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Bomb Blast Reported in Bangkok, Thailand; Donald Trump Continues to Surge in Polls; Interview with Presidential Candidate George Pataki; Interview with George Pataki; 5 States Try to Cut Money While Congress is in Recess. Aired 8-8:29a ET

Aired August 18, 2015 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[08:00:70] ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: So this morning police are on the hunt for a suspect spotted on surveillance footage. Look at your screen right now. This was near the blast site as new video surfaces of the first blast. CNN's Andrew Stevens is live for us in Bangkok. What's the latest thinking, Andrew.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ANDREW STEVENS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Two certainly significant developments today in that maiming of the suspect, also this second explosion. And the Thai authorities are coming out and saying this is the worst attack ever.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STEVENS: Just in this morning, another bomb goes off in Bangkok. This surveillance video shows water shooting into the air. The bomb exploding on the peer only a few miles away from Monday night's bomb that ripped through central Bangkok. Thai officials are on the hunt for this man believed to be connected to that bombing at the shrine. The suspect seen here in this surveillance video putting a backpack underneath a bench and then walking away. Newly released cellphone video captures the chaotic scene during evening rush hour on Monday. Unsuspecting tourists and locals walk along a popular footbridge before the sudden explosion below.

SANJEEV VYAS, BANGKOK BLAST EYEWITNESS: I got up on the sidewalk, and that's when I heard this huge explosion. I could actually feel. I see like bodies everywhere and then cars on fire.

STEVENS: People waiting in traffic captured the bomb going off right in front of them. Smoke and embers filled the air, surveillance video capturing the unprecedented large and deadly blast lighting up the night sky.

OLIVER HOLMES, CORRESPONDENT FOR "THE GUARDIAN": I saw about five different ambulances screaming away from the scene. I saw there were hundreds of medics, police, fire brigade.

STEVENS: The bomb claiming more than 20 lives and injuring over 100. Local police believe that this was a, quote, "deliberate act of terror," targeting a Hindu shrine, a major tourist attraction in Thailand also near a large shopping mall. BOB BAER, CNN INTELLIGENCE AND SECURITY ANALYST: They attacked a

touristic site. It tells me that this group wants to hit at the economy. This can do a lot of damage, especially if there's a follow- on.

STEVENS: Thai officials telling the state run news agency they did receive a warning of possible attacks but no specifics.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

STEVENS: And Michaela, a touching scene just a few minutes ago down there at that bomb site. Thais arriving with arms full of red roses and handing out single red roses to other Thais who have come to share their sorrow and grieve for their lost fellows. Also others, Chinese died in this attack, Malaysians, Hong Kongers, a lot of foreign tourists who were targeted, authorities say. Indeed, a dark, dark day for Thailand. And still, even though they have a suspect, no clear motive as to what was behind that horrific attack, Michaela.

MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN ANCHOR: Nice to hear a little bit of moments of light coming in such tremendous sadness. Thank you for that. We appreciate it.

Back at home in politics, Donald Trump topping the polls again, apparently getting stronger, in fact. Look at these brand new CNN/ORC poll numbers show he's made some big gains since last month, now commanding 24 percent of the Republican vote. That's not the only surprise in these numbers. CNN's Sara Murray join us live from Washington with more surprises for us.

SARA MURRAY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Michaela. Like you point out, Donald Trump with really strong support, one in four Republican voters backing him. Let's take another look at those top line numbers. You can see there Jeb Bush losing a little from July but still doing better in our poll than the FOX News poll you saw yesterday. And Ben Carson rounding out the top three, getting a pretty good bump in this latest poll, and yet another vote for the sort of antiestablishment wing.

Now, let's take a look at the all-important unfavorable-favorable numbers for Donald Trump. This is an area he was struggling in before sort of building up his favorability numbers. And he has seen a big gain, an eight-point jump from July, now 58 percent of Republican primary voters see him favorably. Just 38 percent see him unfavorably.

