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American Morning
Interview With Gavin Newsom; Lesbian Couple Enjoy Legal Marriage
Aired February 13, 2004 - 08:17 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Gay marriage is still not banned in Boston or the rest of Massachusetts. The law makers in that state ended two days of debate at midnight last night without passing an amendment that would have banned same-sex marriage. While they debated, the City of San Francisco defied California law yesterday, issuing licenses and marrying 87 same-sex couples.
Last night in an exclusive interview here on CNN, I talked with the mayor of San Francisco, Gavin Newsom.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MAYOR GAVIN NEWSOM, SAN FRANCISCO, CALIFORNIA: I think there'll be a time in this country when we'll agree with the absurdities of creating a statute of discrimination which says that I have the chance to be married and you and others have the chance to be married, an opposite gender individual, and I have privileges, as well as obligations and rights that are not extended to other people. And I don't believe as mayor, taking the oath of the constitution, that I have the right to perpetuate that kind of discriminatory policy.
HEMMER: Yes, Mr. Mayor, what's the possible penalty against this act today?
NEWSOM: Well, I don't know, the penalty of not doing it. What is the morality of perpetrating discrimination? Where is the fundamental decency to extend the same privileges and rights that the rest of us are afforded? What is the fundamental right to perpetuate a policy of separate but unequal, which a lot of people seem to suggest as a compromise. Do you compromise your values? Do you compromise core principles? I'm not going to compromise.
I read the constitution of the State of California and nowhere in there does it tell me to constitute on the fundamental right of non- discrimination.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HEMMER: That's Mayor Gavin Newsom from last evening.
Now, from San Francisco today, one of the same-sex couples married yesterday, Alexandra D'Amario and Margot McShane.
My apologies, Alexandra.
ALEXANDRA D'AMARIO, MARRIED GAY PARTNER: Oh, that's OK. HEMMER: And welcome here to AMERICAN MORNING.
Tell us, how is your life different, Alexandra, today than it was 24 hours ago?
D'AMARIO: Well, you know, I woke up so excited this morning and, you know, how is it different? It's not that different. We have a piece of paper which now tells us that we have a lot of legal protection and it's just, it's life changing, really.
HEMMER: Let me talk about that legal protection. You're pregnant, right, with twins?
D'AMARIO: Yes, I am.
HEMMER: When your babies are born, how will they get more protection under California law, that this is in defiance of, essentially?
D'AMARIO: Yes, well, I'm not that familiar with California law. I think of protection in terms of our children going to school and being protected by saying I have two moms and people not making fun of them, people not picking on them, harassing them, making them feel different. That's how I feel they'll have protection.
HEMMER: There is an expected challenge in the legal sense, and probably more after that, as well.
I want to read you a statement from an organization in California. It's the Campaign for California Families, a family issues organization against what's happening there in your city. They say, and quoting now, "These so-called marriages are not worth the paper they're written on. The mayor has no more authority to issue same-sex marriage licenses than he does to cede San Francisco from the State of California. It's merely a symbolic act and a media stunt with no validity."
Margot, on record for you now, your reaction to that statement and legal challenge that may ensue?
MARGOT MCSHANE, MARRIED GAY PARTNER: Yes, well, that -- when I hear that statement, I feel like that's the point of view of possibly people's personal religious beliefs. This is not a religious issue. It's actually an issue of rights in our feeling. It's a feeling of fairness. We feel like we've been denied the rights to be a married couple. We live exactly like a married couple. The only difference is that we're the same gender.
And to us it's an issue of what we're being denied that straight couples aren't. We're not saying everyone has to agree with us or that we're trying to change people's conviction. We're just saying that we're being denied basic rights of fairness and equality. And that's really what we're fighting for.
HEMMER: Margo, if you could for our viewers, explain to us the rights that you're talking about. Why do you deserve them as a couple?
MCSHANE: Why do you deserve them? I don't know if you're married, but that's the question I ask straight people, why do they deserve it? And they usually look at us and say yes, you're right, that isn't fair. And most people aren't familiar enough with the issue to understand that this is an act of discrimination. And so just more technically, though, I mean we are, it's our role as parents, as good parents, to protect our children. And as you know, Alex is pregnant with twins. So if we don't want our child to be discriminated against. Right now I don't have legal rights to be the second parent. I have to go through a whole adoption proceeding. That's just not fair.
And it's also, it's just a discrimination, kind of an affront to my entire family. I have a nephew who grows up with a loving, committed couple here who are both of his aunts and I have to explain to him that in America that we're not allowed to get married. Well, why, Margot? Well, because we're gay. We're two women. He doesn't understand that.
So just, I think it's just kind of basic logic a 5-year-old would understand.
HEMMER: Thanks for talking with us today.
Margot McShane in San Francisco; also, Alexandra D'Amario. I got it right the second time, right?
MCSHANE: D'Amario.
D'AMARIO: D'Amario.
MCSHANE: That's OK, close. Better.
HEMMER: Thanks for saving me. It's a Friday.
Thanks to both of you. We'll follow the story again today.
D'AMARIO: Thanks so much.
HEMMER: Thank you.
