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Time Running Out to Find Boys Lost at Sea?; Ex-Prison Worker Pleads Guilty to Aiding Escape; Tom Brady Suspension Upheld; NYT: Trump Calls Lawyer 'Disgusting' Over Breast Pump. Aired 6-6:30a ET

Aired July 29, 2015 - 06:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: The search continues for two teenagers lost at sea.

[05:58:42] UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There's always a possibility that these kids are still alive.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: As time passes the possibility of finding them decreases.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She was swept off her feet, and when she realized who she was dealing with, everything changed.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Are you pleading guilty because you are, in fact, guilty?

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Donald Trump on the record about an aide's controversial comments.

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE (via phone): You have to understand, Michael was extremely angry.

It's a vicious business.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is Tom Brady a cheater?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The four-game suspension for NFL superstar Tom Brady still stands.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is totally incriminating. It's a fairy tale that he destroyed this phone.

TOM BRADY, NEW ENGLAND PATRIOTS QUARTERBACK: I had no knowledge of anything. You know, I didn't open the door in any way.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ANNOUNCER: This is NEW DAY with Chris Cuomo, Alisyn Camerota and Michaela Pereira.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning, everyone. Welcome to your NEW DAY. It is Wednesday, July 29, 6 a.m. in the East. Chris is on assignment today, and John Berman is here with us. Great to have you.

So the search for those two teenage boys lost at sea is expanding from Florida all the way now to South Carolina. Rescuers still holding onto hope that Perry Cohen and Austin Stephanos are alive. They were last seen Friday afternoon refueling their boat, but on Sunday, it was found capsized.

MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN ANCHOR: The Coast Guard will resume their search as soon as the sun comes up this morning. It truly now is a race against time. Officials say it's only possible to survive in those waters up to five days.

CNN's Alina Machado is live in Jupiter, Florida, with the very latest for us this morning -- Alina.

ALINA MACHADO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Michaela, officials here definitely keeping that in mind. The search for these missing teens has been exhaustive. So far, the Coast Guard has searched more than 30,000 nautical miles, but they still have not found these missing boys.

The teens, as you mentioned, were last seen leaving this area on Friday. Their capsized boat was found near Cape Canaveral on Sunday. The search area has continued to move north, with the Coast Guard most recently focusing in on an area that is about 100 nautical miles off the Georgia coast.

Authorities say that the situation for these teens growing increasingly dire with every passing hour. And yet, the families are still very much hopeful.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We are 100 percent committed to finding and rescuing those boys, as is the Coast Guard. And we will not stop until we get them back home with us.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MACHADO: Now yesterday, the Coast Guard told me that they have started going through the decision process of talking about when to suspend the search. They're not there, yet. But it's definitely something they're talking about.

Meanwhile, the families have already raised more than $133,000 to fund private searches -- Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: Alina, thanks so much for all that background.

We want to bring in now, for an update with the search, the chief of response for the Coast Guard, 7th District in South Florida, Captain Mark Fedor.

Captain, thanks so much for joining us again on NEW DAY.

We saw the search area, the latest search area. It's highlighted in red. Maybe we can put it up again. How have you decided to zero in on that? It stretches all the way now up to Charleston, South Carolina.

FEDOR: That's right. We're entering the sixth day of our search. And it's still an exhaustive effort. We've conducted over 48 different searches as of this afternoon with the planned searches. Over 48 will be done covering an area of 36,000 miles. So we're searching, you know, from Jupiter, essentially, all the way up to Charleston, and 180 miles to the east of Savannah. So it's a huge area. We are still searching around the clock.

However, we are having that discussion of when we should suspend the search. And that is a gut-wrenching decision. We're looking at all aspects of the case. That is something we have to talk about as we move forward.

CAMEROTA: Captain, it is so heart-breaking. It's so heart- breaking to think you won't find them today and that you may never find them. So who will make that decision of when it's time to suspend the search?

FEDOR: Well, it is. It is gut-wrenching. I have a 14-year-old and a 13-year-old sons at home. So, it's certainly personal to me.

It is my responsibility to make that decision to suspend the search. But it is done in a very holistic manner. We look at both the art and the science of search and rescue. The science based on the pure physiology of how long someone can live in the water. But, also the art of it. The will to live. The age of these children. So we take all that into account as we make this decision. There's certainly no black and white answers.