But maybe the most surprising number is the biggest jumps are Donald Trump's stance on the issues. Let's take a look at those poll numbers. Now you can see there he is leading in every major issue, 45 percent think he'd be the best on the economy, 44 percent on illegal immigration. They even rank him on the top for social issues and on dealing with ISIS, pretty remarkable for a guy who has put out relatively few policy specifics. He just came out with an immigration plan after we finished this poll. But he's also a guy who's flip- flopped on a lot on the social issues, so those are interesting numbers. Now, the other big question for Trump is how he would fare with women especially after that spat with Megyn Kelly of FOX News and some of his previous comments. And our poll shows that women actually view him more favorably than men. So 60 percent of women said they had a favorable view compared to 57 percent of men who said they had a favorable view of Trump.

Now, there is one big caveat standing out. When you look at how Donald Trump impacts the GOP's chances in 2016, 58 percent of Republican voters think they would be better off without Trump, 38 percent say they would be better with Trump. So still some voters out there who are pretty skeptical. Back to you, Chris.

[08:05:16] CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: And also I think that that probably reflects the fact that two-third of the field isn't with Trump, two-thirds of those polled, but they're just so split up among all these other candidates, it's tough to see any other source of strength other than Trump.

Sara, stay with us, and let's bring in CNN political director Mr. David Chalian. Of course, I was just stealing a point you made earlier on that you still have a lot of voters, David, who aren't with Trump in that field. But what is the challenge for the GOP? They're not going to scare Trump out of the race. He doesn't seem to want to go anywhere. So how do they include him?

DAVID CHALIAN, CNN POLITICAL DIRECTOR: Well, now the challenge for the remaining competitors not named Trump is to be able to do nothing to offend the Trump supporters so that when the voting starts, if indeed, as you just said, Chris, very wisely, if indeed the vote share that is split up among the other 16 starts consolidating behind one person so there's a one-on-one with Trump at the end of the day, that person wants to be able to woo some of those Trump voters to his or her side as well. That's the challenge -- don't offend Trump supporters even if you're going to agree with Donald Trump on policy and try to be that last man standing in that one on one fight.

CAMEROTA: That's a complicated threading of the needle. Sara, people have said just a few weeks ago that Donald Trump had a ceiling of 20, that this was all sort of a novelty. He's now exceeding that ceiling. We can look here in July he was at 18 percent. Now a month later he is at 24 percent. What else jumps out at you besides Donald Trump's sort of meteoric rise? Sara, when you look at these latest CNN polls, what jumps out at you?

MURRAY: Well, I think we keep underestimating where the ceiling is, as you pointed out. But I also think the interest thing is where Donald Trump is drawing support. So if you dig in on these numbers, he's getting a lot of support from working class Americans, from folks who don't have a college degree, which is pretty remarkable considering this guy is a billionaire in the race and has somehow managed to cast himself as a populist in the field, the guy who understands what working class, blue collar Americans are going through. And I think that that's something a lot of other Republicans are probably going to be paying attention so. Look, the base of the Republican party is very white, it's very southern, it's based in the Midwest. And so they need to talk to these voters to win the Republican nomination. And somehow Donald Trump is doing that better than a lot of others in the field.

CUOMO: How much of Trump's success, Chalian, is a rejection of Jeb Bush? When we look at these numbers, he was seen when Donald got into the race as a prohibitive favorite, $100 million plus in the super PAC money, the name, the pedigree. Now he is really favorable, you know, look at his numbers. And look how he's falling into the rest of the PAC. How do you explain it?

CHALIAN: I do think, Chris, that Jeb Bush's unfavorable is going up. That's among everyone there. But even among Republicans his unfavorable numbers went up --

CUOMO: It's 29 to 40 or something like that at this point.

