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New Day
Explosive Start to First GOP Presidential Debate; Chuck Schumer to Vote Against Iran Nuclear Deal; Russia Suspected in Pentagon Email Hack Attack. Aired 6-6:30a ET
Aired August 07, 2015 - 06:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I don't frankly have time for total political correctness.
[05:58:25] DR. BEN CARSON (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: There is no such thing as a politically correct war.
SEN. RAND PAUL (R-KY), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I think you are on the wrong side of this.
GOV. CHRIS CHRISTIE (R-NJ), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Blowing hot air.
MIKE HUCKABEE (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I think it is time to do something more bold.
JEB BUSH (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I'm going to have to earn this.
SEN. MARCO RUBIO (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: This election better be about the future. Not the past.
HUCKABEE: Iran gets everything they want.
TRUMP: If Iran was a stock, you folks should go out and buy it.
GOV. SCOTT WALKER (R-WI), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Terminate the deal on day one.
JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: U.S. Senator Chuck Schumer announced he will vote against President Obama's nuclear deal with Iran.
BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Congressional rejection of this deal leaves one option. Another war in the Middle East.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ANNOUNCER: This is NEW DAY with Chris Cuomo, Alisyn Camerota and Michaela Pereira.
CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning. Welcome to your NEW DAY. It is Friday, August 7, 6 a.m. in the East. On my left and right, the beautiful John Berman and Brooke Baldwin. Beautiful applied equally.
It was politics raw and real in the first debate. Republicans facing off in the 2016 race. The top ten candidates leaving no stone unturned. Donald Trump taking heat from all sides, but he was no different.
BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Meantime, Carly Fiorina getting strong reviews for her performance at the so-called happy hour debate of the lower ranked candidates. So who gained ground? Who lost ground in those early battles?
Let's begin our comprehensive debate coverage this morning with CNN political reporter Sara Murray live in Cleveland. Sara, good morning.
SARA MURRAY, CNN POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Brooke.
Well, we definitely got the fireworks we were hoping for. And even though Donald Trump was at center stage, plenty of candidates managed to get their zingers in. Let's take a look at the highlights.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Donald Trump!
MURRAY (voice-over): Right out of the gate, Donald Trump's presence made this a very different Republican debate. A question about a pledge not to run as an independent.
BRET BAIER, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: Raise your hand right now, if you won't make that pledge tonight. Mr. Trump?
TRUMP: I cannot say, I have to respect the person that, if it's not me, the person that wins. If I do win and I'm leading by quite a bit, that's what I want to do. I can totally make that pledge. If I'm the nominee, I will pledge I will not run as an independent.
MURRAY: As the GOP crowd booed, Rand Paul, whose outsider status tumbled thanks to Trump, couldn't wait to pounce.
PAUL: Here's what's wrong. He buys and sells politicians of all stripes. He's -- he's already hedging his bet on the Clintons. OK?
MURRAY: Trump later lashed out at Paul.
TRUMP: I don't think you heard me. You're having a hard time tonight.
MURRAY: Most of his ire was aimed not at a competitor but the FOX moderator.
MEGYN KELLY, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: You call women you don't like fat pigs, dogs, slobs and disgusting animals. Your Twitter account...
TRUMP: Only Rosie O'Donnell. I think the big problem this country has is being politically
correct. I have been -- I have been challenged by so many people. And I don't, frankly, have time for total political correctness. And to be honest with you, this country doesn't have time, either.
And honestly, Megyn, if you don't like it, I'm sorry. I've been very nice to you, although I could probably maybe not be based on the way you have treated me, but I wouldn't do that.
MURRAY: But the biggest fireworks flew over Trump's head between Chris Christie and Rand Paul over personal liberties versus security.
CHRISTIE: When you're sitting in the subcommittee just blowing hot air about this, you can say things like that.
PAUL: I don't trust President Obama with our records. I know you gave him a big hug. And if you want to give him a big hug again, go right ahead.
CHRISTIE: And you know -- you know, Senator Paul? Senator Paul, the hugs that I remember are the hugs that I gave to the families who lost their people on September 11.
MURRAY: All GOP establishment eyes were on Jeb Bush, to see if he showed fire in the belly, often lacking in his performances.
BUSH: I believe that the great majority of people coming here illegally have no other option. They want to provide for their family. But we need to control our border. And there should be a path to earn legal status for those that are here, not amnesty. Earned legal status.
