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Lone Wolf Terrorist Attacks Examined; Protests in Ferguson, Missouri, Continue; Organization Helps U.S. Veterans Start Businesses. Aired 8-8:30a ET

Aired October 22, 2015 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[08:00:00] CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: And my friends, today is the day. Former secretary of state Hillary Clinton set to eight to 10 hours of grilling before the House Benghazi committee. There will be a winner and a loser after this is all over. And under the microscope specifically is the issue of the whether Clinton's actions or inactions cost Americans their lives, and is there any new insight that questions the facts that justifies this investigation.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: So her high stakes testimony is just two hours away, or less now. It comes amid criticism of the committee that this is a politically motivated witch hunt. So we have some new CNN polling out just this morning about how Americans feel about this investigation. Let's begin with CNN's senior political correspondent Brianna Keilar. She's live in Washington. What do we know at this hour, Brianna?

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Here is what today is going to look like, Alisyn. Four two hour blocks of questions separated by breaks. That is roughly how it is going to go. And Hillary Clinton has been preparing for what we expect will be a grueling day, a possibly dramatic day. The Republican chairman of the committee Trey Gowdy says this is about having a final and definitive accounting for Benghazi. But Democratic supporters of Clinton say this is the political hatchet job. And while Americans are split on whether the committee has gone too far, most of them, Democrats and Republican, see politics at play.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

HILLARY CLINTON, (D) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I really don't know what to expect.

KEILAR: This morning, just hours from the highly anticipated Benghazi hearing.

CLINTON: They ended up being a partisan arm of the Republican National Committee.

KEILAR: A new CNN/ORC poll reveals the public agrees with the Democratic frontrunner -- 72 percent believe the investigation is being used for political gain.

REP. KEVIN MCCARTHY, (R) HOUSE MAJORITY LEADER: We put together a Benghazi special committee, a select committee. What are her numbers today? Her numbers are dropping.

KEILAR: Two members of the GOP admitting as much.

REP. RICHARD HANNA, (R) NEW YORK: This may not be politically correct, but I think that there is a big part of this investigation that was designed to go after people.

KEILAR: But committee chair Trey Gowdy strongly denies he's playing politics.

REP. TREY GOWDY, (R) SOUTH CAROLINA: I have told my own Republican colleagues and friends, shut up talking about things that you don't know anything about.

CLINTON: Was it because of a protest or was it because of guys out for a walk one night who decided they'd go kill some Americans?

KEILAR: That anger and frustration palpable in Hillary Clinton's last testimony before Congress more than two years ago.

CLINTON: What difference at this point does it make?

KEILAR: A moment likely still fresh in the minds of the Republican led committee members.

REP. JEFF DUNCAN, (R) SOUTH CAROLINA: Madame Secretary, you let the consulate become a death trap.

KEILAR: Yet after three years of accusations, seven investigations, thousands of pages of e-mails, and hours of testimony, Republicans say they still have unanswered questions. On September 11th, 2012, Islamic extremists overran the U.S. mission in Benghazi, setting it ablaze and then storming a nearby CIA annex, killing four Americans including U.S. Ambassador Chris Stevens. But is Clinton ultimately to blame for the terror attack and deadly security lapse? That is what some Republicans say is still unknown.

CLINTON: With specific security requests they didn't come to me. I had no knowledge of them.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KEILAR: This committee holding the hearings today, the Benghazi select committee, is responsible for uncovering that Hillary Clinton solely used personal e-mail while she was secretary of state and that that e-mail was housed on a personal serve in her home in New York. But at the same time despite the release of thousands of e-mails there really hasn't been a smoking gun found, that there was either a cover up that the Obama administration did after the attack or that Hillary Clinton was involved in some sort of cover up.

But what we're expecting, guys, is that -- and Republicans say this. They say they have some new documents that they will be airing today. So we'll stay tuned to see what that's about.

CAMEROTA: It will be so interesting to see how much of the questioning deals with the e-mail scandal and how much deals with Benghazi. So we know you will be watching that for us. Thanks so much for the preview.

Meanwhile, Congressman Paul Ryan getting some conditions met. He demanded the backing of the House freedom caucus before moving forward to become speaker. And this morning, more than 70 percent of that freedom caucus has voted to back him. But is that enough? CNN's senior political reporter Manu Raju live from Washington. He wanted 80 percent. So is 70 enough?