CHALIAN: Yes, quite a bit from July to now. And I think part of that is the debate, the Donald Trump factor of dominating all and Jeb Bush sort of looking a little timid or not willing to sort of take the fight to him, that there's been sort of a depression of support overall.

I don't think, though, that the Trump support is necessarily a rejection of Jeb. I think the Trump support is a rejection of the establishment overall. And in fact, Scott Walker today is going to be giving a speech talking about his plan to repeal and replace Obamacare. One of the things he's going to say is we were promised that a Republican Senate would get a bill to repeal Obamacare on the president's desk, and that hasn't happened. He's taking on Mitch McConnell or the Republican Senate leadership, again tapping into this notion that anything establishment and Washington needs to be rejected. Scott Walker now trying to grab that as well.

CAMEROTA: Sara, let's talk about how women feel about Donald Trump, because the numbers are pretty stunning. His favorability as you pointed out among women is 60 percent. Have they explained exactly what it is about Donald Trump that they like?

MURRAY: I think there are a couple of realities. Women are not some mythical creature that wants a total different thing than men do. Women say the same thing when you talk to them that the men do. They like he's really blunt. They think he's honest with them when he's talking about the different issues and when he's talking about changing Washington.

I think the other thing, though, is they don't think this spat with Megyn Kelly is that big of a deal. It's just another political battle. They don't look at it and think it did real damage with him among women. And they didn't believe that just because of that exchange that all of a sudden Donald Trump as president would be worse to women than he would be to men.

CUOMO: People thought that he was going to be done when he said what he said about Megyn Kelly. It wound up, you could argue, being optically worse for her. And then he comes out with this proof of performance thing where he shows look at who I hire as women, look where I put the, look what I pay them. And now he's challenging the rest of the field to do it and nobody's really answering yet with what he's put out.

[08:10:07] I mean, it's amazing, the turnabout in it. The question is does it sustain? Can he really show that he's an advocate for women?

CAMEROTA: We'll ask Rick Perry about that shortly. And I believe you'll ask George Pataki about it.

CUOMO: Former New York governor.

CAMEROTA: The other interesting thing is that people thought that he didn't do well at the debate. He didn't get high marks from that debate, but yet his numbers keep going up.

CUOMO: Everyone felt Rubio did great and his numbers have not moved the way that Donald Trump's did.

CAMEROTA: David, Sara, thanks so much for all of your insight into this. We'll talk to you again.

CUOMO: Alisyn gave you the nod towards the NEW DAY pledge to have the candidates on to discuss the issues and be tested as often as possible. We do have joining us live from the Iowa state fair Republican presidential candidate, former governor three-term of New York, George Pataki. Governor, thank you for joining us and what we here is a very ugly weather situation. And you are very tall, so I hope you are safe from any type of lightning situation. You OK?

GEORGE PATAKI, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Well, there is lightning out here at the Iowa state fair. I'm under a tent. And hey, some of the experts say it wouldn't be a bad thing if my campaign got struck by lightning. I'm not so sure that they're right, but we are looking to break into the top tier.

CUOMO: Listen, no, God forbid, we want you safe and we want your ideas to get out there, so let's get after that this morning.

When you look at these numbers and why Trump is in front and how it's communicating into the different echelons of issues and everything, anywhere you look he is being strong. What do you think it is that you need to take to him to get up into the upper echelon, as you suggest?

PATAKI: Chris, I think it's very simple. Americans are fed up with Washington. They think it's an inside game, that it's a rigged game. It doesn't matter which party is in control. It seems that government grows bigger, more expensive, more intrusive, more powerful. And they're right. It's not just Republicans. It's independents and it's a lot of Democrats. It's not just Trump. If you look at the top three, Trump, Carson, another person who's never held political office, Ted Cruz, who is always looking to shut down the government or filibuster against the insiders. So it is this reaction to an inside game. And I totally share that frustration, because it is an inside game, and we have to take back Washington from the powerful, from the interests, from the lobbyists and give it back to the people.

