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Hundreds Protest Police Use of Force; Tulsa Deputy Surrenders, Released on Bond; Culture of Excessive Force in Policing?; Hillary Clinton's No-Frills Campaign; Iran Bill Gets Unanimous Approval by Senate Committee; Educators Sentenced in Cheating Scandal. Aired 6- 6:30a ET

Aired April 15, 2015 - 06:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: These demonstrations will only get larger. They will only get angrier.

[05:58:48] UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: New video igniting more questions about excessive force.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Stand off. Stand off. The gun is loaded.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hillary Clinton back on the campaign trail.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What's it like to be back in the game?

HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: It's great.

Americans and their families need a champion.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Today, I'm going to put you in jail.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Ten Atlanta public school educators sentenced to prison for a year's-long cheating scandal.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: These teachers got caught in the trap.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is not a victimless crime.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ANNOUNCER: This is NEW DAY with Chris Cuomo, Alisyn Camerota and Michaela Pereira.

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome. Welcome to your NEW DAY. It's Wednesday, April 15, tax day, 6 a.m. in the east. Alisyn's off. J.B. is here with me and Mick, and we have big news for you.

Hundreds of protesters on both coasts outraged by excessive force use of police. Police clashing with these hundreds of protesters in New York and L.A., officers injured, dozens arrested after blocking traffic on the Brooklyn Bridge. Folks are marching in defiance.

MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN ANCHOR: All this as new video surfaces of more questionable police tactics. An officer in Arizona -- look at that -- intentionally using his cruiser to take down a suspect who is running through the streets with a gun. Were the actions of that office justified, or does it speak to a wider problem?

Let's begin our coverage with CNN's Rosa Flores. Rosa, good morning.

ROSA FLORES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning.

Emotions are high across the country as a number of cases involving police and questions about use of force keep growing. But hear this: this time it doesn't involve a Taser or gun. It involves a police cruiser weighing about 2 tons.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

FLORES (voice-over): Hundreds taking to the streets and cities across the country in protest of police use of force. Crowds converging on police precincts and blocking highways, leading to dozens of arrests from California to New York.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Guys, we're going to send that crowd right through there.

FLORES: More than 200 protesters marching across New York's Brooklyn Bridge. Police say an off-duty officer was assaulted after exiting his stopped car during the demonstration. A second officer was struck in the head with a bottle just a short time later.

The outrage sparked by the shooting death caught on tape of Walter Scott in South Carolina, the unarmed black man shot several times while fleeing police after a routine traffic stop. Officer Michael Slager has since been charged with murder.

Scott's death is just the latest in a string of fatal shootings at the hands of police, starting with the death of Michael Brown in Ferguson, Missouri, last summer.

And now this new video out of Arizona, igniting more questions about excessive force. This dash-cam video shows a police cruiser ramming into an armed suspect in a violent crime spree, seen here waving a gun and firing it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: One round just went out into the sky. It's definitely unlocked now. He's definitely loaded.

FLORES: The first officer on the scene warns a police unit coming towards 36-year-old Mario Valencia.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Stand off. Stand off. The gun is -- the gun is loaded.

FLORES: But just two seconds later.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oh! Jesus Christ, man down!

(END VIDEOTAPE)

FLORES: Now, Valencia is facing 15 charges, in part for allegedly robbing a 7-Eleven in his underwear, igniting a fire at a church and then stealing a car from a house and then stealing a gun, as well.

Now, police also say that this man was suicidal, pointing his gun to his head several times. So they believe that they have saved this man's life.

Now, as for the protests, those are expected to continue. We're expecting about 1,000 protesters here in New York -- Michaela.

PEREIRA: All right, Rosa. That video is so shocking from Arizona.

Also this morning, the reserve deputy who gunned down a suspect in Tulsa is out of jail after posting bond. Robert Bates surrendering to authorities Tuesday to face manslaughter charges.

