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American Morning

Raging Wildfires; Road to Recovery; Miller to Testify; Heightened Violence

Aired September 30, 2005 - 07:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR: Thanks, Kelly.
I'm Miles O'Brien.

Huge flames racing through the hills of southern California, million-dollar homes at risk. Hundreds of residents helpless to do anything but watch and hope the forecast is right, the winds die down.

And in New Orleans, the mayor risking a health crisis, perhaps, by bringing people back into the city? Everything from mold to spoiled food and dirty water among the dangers awaiting those who return.

And "New York Times" reporter Judith Miller is free after 85 days in jail, and now she will testify today in that CIA leak investigation. What will it all mean for the Bush administration?

All ahead on this AMERICAN MORNING.

Good morning, welcome, we're glad you're with us. A lot to cover this morning, including some new violence in Iraq.

But before we get started, let's say hello to Elizabeth Cohen in New Orleans, who's in for Soledad this morning.

Good morning -- Elizabeth.

ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Miles.

I'm here, as you said, in New Orleans. You can see the skyline behind me. Residents are beginning to trickle back in. And so to prepare for that, I'm on the USNS Comfort. It is the only functioning trauma center in New Orleans Parish. We're right here on the Mississippi River. And they're expecting their first patients today -- Miles.

O'BRIEN: All right, Elizabeth Cohen, back with you in just a few moments.

Now that developing story in southern California. Another night of raging wildfires in the hills and canyons north of Los Angeles, some 3,000 firefighters on the scene this morning. The largest fire located near the town of Chatsworth. It's burned about 17,000 acres.

Dan Simon is near that fire and the town of West Hills.

Dan, any relief in sight for the firefighters?

DAN SIMON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, good morning, Miles.

We're waiting for new estimates on the amount of acreage burned. But firefighters definitely got a break with the weather last night. The temperatures dropped and the winds stayed calm. The story, thus far, is not what has burned, it's what's been saved. More than 2,000 homes have been saved. Only one house, along with a couple of other structures, has burned to the ground.

The areas folks are primarily concerned about are Chatsworth, Simi Valley and Thousand Oaks. All are along the northern fringe of Los Angeles.

And, Miles, we're seeing a Katrina-like effect with these evacuees. Folks are heeding the evacuations. Several hundred people have fled their homes. Many have taken advantage of the Red Cross shelters that are up and running.

We spoke to one woman who fled her house as the flames came dangerously close. Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARILYN BLITSTEIN, THOUSAND OAKS, CA., RESIDENT: The fire department said you know you better be getting out, it's going to be here in an hour and a half. And then somebody -- then we started packing up. And somebody came at 3:00 telling us, knocking on our doors, telling us, you know, to think about getting out real soon, pack up.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SIMON: And, Miles, we are here at one of the fire stations where some of the crews are getting a much-need rest. Meanwhile, Governor Schwarzenegger is expected to take an aerial tour of the fire area later this afternoon.

Back to you.

O'BRIEN: Dan Simon, thank you very much.

About a third of New Orleans' half million residents can begin moving back today into parts of the city that were spared major flooding. People who live in these eight zip codes will be allowed to return to their homes beginning this morning. There they are on the screen.

Dan Lothian is live now on Jefferson Avenue, uptown section of New Orleans, one of the areas where residents are planning to return today.

Dan, what will they say when they come home?

DAN LOTHIAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, good morning, Miles. Residents will really see a mix of a few things. First of all, I'm in this neighborhood, as you mentioned, uptown, where you have these historic homes. Some of the residents returning here will have power and water. Others will not.

And another thing that they'll see immediately, at least out on the streets when they come into the community, some of the same things that we saw this morning just driving in here. Cars still discarded along the side of the road, or, like this one, right in the median.

There's also a lot of debris also piled in the middle of the road. You will see debris even on the road in some areas. Some of the lanes are blocked by a lot of debris. But they're still -- it's still very passable. They have been able to move all that debris to the side of the road.

Now this follows yesterday when businesses were -- business leaders and owners were allowed to return to the same zip codes to check out their businesses and start doing some cleanup work. Some of them have already been doing this over the past week, going through their businesses, trying to get back online.