CAMEROTA: Captain, I can imagine. And I can't -- I can't imagine the pressure that's on your shoulders of when and what time and how you're going to make that decision today. I mean, let's go through it. These are teenage boys. If anybody can survive, they can. They've -- they've spent their lives on the sea, as we've heard from their moms. They were healthy. But we're in the sixth day. I mean, if you don't find them today, what will you decide?

FEDOR: Well, again, we're in that process now. And there's a lot of factors to consider. It is not as simple as looking at a table that determines survivability. It's a lot more complicated than that, and it should be. Like you said, we're talking about two young kids here. And we want to find them, desperately. But, we know we're rapidly approaching that point where we might have to suspend.

CAMEROTA: Captain, have you spoken to the families of these boys in the past 12 to 24 hours?

FEDOR: Yes, we have. We started talking to them earlier in the week. In fact, I am planning to speak with them today, along with some of my subject matter experts. We have told them all along exactly what we're doing, what we've done and what we plan to do. And they will know our intentions before they become -- become clear to the public. CAMEROTA: Captain, I can't imagine that conversation if you have

to have it with the parents about suspending the search.

FEDOR: It's a difficult conversation. But we want them to know how much effort we have put into the search and how much we empathize with them and how much dedication the men and women of the Coast Guard, as well as our Department of Defense partners and all the other government agencies that have participated in this search have fully dedicated over the last few days to try to find Perry and Austin.

[06:05:13] So we really want to try to help them understand that. I know that might not ease their pain in the short term, but hopefully over time, they can take some solace in that fact.

CAMEROTA: Well, Captain, I mean, everyone knows that you've done a Herculean effort here. I mean, just the amount, the search area and the amount of manpower that has been out there. Will you be doing anything differently today, this morning on the sixth day of the search, than what you have been doing?

FEDOR: Yes, yes. We constantly evaluate the effectiveness of our search patterns. So we recalculate those, and we try to determine where is the best place to search based on the existing weather conditions, which have been favorable. But the currents are always shifting; the wind is always shifting. So we take that into account when we -- when we calculate these new search patterns.

CAMEROTA: I mean, Captain, we've been doing stories this summer on just the high level of shark infestation of these waters. It's a horrifying thought to think of, but, have you calculated that in, that you might not find any evidence of the boys?

FEDOR: Yes. That's one of the possibilities. You know, being in the water, over the course of several days, especially we're not even certain if they have any means of flotation. It is a very challenging environment for any mariner that goes to sea. We recognize that. And when you're in the water, it's just a dangerous environment for that length of time.

CAMEROTA: Yes. Captain, we don't envy your assignment today. But our thoughts are with you, and we are praying for some resolution of this case. Thanks so much for being on NEW DAY. Please keep us posted today.

FEDOR: Thank you.

CAMEROTA: Let's get over to John.

BERMAN: All right. Thanks, Alisyn.

Shocking, graphic, intimate details from former prison worker, Joyce Mitchell, as she admitted to helping two convicted killers escape from upstate New York maximum-security prison. Mitchell herself now faces prison time. CNN's Alexandra Field has the very latest from Plattsburg, New York.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ALEXANDRA FIELD, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Joyce Mitchell, tearful in court and taking responsibility.

ANDREW WYLIE, CLINTON COUNTY D.A.: Because the evidence was so overwhelming, she has acknowledged her guilt.

FIELD: The 51-year-old former prison employee, admitting she helped inmates Richard Matt and David Sweat escape from New York's Clinton Correctional Facility.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Are you pleading guilty because you are, in fact, guilty?

FIELD: Newly-released documents reveal the details of what Joyce Mitchell knew and when. "I've known about them cutting the hole in the wall for about three or four weeks," Mitchell tells investigators in the days following the escape.

During the police interviews, Mitchell revealing she had sent Sweat sexual letters and naked photos, but adding that she only had sexual contact with Matt. "We were alone and inmate Matt grabbed me and kissed me. It startled me. He kissed me with an open-mouth kiss. I didn't say anything, because I was scared for my husband, who also works in the facility."