Meanwhile, the victim's family says the 73-year-old essentially paid for the right to play cop. They're vowing to fight until all questions are answered.

Ryan Young joins us live from Tulsa this morning -- Ryan.

RYAN YOUNG, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Michaela.

Robert Bates bonded out just 30 minutes after turning himself in. There are about two dozen protesters who showed up outside the jail to show they were upset about the video that everyone has seen. In fact, we'll show you this video.

This was a case where they had pulled over a man who they had decided to buy a gun, the operation shows. The man takes off running. They chase after him. And then at some point Robert Bates says, "Taser, Taser," but instead fires his gun.

Now across the country, Tasers and guns are usually on the opposite side of the waist. But in this case, the gun was fired by an accident, and he was shot in the back. That man would later die. And of course, the attorney for Robert Bates says this was an accident, something that he didn't intend to do.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SCOTT WOOD, ATTORNEY FOR ROBERT BATES: You know, obviously, he's -- he is very upset about what happened. He feels badly. The incident completely took him by surprise. He's -- has all the requisite training. He's Taser certified. And if you've watched the video, you know, he was quite shocked when his gun went off.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

YOUNG: Now, Eric Harris would later die after being shot. I can tell you there's a lot of conversation in this community

just about what exactly happened. Also the fact that Bates has donated cars and money to the sheriff's department over the years. So people are wondering why he was out there in an operation just like this one, Michaela.

PEREIRA: All right. Ryan, thanks so much. In our 8 a.m. hour, we're going to speak with Scott Wood, the attorney that represents the Tulsa deputy, the reserve deputy who's now charged with manslaughter. That's coming up -- Chris.

CUOMO: So what are we seeing? Are we seeing a trend, or are we seeing cases that just capture the interest of people? Let's discuss. NYPD retired detective Harry Houck; and CNN law enforcement analyst and former FBI assistant director, Mr. Tom Fuentes. Gentlemen, thank you.

Harry, we start with the obvious. Are cops out of control?

[07:05:03] HARRY HOUCK, RETIRED NYPD DETECTIVE: No. No. I mean, we've seen a couple of instances in the last year here. I wouldn't say out of control. We have millions and millions of interactions with police officers every year. And this is only about four or five different problems that we've had.

CUOMO: Now, Tom Fuentes, the numbers bear out what Harry Houck just said. There's like 69 million contacts with people. And there's -- I have all these stats and graphs show excessive force is about at most, you'll see about 1.5, percent and a half. And that's down over the years. But then when we see these cases, and we see that often police forces try to excuse the behavior, it does feed the suspicion that there is a culture of excess. How do you see it?

TOM FUENTES, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Well, I see, Chris, that several of these incidents have been blown so far out of proportion as to be ridiculous.

And what the bottom line is with many of these is individuals failing to comply with a lawful order from the police. Whether it's that they're under arrest, whether it's stay in your car, whether in this case in Arizona drop that gun, which can drop other people, you know, up to a mile away. To be calling that excessive force is absurd.

CUOMO: True. But every case is different. And look, I hear it from friends and...

FUENTES: That's right. This case is different. And it's absurd to call that excessive force.

CUOMO: All right. Well, you've got to look at them one at a time. I've got friends and loved ones on the force that tell me the same thing, Harry.

But you look at Tulsa. I think all people would agree who have been on the job that guy should have been nowhere near a task force. He -- however he got there, he got there. But you know, you see the guys when they run up on that guy. They know he's been shot instead of Tased. You've got the undercover guy with his knee on his head, saying, "I don't -- 'F' your breath. I don't care about your..."

HOUCK: Right.

CUOMO: That's not a necessary disposition. I know that he's pissed that the guy ran. I know that cops don't like that.

HOUCK: You've got to understand.

CUOMO: But he's a professional.

HOUCK: Right. He might not have known that that guy was shot yet.

CUOMO: He's screaming, "He shot him, he shot him."