And some of the big concerns that the business owners have been seeing, and no doubt the residents will see as well, will be the problem of mold. Some will just be dealing with mold. Others will be dealing with homes that have to be completely rebuilt. For that reason, the mayor, yesterday, was giving a warning to all of the residents who will be returning, saying that they should be returning at their own risk.

Some of the businesses or, rather, some of the residents will find their homes have stickers on them that essentially tell them that they can't move into their residences until they do some shoring up. Because some of the roofs may not be safe, they may collapse, some of the foundations may have shifted and so they will have to do extensive work before they can move in.

Tens of thousands of people, perhaps as many as 200,000, expected to return to see their homes for the first time. And no doubt this will be a difficult, but also an exciting day for some. They'll get a chance to come back, many of them for the very first time, to see what's left. But, also, they'll get to see what was taken away -- Miles.

O'BRIEN: I'm sure it's going to be a lot of emotion, Dan, but there are practical considerations here. You talk about some of these places that have been undermined, the foundations are not good. Will people be allowed in places like that or will there be warnings there? And have they had time to go through and really analyze all these structures to see if they are safe for people to go in and just even recover belongings?

LOTHIAN: Well, essentially, the city officials have gone around and they have tagged the buildings that are not safe. And the residents can return to those buildings, but they have to -- they have to get them shored up. They have to get them strengthened, maybe even rebuild. Whatever it is, whatever the extent of the damage is, they need to make the necessary repairs before they can move in because they're not safe.

And, of course, health concerns. That's a big issue here. Not only with the mold, which I mentioned earlier, but there are a lot of concerns about what may be in the water. The water may not be safe and certainly isn't safe in this area for people to drink. They can take showers in certain areas, those who do have water. They can't drink it. So there are a lot of issues, like health concerns, that still have to be addressed. The mayor, of course, as I mentioned, telling residents to return at their own risk -- Miles.

O'BRIEN: Well it sure is a long way from normal.

Dan Lothian, thank you very much.

LOTHIAN: OK.

O'BRIEN: He is in the uptown district of New Orleans this morning.

"New York Times" reporter Judith Miller is free from prison, expected to testify today before a federal grand jury in Washington. Miller was released Thursday after spending 85 days behind bars. She had been jailed for refusing to name a source in connection with an investigation of the leak of a covert CIA's operative's name.

Miller reached a deal with prosecutors after receiving permission from her source to provide evidence to the grand jury. Now the source has been identified as Lewis "Scooter" Libby. Libby is Vice President Dick Cheney's Chief of Staff.

Elaine Quijano live at the White House for us this morning.

Elaine, is the White House concerned that the investigation may be focused on Libby?

ELAINE QUIJANO, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, at this point we should tell you, Miles, no official White House reaction just yet. The reaction that we do have comes to us from Joseph Tate. He is the attorney for Lewis Libby. And he says, first of all, there is no reason to believe, he says, that his client is the target of the investigation.

Now, it was over a year ago, according to the attorney, that Lewis Libby signed a waiver of confidentiality. The lawyer says that he followed up with a phone call to a "New York Times" attorney, assuring him that it was a voluntary waiver. But a few weeks ago, Judy Miller's attorney contacted Libby's lawyer and said Judy Miller had not accepted that waiver as valid because it -- quote -- "came from lawyers."

Now that is the account, according to the lawyer for Lewis "Scooter" Libby, Joseph Tate, who also told CNN -- quote -- "I assured Bennett," and Bennett is Judy Miller's attorney, Bob Bennett, "that it," the waiver, "was voluntary. And he asked, would Scooter say that to Judy? And I said Scooter doesn't want to see Judy in jail. My reaction was, why didn't someone call us 80 days ago?"

Now after that conversation, Lewis Libby spoke with Judy Miller by phone. An arrangement was made. Both attorneys listened in. Those steps, eventually, leading to Miller's release. But Tate says that Lewis Libby assumed Judy Miller was protecting another source or perhaps was there for another reason.

But all of this, of course, stems from the leaking of that CIA operative Valerie Plame's name whether anyone from the administration did that in retaliation for critical comments her husband made. But certainly, at this point, what the lawyer for Lewis Libby is saying is that there is no indication, no reason to believe that his client is indeed the focus of this investigation -- Miles.

O'BRIEN: Elaine Quijano at the White House, thank you very much.