MURRAY: Bush's former protege, Marco Rubio, showed off his talent for rhetorical flair.
RUBIO: I think God has blessed us. He's blessed the Republican Party with some very good candidates. The Democrats can't even find one.
MURRAY: Ohio's governor, John Kasich, had this memorable moment.
GOV. JOHN KASICH (R-OH), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I just went to a wedding of a friend of mine who happens to be gay. Because somebody doesn't think the way I do doesn't mean that I can't care about them or can't love them. So, if one of my daughters happened to be that, of course, I would love them and I would accept them.
MURRAY: These candidates know a key test for many GOP voters is who can best take on Hillary Clinton.
WALKER: For the cyber attack from Russia the other day, it's sad to think right now, but probably the Russian and Chinese government probably know more about Hillary Clinton's e-mail server than do the members of the United States Congress. And that has put our national security at risk.
MURRAY: But the standout moments against Clinton didn't happen at this debate, but hours earlier with the undercard.
CARLY FIORINA (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Hillary Clinton lies about Benghazi. She lies about e-mails. She is still defending Planned Parenthood, and she is still her party's front-runner.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CUOMO: Fiorina getting a lot of praise for her performance.
BALDWIN: So is (UNINTELLIGIBLE) talked to her this morning.
CUOMO: Right. But there's so much -- she's going to be on the show here, coming up not too long from now. Brooke is going to sit down with her.
But there's a lot to analyze and scrutinize, so let's bring in Peter Hamby, CNN contributor and the head of news at Snapchat. And we have CNN political commentator and political anchor at New York One, Mr. Errol Louis; and also senior political reporter Nia-Malika Henderson. It's good to have all of you.
Now, Errol, I'll start with you here, with us in studio. There's no question of what the people on that stage last night needed to do, on some level, was to get in on Donald Trump's action, you know, and get that base to like them the way they like him, at least a little bit. Who did that?
ERROL LOUIS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, I don't know if it's so much as "I'm trying to steal that base," but at least understand it and not sort of run against it.
I thought Ted Cruz was an admirable, sort of a saner, calmer version of Donald Trump. And I thought he came off quite well, actually. I mean, he said some things that I thought were, you know, really sort of out of the box, and so did Mike Huckabee. But I thought in both cases, they said, "Look, I am conservative. I will take outrageous stances."
[06:05:07] I mean, if you think about it, Mike Huckabee said some things about -- about personhood that nobody is talking about, saying that from the moment of conception, constitutional rights should attach to a fetus. I mean, that's extraordinary. And to sort of elevate it to that level, somebody who was a governor and can actually, you know, sort of be conceivably have to try and put this in place?
CUOMO: I flanked (ph) that on Twitter last night, what Huckabee said, to see who agreed and who didn't.
LOUIS: It's extraordinary.
BALDWIN: Especially some of the language, like...
CUOMO: It's a huge range.
BALDWIN: ... comparing to parts of a car, a Buick. That struck me for sure.
LOUIS: Yes, I mean, that's -- that's jarring language.
BALDWIN: it is.
CUOMO: I suppose the main question that we have not answered with regard to reproductive rights, stem cell research and what's going on with Planned Parenthood: when does life begin? There are a lot of different answers.
BALDWIN: Let's move to Trump. And Nia, I'm going to come to you on this, but first, let me just set up this bite. So essentially, one of the first questions to Donald Trump is about some of the language he's used in describing women, incredibly derogatory language. And the question, ultimately: How would that fit in with being a temperament of a president of the United States. And then afterwards, you'll hear him attacking the moderator here asking the question in the spin room. Here you go.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: What I say is what I say. And honestly, Megyn, if you don't like it, I'm sorry. I've been very nice to you, although I could probably maybe not be, based on the way you have treated me, but I wouldn't do that.
The questions to me were not nice. I didn't think they were appropriate, and I thought Megyn -- I thought Megyn -- I think Megyn behaved very badly, personally.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The question about women, you didn't like that?
TRUMP: No, I thought it was an unfair question. They didn't ask those questions of anybody else, and I thought it was an unfair question. But you know what? The answers were good, obviously, because everybody thinks I won.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: All right. So unfair questions, he says. Let me add this, Nia. One more thing, because Trump or someone from Camp Trump has been up in the middle of the night tweeting. All right? So this is just part of it. And I should be clear that these aren't necessarily original Donald Trump tweets. He's retweeting, which I think is significant, nonetheless.