HOUCK: But all he's doing right now is trying to handcuff the guy. He's got to get him handcuffed. He doesn't know exactly where he was shot, whether or not he's already shot. He doesn't know if the shot wings that guy, although he started yelling and screaming. So you've got to get him handcuffed first. And the fact that he made a comment like that, it's in the heat of the moment. OK. Every time you try and arrest somebody, they always tell you they can't breathe. You know the guy can breathe, because if he can say he can't breathe, he can breathe.

CUOMO: All right. So then you look at the case in South Carolina. You've got these other cops walking up on the scene. They lie about giving CPR, allegedly. They -- you know, they don't have reports that echo what is obvious to everybody, because they didn't know they were on videotape.

And that's another thing that the stats show, Tom. Is that these 54 or so who wind up being prosecuted for killing somebody, cops, they're mostly white. And almost all of the cases have video, the guy was shot in the back and/or a cop came clean about a cover-up. What does that tell you?

FUENTES: Well, it tells me that if a black officer shoots somebody, it's not going to get the attention as a white officer shooting a black person. I think that's part of the situation.

We don't have adequate stats or information being furnished to the government to analyze the race of every shooter and every victim in these situations. So I think that's part of it. It's just...

CUOMO: Tom, listen, you know, you're a trusted council on these issues to be sure. But the idea that we don't have the resources to have the statistics is just -- doesn't make any sense. Of course we do. And the statistics show that two out of every three cops that shoot somebody are white. I got the stats right in my hand.

FUENTES: No, we don't have the statistics, Chris. That's not true. CUOMO: I have a report from the U.S. Department of justice, Tom.

And it says in here that two out of three cops who shoot somebody -- "The Washington Post" followed it up -- are white. And one out of three are black.

HOUCK: Does that really matter? I mean, probably the majority of police officers are white. That's probably why you're probably seeing that. And a lot of the perpetrators are black. You know, like here in New York majority of crimes being committed are being committed by black people.

CUOMO: Right. But here's -- here's why it matters, Harry. And look, I hear both of what you're saying, and I'm testing the proposition, because a lot of people are angry. OK? And why they hear Tom Fuentes say, "Hey, don't run away from the police. That's what starts all this." OK. But you are the professionals. You are not supposed to react the way the person does, right? They're acting like the worst of us.

HOUCK: We don't get paid to get killed.

CUOMO: True.

HOUCK: That's a problem. We don't get paid to get hurt. We get paid very well for what we do, and we take and we put our lives in danger. Right? But we're not going to let ourselves get killed, because somebody thinks that what we're doing isn't politically correct.

You know, you have a couple instances where officers acted incorrectly. OK. That's a small amount. You said you have the statistics there.

CUOMO: No question that excessive force is a small amount of all interactions.

HOUCK: Right. So perception right now is reality -- all right? -- although it's not factual.

CUOMO: Do you think that the police cause is being hurt by the reaction of agencies, when you do have this infrequent case of excessive force, Tom? Do you think that's part of the problem?

FUENTES: Well, how do you define that? I mean, we're talking about several officers here who have been criminally charged, one with murder in the case of Slager. And then the other officer, the reserve officer also criminally charged.

[06:10:05] We had an incident earlier this year with a South Carolina state trooper shooting the individual that he asked to produce I.D. He went to his car, came out. The officer was fired that day. He's being prosecuted.

So I think that, you know, actions are being taken when it's necessary to take them. Now, some, you're right, there's probably many a case that should have been brought that wasn't, but we're seeing many cases be brought when they should be.

CUOMO: And it's all about progress. Two issues pop up, Harry. One: these cases where we see a force come down quickly.

HOUCK: Uh-huh.

CUOMO: Video.

HOUCK: Right.

CUOMO: Body cameras.

HOUCK: Uh-huh.

CUOMO: Independent investigation. Not state looking at local but having outside units. Do you think those are appropriate changes to have on a mass scale?