In Iraq this morning, at least 7 are dead, 42 wounded after a car bombing today. It happened in Hilla, about 60 miles south of Baghdad. That attack coming a day after a string of car bombings north of the capital in Balad.

Aneesh Raman is in Baghdad.

Aneesh, who are the targets of all these bombings?

ANEESH RAMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Miles, it is yet again Iraqi civilians. Women and children, we're told, among those seven killed after a car bomb detonated south of the capital in the town of Hilla. It took place at a vegetable market. It is the weekend here, so one can only assume there would have been a good number of people out on the streets. We know that over 40 others were wounded.

As that explosion took place, Miles, the residents of Balad, as you mentioned, north of the capital, awoke to an incredibly gruesome scene. A trio of car bombs there last night, along with mortar and small-arms fire. Killed now, in terms of confirmed numbers, 82 people. Over 120 others wounded.

A clearly coordinated attack, we're told. The first car bomb detonating at 6:30 p.m. local as people were on one of the main streets of Balad. As is often the case, Iraqis surrounded that explosion, surrounded the scene, and 10 minutes later, another suicide car bomb detonated. And then 10 minutes after that on a street not far away, a third car bomb.

The questions from the residents this morning, Miles, as simple as it can be, why does this keep happening? Where is the government? Where is the security -- Miles?

O'BRIEN: Aneesh, the big question here is, as the violence continues its uptick, it seems as if the civil strife is growing. Got to be on the precipice of civil war at this point.

RAMAN: Well we are seeing very disturbing new trends in the violence as well, Miles. Not just the insurgent Sunni violence against the majority Shi'a community, but teachers now being targeted, six of them killed just days ago south of the capital, the first female suicide bomber in the town of Tal Afar and also increasingly routine discovery of bodies, 32 in the past 5 days. The majority of those are Sunnis killed at the hands of local Shi'a militias.

So instead of top down, we don't hear any calls from the Shi'a leadership to respond to the Sunni violence, but bottom up that violence is emerging, that strife is deepening, and the divide between the Sunnis and the Shi'a seems to be doing so as well -- Miles.

O'BRIEN: Aneesh Raman in Baghdad, thank you very much.

One group of Marines who took heavy losses in Iraq will be back on U.S. soil this morning. The Ohio-based 3rd Battalion 25th Marines Reserve Unit deployed in January. The unit lost 48 servicemen in Iraq, including 16 members of Lima Company. In August, nine members of the Lima Company were killed in the single deadliest roadside bombing of U.S. troops in Iraq. The Marines land in North Carolina for five days of transition training before heading to their home units in Ohio, West Virginia and New York.

Let's check the forecast now, Bonnie Schneider in for Chad Myers today. And Bonnie with a focus, of course, on what's going on on the West Coast and the fires.

Good morning -- Bonnie.

BONNIE SCHNEIDER, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Good morning, Miles.

(WEATHER REPORT)

O'BRIEN: All right, better get up there and see it soon.

SCHNEIDER: Yes.

O'BRIEN: Bonnie Schneider, thank you very much.

Still to come on the program, one of the country's leading conservatives comes under fire. We'll find out why critics say some recent comments by Bill Bennett are racist.

And next, more on Judith Miller's release from jail. Find out why CNN's senior legal analyst Jeffrey Toobin thinks the timing of this is bizarre.

Stay with us for more AMERICAN MORNING.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: After spending 12 weeks in jail protecting a confidential source, "New York Times" reporter Judith Miller is out, and she is expected to testify before a federal grand jury today. Her source is reported to be Lewis "Scooter" Libby. He is Vice President Dick Cheney's Chief of Staff. Libby gave Miller permission to testify, but why now? And what does it mean for the CIA leak investigation? National correspondent Kelly Wallace has been on this story since the beginning, and so has our senior legal analyst, Jeffrey Toobin. No better a panel of journalists could be found than this.

KELLY WALLACE, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: How kind of you.

JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: No better.

WALLACE: You're kind.

O'BRIEN: Let's start with you, Jeff. I should do ladies first, I know, but let's start with you.

WALLACE: No, no, no, I'd go to the senior legal analyst.