"FOX viewers give low marks to bimbo" is the word used, Megyn Kelly, will consider other prograMs. OK? Second one, "I'm getting lots of Megyn Kelly hate mail tonight. #GOPdebate." And then he said, "She is totally overrated and angry. She really bombed tonight."
I mean, yes. What is all of this about? Is that very presidential of him? NIA-MALIKA HENDERSON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Not
really. But it goes to what we sort of already knew about Donald Trump, and that is that he is incredibly thin-skinned. He said in that debate that, you know, "I've been nice to you, Megyn. Maybe I won't be going forward." And he's certainly making good on that, not being very nice to her going forward.
I guess the question is what good does this do him? He did get some affirmation, I think, on Twitter from some people saying that they thought Megyn Kelly was going after him with these questions. There aren't really any unfair questions in a debate. So him being sort of testy and moody and like a petulant child over these questions is kind of odd, but it is in keeping with the Trump brand, sort of being the one who's always being attacked.
In this case, it's FOX news, and in this case, it's Megyn Kelly, who is many ways people really like at FOX News, right? I think she did a great job in that debate, raised some legitimate questions. And Trump gave the obvious answer there, I think, in saying it was politically correct and did something else, true to form, which is to then go after Megyn Kelly after it was all said and done.
CUOMO: Brooke did a good job of laying out the plus-minus on Trump, how he deals with things to his advantage and, perhaps to his disadvantage. Peter Hamby, speaking of St. Peter, there's another moment of contrast to look at. John Kasich also got a question that was arguably snarky, but he dealt with it very differently. Let's listen to the question and his answer and contrast what he did, versus Trump.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: You defended your Medicaid expansion by invoking God, saying to skeptics that, when they arrive in heaven, St. Peter isn't going to ask them how small they kept government, but what they have done for the poor. Why should Republican voters who generally want to shrink government believe that you won't use your St. Peter rationale to expand every government program?
KASICH: First of all -- first of all, Megyn, you should know that President Reagan expanded Medicaid three or four times.
Secondly, I had an opportunity to bring resources back to Iowa to do what? To treat the mentally ill. Ten thousand of them sit in our prisons. It costs $22,500 a year to keep them in prison. I'd rather get them their medication so they could lead a decent life.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CUOMO: Contrast and compare, Mr. Hamby.
PETER HAMBY, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Yes, look, I mean, Kasich has used that answer before in the past, and he's come off as sanctimonious and preachy. And conservatives don't like that.
I think what you've seen with John Kasich as he's entered the race is him repositioning himself as a little bit more of a happy warrior, a sunnier figure. He's much nicer with the press than he used to be. I can tell you that from personal experience.
Look, I think that Kasich knows that his strength in this campaign is not going to be necessarily charisma. It's going to be that he's been around the block. He's a guy who cares about problem solving. He's a pragmatist. You know, he wrote he federal budget back in the '90s. He's presided over a really healthy growing economy in the state of Ohio as governor.
[06:10:19] So look, I think he did well there by taking a difficult question and saying, "Look, I'm a guy who can get things done. You know, you may not like me, but this is who I am." And I think that is just what his style is going to have to be in this campaign, Chris.
BALDWIN: Ten voices on the stage. Definitely some louder than others. We have a graphic that shows you who spoke the most and then, of course, all the way down, who spoke the least. And I think almost as important as who we're are talking about and who really stood out on the stage, Errol, is also who we're not talking about. And there was even a moment where Ben Carson was sort of saying on that second question down the line, "Thanks for coming back to me. I want to get more in on this."
Who did not resonate?
LOUIS: Well, I thought Ben Carson had a tough time. I mean, you know, his -- his brand was that he sort of face-to-face attacked the president, you know. And that's kind of where he burst onto the national scene. He's got a very impressive personal resume. But those are two things that didn't fit well with this format, to talk about your personal resume, and that you're a neurosurgeon and so forth.
BALDWIN: Right.
LOUIS: No time, really, for that. Also, Obama wasn't on stage. This wasn't that kind of a debate. So he didn't really get a chance, I think, to sort of show people what he's about. And to a certain extent, he did sort of fade a little bit off the stage.
I think also, Marco Rubio made the best of his time, you know, but he didn't get much of it. There were questions that -- I was expecting to hear more about. You know, the government shut down some of these issues that the Senate took up over the last couple of years. I thought they were going to get more of a chance to talk about some of the votes that they had cast. You know, again, 90 minutes is not a lot of time.