Mitchell also says there was oral sex with Matt and other sexual encounters with the inmate who plotted to kill her husband, referred to as "the glitch." She explains, "After I picked them up, the plan was to drive to my home, and inmate Matt was going to kill 'the glitch.' After, we were going to drive somewhere. I can't remember where we were going to go, but I know I was told it was around six or seven hours away."

The plan: to lay low in the woods together for weeks, says Mitchell. Then Matt would split off, leaving her and Sweat together. But Mitchell got cold feet and couldn't go through with it telling investigators she loved her husband, Lyle, too much.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PEREIRA: That was Alexandra Field reporting for us.

Donald Trump distancing himself now from one of his top aides after controversial comments he made about rape. Trump's executive vice president, Michael Cohen, apologizing for telling a "Daily Beast" reporter that, legally, you cannot, quote, "rape your spouse" in an explosive interview while trying to defend Trump from a decades-old rape allegation made by his ex-wife, Ivana.

But does Trump still stand behind his adviser? So you know, Don Lemon put that question to the presidential candidate.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: Do you stand by Michael Cohen? TRUMP (via phone): No, you have to understand, Michael was

extremely angry, because he knew it never took place. He knew this website was a joke, considered a joke. And he was very angry. And maybe he didn't even understand the question.

But no, I don't. I disagreed with him. In fact, when I read it, I disagreed. I didn't know if he said it. Who knows what he said? Because frankly, I'm not sure they reported accurately anyway. But assuming he said it, no, I disagree with that.

LEMON: But you still -- I mean, you're not going to fire him or get rid of him?

[06:10:02] TRUMP: No, I'm not. He was very angry, because they issued a false story to get publicity for themselves and to try and make themselves relevant, which they're not.

So what happened is he probably got angry. No, I disagree with it. In fact, when I first saw it, I said, "Wow." You know, it's something I disagree with, but that's the way it is. And, you know, he's speaking for himself. He's not speaking for me, obviously, but I did tell him I disagreed with him.

LEMON: This is something from 1993 that you -- why do you think this is coming up when you have denied this for more than 30 years now, you and Ivana? Why is this coming up now?

TRUMP: Well, it's a vicious business that you are in. I mean, it's a vicious business, you know, the world of politics. And you know, I've always heard from the time I'm very young, it's very, very hard for a very successful person to run for a political office, especially for president. And now you see it. I mean, you know, you see the way people are trying to pummel me.

LEMON: Now this debate is coming up. Are you ready for it?

TRUMP: I have absolutely no idea how to answer that question. I am me. I don't have pollsters. I mean, I have a lot of money, much more money than all of them put together and all of their phony contributions put together. But you have to understand, I want to be me.

LEMON: But Donald, you're going to be up on that stage -- on that stage. You're going to have a timer. You're going to be up against the other candidates. Are you preparing? Do you have a debate coach

TRUMP: I am what I am. I am what I am. I mean, the debate coach, look, Romney had a debate coach, and Obama had a debate coach. Frankly, I thought Obama was terrible, but Romney got worse and worse every time there was a debate. By the time they had the third debate, he was catastrophic. I don't know what happened to him. I have to be myself. And if it's not good enough, that's OK. I'll go onto other things. I'll ride into the sunset and build some more buildings and some create more jobs. And that's OK. I'm doing this because I want to make America great again. And that's why I'm doing it. (END VIDEOTAPE)

PEREIRA: Donald Trump doesn't stop there. He also takes on President Obama, his Republican rivals, his wealth. So much more. We're going to give you more of Don Lemon's interview with Trump later on, on NEW DAY.

BERMAN: It's interesting to hear Trump talk about the debates. Because you know these other guys right now are preparing themselves for Donald Trump, perhaps even coming up with one or two lines to take on Donald Trump.

CAMEROTA: A zinger?

BERMAN: I wonder if Donald Trump is really just going to be himself or whether he's going to go into this as a politician with something prepared.

CAMEROTA: Well, I take him at his word. I mean, I think that he -- he poo-pooed of having a debate coach. He thinks that all these other politicians are over-prepared, and they become too stilted. He wants to be himself.

PEREIRA: Everybody keeps saying he is himself and that he is just spontaneous and he's just plain-speaking. You don't think any of that is calculated?

CAMEROTA: I think -- yes. I think he's very strategic in his own head. Meaning, I don't think anyone could be brought in that would train Donald Trump.