HOUCK: Those are great. I mean, I got no problem with anybody...

CUOMO: They get fought by a lot of agencies.

HOUCK: Right. But if an officer acts properly, I don't care. Bring the FBI in if you want, you know, civil rights violations. I don't care. As long as you're acting properly as a police officer, all right, it's fine. And if it makes other people happy, do it. You want to bring in a state special prosecutor, go ahead.

But you know, if I'm going to say every time a white police officer has an encounter with somebody black that it's racist, that's the problem. You've got these demagogues who are throwing the race card around all the time. It's creating all these demonstrations. It creates riots. We have to have that stop.

And we also -- the bigger issue is we need to have a conversation on resisting arrest. It's like resisting arrest is OK. It's not OK. It brings it to another level where somebody's life is in danger.

CUOMO: There's no question that that is often an incendiary force. But when people are angry, you've got to unpack what the outrage is about, and you've got to have the conversation. Otherwise, you get no progress.

HOUCK: Right. And you have to speak the truth.

CUOMO: Tom Fuentes, Harry Houck, thank you very much. I know it's not a comfortable conversation to have, but it's an important one. And as we're saying here, every case is different and needs to be tested. We will do that with the most recent case in Arizona. We have the police chief there, whose officer intentionally, admittedly rammed a crime spree suspect with a police cruiser. Was that right? Was that excessive force? We'll discuss. You decide -- John.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: All right, Chris. Thanks so much. So it was a low-key political event, as long as you consider live

coverage and a swarm of scurrying reporters to be low-key. Hillary Clinton holding her first campaign events in Iowa. But really, there is a big difference stylistically in her campaign, at least so far, this time around. CNN senior political correspondent Brianna Keilar live in Norwalk, Iowa.

Good morning, Brianna.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Berman.

Yesterday, Hillary Clinton took on corporations. She took on big business and big money. Well, today she's having a small business roundtable here at Capital City Fruit outside of Des Moines. And it's also a symbolic stop in this agriculture state of Iowa.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How are you?

KEILAR (voice-over): Hillary Clinton back on the campaign trail after a public stop at a small coffee shop in Le Claire, Iowa, a town of fewer than 4,000, it was onto a round-table discussion with students and faculty at a satellite campus of Kirkwood Community College in Monticello.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That's great.

KEILAR: Clinton telling a small group of Iowans why she's running in person for the first time.

HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I'm running for president, because I think that Americans and their families need a champion. And I want to be that champion.

KEILAR: She struck a populist tone, taking on Wall Street and stagnant middle-class wages.

CLINTON: The deck is still stacked in favor of those already at the top. There's something wrong when CEOs make 300 times more than the typical worker.

KEILAR: And despite personally blessing a super PAC to support her run, she said she wants to clamp down on outside political groups.

CLINTON: We need to fix our dysfunctional political system and get unaccountable money out of it once and for all, even if that takes a constitutional amendment.

KEILAR: It's a far cry from her unsuccessful effort here eight years ago. The big rallies.

CLINTON: I'm in it to win it.

KEILAR: And her ride with the campaign, nicknamed "the Hillicopter," traded in for the much more humble Scooby van that had national and local media running for a Hillary Clinton sighting.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What's it like to be back in the game?

CLINTON: It's great.

KEILAR: But Clinton's appearance is serious business in Iowa. Democratic operatives in the Hawkeye State tell CNN Iowans are eager to connect with her, but they want substance on the issues.

CLINTON: I'll be rolling out ideas and policies about what I think will work. But I want it to be informed by what's actually working.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KEILAR: And we expect it to be some time before Hillary Clinton really talks specifics. Four to five weeks, I am told, by an aide. So right now she's in this listening phase, hearing ideas and concerns before she addresses them. That's what her campaign is saying, Michaela.

PEREIRA: All right, Brianna. We're going to unpack that a little bit with some of our political experts that are joining us in a little while. More now for you right now. It is a bill Congress and the White House can live with. A key Senate panel approving the compromise measure that allows lawmakers to have a say on any final nuclear deal with Iran.

