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American Morning

Interview With Christopher Shays

Aired February 02, 2004 - 08:04   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Now to the latest terror concerns, which led to the grounding of seven flights over the weekend. In just a moment, we're going to talk with Congressman Christopher Shays about what's being called credible intelligence that led to the cancellations.
But first, here's CNN's Elaine Quijano.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ELAINE QUIJANO, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): A federal law enforcement source tells CNN the current worries regarding canceled flights were based primarily on fears that terrorists could possibly use planes as "air taxis" to deliver biological, chemical or radioactive material to various U.S. cities.

But the source calls the information spotty and says it may be unreliable.

A senior administration official says that scenario is simply one of many possibilities, that at this point no one scenario is causing greater concern over another.

Law makers say the U.S. isn't taking any chances.

SEN. JAY ROCKEFELLER (D-WV), VICE CHAIRMAN, INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEE: We don't know how to protect against biological. Therefore, if there's any whiff -- I mean any sense, not whiff, but any sense of biological, you play it safe and you, and the plane doesn't fly.

QUIJANO: One former counter-terrorism official says he believes the government is going too far.

LARRY JOHNSON, FORMER STATE DEPARTMENT COUNTER-TERRORISM OFFICIAL: And I think this constant over reaction to unreliable, unproven, untested intelligence is doing a disservice to the air passengers, to the airlines and to the security of this country.

QUIJANO: For passengers traveling abroad, a mixture of acceptance and anxiety.

KATHLEEN ROTTIER, TRAVELER: There were French police, armed policemen around the airplane as we boarded. I don't know what they were looking for. But in a way it makes you feel uncomfortable, but then on the other hand, that level of security does offer some comfort. QUIJANO (on camera): U.S. officials say they'll continue to monitor all the intelligence information and take whatever steps they deem necessary. For now, officials also say there are no plans to raise the nation's terror threat level.

Elaine Quijano, CNN, Dulles International Airport.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN: Congressman Christopher Shays is chairman of the House committee on homeland security.

He joins us from New Haven, Connecticut to talk about the renewed concerns about a terrorist attack from the air.

Congressman Shays, nice to see you.

Thank you for being with us this morning.

REP. CHRISTOPHER SHAYS (R), CONNECTICUT: Thank you.

Nice to be with you.

O'BRIEN: Thank you very much.

As you heard, these -- there were reports that these flights were cancelled because of credible intelligence that al Qaeda might use these flights as sort of air taxis, transporting biological or chemical weapons.

Can you give us any more information about this information?

SHAYS: No, other than that Jay Rockefeller is right. I mean we're going to be somewhat cautious. We have tremendous concerns about chemical weapons and biological weapons. If it's chemical and an airplane, we'll know about it pretty quickly. If it's biological, passengers will have dispersed, gone into other areas.

The fact is we're at war and I think some people still don't get it.

O'BRIEN: You say cautious, but some critics say that it's over reaction to unreliable information.

How do you answer them?

SHAYS: Well, I'm going to try to determine the reliability, as will other members of Congress. So, you know, that's obviously a question that we're going to have to check. I mean given our failure to find weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, I can understand people questioning the reliability. But the fact is that we know al Qaeda is doing these things. And the fact that certain plans were chosen obviously makes me feel that the information was more specific.

O'BRIEN: Do you think there's enough being done overseas to protect passengers' safety, especially when you're talking about chemical and biological weapons? It doesn't necessarily seem as if the U.S. has a good handle on how exactly to protect people against those concerns.

SHAYS: Well, I think we in the United States do a better job than they do in Europe. In traveling from Europe, I'm pretty surprised with how lax it appears to be at times. But one of the things that people need to know in this country, we do not check any of the cargo that goes on cargo planes or cargo that goes on passenger planes. And 22 percent of what's in the belly of a passenger aircraft is cargo.

O'BRIEN: So then the answer to that, or the question, I guess, that raises for passengers is so how safe am I flying? Are you saying I shouldn't fly at all because if you're not checking a tremendous percentage and at the same time we're worried about chemical and biological weapons being brought in on these "air taxis," how can you possibly protect me?

