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American Morning

Interview With David Kay

Aired February 12, 2004 - 07:16   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: President Bush says something must be done to stop the black market in nuclear equipment before weapons of mass destruction fall into the hands of terrorists.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: With that technology and expertise on the market, there's the terrible possibility that terrorist groups could obtain the ultimate weapons they desire most.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

O'BRIEN: Mr. Bush yesterday outlined a seven-point plan to curb weapons proliferation.

Former CIA weapons inspector David Kay joins us this morning from Washington, D.C. to talk about the president's policy initiative.

Hi, David. Good morning. Nice to see you.

DAVID KAY, FORMER CHIEF U.S. WEAPONS INSPECTOR IN IRAQ: Good to see you, Soledad.

O'BRIEN: Thank you. The president proposed seven steps that would work toward stopping the illicit proliferation of weapons of mass destruction and trafficking. Many people, though, say it stops way too short of what it needs to do. What do you think?

KAY: Well, I think there are vital steps along the path towards more effective control. They are admirable and in many ways they reflect a return to a bipartisan consensus of these measures. The real issue is going to be some of them are quite sharp departures from the administration's previous position, and getting international reaction is not going to be obviously easy.

O'BRIEN: Before we get into talking about international support for this, let's talk a little bit about what some people have criticized; for example, that these policies apply only very specifically to a couple of countries in many instances.

KAY: Well, I think fortunately, at least so far, there are only a handful of countries that are really involved in active proliferation. I think the policies themselves, though, are much broader than that in terms of going to the future. And what you would really like is a set of policies and institutions that discourage countries from going down this path. I think the president has laid out a pretty effective set in that way, if we can get them adopted.

O'BRIEN: And, of course, getting them adopted is going to rely on international acceptance of them. Many think this proposal actually is not going to get sold to the IAEA, saying to some degree that it's not fair.

I want to read you a little bit of what Mohamad ElBaradei had to say. He wrote an article about this. He said: "A fundamental part of the nonproliferation bargain is the commitment of the five nuclear states recognized under the Nonproliferation Treaty -- Britain, China, France, Russia and the United States -- to move toward disarmament."

Do you actually agree with that? Do you think that's going to happen?

KAY: Well, I think ElBaradei is absolutely correct. That was part of what many states perceived as a political bargain. I think it's -- we've papered over it, as have the other five nuclear powers, by saying that's the ultimate objective. I think, in fact, some progress has been made. It's quite clear more needs to be made. But I actually don't think that is the one which there is the most -- going to be the most serious resistance.

O'BRIEN: What do you think is going to have the most serious resistance?

KAY: Well, the president called -- and I think very wisely -- for international criminalization through the U.N. of states and individuals who engage in the proliferation and exchange of nuclear materials. The problem with that is this administration certainly has not been an advocate of the International Criminal Court or international criminal jurisdiction. And just this past week, we applauded the Pakistani decision to pardon A.Q. Khan, who is the poster boy, for running a Sam's Club for nuclear technology. Our policy has been inconsistent on this, and, believe me, other states will point that out.

O'BRIEN: When you talk about inconsistencies, certainly you have to then talk about intelligence. What's the strength of our intelligence when it regards all of this? I mean, do we have accurate intelligence to combat the illegal proliferations of weapons of mass destruction?

KAY: Well, I think the president very acutely in a part of the speech not widely reported opened the door for that in pointing out the need for more effective intelligence and the need for reform and identifying his new commission as the body to do that. I think that's really quite good.

O'BRIEN: David Kay is the former U.S. chief weapons inspector in Iraq joining us this morning from our bureau in Washington, D.C. Nice to see you, David. Thanks for being with us.

KAY: Good to see you again.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com.







Aired February 12, 2004 - 07:16   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: President Bush says something must be done to stop the black market in nuclear equipment before weapons of mass destruction fall into the hands of terrorists.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: With that technology and expertise on the market, there's the terrible possibility that terrorist groups could obtain the ultimate weapons they desire most.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

O'BRIEN: Mr. Bush yesterday outlined a seven-point plan to curb weapons proliferation.

Former CIA weapons inspector David Kay joins us this morning from Washington, D.C. to talk about the president's policy initiative.

Hi, David. Good morning. Nice to see you.

DAVID KAY, FORMER CHIEF U.S. WEAPONS INSPECTOR IN IRAQ: Good to see you, Soledad.

O'BRIEN: Thank you. The president proposed seven steps that would work toward stopping the illicit proliferation of weapons of mass destruction and trafficking. Many people, though, say it stops way too short of what it needs to do. What do you think?

KAY: Well, I think there are vital steps along the path towards more effective control. They are admirable and in many ways they reflect a return to a bipartisan consensus of these measures. The real issue is going to be some of them are quite sharp departures from the administration's previous position, and getting international reaction is not going to be obviously easy.

O'BRIEN: Before we get into talking about international support for this, let's talk a little bit about what some people have criticized; for example, that these policies apply only very specifically to a couple of countries in many instances.

KAY: Well, I think fortunately, at least so far, there are only a handful of countries that are really involved in active proliferation. I think the policies themselves, though, are much broader than that in terms of going to the future. And what you would really like is a set of policies and institutions that discourage countries from going down this path. I think the president has laid out a pretty effective set in that way, if we can get them adopted.

O'BRIEN: And, of course, getting them adopted is going to rely on international acceptance of them. Many think this proposal actually is not going to get sold to the IAEA, saying to some degree that it's not fair.

I want to read you a little bit of what Mohamad ElBaradei had to say. He wrote an article about this. He said: "A fundamental part of the nonproliferation bargain is the commitment of the five nuclear states recognized under the Nonproliferation Treaty -- Britain, China, France, Russia and the United States -- to move toward disarmament."

Do you actually agree with that? Do you think that's going to happen?

KAY: Well, I think ElBaradei is absolutely correct. That was part of what many states perceived as a political bargain. I think it's -- we've papered over it, as have the other five nuclear powers, by saying that's the ultimate objective. I think, in fact, some progress has been made. It's quite clear more needs to be made. But I actually don't think that is the one which there is the most -- going to be the most serious resistance.

O'BRIEN: What do you think is going to have the most serious resistance?

KAY: Well, the president called -- and I think very wisely -- for international criminalization through the U.N. of states and individuals who engage in the proliferation and exchange of nuclear materials. The problem with that is this administration certainly has not been an advocate of the International Criminal Court or international criminal jurisdiction. And just this past week, we applauded the Pakistani decision to pardon A.Q. Khan, who is the poster boy, for running a Sam's Club for nuclear technology. Our policy has been inconsistent on this, and, believe me, other states will point that out.

O'BRIEN: When you talk about inconsistencies, certainly you have to then talk about intelligence. What's the strength of our intelligence when it regards all of this? I mean, do we have accurate intelligence to combat the illegal proliferations of weapons of mass destruction?

KAY: Well, I think the president very acutely in a part of the speech not widely reported opened the door for that in pointing out the need for more effective intelligence and the need for reform and identifying his new commission as the body to do that. I think that's really quite good.

O'BRIEN: David Kay is the former U.S. chief weapons inspector in Iraq joining us this morning from our bureau in Washington, D.C. Nice to see you, David. Thanks for being with us.

KAY: Good to see you again.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com.