CUOMO: He may have had the best answer of the night in terms of what he would do versus Hillary Clinton. Let's leave you with that. Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) RUBIO: The evidence is now clear that the majority of people
coming across the border are not from Mexico. They're coming from Guatemala, El Salvador and Honduras. Those countries are the source of the people that are now coming, and it's a majority.
I also believe we need a fence. The problem is, if El Chapo builds a tunnel under the fence, we have to be able to deal with that, too. And that's why you need a nominee -- I'm a nominee -- how is Hillary Clinton going to lecture me about living paycheck to paycheck? I was raised paycheck to paycheck. How is she -- how is she going to lecture me -- how is she going to lecture me about student loans? I owed over $100,000 just four years ago. If I'm our nominee, we will be the party of the future.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CUOMO: And that is his pitch, you know, in a single answer there about how -- what he represents for his party. There was a lot exposed last night. Boy. This really was for better and worse.
Thanks to our panel for wrapping it up for us. We'll be back with you soon -- John.
BERMAN: All right. A night of political bomb throwing at the debate. There was a political bombshell in Congress. A key ally of President Obama announced that he will vote to reject a nuclear deal with Iran.
New York Senator Chuck Schumer, influential Jewish Democrat, almost certainly the next Democratic leader, says he will vote no. CNN's Sunlen Serfaty live in Washington with the latest.
Good morning, Sunlen.
SUNLEN SERFATY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, John.
This is a big blow for President Obama. Schumer's support here really would have been key for the White House. But coming out overnight against this deal, saying in a statement, quote, "I will vote to disapprove the agreement, not because I believe war is a viable or desirable option, not to challenge the path of diplomacy. It is because I believe Iran will not change."
And this, on Capitol Hill could pave the way for other undecided Democrats to come out in -- come out in opposition to this deal. And quickly, after, indeed, we saw Representative Engle of New York. He had a one-on-one meeting with President Obama just this week. He came out also against it.
The White House here, they need to hold onto a majority of Democrats in the Congress to sustain a veto, a potential veto. A White House official down playing this move by Schumer, saying it follows a string of Democrats in recent days, like Senator Shaheen and Senator Gillibrand from New York, who came out in support of the deal. So they may be feeling increasingly confident about their chances. But the president is trying to keep up the momentum as lawmakers
head into their summer recess. And the sale job by the president, it drew some heat from Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell, blasting President Obama for what he called a crass tone.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. MITCH MCCONNELL (R-KY), SENATOR MAJORITY LEADER: The president strikes me as so far is treating us like a political campaign. Demonize your opponents. Gin up the base. Get the Democrats all angry. And you know, rally around the president.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SERFATY: And the Senate will be on recess until the first part of September. Their first order of business is getting to debate this bill. President Obama heads to his own vacation on Martha's Vineyard for two weeks later today, Brooke, where White House officials say he will continue to try to drum up support.
BALDWIN: Sunlen, thank you so much at the White House this morning.
[06:15:05] Also, an unclassified e-mail server used by the office of the joint chiefs has been hacked, and defense officials say Russia is the prime suspect.
Let's get the latest from our CNN Pentagon correspondent, Barbara Starr.
Barbara, good morning.
BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Brooke.
So Russia, indeed, suspect No. 1 here at the Pentagon. This was a hacking attack, spear-phishing right into the e-mail system of the joint chiefs of staff. The unclassified e-mail, but still, 4,000 military and civilian personnel, top people that work for the joint chiefs and the chairman of the joint chiefs. They believe it was directly targeted at them.
All of the protections were in place. But this was a very sophisticated attack, we are told. The Pentagon says it was a stealthy. They got inside the unclassified system in a way -- and they're not describing that way to us -- in a way that had never been seen before.
Why do they say Russia? So sophisticated, they believe it had to be a state entity. The Chinese, the Russians the only ones capable of pulling it off. The Chinese generally drain data out of the system when they hack into it, as we saw they did with the Office of Personnel Management when they grabbed tens of thousands of personnel records.
This was more malicious activity: getting inside, trying to insert malicious code, computer code into the system. So when it happened two weeks ago, they took the whole thing offline. And even this morning, here at the Pentagon, the joint chief staff trying to repair it, get it all back up and running.
But let's go back to that point, directly targeting the joint chief's of staff e-mail system. Was it a message from Moscow -- Chris?
BERMAN: All right, Barbara. I'll take it. What a mess there.
