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American Morning

Same-Sex Marriage

Aired February 25, 2004 - 07:04   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: President Bush is taking the same- sex marriage debate to a new level with his decision to back a constitutional ban of such unions.
In just a few moments, we're going to hear from both sides in what is sure to be a major campaign issue. We're going to be talking with Congressman Marilyn Musgrave. She sponsored the bill. Also, Candace Gingrich. She is the sister of Newt Gingrich. We'll talk to them in just a moment.

But first, here is senior White House correspondent John King.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOHN KING, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It is scenes like this in San Francisco that the president says left him no choice but to endorse a constitutional amendment banning gay marriages.

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: A few judges and local authorities are presuming to change the most fundamental institution of civilization. Their actions have created confusion on an issue that requires clarity.

KING: The White House says Mr. Bush favors an amendment that defines marriage as between a man and woman, but lets individual states allow civil unions that give legal recognition and partnership benefits to gay couples.

BUSH: Our government should respect every person and protect the institution of marriage. There is no contradiction between these responsibilities.

KING: Such an amendment is a major priority for religious conservatives critical to Mr. Bush this election year, and Democrats were quick to accuse the president of pandering.

SEN. EDWARD KENNEDY (D), MASSACHUSETTS: It's about politics, an attempt to drive a wedge between one group of citizens and the rest of the country solely for partisan advantage.

KING: Gay rights advocates, including the Log Cabin Republicans, say the president can no longer claim to be a compassionate conservative.

PATRICK GUERRIERO, LOG CABIN REPUBLICANS: The president has jeopardized the over one million gay and lesbian votes he received in 2000. This is really a declaration of war on gay and lesbian families.

KING (on camera): In the last campaign, Mr. Bush said gay marriage was a state issue, but now aides say he was swayed by court rulings in Massachusetts, by San Francisco's decision to allow thousands of gay weddings in defiance of state law, and by word local officials in New Mexico and elsewhere might soon issue gay marriage licenses as well.

John King, CNN, the White House.

O'BRIEN: Republican congressman Marilyn Musgrave of Colorado is the sponsor of the federal marriage amendment, and she joins us this morning from Washington to talk about that proposal first introduced last May, and also the political firestorm that now surrounds it.

Nice to see you, Congresswoman. Thank you for being with us.

REP. MARILYN MUSGRAVE (R), COLORADO: You're welcome.

O'BRIEN: Obviously, what the president announced is going to satisfy certainly his conservative base. But to what degree do you think that this announcement was political?

MUSGRAVE: Well, I think it will actually encourage his base to know for sure that our president stands for the definition of marriage as a union between a man and a woman. I think the things that are political are a rogue mayor in San Francisco suddenly reinterpreting the constitution in that state and defying California law and what the people of California have said.

So, I think it's an encouragement to people who believe in the traditional definition of marriage when our president steps up and says that that is what he indeed supports.

O'BRIEN: Certainly there are many folks who say the timing of this is, to some degree in their minds, suspicious. Are you concerned at all about the swing voters who may not emotionally and morally agree necessarily with the president, he'll lose their vote?

MUSGRAVE: I don't think he's going to lose votes over this. I think he's going to gain votes. I think the conservative sometimes get disillusioned and decide to stay home and feel like it doesn't really make any difference. But I think they're going to be encouraged to come out and vote for the sanctity of marriage, for the traditional definition of marriage that we've had in place in this country for over 200 years.

O'BRIEN: Here is what you need to get this amendment passed. You're going to need support from two-thirds of both the House and the Senate, then three-quarters of the states. That's an incredibly high hurdle. How realistic do you think it is that that's going to happen?

MUSGRAVE: Well, it should be a very high hurdle to pass a constitutional amendment with the super majorities in the House and the Senate, and then 38 states to ratify. But polling shows that Americans overwhelmingly support the traditional definition of marriage, and it's very appropriate to respond to the things that are going on with the Massachusetts Supreme Court, the mayor in San Francisco, and other local officials who want to impose gay marriage on this nation.

O'BRIEN: Polling also shows that it's a very split issue when it comes to whether or not there should be a constitutional amendment banning gay marriage. So, I'm wondering if the people are not necessarily behind you. Even if they don't necessarily support gay unions, they don't necessarily want a constitutional amendment.

MUSGRAVE: Well, I think it's going to be abundantly clear that the federal marriage amendment is the only response to these actions that are taking place in Massachusetts and in San Francisco. And when the American people know that the federal marriage amendment is the only vehicle to protect the definition of marriage, they will be very supportive.

O'BRIEN: Congresswoman...

MUSGRAVE: I'm confident about that.

O'BRIEN: Forgive me for interrupting you there. Congresswoman Marilyn Musgrave joining us this morning. Nice to see you, and thank you for being with us.

MUSGRAVE: Thank you.

O'BRIEN: On the other side of this emotional debate is Candace Gingrich. She has been a prominent gay rights advocate since 1995 when her brother, Newt Gingrich, was elected speaker of the House. She is also the author of "The Accidental Activist," and she joins us from Washington, D.C. as well.