O'BRIEN: Jeff, why now? I don't understand, if this was as simple as a phone call from Scooter Libby saying, hey, it's OK to use my name, couldn't this have happened before she went to jail?

TOOBIN: It sure seems that way to me. I think the timing is just bizarre. Here you have a woman. It's been in all the papers. Everybody knows she was going to prison to protect a source. The source we now know is Scooter Libby. He reads the papers. He knew this. Why didn't they have a conversation in July where they settled this issue, gave the waiver, knowing, intelligent, voluntary waiver, instead of waiting until September...

O'BRIEN: Yes.

TOOBIN: ... where accomplishing the exact same thing, but she's been in jail for three months?

WALLACE: Because it does raise the question, and Libby's own attorney talking to CNN last night is raising the question about why did they wait 80 days to contact Libby's attorney? Because, all along, Judith Miller's folks, and apparently Libby's attorney, had talked to one of Miller's attorney last year, saying that this waiver was voluntary. Miller's team has felt that this was more of a, you know, formulaic waiver that government officials are coerced to give.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.

WALLACE: But he said a year ago it was voluntary. Clearly, you know, she didn't believe it.

O'BRIEN: So, in other words, she got a boilerplate document with lawyers as intermediaries and said that's not good enough. That would be the moment when I would pick up the phone.

TOOBIN: Well, and this is exactly...

O'BRIEN: As a reporter that is the thing you do, right?

WALLACE: Right.

TOOBIN: And that's exactly what happened with Matt Cooper, this exact issue about whether the waiver, in that case from Karl Rove, was voluntary. It got all sorted out the day before Cooper was supposed to go to prison, so he didn't go. So it's not like this issue was some sort of a surprise. And that's why it just doesn't make any sense to me that this was not resolved until long after she went to prison.

O'BRIEN: So was Judith Miller perhaps trying to take a stand here for some reason?

WALLACE: Well, you know we'll want to hear from her. And right now we haven't heard from her, her husband, her attorneys aren't really talking. She definitely did want to take a stand, because she, all along, has said that she should not be able -- should not have to reveal a confidential source. To have people come forward and reveal important information that the public needs to know, you need to rely on these confidential sources.

TOOBIN: But I don't even get the taking a stand argument. Because it's one thing if she sort of sat through to the end of the grand jury and then really took a stand that I don't believe these waivers are voluntary, I'm just going to stick it out to the bitter end. But she didn't do that.

O'BRIEN: Yes.

TOOBIN: She did accept the waiver, ultimately, after 12 weeks in prison. So I don't understand what point you make by going to prison for part of the term. I mean, it seems like you could just resolve this earlier and not go at all.

O'BRIEN: The timing is very curious. Let's talk what this might mean for this investigation for just a moment here. These are tough cases to prove, aren't they?

TOOBIN: Terribly difficult. Under this statute, as I understand it, only one person has ever been prosecuted, and that was a guilty plea. So there has never been a criminal trial. There are a lot of conditions you have to satisfy before you can prosecute someone for leaking this kind of information. It seems likely to me, frankly, that this investigation will end no prosecutions. Judy Miller will be the only person to go to prison.

WALLACE: Well it's very interesting.

O'BRIEN: And she never wrote a story on it.

WALLACE: And she never wrote a story.

TOOBIN: Never wrote a story.

WALLACE: But it's also interesting, because we should be at the end, because all along the special prosecutor, Patrick Fitzgerald, had said that once he had Matt Cooper's testimony and Judith Miller's that would pretty much phase out his investigation. So if she testifies, we expect her to testify today, we should find out.

TOOBIN: Resolution within the next week or so you would think.

O'BRIEN: So, all right, and the criteria that they have to prove here is pretty -- give us just a sense of the kind of things?

TOOBIN: Well you have to know that the person was a secret agent. You have to intend to blow their cover. There are a lot of elements of this crime that a simple conversation between a source and a reporter might not satisfy it.

WALLACE: But also we had learned and we've been hearing through reports, and not only just looking, about any violation of, you know, intentionally disclosing a covert agent's name, but also whether along the way obstruction of justice or perjury was committed. And that's...

O'BRIEN: Right.

TOOBIN: And that is often the way these investigations proceed, but the substantive crime is not established, but someone lies in the course of an investigation.