Breaking overnight, a suspected tornado rips through a Walmart in Troy, Alabama. Look at this picture. Wow. A powerful storm caused the store's roof to collapse, injuring two people inside. The twister, a possible twister, also damaged a nearby strip mall. In total, four people were injured.
CUOMO: So what happens after a debate is often as much or even more important than what happens during it. So we're going to look at the big winners and losers but also the spinners of last night's Republican slug fest. Who really came out on top?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[06:21:22] CUOMO: Welcome back to NEW DAY.
At last night's debate, we saw the candidates make a lot of claims about each other and about America. They sounded good, but were they "truthy"? We have John Berman here to check.
Marco Rubio came out strong, polished last night. He got hit, though, on an issue about abortion and his record. Tell us about it.
BERMAN: Yes. Megyn Kelly asked him about abortion and the issue of exceptions. Whether he ever supported exceptions for rape or incest to his opposition to abortion. Let's listen to exactly what Marco Rubio said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: If you believe that life begins at conception, as you say you do, how do you justify ending a life just because it begins violently, through no fault of the baby?
RUBIO: Well, Megyn, first of all, I'm not sure that that's a correct assessment of my record. I would go on to add that I believe all...
KELLY: You don't favor a rape and incest...
RUBIO: I have never said that. And I have never advocated that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BERMAN: So the claim here, to be clear, is he says he never advocated for rape/incest exceptions to abortion plan -- ban. There's no question that Marco Rubio is anti-abortion. The question he raised last night is has he ever supported exceptions? Well, he did back Senate bill 1670, the Pain-Capable Unborn Child
Protection Act of 2013. And that legislation would have banned abortion in most circumstances, with exceptions carved out for rape or incest against a minor.
CUOMO: So the senator is going to be on NEW DAY in the next hour. What do you think he's going to say? Did he not sponsor the bill? Was it just like a little part of it? Was it not really a bill about this? Is there any...
BERMAN: He said he had never advocated for exception. So the verdict we're giving him here is flat-out false. He has advocated for it before. But worth pressing him on, to be sure.
CUOMO: All right. So then, Governor Christie also was in a situation last night. Tell us about that.
BERMAN: Governor Christie, like so many governors, asked about his record, he made some claims about the state of New Jersey and what he's done for it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHRISTIE: We came in. We balanced an $11 billion deficit on a $29 billion budget by cutting over 800 programs in the state budget. We brought the budget into balance with no tax increases. What's happened since? A hundred and ninety-two thousand new private sector jobs in the five and a half years I've been governor.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BERMAN: So the claim here, to be clear: He says he inherited an $11 billion deficit; he balanced the budget; no tax increases; 192,000 jobs. So what actually happened? Well, you know what? He did inherit that deficit. He did balance the budget. He did not raise taxes. As for jobs, well, he created 100 -- or there were 166,000 created. Close, you know, close enough.
CUOMO: Why do you -- what do you think accounts for the difference?
BERMAN: Rounding error, perhaps. Who knows? But it's close. That's the important thing here.
But, the verdict is here, look, he's ignoring the fact that the situation in New Jersey, it is bleak. He's not making pension payments, even though a court has ordered him to. And they have had nine credit downgrades since he's been governor. So his exact claim there is true, but a little misleading.
CUOMO: His answer to that last night was, "If you think it's bad now, you should have seen what it was like when I got it," which got some applause...
BERMAN: Right.
CUOMO: ... but left him in that situation.
Then we get to the man of the hour. Donald Trump, often held to a different standard when it comes to whether or not he's spot on with what he says. But last night was a big one, even for him.
BERMAN: Look, Donald Trump is all about Donald Trump. And I think, as far as he's concerned, the world and the campaign revolves around him. So listen to this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: If it weren't for me, you wouldn't even be talking about illegal immigration, Chris. You wouldn't even be talking about it. This was not a subject that was on anybody's mind until I brought it up at my announcement and I said Mexico is sending.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BERMAN: Not a subject that was on anyone's mind. So, the claim here, again, is that no one's been talking about it. "No one talked about it before I did." Well, is that true? Is that true? Let's look at Carly Fiorina in May.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[06:25:13] FIORINA: Secure the border. It hasn't been secured under George W. Bush or Barack Obama. It needs to be secured, because the problem just keeps getting worse if we don't secure it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BERMAN: That was Carly Fiorina in May. Let's look at Chris Christie in May.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHRISTIE: ... come up with a solution for it, but I think that just immediately going to a path to citizenship, as Hillary Clinton is, is proposing to do, it's just pandering; it's politics.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BERMAN: Let's look at Rick Perry, last December.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RICK PERRY (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Securing our border with Mexico. Over the past decade, Texas has invested hundreds of millions of dollars, countless man-hours filling a role that's been largely abdicated by Washington.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BERMAN: So Trump's claim that no one was talking about it. The verdict, false. They were all talking about it. Everyone has been talking about immigration. Donald Trump did not create, Chris, the immigration debate.
