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American Morning

Martha Stewart Trial

Aired February 05, 2004 - 07:15   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: Moving on now, if we can after all of that -- excuse me -- to the Martha Stewart trial and the most damaging testimony yet from the government's star witness, her former stockbroker's assistant. Douglas Faneuil says he alerted Stewart that ImClone's CEO was dumping shares he held in his own company, and Faneuil says he did so because his boss, Stewart's co-defendant, Peter Bacanovic, told him to.
CNN senior legal analyst Jeffrey Toobin was in court yesterday for quite a dramatic day, I understand, joining us now.

JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: I'll tell you, this courtroom was riveted. Martha Stewart has had bad days in her life, I'm sure, but I doubt she has had any quite as bad as yesterday. This guy was...

COLLINS: Why was that? What happened?

TOOBIN: Well, he is an extremely good witness. At one point, his descriptions of his meetings with Peter Bacanovic became so vivid and so animated that he was basically doing, like, an impression. He was saying, and then I said, and then he said.

COSTELLO: Have you ever seen anything like that before?

TOOBIN: Well, no. And Robert Morvillo, Martha Stewart's lawyer said, your honor, I object to the acting. And the judge said no, that's OK, because we want to give the jury a vivid picture of what went on. And it was extremely believable testimony, I thought anyway.

COLLINS: Effective?

TOOBIN: Very effective, because, you know, it just had the ring of truth of here you had this somewhat star-struck then 26-year-old kid, you know, being told to pass on this inappropriate, if not illegal, information to Martha Stewart. He did it, and then he started to have misgivings about it. And Peter Bacanovic repeatedly telling him in these dramatic confrontations, look, this is the story. This is what we're saying about this transaction. And it just seemed to me to have the real ring of truth.

COLLINS: Tell us a little bit about the reaction from Martha Stewart.

TOOBIN: Well, that was the other thing. He talked about the conversation where he gave Martha Stewart the tip, and Martha at one point said, well, tell me when you make this sale of the ImClone stock. And Faneuil said, OK, I'll tell your assistant, Ann Armstrong. And Martha went on a tirade on the phone. She said, no, don't you get my personal assistant involved with it. You tell me directly. You e- mail me to my personal account, which was incriminating, because it suggests that she wanted to keep this transaction secret, even from the people she worked with every day.

COLLINS: But her reaction in the courtroom as well. We talked about this, too.

TOOBIN: She is...

COLLINS: She is listening to her lawyers.

TOOBIN: She is as cool as a cucumber. I have never seen a better demeanor on a criminal defendant. She doesn't roll her eyes. She doesn't sigh. She doesn't, you know, indicate exasperation. But she's got to be suffering, because, you know, she is too smart not to know that this was a bad witness for her.

COLLINS: Now, what about the conversation that took place when the jury was not present about Faneuil? Are they trying to discredit him a little bit here with some history?

TOOBIN: Right. One of the ways that the defense is trying to discredit Faneuil is they're trying to raise issues of drug use. But, you know, I think for a New York jury, his drug use is not going to impress them as being very serious -- using marijuana once a month, a couple of experimentations with ecstasy.

It really -- the defense tried to make a little bit of an issue of it. I think it fell completely flat. He's obviously not a drug addict. He obviously wasn't high or, you know, deranged in some way. If that's the best the defense has to discredit Faneuil, they've got a lot of problems.

COLLINS: All right, stand by for more antics in the courtroom. Thanks so much, Jeffrey Toobin, CNN senior legal analyst.

TOOBIN: Cross-examination continues today.

COLLINS: All right, very good. And you'll be watching it.

TOOBIN: I will.

COLLINS: Thanks, Jeffrey.

TOOBIN: OK.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com.






Aired February 5, 2004 - 07:15   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
HEIDI COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: Moving on now, if we can after all of that -- excuse me -- to the Martha Stewart trial and the most damaging testimony yet from the government's star witness, her former stockbroker's assistant. Douglas Faneuil says he alerted Stewart that ImClone's CEO was dumping shares he held in his own company, and Faneuil says he did so because his boss, Stewart's co-defendant, Peter Bacanovic, told him to.
CNN senior legal analyst Jeffrey Toobin was in court yesterday for quite a dramatic day, I understand, joining us now.

JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: I'll tell you, this courtroom was riveted. Martha Stewart has had bad days in her life, I'm sure, but I doubt she has had any quite as bad as yesterday. This guy was...

COLLINS: Why was that? What happened?

TOOBIN: Well, he is an extremely good witness. At one point, his descriptions of his meetings with Peter Bacanovic became so vivid and so animated that he was basically doing, like, an impression. He was saying, and then I said, and then he said.

COSTELLO: Have you ever seen anything like that before?

TOOBIN: Well, no. And Robert Morvillo, Martha Stewart's lawyer said, your honor, I object to the acting. And the judge said no, that's OK, because we want to give the jury a vivid picture of what went on. And it was extremely believable testimony, I thought anyway.

COLLINS: Effective?

TOOBIN: Very effective, because, you know, it just had the ring of truth of here you had this somewhat star-struck then 26-year-old kid, you know, being told to pass on this inappropriate, if not illegal, information to Martha Stewart. He did it, and then he started to have misgivings about it. And Peter Bacanovic repeatedly telling him in these dramatic confrontations, look, this is the story. This is what we're saying about this transaction. And it just seemed to me to have the real ring of truth.

COLLINS: Tell us a little bit about the reaction from Martha Stewart.

TOOBIN: Well, that was the other thing. He talked about the conversation where he gave Martha Stewart the tip, and Martha at one point said, well, tell me when you make this sale of the ImClone stock. And Faneuil said, OK, I'll tell your assistant, Ann Armstrong. And Martha went on a tirade on the phone. She said, no, don't you get my personal assistant involved with it. You tell me directly. You e- mail me to my personal account, which was incriminating, because it suggests that she wanted to keep this transaction secret, even from the people she worked with every day.

COLLINS: But her reaction in the courtroom as well. We talked about this, too.

TOOBIN: She is...

COLLINS: She is listening to her lawyers.

TOOBIN: She is as cool as a cucumber. I have never seen a better demeanor on a criminal defendant. She doesn't roll her eyes. She doesn't sigh. She doesn't, you know, indicate exasperation. But she's got to be suffering, because, you know, she is too smart not to know that this was a bad witness for her.

COLLINS: Now, what about the conversation that took place when the jury was not present about Faneuil? Are they trying to discredit him a little bit here with some history?

TOOBIN: Right. One of the ways that the defense is trying to discredit Faneuil is they're trying to raise issues of drug use. But, you know, I think for a New York jury, his drug use is not going to impress them as being very serious -- using marijuana once a month, a couple of experimentations with ecstasy.

It really -- the defense tried to make a little bit of an issue of it. I think it fell completely flat. He's obviously not a drug addict. He obviously wasn't high or, you know, deranged in some way. If that's the best the defense has to discredit Faneuil, they've got a lot of problems.

COLLINS: All right, stand by for more antics in the courtroom. Thanks so much, Jeffrey Toobin, CNN senior legal analyst.

TOOBIN: Cross-examination continues today.

COLLINS: All right, very good. And you'll be watching it.

TOOBIN: I will.

COLLINS: Thanks, Jeffrey.

TOOBIN: OK.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com.