CUOMO: Governor, what's your take on why you're not resonating? You and I have a lot of personal history. I've known you since I was a kid. You beat my father, Mario Cuomo, who was a big name guy in New York state. You showed you can take on a big guy and win. You did three terms. What are you telling yourself about why you're not breaking out of this pack?

PATAKI: I think part of it is that there is so much attention being paid to one candidate as we hear constantly on the news. And the other is that it's very early in the process. And the angry candidate, the one who is looking to divide, is the one getting attention right now.

What I want to do is bring people together. You were talking a minute ago about how the Senate can't even send Obama a bill to repeal Obamacare. That's because Republicans are not going to have 60 senators. We're going to have to bring people together, work across party lines, get Democrats to support Republican efforts to repeal Obamacare and put in place a better alternative. That doesn't resonate in a 30-second sound bite or with those who are looking to express their anger.

But ultimately I think people want grown up government, they want somebody who can bring us together and actually solve America's problems. And Chris, I'm still very hopeful that they're going to say, OK, we've had enough theater, we've had enough fun. Who can actually bring people together and lead America, and that's Pataki.

CUOMO: And how long do you think you will stay in the race? I know you have a lot of different interests. You've been very successful since you've been governor. How long will you keep it up?

PATAKI: I'm going the whole way here. I'm out in Iowa. I'm looking forward to the caucuses next February. I was in New Hampshire two days ago looking forward to the first primary, and I intend to be in this the whole way. You know, Chris, when I ran first time for governor, as you well know, people didn't give me much of a chance. But you stay with it, you believe in yourself and your ability to lead. You believe in the people's desire to have government that works, grown-up government. That's me. I'm in this to win it.

CUOMO: Well, you had a little bit of a similar calculus. I know my mother is going to get very mad right now because I'm going to talk about why you beat my pop.

(LAUGHTER)

CUOMO: But you had a very dominant social issue at the time, which was the death penalty. And you had an incumbent who had been in there for three terms. You had an economic slowdown. So it was a little bit of a similar combination of dynamics that you have today. What do you think that major social is to attach yourself to, and what is your angle to addressing the fatigue?

PATAKI: Chris, I think you're exactly right. There are two big issues here. One is Americans don't see that the economic recovery is affecting their lives. And we have to have stronger job growth, better job creation, and less government. To grow the private sector you have to shrink the public sector. I know I can do that if I have the chance to lead.

And the other very emotional issue to both you and me is ISIS and radical Islam and the threat they pose not just in New York but to America.

[08:15:03] And we saw the consequences of thinking that because it's overseas we're safe. We're not safe.

And I am the one out there saying we have to shut down ISIS recruiting here in America, encouraging Americans to jihad against fellow Americans. We have got to destroy their training center, recruitment hubs over there before they have a chance to attack us here.

The issues are there. The American people understand the importance of these issues. I just have to continue to make the case and fight.

CUOMO: Trump is taking it to the next level. He's putting out plans. He put out his proof of performance in terms of how he hires women, what he pays them.

We're going to ask you campaign and all the others to put out numbers of when you were governor, do you have women in positions? It's different with government. They get paid by level so it's different. So, it's different. It's so much a merit-based pay. But your campaign will produce those numbers for us, I'm sure.

What do you think about his immigration plan? Do you think he can build a wall and have Mexico pay for it? Do you think he can beat ISIS by taking their oil? What do you think of his ideas?

PATAKI: Chris, these are all simplistic sound bites that sound wonderful to people who are angry. But when you think about it, Mexico is not going to pay to build the wall. Yes, we have to secure the border but we're not going to send millions and millions of people going around America, rounding them up, putting them on buses and sending them back somewhere.

And just taking away ISIS's oil doesn't take away the fanaticism. It doesn't take away their recruiting centers and training hubs. It doesn't take away the fact they have over 10,000 people with Western passports training right now to attack us in America and the west.