[06:15:03] This morning Iran's president is responding to the move from Congress. All of this as President Obama is poised to remove Cuba from the U.S. list of state sponsors of terrorism. A whole lot to look at with Michelle Kosinski. She's following all the developments for us live at the White House. Good morning to you, Michelle.

MICHELLE KOSINSKI, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Hey, Michaela. Right after weeks of battling and lobbying over this, this looks like a real compromise. I mean, the White House is framing it this way, that this would not be exactly an up or down vote on the Iran nuclear deal that Congress would take. But a vote on whether to remove the sanctions that were imposed by Congress in the first place. That's something we knew that they could do anyway, right?

But if this bill does pass, it would also make the White House submit the deal in writing to Congress with classified materials. There would be a review period. The White House would have to certify periodically that Iran was living up to the deal.

The question is, if Congress is going to vote on whether or not to remove those sanctions, would this effectively then be an up or down vote? Iran seems to think so. Its president just said there will be no deal unless all the sanctions are lifted.

Now, the other big news is that President Obama now officially says it is time to remove Cuba from the list of state sponsors of terror. Now, that is something that this divided Congress would have an up or down vote on. They have 45 days to respond to that -- John.

CUOMO: I'll take it. Thank you very much.

KOSINSKI: Oh, Chris.

CUOMO: Michelle. It's fine. We all look alike.

All right. So there's a big situation in Atlanta to tell you about. Fireworks in court as former educators convicted in the Atlanta public school cheating scandal learn their fate.

Now, most of them are getting harsher sentences, because they refuse to own up to their crimes. We have Victor Blackwell on the scene, joining us from the CNN center in Atlanta with more on this. A lot of people involved. Some did different tacks there, Victor, but how did it turn out?

VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Chris, ten of the 11 teachers and test administrators now convicted in this case. And the judge in this case really said that he wanted the defendants here, now convicted felons, to own up to their roles in this scandal. And when some refused, there was shouting and finger pointing, even threats to throw the defense attorneys in jail.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BLACKWELL: Do y'all have anything to say about the decision today?

(voice-over): This morning ten Atlanta public school educators now out on bond, some planning their appeals.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All rise.

BLACKWELL: After a judge sentenced them to prison on Tuesday for a year's long cheating scandal, changing answers on standardized tests.

JUDGE JERRY BAXTER, FULTON COUNTY SUPERIOR COURT: Everybody in the education system at APS knew that cheating was going on. And your client promoted it.

BLACKWELL: Judge Jerry Baxter dolling out prison sentences to eight of the former educators, punishments for the crime of racketeering, charges normally reserved for putting away violent mobsters.

BAXTER: There were thousands of children that were harmed in this thing. This is not a victimless crime that occurred in this city.

BLACKWELL: According to the indictment, the cheating conspiracy dates back to 2001. And for at least four years between 2005 and 2009 the educators altered, fabricated and falsely certified test answers. Three of the educators face the harshest sentence: seven years in prison and 13 years of probation. A punishment that some of the defense attorneys strongly fought.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I am making a motion for you to recuse yourself from sentencing my client, because you are not making your decisions based -- apparently you're going back and forth declaring (ph) motion.

BAXTER: You sit down. I'm going to put you in jail. If you yell at me, point at me...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You're yelling at me, Judge.

BLACKWELL: Judge Baxter actually agreed to leniency the day before sentencing, allowing prosecutors to offer plea deals on Monday, but only two took them.

BAXTER: I was trying to give everybody one more chance. And, you know, probably going to be -- have tomatoes thrown at me, but, you know, nobody took it. Nobody took it. So, you know, things change. And all I wanted -- all I want from any of these people is just to take some responsibility. But they refuse. They refuse. And I am convinced that your client recruited those two retired teachers and cheated on that test.