O'BRIEN: So what would the likely timing be? Once she testifies, what is likely after that? How long will the grand jury take?

TOOBIN: Well, basically a week or two. I would think that Fitzgerald will either announce indictments, get the grand jury to vote, one, or close up shop and say we're not prosecuting anybody.

O'BRIEN: All right. Thank you very much. We still have some questions, don't we?

WALLACE: We have many questions.

TOOBIN: We have many questions.

O'BRIEN: All right, let's get on it, guys.

WALLACE: Get on it.

(CROSSTALK)

O'BRIEN: You know what I'd suggest, make a phone call or two.

TOOBIN: Yes, good idea.

WALLACE: Yes.

(CROSSTALK)

WALLACE: Work the phones.

TOOBIN: Tool of the journalistic trade.

WALLACE: Work the phones.

O'BRIEN: Call them up, get the answer.

All right, thanks very much, guys. Appreciate that.

Back with more in just a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: Well, I guess this is in our insult to injury category this morning. Hurricane victims waiting for a little help from the Small Business Administration, the SBA. Well, they're going to be on hold for a little longer.

Andy Serwer is here with that.

ANDY SERWER, "FORTUNE" MAGAZINE: Good morning, Miles.

This is a major red tape alert this morning. Tens of thousands of business owners in the Gulf region are desperate for help, so they have applied for help from the Small Business Administration, trying to get loans from this government agency. The SBA is supposed to process these loans ASAP. Guess what, they haven't done it. Twenty- eight thousand loans have been approved, Miles, plus, and only one check has been cut.

O'BRIEN: One single check?

SERWER: One. That's a ratio of one to...

O'BRIEN: Who got the check?

SERWER: We don't know.

O'BRIEN: I don't know.

SERWER: But 1 to 28,000. This is supposed to happen within a matter of weeks.

Now, the SBA is blaming computers, computer glitches, I can't even say it, a computer glitch. "USA Today" has the story. A new $23 million system, they say, is crashing, it's faulty. And this is my favorite part. The SBA says that its workers in the field can't read the computer tablets in the glare of the Gulf Coast sunlight. News flash to SBA workers, get in the shade.

I mean what's going on here? This is truly remarkable. And the government is supposed to speed up and help. I know it might take a few days to do this, but if there was ever a time to get on the ball and off the dime, this would be it.

O'BRIEN: You know it's just -- it's hard to imagine. I want to know who got that check and who they know?

SERWER: We should try to track that down.

O'BRIEN: And we'll try to track that down. But, yes, folks, if you got a little glare problem, step inside. Step inside. SERWER: Get into the shade. Get thee into the shade.

O'BRIEN: Yes. All right. All right, thank you -- Andy.

SERWER: You're welcome.

O'BRIEN: Outrage moment of the morning.

Let's go to Elizabeth Cohen who is on the USNS Comfort this morning.

Good morning -- Elizabeth.

COHEN: Good morning, Miles.

Miles, this is only the second time in history that this ship has been called to the aid of U.S. citizens. We'll be talking to two doctors on board about this unusual mission. That, and more, on AMERICAN MORNING.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: Get the latest news every morning in your e-mail. Sign up for AMERICAN MORNING Quick News at CNN.com/am.

Still to come, Joint Chiefs Chairman General Richard Myers will join us live. He's retiring today. We'll ask him to reflect on the war in Iraq and find out when he thinks U.S. troops can come home.

Stay with us for more AMERICAN MORNING.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

O'BRIEN: It's about half past the hour on this AMERICAN MORNING.

Coming up, furious reaction in Washington to some very controversial comments by conservative commentator William Bennett.

But, before we get to that, let's say hello, once again, to Elizabeth Cohen in New Orleans in for Soledad this morning -- Elizabeth.

COHEN: Good morning, Miles.

Miles, I'm on the flight deck of the USNS Comfort. And you can see behind me downtown New Orleans, Algiers lit up. Here on the other side, the lower Ninth Ward and the Seventh Ward not lit up.

Now here on the Comfort, they'll be taking patients this morning for the first time. This, and an Army hospital, are the only two fully functional hospitals in this city -- Miles.

O'BRIEN: All right, we'll be back with you in just a little bit, Elizabeth, thank you very much.

General Richard Myers is stepping down today as the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff.

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