BERMAN: This is the first time we'll see a contrast between Trump and other people on the stage.

PEREIRA: It will be very interesting. Right?

CAMEROTA: Very interesting. We'll discuss that more coming up.

We do have other news to tell you about, because breaking overnight, some 2,000 migrants stopped -- were in an attempt to enter the Chunnel tunnel in France. They were trying to make their way to the United Kingdom. French authorities were able to intervene. Some of the migrants were injured. Officials in Europe have been trying to stem the growing migrant crisis, which has turned more broad and deadly this year.

BERMAN: Developing this year, a new rift in the Republican ranks. Republican Congressman Mark Meadows of North Carolina filing a rare

request to oust House Speaker John Boehner. The motion to vacate the chair has only been tried one time before, 105 years ago. It failed then. Meadow says he is trying to force a family conversation among Republicans, sort of a dysfunctional family conversation, and end what he calls a punitive culture in the party.

PEREIRA: Secretary of State John Kerry and other administration officials including Defense Secretary Ash Carter and joint chiefs chair Martin Dempsey, all on Capitol Hill today for yet another hearing on the Iran nuclear deal. While pushing the deal on The Hill Tuesday, Secretary Kerry sparred with House Republicans, including Congressman Scott Perry.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. SCOTT PERRY (R), PENNSYLVANIA: We stand for America. You represent America.

JOHN KERRY, U.S. SECRETARY OF STATE: Congressman, I don't need any lessons from you about who I represent. I've represented and fought for our country since I was out of college.

PERRY: And God bless you for your service.

KERRY: Don't give me lessons about that, OK?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PEREIRA: Adding to -- fuel to the opposition, Iran's supreme leader, an account associated with him, sending out this chilling tweet, which appears to show President Obama holding a gun to his own head. The administration still pushing forward, because officials say the deal is in America's best interests.

CAMEROTA: A 23-year-old Florida man charged with plotting to bomb a Key West beach in the name of ISIS. The FBI says the suspect wanted to bury a backpack bomb with a timer under the sand and detonate it remotely. Authorities first became aware of him through his Facebook posts, where he urged people to become, quote, "warriors" and cut off the heads of their enemies. The suspect faces a detention hearing next week.

[06:15:02] BERMAN: So unless a court intervenes, New England Patriots quarterback Tom Brady will miss the first four games of the NFL season after his Deflategate suspension was upheld. Brady and the NFL players' union, though, they are not giving up the fight.

CNN's Coy Wire live in Atlanta with the details. Coy, destroying your cell phone on the day of the interview might not be a wise idea.

COY WIRE, CNN SPORTS CORRESPONDENT: Might not be wise, John, and I apologize that you had to hear this news yesterday. But I see from Twitter, you have not given up hope. His jersey still hanging in your office.

But for now, tom Brady's fight to clear his name looks to be heading to court. As you mentioned, Roger Goodell denied, of course, Brady's appeal yesterday. And at the same time, released that new information of which you speak that could be damaging to Brady's image. It all involves a cell phone.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

WIRE (voice-over): This morning, the four-game suspension for NFL superstar Tom Brady still stands. The decision was based, in part, on what the league commissioner calls Brady's attempt to hide evidence.

In a shocking reveal, Roger Goodell says the New England Patriots star had his assistant destroy his cell phone and sim card, the same phone he used to communicate with an equipment assistant in the days following the infamous AFC championship game, where Brady is accused of being generally aware that game balls were being deliberately deflated for better grip.

The NFL says they believe the cell phone, containing more than 10,000 text messages, was destroyed on or around March 6, the day their investigators interviewed Brady.

This, on the heels of a damning report by the NFL released in May. The report says two team employees, including the assistant, violated league rules when they deflated game balls in exchange for cash, free shoes and autographs from the three-time Super Bowl MVP. The report also claims that Brady and the deflators exchanged phone calls and texts.

BRADY: I have no knowledge of anything. You know, I didn't alter the ball in any way.

WIRE: Brady has consistently denied involvement in the football tampering scandal and says he usually destroys old phones when he gets new ones.

JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: This is totally incriminating. It's a fairytale that he destroyed this phone on the day of his interview because of some regular procedure he had.

WIRE: The NFL Players Association now says it will file an appeal, releasing a statement saying, "The outrageous decision was based on a smoke screen of irrelevant text messages."