We expect more unions to come out of San Francisco today, at least that's the word from the mayor last night. We'll let you know what happens there.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Marriage>
Aired February 13, 2004 - 08:17 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BILL HEMMER, CNN ANCHOR: Gay marriage is still not banned in Boston or the rest of Massachusetts. The law makers in that state ended two days of debate at midnight last night without passing an amendment that would have banned same-sex marriage. While they debated, the City of San Francisco defied California law yesterday, issuing licenses and marrying 87 same-sex couples.
Last night in an exclusive interview here on CNN, I talked with the mayor of San Francisco, Gavin Newsom.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MAYOR GAVIN NEWSOM, SAN FRANCISCO, CALIFORNIA: I think there'll be a time in this country when we'll agree with the absurdities of creating a statute of discrimination which says that I have the chance to be married and you and others have the chance to be married, an opposite gender individual, and I have privileges, as well as obligations and rights that are not extended to other people. And I don't believe as mayor, taking the oath of the constitution, that I have the right to perpetuate that kind of discriminatory policy.
HEMMER: Yes, Mr. Mayor, what's the possible penalty against this act today?
NEWSOM: Well, I don't know, the penalty of not doing it. What is the morality of perpetrating discrimination? Where is the fundamental decency to extend the same privileges and rights that the rest of us are afforded? What is the fundamental right to perpetuate a policy of separate but unequal, which a lot of people seem to suggest as a compromise. Do you compromise your values? Do you compromise core principles? I'm not going to compromise.
I read the constitution of the State of California and nowhere in there does it tell me to constitute on the fundamental right of non- discrimination.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HEMMER: That's Mayor Gavin Newsom from last evening.
Now, from San Francisco today, one of the same-sex couples married yesterday, Alexandra D'Amario and Margot McShane.
My apologies, Alexandra.
ALEXANDRA D'AMARIO, MARRIED GAY PARTNER: Oh, that's OK. HEMMER: And welcome here to AMERICAN MORNING.
Tell us, how is your life different, Alexandra, today than it was 24 hours ago?
D'AMARIO: Well, you know, I woke up so excited this morning and, you know, how is it different? It's not that different. We have a piece of paper which now tells us that we have a lot of legal protection and it's just, it's life changing, really.
HEMMER: Let me talk about that legal protection. You're pregnant, right, with twins?
D'AMARIO: Yes, I am.
HEMMER: When your babies are born, how will they get more protection under California law, that this is in defiance of, essentially?
D'AMARIO: Yes, well, I'm not that familiar with California law. I think of protection in terms of our children going to school and being protected by saying I have two moms and people not making fun of them, people not picking on them, harassing them, making them feel different. That's how I feel they'll have protection.
HEMMER: There is an expected challenge in the legal sense, and probably more after that, as well.
I want to read you a statement from an organization in California. It's the Campaign for California Families, a family issues organization against what's happening there in your city. They say, and quoting now, "These so-called marriages are not worth the paper they're written on. The mayor has no more authority to issue same-sex marriage licenses than he does to cede San Francisco from the State of California. It's merely a symbolic act and a media stunt with no validity."
Margot, on record for you now, your reaction to that statement and legal challenge that may ensue?
MARGOT MCSHANE, MARRIED GAY PARTNER: Yes, well, that -- when I hear that statement, I feel like that's the point of view of possibly people's personal religious beliefs. This is not a religious issue. It's actually an issue of rights in our feeling. It's a feeling of fairness. We feel like we've been denied the rights to be a married couple. We live exactly like a married couple. The only difference is that we're the same gender.
And to us it's an issue of what we're being denied that straight couples aren't. We're not saying everyone has to agree with us or that we're trying to change people's conviction. We're just saying that we're being denied basic rights of fairness and equality. And that's really what we're fighting for.
HEMMER: Margo, if you could for our viewers, explain to us the rights that you're talking about. Why do you deserve them as a couple?
MCSHANE: Why do you deserve them? I don't know if you're married, but that's the question I ask straight people, why do they deserve it? And they usually look at us and say yes, you're right, that isn't fair. And most people aren't familiar enough with the issue to understand that this is an act of discrimination. And so just more technically, though, I mean we are, it's our role as parents, as good parents, to protect our children. And as you know, Alex is pregnant with twins. So if we don't want our child to be discriminated against. Right now I don't have legal rights to be the second parent. I have to go through a whole adoption proceeding. That's just not fair.
And it's also, it's just a discrimination, kind of an affront to my entire family. I have a nephew who grows up with a loving, committed couple here who are both of his aunts and I have to explain to him that in America that we're not allowed to get married. Well, why, Margot? Well, because we're gay. We're two women. He doesn't understand that.
So just, I think it's just kind of basic logic a 5-year-old would understand.
HEMMER: Thanks for talking with us today.
Margot McShane in San Francisco; also, Alexandra D'Amario. I got it right the second time, right?
MCSHANE: D'Amario.
D'AMARIO: D'Amario.
MCSHANE: That's OK, close. Better.
HEMMER: Thanks for saving me. It's a Friday.
Thanks to both of you. We'll follow the story again today.
D'AMARIO: Thanks so much.
HEMMER: Thank you.
We expect more unions to come out of San Francisco today, at least that's the word from the mayor last night. We'll let you know what happens there.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Marriage>