SHAYS: Well, it's like saying should I drive an automobile? I mean I drive an automobile knowing that tens of thousands of people are killed. I fly in an airplane, frankly, knowing it still could be blown out, blown up in the air. I mean that's the reality. It's not something that I'm expecting will happen, but I know it could happen.

O'BRIEN: Let's talk a little bit about this domestic flight, this Continental Airlines flight. It was the first U.S.-based airline to cancel a domestic flight over concerns about terrorism.

Do you think, as Senator Rockefeller has said, this is the new reality and we have to just get used to this?

SHAYS: You know, this is the new reality. People are safer today than they were before September 11, 2001. We just don't feel safer because we had a false sense of security before. But the reality is these terrorists are willing to blow themselves up in the process of blowing up others and it's very hard to defend and we're working overtime.

I think one of the things this points out is that we are making some success. We are aware that some flights can be in danger and we're acting accordingly.

O'BRIEN: Do you expect that the terror threat level will be raised any time soon?

SHAYS: Oh, it will go back and forth. But when it is raised, I'd like people to pay attention to it. It doesn't mean you go about your normal day. You do the things you have to do, but you're wise about what you do when the terrorist threat is raised to, say, code orange.

O'BRIEN: Can you elaborate on that, because go about your normal day is almost verbatim what every elected official will tell you to do.

SHAYS: Yes. You know, I'm surprised that they tell you that. I mean if some of the things you do normally you don't have to do, then maybe you should decide not to. I'm talking about when you go to code orange. When we went to code orange, I wouldn't have flown to Europe because I knew I had to fly back and I knew that there was very serious concern about terrorists on planes.

Remember, the foreign carriers have resisted having marshals on aircraft. They don't think they need it and we think they do. So I think people need to just start to say what do I have to do and do the things they have to do when you have a threat that goes up to code orange.

O'BRIEN: Congressman Christopher Shays joining us this morning.

Nice to see you, sir.

SHAYS: Thank you.

O'BRIEN: Thanks for being with us.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com






Aired February 2, 2004 - 08:04   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Now to the latest terror concerns, which led to the grounding of seven flights over the weekend. In just a moment, we're going to talk with Congressman Christopher Shays about what's being called credible intelligence that led to the cancellations.
But first, here's CNN's Elaine Quijano.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ELAINE QUIJANO, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): A federal law enforcement source tells CNN the current worries regarding canceled flights were based primarily on fears that terrorists could possibly use planes as "air taxis" to deliver biological, chemical or radioactive material to various U.S. cities.

But the source calls the information spotty and says it may be unreliable.

A senior administration official says that scenario is simply one of many possibilities, that at this point no one scenario is causing greater concern over another.

Law makers say the U.S. isn't taking any chances.

SEN. JAY ROCKEFELLER (D-WV), VICE CHAIRMAN, INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEE: We don't know how to protect against biological. Therefore, if there's any whiff -- I mean any sense, not whiff, but any sense of biological, you play it safe and you, and the plane doesn't fly.

QUIJANO: One former counter-terrorism official says he believes the government is going too far.

LARRY JOHNSON, FORMER STATE DEPARTMENT COUNTER-TERRORISM OFFICIAL: And I think this constant over reaction to unreliable, unproven, untested intelligence is doing a disservice to the air passengers, to the airlines and to the security of this country.

QUIJANO: For passengers traveling abroad, a mixture of acceptance and anxiety.

KATHLEEN ROTTIER, TRAVELER: There were French police, armed policemen around the airplane as we boarded. I don't know what they were looking for. But in a way it makes you feel uncomfortable, but then on the other hand, that level of security does offer some comfort. QUIJANO (on camera): U.S. officials say they'll continue to monitor all the intelligence information and take whatever steps they deem necessary. For now, officials also say there are no plans to raise the nation's terror threat level.

Elaine Quijano, CNN, Dulles International Airport.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN: Congressman Christopher Shays is chairman of the House committee on homeland security.

He joins us from New Haven, Connecticut to talk about the renewed concerns about a terrorist attack from the air.