Brady's attorney says the appeals process was a sham and that Brady was completely transparent, giving an unprecedented amount of electronic data to the commissioner.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WIRE: What will happen now? Tom Brady and the players association will likely file a suit against the NFL and an injunction requesting that a judge put a stay on his suspension until the case is sorted out in court. That could prevent Brady from missing any time this season. But as it stands right now, Brady's back up, Jimmy Garoppolo, will get the start in week one -- guys.

PEREIRA: I'm wondering if, Coy, we can anticipate a very solemn ceremony removing said jersey from a certain anchorman's office later today.

BERMAN: You know, I may take it down. Honestly, I've been on the phone with my friends overnight. And it's hard to come up with a plausible justification for destroying the cell phone during this investigation. You know, it's not just an issue of whether he did it or not. Now it's an issue of what he did after the fact, too. And we need to hear more. We need to hear more.

All right. Donald Trump under fire for standing by a top adviser who made a controversial comment about rape. And now wait until you hear what he said to a pregnant female lawyer about her breast pump. Yes, folks, Donald Trump weighing in on the issues of breast pumps. That's coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:22:39] CAMEROTA: Interesting allegations this morning against GOP front-runner, Donald Trump. "The New York Times" has a titillating story. You're welcome. Reporting that Trump has an aversion to breast pumps. Here to explain, CNN political commentator and Republican consultant Margaret Hoover and CNN political analyst and editor at "The Daily Beast," John Avlon.

Hi, guys.

JOHN AVLON, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Good morning.

MARGARET HOOVER, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: You'll know why we're laughing.

CAMEROTA: "The New York Times" has this story that Donald Trump was supposed to be giving a deposition about a lawsuit he was embroiled in about one of his buildings, and the opposing lawyer wanted to take a break to pump. She had a newborn. It was all approved beforehand. She was going to take an hour break to pump.

Donald Trump was, reportedly, so appalled by this notion that she had to breast pump that he verbally sort of yelled at her, called her disgusting and stormed out of the room. Margaret, go.

HOOVER: Look, with hundreds of pages of review of these depositions and other depositions, public documents, demonstrate is that things that we know about Trump's character -- he's boorish, he's demeaning, he uses hyperbole, he has a thin skin, he doesn't like being criticized, these are all things that don't tend to bode well in the long term of a presidential race.

CAMEROTA: But is that why this story is relevant, because OK, so he's disgusted by these breast pumps. Why is that relevant to the presidential race?

AVLON: This story is relevant because "The New York Times" has gone and looked at him under oath. These are depositions. This is how he behaves when there's not some carnival barker P.R. imprimatur. But, he actually has taken an oath to tell the truth, and even then, they say there is a persistent pattern of mistruths and mischaracterizations.

BERMAN: Let me read the statement here from the Trump attorney. And by the way, no one disputes that he said it was disgusting and then stormed out of the room. Trump's attorney says that his language "was in no way a statement about her decision to breast-feed or pump. It was solely the fact that she was appearing to do it in the middle of a deposition. In my 20 years of legal practice, I've never seen more bizarre behavior in a deposition. That is what led to his remark.

But as you said, it's not just the disgusting; it's the fact that it was under oath. It was the fact that, if you read "The New York Times" article, he admitted to exaggerated wildly on many things and admitted to exaggerating about things under oath.

AVLON: Yes.

BERMAN: The man is schooled in hyperbole, John Avlon, including when he talks about your baby, "The Daily Beast." You know, he lashed out to Don Lemon last night about "The Beast" and "The Beast" reporting about these rape comments from his aide. I just want to give you a chance to talk about what he said.

[06:25:06] AVLON: Look, it's good to have good enemies in life. They define you. But let me tell you a little bit about "The Daily Beast." Because I know you guys read it every day, but as part of our mission, we love confronting bullies, bigots and hypocrites. And we're nonpartisan but not neutral. And we will follow the facts without fear or favor. And that's what we've done with this story.

And his counsel thought he could intimidate and threaten one of our reporters, Tim Mack, and we pushed back. Because "The Daily Beast" is not intimidated; we will not be intimidated. And anybody who thinks you can, that's when you get the big pushback. That's the way we roll at "The Daily Beast." And this is not going to fly.