BLACKWELL: Now, the seven-year sentences were reserved, according to the judge, for those three at the top of this scandal. And according to CNN affiliate WSB, they were much longer than the three-year sentences that were offered by the state as part of a proposed deal by the district attorney and the judge. When they declined those, more than doubled them.

The two who accepted the deals apologized and offered their apologies for their guilt in this case and were offered, one, six months in jail on the weekends only, the other home confinement, John.

BERMAN: Victor Blackwell, talking about kids, and we're talking about schools here. Thanks so much, Victor.

BLACKWELL: Sure.

BERMAN: The Senate overwhelmingly passed legislation overall how Medicare pays doctors for the so-called Medicare doc fix. The vote was 92-8. Lawmakers signed off on the measure that fixes the formula for reimbursing Medicare physicians. It did pass in time to avoid a 21-percent pay cut for doctors.

[07:20:18] The bill now goes to the president's desk. He says he will be proud to sign it. He says it strengthens the healthcare system.

PEREIRA: Close, but no cigar. The second attempt to land a SpaceX rocket on a floating barge was that: close but no cigar. That's how the company founder, Elon Musk, put it after the rocket came back down on the barge. But, oh, tipped over.

The attempted landing came after the latest launch of a cargo ship to the International Space Station carrying groceries, the first- ever espresso maker, I'm told, and much more on a supply mission. Apparently, Seamless (ph) does not deliver to the ISS. So what they're trying to do is have a rocket that they can reuse, relaunch, launch, relaunch, hopefully within a day at some point. That's what they're attempting to do.

CUOMO: Reuse, recycle, relaunch?

PEREIRA: Exactly.

BERMAN: And the espresso maker, because they need a lot of espresso up there. You need to be able to use a reusable rocket to get them all the caffeine that they need.

PEREIRA: It's a caffeine delivery system. We understand that's what this is really about.

CUOMO: Espresso is the astronaut rocket fuel.

BERMAN: Exactly.

CUOMO: Parallel construction.

Hillary Clinton keeping it low-key, except for the hordes of media following her every move. Hillary is doing less talking and more listening, so the question is this: is this the right strategy for a return to the White House?

BERMAN: And CNN goes to the front lines of a huge humanitarian crisis unfolding in Yemen right now. Thousands displaced, millions in need of food and shelter. We have a CNN exclusive you really have to see, straight ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:25:26] PEREIRA: Well, we are inching closer, and I mean inching -- look at that clock -- to the 2016 presidential election, now just a mere 572 days to go. It was intentionally a small campaign rollout for Hillary Clinton, with more media than Iowans at her first day's stop.

Is the new Clinton strategy proving effective in the early going? Let's bring in CNN political analyst and editor in chief of "The Daily Beast," Mr. John Avlon; CNN political commentator and Republican consultant Ms. Margaret Hoover. And also with us -- so glad to have her -- senior political analyst and presidential campaign senior correspondent for "The New York Times," Maggie Haberman.

This is so great to have a whole conversation. I feel like we should have catering here, serve drinks to have this conversation. Maggie, I want to talk to you about this notion of...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (UNINTELLIGIBLE)

PEREIRA: I know. Well, I didn't want to say. So the slow rollout, the low-key, no frills, yes, except for the media frenzy that happened to follow Hillary Clinton. So as much as she wants it to be that way, can it be? Just because you say it is doesn't mean the world is going to accept that as such.

MAGGIE HABERMAN, "THE NEW YORK TIMES": It gets as close as you can to it. One of the things she did in 2000 when she was running for the Senate is she was doing these sleepovers at voters' houses, and they weren't really advertising those. Right? So it basically had the effect of, look, this is real. I don't think we're going to see her...

PEREIRA: No sleepovers this time?

HABERMAN: ... sleeping over in people's houses in Iowa this time around or New Hampshire. But I think to the extent that they are capable, they're going to try.