Nice to see you. Good morning. Thanks for being with us.

CANDACE GINGRICH, HUMAN RIGHTS CAMPAIGN: Good morning, Soledad.

O'BRIEN: You have said that you think the timing of this proposal is, in your word, suspicious. Why do you think so?

GINGRICH: Well, you know, they say that timing is everything, and I think in an electoral year it's magnified even more. Just a few weeks ago in "The Washington Post," a Republican official was quoted as saying that the president was bringing this issue up now because he wanted to start his campaign off on a fresh, new issue.

I think, to me, it's clear that the president is attempting to change the Constitution, because it's an attempt to change people's attention on the falling poll numbers, on the deficit, on the lack of jobs that have been produced.

O'BRIEN: As we heard from Congresswoman Musgrave, the public does not support gay marriage. They may not necessarily want a constitutional amendment, but overwhelmingly, to a large degree, the public does not support gay marriage. Are you concerned that there could be public support for what the president is proposing? GINGRICH: Well, you know, what I see are people who understand what a precious document that the Constitution is. I see folks, not just gay, lesbian, bisexual and trans-activists, but their friends and family who care about them. And I see people like the American Bar Association, people like the Leadership Conference on Civil Rights, who have come out in opposition to the federal marriage amendment.

O'BRIEN: Here is what Senator Rick Santorum had to say. He said that: "Gay marriage devalues what marriage is. It turns marriage into not a union of two people for the purposes of furtherance of the culture, but simply a sign of affirming someone's love for another, which, while not unimportant, is not the centrality of what marriage is about."

What's your reaction to that?

GINGRICH: Well, I'm pleased that Senator Santorum doesn't think that my family is unimportant, but I would say to him that the same things that come with heterosexual marriage, with having marriage recognized legally, are the things that we're seeking. It's the 1049 benefits. It's the security, the support, the rights, the responsibilities that come with marriage for our families and our relationships.

O'BRIEN: Last quick question for you. The Log Cabin Republicans, a group of gay Republicans, they issued a statement, and what they said was that "Pandering to the radical right is going to alienate the centrist, fair-minded swing voters."

One million gay Republicans voted for President Bush. Do you think that is going to make a big difference in this election, losing their support?

GINGRICH: I absolutely do. I mean, in addition to those one million gay Republican reported to have voted for President Bush, we're talking about their friends and family members who care about this issue. And also, that one million people is a pretty important number when you consider that President Bush lost the popular vote in 2000.

O'BRIEN: Candace Gingrich joining us this morning. Nice to see you. Thanks for being with us.

GINGRICH: You, too. Thank you.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com.







Aired February 25, 2004 - 07:04   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: President Bush is taking the same- sex marriage debate to a new level with his decision to back a constitutional ban of such unions.
In just a few moments, we're going to hear from both sides in what is sure to be a major campaign issue. We're going to be talking with Congressman Marilyn Musgrave. She sponsored the bill. Also, Candace Gingrich. She is the sister of Newt Gingrich. We'll talk to them in just a moment.

But first, here is senior White House correspondent John King.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOHN KING, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It is scenes like this in San Francisco that the president says left him no choice but to endorse a constitutional amendment banning gay marriages.

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: A few judges and local authorities are presuming to change the most fundamental institution of civilization. Their actions have created confusion on an issue that requires clarity.

KING: The White House says Mr. Bush favors an amendment that defines marriage as between a man and woman, but lets individual states allow civil unions that give legal recognition and partnership benefits to gay couples.

BUSH: Our government should respect every person and protect the institution of marriage. There is no contradiction between these responsibilities.

KING: Such an amendment is a major priority for religious conservatives critical to Mr. Bush this election year, and Democrats were quick to accuse the president of pandering.

SEN. EDWARD KENNEDY (D), MASSACHUSETTS: It's about politics, an attempt to drive a wedge between one group of citizens and the rest of the country solely for partisan advantage.

KING: Gay rights advocates, including the Log Cabin Republicans, say the president can no longer claim to be a compassionate conservative.

PATRICK GUERRIERO, LOG CABIN REPUBLICANS: The president has jeopardized the over one million gay and lesbian votes he received in 2000. This is really a declaration of war on gay and lesbian families.

KING (on camera): In the last campaign, Mr. Bush said gay marriage was a state issue, but now aides say he was swayed by court rulings in Massachusetts, by San Francisco's decision to allow thousands of gay weddings in defiance of state law, and by word local officials in New Mexico and elsewhere might soon issue gay marriage licenses as well.

John King, CNN, the White House.

O'BRIEN: Republican congressman Marilyn Musgrave of Colorado is the sponsor of the federal marriage amendment, and she joins us this morning from Washington to talk about that proposal first introduced last May, and also the political firestorm that now surrounds it.

Nice to see you, Congresswoman. Thank you for being with us.

REP. MARILYN MUSGRAVE (R), COLORADO: You're welcome.

O'BRIEN: Obviously, what the president announced is going to satisfy certainly his conservative base. But to what degree do you think that this announcement was political?