CAMEROTA: All of this was a story about old rape allegations from his ex-wife during their divorce proceedings. She has since recanted.

BERMAN: And endorsed him for president.

CAMEROTA: And endorsed him and supported him. And so he basically says that it was a low blow that "The Daily Beast" was even going to be doing this story.

AVLON: First of all, the reason it's relevant, in a 1993 book, this allegation was published. So this is already out there. The reason the allegation is relevant, which incidentally, even in the corrected version, when the clarification was put out by his first wife, she did not deny using the term "rape" very explicitly. So you can't exactly redo that.

When you begin a presidential campaign by calling undocumented Mexican immigrants rapists, large swaths of them, all of a sudden, that becomes relevant. Wall of a sudden, when you run for president, everything in your past becomes relevant, because it's a character reference. And just as Mr. Cohen's comments reflect the tone comes from the top inside the Trump organization, he has to be held to account. And if he's going to actually take this marketing scam and try to

project it on the American people and run for president, he's got to be ready to be held to account for everything he has done and said while playing tabloid rules in business and politics over a period of decades.

Let's not forget, this guy's last foray into politics began by backing the whole birther scam. So let's not forget that. Before he went off on immigrants, before doing the divide and conquer stuff. So let's hold that to account. Let's be clear-eyed about it, and let's not flinch.

BERMAN: Let's talk about the debate stage where he will be one week, I guess, from tomorrow, right, in Cleveland against other Republicans. Let's take a look at the top ten right now in the latest poll of polls. Because presumably, these could be the people on stage with Donald Trump. And you see, at the bottom there -- we may see at the bottom there -- that there is a sort of a fight for tenth place. Look, Kasich, Perry, Santorum. Then Fiorina, Jindal. you know, all those people want to be the tenth person on that stage.

CAMEROTA: And we don't know who will be, at the moment.

BERMAN: No.

CAMEROTA: Because they're all trying to convince people that they're in tenth place.

HOOVER: I've got to tell you, I am really looking forward to the 5 p.m. debate. So the way that...

BERMAN: That's the earlier one.

HOOVER: Yes, because I'm a total nerd and a political geek. But there's something to debate that's going to be about how to fix the country is not the one Donald Trump is in. It's not the one where you have ten candidates that they have to call a forum, because there is no debating. They each only get a couple of minutes to say their thing.

The other debate is actually going to be aired on television at 5 p.m. with six candidates is actually going to be really substantive. You have governors, there-term Governor George Pataki of New York. People who have had substantive leadership positions elected by their constituencies, served multiple terms, done real things for policy in the United States. That's going to be the good debate, not this side show at 9 p.m. I don't really want to watch the Donald Trump show.

CAMEROTA: You really don't want to see him on a debate?

BERMAN: Not really.

AVLON: What's sad is you've got -- you're going to have presidential candidates, people who served an elected office, unlike Donald Trump, fighting on a margin of error to prove that they, three people tied for 2 percent, can make that 10 percent. Because then otherwise, you're being relegated to obscurity.

HOOVER: But the problem with the rules here is that there is no national primary. Right? You have primaries in Iowa. You have primaries in all these states. They are regional primaries. And so a national poll undermines where the Republican primary voters' hearts and minds actually are. It is sort of a false standard to be first interviewing and seeing these candidates' profiles.

CAMEROTA: The whole thing is sort of the hunger games. I mean, you know, the way that they decided to do it and these bottom tier have to duke it out for tenth place. But it will be fascinating to watch the first debate. That's next week. But we do have 467 days left, 17 hours, 31 minutes.

AVLON: How many with Trump?

CAMEROTA: We shall see, John Avlon.

BERMAN: the GOP front runner, John Avlon.

CAMEROTA: Thanks so much, guys. We also will be speaking live, by the way, later in the program with Elizabeth Deck. She was the lawyer whom Trump called disgusting for her breast pump. That's live next hour. Stick around.

BERMAN: Indeed.

CAMEROTA: Michaela.

PEREIRA: All right, guys. We're going to talk about a story that's likely populating your social media feed. A dentist from Minnesota is accused of hunting down a beloved lion in Zimbabwe. He insists he did nothing illegal, but he could face poaching charges. We're going to take a closer look at the story, coming up.

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