CUOMO: However, could you give him, as a defense, nobody was getting it to resonate with the voters the way he was. So by extension, he gave it life in this campaign.
BERMAN: He made it a controversial issue, perhaps more controversial. But he was not the first person to bring it up.
CUOMO: He still gets the big red "F" there, though, from the J.B. man, Brooke.
BALDWIN: All right. I want to almost start where you all ended up with that and fact check further with Alex Castellanos, founder of NewRepublican.org and chairman of Purple Strategies. And I have with me here in studio this morning Jeffrey Lord, CNN political commentator and former political director under Ronald Reagan.
So gentlemen, good morning to both of you. And Jeffrey Lord, to you first. Yes, thank you, Berman, for the match up, you know, as far as all the other soundbites of all these other presidential wannabes, talking about immigration. But we've said this before and it's not even immigration is the issue. Veterans issues. And also even the economy. We heard Trump so many times last night saying, "We need to win. We need to win."
I am wondering if one should, perhaps some not jumping at it, but give him a little credit for bringing those issues to the forefront.
JEFFREY LORD, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I agree. I would respectfully disagree with the honorable Mr. Berman.
BALDWIN: The honorable?
LORD: And I would suggest -- I would suggest that, you know, people have been talking about this issue forever, but he is the one who brought this to a fever pitch.
No one had heard of Jamiel Shaw, the African-American father who lost his son. Nobody heard of the killings of all these families, their children, et cetera. And then, of course, Kate Steinle happens right in the middle of this. So I really do think he deserves serious credit for getting this on everybody's lips.
Although I will say, they've misrepresented him in a lot of cases. And they say he's talking about Mexican immigrants when he's talking about illegal immigrants, and there's a big difference.
BALDWIN: To women, Alex Castellanos. And I know one of the -- one of the soundbites that's also really resonating this morning is the way in which Donald Trump took on one of those moderators, Megyn Kelly. And this is all, of course, with the backdrop that Donald Trump has definitely stepped into it with the story recently resonating, with the woman who was breast-feeding [SIC] at the deposition and the words, the choice words he used towards her. These are the words he chose last night.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: What I say is what I say. And honestly, Megyn, if you don't like it, I'm sorry. I've been very nice to you, although I could probably maybe not be, based on the way you have treated me, but I wouldn't do that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: And I don't know if you have checked the Donald's Twitter feed this morning, Alex, but he's -- he's been on fire, going at it continuously on Megyn, on the women vein. And I'm just wondering, for you -- listen, women's votes matter incredibly much. And how will that sit with women?
ALEX CASTELLANOS, REPUBLICAN CONSULTANT: Well, it won't sit well with women, but it won't sit well with men or anybody else.
Last week, we were talking about Donald Trump growing from a protest candidate, sticking his finger in the eye of the Washington establishment, to someone who maybe could grow to become president. Rudy Giuliani said maybe there's a little Reagan in this guy. We're not going to be talking about Donald Trump like that anymore. He is merely a protest candidate now because of that moment.
He was angry, he was out of control. He didn't just bite the Washington establishment; he bit Megyn Kelly. That means he could bite any of us. Anger is not a sufficient qualification for president. This was a turning point in the beginning of the decline for Donald Trump.
BALDWIN: Speaking of Reagan in someone, let's go from Reagan and Trump to Reagan and Rand Paul. Rand Paul last night calling himself a Reagan conservative -- and I know you, sir, took issue with that -- when he was asked about Iran.
LORD: Right.
BALDWIN: Let's listen to that.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PAUL: I don't think that the president negotiated from a position of strength, but I don't immediately discount negotiations. I'm a Reagan conservative. Reagan did negotiate with the Soviets. But you have to negotiate from a position of strength. And I think President Obama gave away too much, too early.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: What about that didn't sit well with you?
LORD: President Reagan did indeed negotiate, but he waited a good long four years before he got into this. He built up -- rebuilt the American military. He brought on the Strategic Defense Initiative, Star Wars as the...