MUSGRAVE: Well, I think it will actually encourage his base to know for sure that our president stands for the definition of marriage as a union between a man and a woman. I think the things that are political are a rogue mayor in San Francisco suddenly reinterpreting the constitution in that state and defying California law and what the people of California have said.

So, I think it's an encouragement to people who believe in the traditional definition of marriage when our president steps up and says that that is what he indeed supports.

O'BRIEN: Certainly there are many folks who say the timing of this is, to some degree in their minds, suspicious. Are you concerned at all about the swing voters who may not emotionally and morally agree necessarily with the president, he'll lose their vote?

MUSGRAVE: I don't think he's going to lose votes over this. I think he's going to gain votes. I think the conservative sometimes get disillusioned and decide to stay home and feel like it doesn't really make any difference. But I think they're going to be encouraged to come out and vote for the sanctity of marriage, for the traditional definition of marriage that we've had in place in this country for over 200 years.

O'BRIEN: Here is what you need to get this amendment passed. You're going to need support from two-thirds of both the House and the Senate, then three-quarters of the states. That's an incredibly high hurdle. How realistic do you think it is that that's going to happen?

MUSGRAVE: Well, it should be a very high hurdle to pass a constitutional amendment with the super majorities in the House and the Senate, and then 38 states to ratify. But polling shows that Americans overwhelmingly support the traditional definition of marriage, and it's very appropriate to respond to the things that are going on with the Massachusetts Supreme Court, the mayor in San Francisco, and other local officials who want to impose gay marriage on this nation.

O'BRIEN: Polling also shows that it's a very split issue when it comes to whether or not there should be a constitutional amendment banning gay marriage. So, I'm wondering if the people are not necessarily behind you. Even if they don't necessarily support gay unions, they don't necessarily want a constitutional amendment.

MUSGRAVE: Well, I think it's going to be abundantly clear that the federal marriage amendment is the only response to these actions that are taking place in Massachusetts and in San Francisco. And when the American people know that the federal marriage amendment is the only vehicle to protect the definition of marriage, they will be very supportive.

O'BRIEN: Congresswoman...

MUSGRAVE: I'm confident about that.

O'BRIEN: Forgive me for interrupting you there. Congresswoman Marilyn Musgrave joining us this morning. Nice to see you, and thank you for being with us.

MUSGRAVE: Thank you.

O'BRIEN: On the other side of this emotional debate is Candace Gingrich. She has been a prominent gay rights advocate since 1995 when her brother, Newt Gingrich, was elected speaker of the House. She is also the author of "The Accidental Activist," and she joins us from Washington, D.C. as well.

Nice to see you. Good morning. Thanks for being with us.

CANDACE GINGRICH, HUMAN RIGHTS CAMPAIGN: Good morning, Soledad.

O'BRIEN: You have said that you think the timing of this proposal is, in your word, suspicious. Why do you think so?

GINGRICH: Well, you know, they say that timing is everything, and I think in an electoral year it's magnified even more. Just a few weeks ago in "The Washington Post," a Republican official was quoted as saying that the president was bringing this issue up now because he wanted to start his campaign off on a fresh, new issue.

I think, to me, it's clear that the president is attempting to change the Constitution, because it's an attempt to change people's attention on the falling poll numbers, on the deficit, on the lack of jobs that have been produced.

O'BRIEN: As we heard from Congresswoman Musgrave, the public does not support gay marriage. They may not necessarily want a constitutional amendment, but overwhelmingly, to a large degree, the public does not support gay marriage. Are you concerned that there could be public support for what the president is proposing? GINGRICH: Well, you know, what I see are people who understand what a precious document that the Constitution is. I see folks, not just gay, lesbian, bisexual and trans-activists, but their friends and family who care about them. And I see people like the American Bar Association, people like the Leadership Conference on Civil Rights, who have come out in opposition to the federal marriage amendment.

O'BRIEN: Here is what Senator Rick Santorum had to say. He said that: "Gay marriage devalues what marriage is. It turns marriage into not a union of two people for the purposes of furtherance of the culture, but simply a sign of affirming someone's love for another, which, while not unimportant, is not the centrality of what marriage is about."

What's your reaction to that?

GINGRICH: Well, I'm pleased that Senator Santorum doesn't think that my family is unimportant, but I would say to him that the same things that come with heterosexual marriage, with having marriage recognized legally, are the things that we're seeking. It's the 1049 benefits. It's the security, the support, the rights, the responsibilities that come with marriage for our families and our relationships.

O'BRIEN: Last quick question for you. The Log Cabin Republicans, a group of gay Republicans, they issued a statement, and what they said was that "Pandering to the radical right is going to alienate the centrist, fair-minded swing voters."

One million gay Republicans voted for President Bush. Do you think that is going to make a big difference in this election, losing their support?

GINGRICH: I absolutely do. I mean, in addition to those one million gay Republican reported to have voted for President Bush, we're talking about their friends and family members who care about this issue. And also, that one million people is a pretty important number when you consider that President Bush lost the popular vote in 2000.

O'BRIEN: Candace Gingrich joining us this morning. Nice to see you. Thanks for being with us.

GINGRICH: You, too. Thank you.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com.