Congressman Shays, nice to see you.

Thank you for being with us this morning.

REP. CHRISTOPHER SHAYS (R), CONNECTICUT: Thank you.

Nice to be with you.

O'BRIEN: Thank you very much.

As you heard, these -- there were reports that these flights were cancelled because of credible intelligence that al Qaeda might use these flights as sort of air taxis, transporting biological or chemical weapons.

Can you give us any more information about this information?

SHAYS: No, other than that Jay Rockefeller is right. I mean we're going to be somewhat cautious. We have tremendous concerns about chemical weapons and biological weapons. If it's chemical and an airplane, we'll know about it pretty quickly. If it's biological, passengers will have dispersed, gone into other areas.

The fact is we're at war and I think some people still don't get it.

O'BRIEN: You say cautious, but some critics say that it's over reaction to unreliable information.

How do you answer them?

SHAYS: Well, I'm going to try to determine the reliability, as will other members of Congress. So, you know, that's obviously a question that we're going to have to check. I mean given our failure to find weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, I can understand people questioning the reliability. But the fact is that we know al Qaeda is doing these things. And the fact that certain plans were chosen obviously makes me feel that the information was more specific.

O'BRIEN: Do you think there's enough being done overseas to protect passengers' safety, especially when you're talking about chemical and biological weapons? It doesn't necessarily seem as if the U.S. has a good handle on how exactly to protect people against those concerns.

SHAYS: Well, I think we in the United States do a better job than they do in Europe. In traveling from Europe, I'm pretty surprised with how lax it appears to be at times. But one of the things that people need to know in this country, we do not check any of the cargo that goes on cargo planes or cargo that goes on passenger planes. And 22 percent of what's in the belly of a passenger aircraft is cargo.

O'BRIEN: So then the answer to that, or the question, I guess, that raises for passengers is so how safe am I flying? Are you saying I shouldn't fly at all because if you're not checking a tremendous percentage and at the same time we're worried about chemical and biological weapons being brought in on these "air taxis," how can you possibly protect me?

SHAYS: Well, it's like saying should I drive an automobile? I mean I drive an automobile knowing that tens of thousands of people are killed. I fly in an airplane, frankly, knowing it still could be blown out, blown up in the air. I mean that's the reality. It's not something that I'm expecting will happen, but I know it could happen.

O'BRIEN: Let's talk a little bit about this domestic flight, this Continental Airlines flight. It was the first U.S.-based airline to cancel a domestic flight over concerns about terrorism.

Do you think, as Senator Rockefeller has said, this is the new reality and we have to just get used to this?

SHAYS: You know, this is the new reality. People are safer today than they were before September 11, 2001. We just don't feel safer because we had a false sense of security before. But the reality is these terrorists are willing to blow themselves up in the process of blowing up others and it's very hard to defend and we're working overtime.

I think one of the things this points out is that we are making some success. We are aware that some flights can be in danger and we're acting accordingly.

O'BRIEN: Do you expect that the terror threat level will be raised any time soon?

SHAYS: Oh, it will go back and forth. But when it is raised, I'd like people to pay attention to it. It doesn't mean you go about your normal day. You do the things you have to do, but you're wise about what you do when the terrorist threat is raised to, say, code orange.

O'BRIEN: Can you elaborate on that, because go about your normal day is almost verbatim what every elected official will tell you to do.

SHAYS: Yes. You know, I'm surprised that they tell you that. I mean if some of the things you do normally you don't have to do, then maybe you should decide not to. I'm talking about when you go to code orange. When we went to code orange, I wouldn't have flown to Europe because I knew I had to fly back and I knew that there was very serious concern about terrorists on planes.

Remember, the foreign carriers have resisted having marshals on aircraft. They don't think they need it and we think they do. So I think people need to just start to say what do I have to do and do the things they have to do when you have a threat that goes up to code orange.

O'BRIEN: Congressman Christopher Shays joining us this morning.

Nice to see you, sir.

SHAYS: Thank you.

O'BRIEN: Thanks for being with us.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com