What is striking to me about the last couple of days is they're basically running an Obama '08 strategy, right? Which is in 2012, too, but you know, we're engaged with the media. We're trying a new reset button. It's a fresher approach, but we're actually also going to bypass. We're not going to tell you in advance that we're going on this van tour. We're going to tell you when she's in Altoona or wherever it was on Sunday. We're announcing via video. And then there was nothing really on Monday. She dominated Marco Rubio's rollout, which was a very impressive rollout with pictures looking like she was robbing a Chipotle. So, you know, at the end of the day...

MARGARET HOOVER, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Exactly.

CUOMO: That is what it looked like.

HABERMAN: That is what it looked like.

PEREIRA: In a suit.

HABERMAN: And this was all over Twitter in that regard, too.

BERMAN: This is the next Clinton scandal. You just launched a Clinton scandal.

CUOMO: Were they e-mailing about going into Chipotle?

PEREIRA: Oh, give me all your guacamole.

HABERMAN: So I think it was -- I think it was very effective. I don't know that they can sustain this. I think that the question is going to be not can you keep it small and sit at a small table with, you know, 30 reporters in a warehouse looking on, which is what happened in Iowa. It looked like it went pretty well from the visuals.

The question is when she starts getting asked questions by the press, do random voters come up to her and ask her about the e-mails? Things like that. That's where it becomes an issue.

CUOMO: Look, and by the way, that's why reporters run around the corner like that, because you want to be there when the candidate walks up; because you don't know if they're going to answer a question or be asked a question. You have to be there. So independent of those reports.

PEREIRA: I don't fault those guys; it's not a great optic.

BERMAN: That's what she's doing. What about what she's saying? What does she need? When does this candidate need on the policy bones here, lay out an economic plan, any kind of plan?

JOHN AVLON, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Look, I think her experience as secretary of state sort of inoculates her from that immediate obligation. Nobody's questioning whether she's got policy wonk chops.

So while the Republican field is totally fixated on showing they can be president, they've got -- they're going to foreign policy school at night, they're trying to show that they can be taken seriously on the world stage. Hillary Clinton's got to act like she's got that covered. She wants to be relatable, very modest and more direct. That in itself is inauthentic.

BERMAN: She's got to be tested, because yesterday she dropped sort of a big policy bomb. She says all of a sudden campaign finance reform is going to be a giant deal.

HOOVER: A constitutional amendment, even.

CUOMO: Her goal is, what, $2.5 billion to raise for the race? I mean...

HOOVER: And by the way, she's going to rely on some of those super PACs, because every single candidate is going to have them, and she's not going to get across the finish line without it.

But what's interesting, she's also knocked hedge-fund managers, high finance, the people who are doing really, really well. It was this progressive populist pander that we see. It's sort of essentially attacking the criticism from the far left, the Elizabeth Warren wing of the party that she's trying to sort of convince that she's going to be authentically representative of them.

CUOMO: She can take the heat early on, you know, what I would call the Fugazi factor of, you know, being in the van when you're not a van person, and you're going to talk to these person.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What does that mean?

CUOMO: Fugazi? It means fake.

PEREIRA: Fake.

CUOMO: You know, look it up. I think she can weather the criticism of that early on, if there winds up being a genuine payoff in what she actually wants to do at the end of the day.

Because right now listening means "I don't want to talk to you." You know what I mean? "I'm listening to them. I really just don't want to talk to you."

But when she does have to talk, and that would be the same challenge on the other side. Because right now their tactic is bash Hillary. Somebody's going to have to be for other people at some point to be effective.

AVLON: And that's what the campaign is anticipating. And look, when she did her sort of four points, that is -- you know, maybe the delivery was casual, but highly rehearsed. And I do think the inclusion of, you know, floating a constitutional amendment for Citizens United is a big deal.

PEREIRA: I agree.

HOOVER: It was a very choreographed even yesterday, even though it played well. I think, actually, she was probably at her most powerful...