how will they react to this? Do we have any gauge on that?

VERDUCCI: We don't, Bill, but my opinion, talking to some other people, that if he is placed on the writers ballot, he will get the necessary 75 percent support to get in.

O'BRIEN: You don't think they'll vote as a block and try to freeze him out as a statement? Oftentimes, they have in the past.

VERDUCCI: Absolutely, and I think there are a segment of writers who will want to keep him out that on the grounds of what he did is one of the most unforgivable sin in baseball, no matter that he comes clean 14 years later. But I think the majority would differentiate between Pete Rose in uniform again, which I don't know will happen or not, and Pete Rose being enshrined in the Hall of Fame.

O'BRIEN: Five seconds -- Bud Selig, baseball, have they reacted to this yet?

VERDUCCI: He's got a dilemma. He knows the Hall of Famers aren't so sure what to think, but the public, I think, wants to see Pete in.

O'BRIEN: Thanks, Tom. Tom Verducci from "SI." Come back any time. Nice talking to you.

VERDUCCI: Thank you.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com







Aired January 5, 2004 - 09:17   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: They say confession is good for the soul. For baseball great Pete Rose, there could be an even bigger benefit, maybe a ticket to the Baseball Hall of Fame in Cooperstown. Rose was banned from the sport 14 years ago, in 1989. He has always denied that he bet on baseball while managing the Cincinnati Reds in the 1990s. Now, though, in his new autobiography, Rose comes clean about gambling on the game, in part. Excerpts of that book, entitled "My Prison Without Bars," appears now in "Sports Illustrated."
"SI" writer Tom Verducci is here, the only print reporter to have read this book in its entirety.

Nice to see you, Tom. Good morning.

A couple clips want to pull from the book here. Go to the full screen and show our viewers. Mr. Selig, this is the baseball commissioner, who has this meeting with Pete Rose apparently in November of 2002, so about 14 months ago: "Mr. Selig looked at me and said, 'I want to know one thing, did you bet on baseball?' I looked him in the eye, 'Sir, my daddy taught me two things in life -- how to play baseball and how to take responsibility for my actions. I learned the first one pretty well. The other, I've had some trouble with. Yes, sir, I did bet on baseball.'"

Is that as detailed as it gets?

TOM VERDUCCI, "SPORTS ILLUSTRATED": He goes into more detail. More importantly, Bill, he bet on the Reds while managing the team. Rule 21d posted in every single clubhouse, if you bet on a game in which you have a duty to perform, you are placed on the permanent ineligible list. That's the list he's on now. He does goes into further detail. He was betting on as many eight or nine games per day, $2,000 a game, three or four times a week. So it's very detailed in terms of how much he got involved in betting.

O'BRIEN: If he's admitting as manager he bet on baseball, bet on the Cincinnati Reds, did he differentiate between betting the Reds to win or lose?

VERDUCCI: He does, but the rule has no differentiation at all.

O'BRIEN: What does he say then, whether you bet for or against?

VERDUCCI: He says, hey, I always bet on my team to win, I would never do such a thing as bet against them.

O'BRIEN: Because there's a theory that says if he bet his team to lose, then he'd be trying to fix the games. But if he bet the team to win, then therefore, he was always trying to be a competitor, whether it was gambling or managing?

VERDUCCI: Right, and I understand the difference, but the rule does not differentiate. I mean, if you have a manager betting on his team to win, is that singular game more important for him to win now that he has money on it? In other words, say you had a relief pitcher scheduled to have a day off. If you have money on that game and want to win that game that badly, does it become that important for you to win that game?

O'BRIEN: Back to the book and a quote again: "A part of me was still looking for ways to recapture the high I got from winning batting titles and World Series. If I couldn't get the high from playing baseball, then I needed a substitute to keep from feeling depressed. I was driven, in gambling as well as in baseball. Enough was never enough. I had huge appetites, and I was always hungry."

What was your take away from that book after you read it?

VERDUCCI: Well, my take, Bill, was that he was definitely addicted to gambling. I mean, this was around the clock, around the year, in terms of college basketball, NFL football, and when it got to baseball, he could not stop. At that point, you're telling me you have a problem. He had six-figure debts in baseball, got in trouble with a couple different professional bookies.

To me, it was a problem that he had not entirely addressed in terms of the depth of the problem. He did go to Gamblers Anonymous meetings immediately after being suspended. It doesn't sound, reading from the book, that he got a whole lot out of those meetings.

O'BRIEN: What is his motivation now, 14 years later?

VERDUCCI: Well, I think there's a couple of things. I think he realized, with the help of Mike Schmidt, his former teammate, he was never coming back unless he made some sort of confession.

O'BRIEN: Never had chance in the Hall of Fame.

VERDUCCI: Never had a chance.

O'BRIEN: He said he wanted to manage again.

VERDUCCI: And that's the other thing. I think he does want to manage again. And also don't forget how important the Hall of Fame is to Pete Rose, and the clock is ticking there. He has to be reinstated by December '05 in order to get on the baseball writers' ballot. I think he's got a good shot of getting in if he's on the writers' ballot. Now if he's not reinstated by then, his candidacy then bumps to the veterans committee. That's comprised mostly of Hall of Fame players. Many of those people have said, privately and publicly, they don't want him in the Hall.

O'BRIEN: So he's watching the clock and he's trying read the signs also. These sportswriters in America today, how will they react to this? Do we have any gauge on that?

VERDUCCI: We don't, Bill, but my opinion, talking to some other people, that if he is placed on the writers ballot, he will get the necessary 75 percent support to get in.

O'BRIEN: You don't think they'll vote as a block and try to freeze him out as a statement? Oftentimes, they have in the past.

VERDUCCI: Absolutely, and I think there are a segment of writers who will want to keep him out that on the grounds of what he did is one of the most unforgivable sin in baseball, no matter that he comes clean 14 years later. But I think the majority would differentiate between Pete Rose in uniform again, which I don't know will happen or not, and Pete Rose being enshrined in the Hall of Fame.

O'BRIEN: Five seconds -- Bud Selig, baseball, have they reacted to this yet?

VERDUCCI: He's got a dilemma. He knows the Hall of Famers aren't so sure what to think, but the public, I think, wants to see Pete in.

O'BRIEN: Thanks, Tom. Tom Verducci from "SI." Come back any time. Nice talking to you.

VERDUCCI: Thank you.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com