CUOMO: What about --

PATAKI: We have got to attack and destroy them there.

CUOMO: Governor, what about going after employers of those who take illegal aliens, undocumented immigrants, whatever you want to call them and put them to work because they get to cut their costs? Would you go after them?

PATAKI: I think you have to uphold the law. And if it's illegal to employ someone who is not allowed to be here, then you have to go after them. But that's not the solution, Chris.

I have heard that every four years, everybody says, we're going to go after the employers. We're going to get them -- nothing happens.

So, you're going to go into every kitchen in America, of every restaurant, arrest the restaurateur, deport the people in the kitchen. It just is not practical. It's emotionally gratifying to somebody who doesn't have a good job and is angry at Washington. But it's not going to work.

Ultimately, I think the American people are going to say, what's going to work? What's actually going to make America better? What's going to make my career more secure and my community safer? That's going to be the policies that Pataki is advocating and can achieve in Washington.

CUOMO: Governor Pataki, good luck to you there. Stay out of the weather. Thank you for coming on NEW DAY. And you're always welcome here to discuss the issues and be tested. Appreciate it.

PATAKI: Thank you, Chris. Great being on with you again. Appreciate it.

CUOMO: Thank you, sir.

We're going to talk more about the presidential race with GOP candidate Rick Perry. Alisyn is going to put the questions to him and you can test for yourself.

Also a reminder, CNN will host the next Republican debate that's coming on September 16th.

Mick?

MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN ANCHOR: All right. Search teams have recovered all 54 victims who perished in the crash of a Trigana Airlines plane. Investigators have also now retrieved the plane's valuable black box recorders from that remote site in Western Indonesia. They are hoping that it will provide answers about why that plane went down without a distress call.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: Western wildfires now so out of control that some 200 active duty soldiers. This is the first time soldiers have fought wildfires since 2006. The first have destroyed hundreds of homes and scorched 1.1 million acres in Oregon, Washington, Idaho, Montana, California, Nevada, and Colorado. More than a thousand people have had to leave their homes.

CUOMO: And talk about a two-way player, number 75 for the Arizona Rattlers of the Arizona Football League, showing us some big league dance moves, performing with the team's cheerleading squad. You don't learn that in the trenches.

Look at the thighs on this guy. Look at the flexibility. I like that move. Look how quick he is. Look at this guy.

PEREIRA: Wait.

CUOMO: All right. He's not really a football player. He's actually a professional dancer and choreographer who's just built like a lineman.

PEREIRA: Go ahead, fella.

CAMEROTA: That's awesome!

CUOMO: You know what? They might pick him. Look at that step.

CAMEROTA: Look at that.

CUOMO: That's a double dip whoops.

CAMEROTA: I know you like the twerking dance, wait for it.

CUOMO: Turn around, show us what you got. Show us what your mama gave you there in a second. Bing bing bing bing.

PEREIRA: You know, the post-show meeting is going to take on a whole new moment with this one.

CAMEROTA: It is.

As Chris tries to recreate some of these.

CUOMO: How many places will my suit rip?

(LAUGHTER)

PEREIRA: All right. Still ahead here, we've seen this hidden camera video that there's a series of them from Planned Parenthood, spurring five states to act in order to cut off funding. Is there going -- their efforts, is that actually going to work? We'll take a look at that coming up after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:23:21] CAMEROTA: More fallout for Planned Parenthood following the release of those controversial undercover videos -- at least five states now trying to cut off money to the agency. The hidden camera videos claim to show Planned Parenthood profiting from fetal tissue sales. That's a charge the organization vehemently denies.

Let's bring in our CNN senior legal analyst Jeffrey Toobin.

Jeffrey, good to have you on set here.

JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Good morning.

CAMEROTA: So, some Republicans in Congress tried to defund Planned Parenthood. They get about $500 million a year from taxpayers. That effort just failed a couple of weeks ago.

TOOBIN: Correct. CAMEROTA: Now, these five states, Louisiana, Alabama, Utah, New Hampshire and Arkansas are also trying to defund Planned Parenthood in their states.

How do they go around Congress?

TOOBIN: Because not all the money for women's health comes from the federal government. The federal government can decide who gets and who doesn't get the federal money. And the federal government has decided not to cut off Planned Parenthood. But some of the money comes directly from the states, and the states can decide who gets state money and these states are cutting off Planned Parenthood.

CAMEROTA: So this is going to work? These five states is going to work.

TOOBIN: Absolutely. Yes. And it has worked in states previously like Texas, most prominently. They cut off money for Planned Parenthood and a lot of women lost health care as a result.

CAMEROTA: Can we talk about these videos that have reenergized this effort to defund Planned Parenthood because they purport to show Planned Parenthood engaged in illegal activity, such as negotiating the sale of fetal tissue.

Now, Planned Parenthood is legally allowed to transfer fetal tissue for research purposes. But they do appear to catch some of the directors of medical services, even doctors, doing some form of negotiating.

[08:25:01] You've watched these videos. Is it illegal what they're doing?

TOOBIN: It's very hard to tell because the videos have been edited and we -- from people who have a clear ideological agenda. What's illegal is to profit from the sale of the fetal tissue. It is not illegal to sell them to cover Planned Parenthood's costs. That's a very subtle difference. How do you define the costs?

And the answer so far has been no one has established that Planned Parenthood has done anything unlawful.

CAMEROTA: Yes, I mean, even in the pieces there are excerpts that do not appear to be edited. I mean, that's the best we can say.

TOOBIN: Sure, absolutely.

CAMEROTA: We've watched what appear full swaths of the video that don't show any cuts, OK? So, in that, what you hear is the director of medical services negotiating. What they say is that there's -- the costs of the handling of the fetal tissue is somewhere between $30 and $100. And you hear the actor posing as a buyer saying, well, I'd like to pay you on the upper end of that to make sure that I don't get the best. And you hear the doctors saying things like, that would work.

Now, I mean, why not a flat fee? Wouldn't it make sense if they charged everybody $50 so they wouldn't get themselves in this level of trouble?

TOOBIN: Stepping back, I think what everybody finds to troubling about all of this is the whole notion of fetal research itself, of aborted fetuses being used for research. Now, in fact, that has been a long standing and, in fact, political very popular program. Fetal tissue research has proven two extremely successful in medical research. So --

CAMEROTA: Absolutely. And you could argue that if it were not used, it would be discarded.

TOOBIN: Exactly.

CAMEROTA: It's better to have it go to research.

TOOBIN: Exactly. But the problem is, you know, when confronted with the gritty details of the financial transactions, it's certainly distasteful. And these videos, look, there's no question they were distasteful. That is not the same thing as being illegal.

And how you compute Planned Parenthood's costs in getting the tissue to the buyers is not a simple thing. And the fact that some negotiation was involved is going to be pretty much inevitable.

CAMEROTA: We should make it clear that just this week, HHS said that they have looked into this and investigated it and found no wrongdoing on the part of Planned Parenthood.

TOOBIN: Nor has any state nailed Planned Parenthood with actual wrongdoing even. It's just the atmosphere surrounding it because of those videos is really poisoned.

CAMEROTA: Jeffrey Toobin, thanks so much for all the legal analysis.

TOOBIN: OK.

CAMEROTA: What's your take on defunding Planned Parenthood? You can tweet us using #NewDayCNN, or post your comment on Facebook.com/NewDay. You can also find me on Twitter and Facebook @AlisynCamerota.

CUOMO: Please do that.

Donald Trump, far and away the front runner of the GOP pack in 2016. Every poll says the same thing. Who's going to catch him? How are they going to catch him?

We're going to speak with Trump rival and former Texas governor, Rick Perry. Does he have a solution?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)