MANU RAJU, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL REPORTER: Yes. Well, hey, good morning, Alisyn. It seems that way. Paul Ryan spent yesterday trying to win over the hardline conservative who effectively drove out John Boehner and the scuttled Kevin McCarthy's bid to be speaker. Ryan I'm told privately assured them he would not put a comprehensive immigration bill on the floor, he would move forward on bills that only received a majority of the Republican conference's support, and he even said he didn't want to be speaker and would only do it if he won the backing of the three major coalitions in the House, and that includes, of course, the freedom caucus. After a meeting last night here is what one of their leaders said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. TIM HUELSKAMP, (R) KANSAS: Every institution, democratically elected institution, has an opportunity to remove the leader. That is the way it works. And I don't think we augment to change the rules for one man if it was good enough for Thomas Jefferson.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[08:05:10] RAJU: Now, that last comment was referring to Ryan's demand to change House rules to make it harder to eject him from the speakership. That prompted some concerns from conservatives, and he did not receive the endorsement because of that only 70 percent of the roughly 40 members of the group voted to back him, not the 80 percent that the group requires. But still with that 70 percent, it was good enough for Ryan to say that he is going to continue with the speaker's bid, and he's expected to win the official backing of two other coalitions later today, paving the way for him to be speaker next week. Chris?

CUOMO: All right, Manu, thank you very much. Let's bring in Congressman Mike Pompeo of Kansas. He's a Republican and an outspoken member of the House select committee, defending the investigation of Benghazi. It's good to have you with us, sir. It's an important day. Thank you for taking the time.

REP. MIKE POMPEO, (R) KANSAS: You're most welcome, Chris. Thanks for having me on the show this morning.

CUOMO: All right, good. Let's walk through this almost forensically, OK? Because a big part of the political kerfuffle is about what has happened already and what people like you think still needs to happen, OK? So Hillary Clinton has testified before. Her people say she was available for over six hours. She testified for at least five and a half hours, right?

POMPEO: I don't know the exact number. She's testified twice with respect to this issue, that's correct.

CUOMO: She did discuss her knowledge or an action or inaction with respect to what happened before, during, and after the actual incident. Is that true?

POMPEO: She did so. And the committees speaking with her those days had no access to any of the documents that pertain to those very same sets of issues. We've now received thousands and thousands of pages of documents about her actions, the actions of her staff, actions that took place all across the United States government. We've had the benefit of interviewing dozens of those people that none of those committees took the time or had the capacity to interview. So we have a great deal of more information and a lot more fidelity about what happened that day, and so I think we'll be able ask her questions that advance the story of how these four Americans murdered on her watch.

CUOMO: Two follow-ups. One, you say they had none of information. The Democrats countered, specifically Elijah Cummings in his report, that they in fact did have access to tens of thousands of pages of documents and e-mails of Stevens. Not as many as you have now but they did have documents. Are you saying they had none of them, or that you have more?

POMPEO: If I said they have none, I misspoke. It's not even close, Chris. We received nine hundred pages just yesterday afternoon, Chris. These are emails from Ambassador Stevens just yesterday three and a half years after the events. It is not even remotely reasonable to say that the previous committees had any opportunity to have the facts in front of them. Today we have most of it. But we still don't have all of it. But we'll conduct a fact- based inquiry and we'll do our best to show the American people what it is we're trying to do in order to make sure that something like this never happens again.

CUOMO: The purity of the cause gets compromised by the set up to that statement. I understand you have more. We're all very much looking forward to seeing what is so valuable in the more that you have that justified the enthusiasm for this. But when you say they have none, when it is not even close, they didn't have the facts before them, seven different reports came out that said in conclusive fashion they do know the facts, they do think they know what happened. So you think all of that was what, wrong, lies, what was it?

POMPEO: Chris, these are very different investigations. Let's take the Accountability Review Board that Secretary Clinton to heavily relies on. It didn't speak to a single senior State Department official, including America's most senior diplomat, Secretary Clinton. Each of the committees that our body of Congress put forward had its own particular interest. I sat on one of those committees. I sat on the House Intelligence Committee. We looked at the intelligence community did and issued a report based on that. This is the first time we've had a committee with the ability to have the scope and the breadth and now the facts upon which to ask Secretary Clinton questions about her actions for security for those four men, and the actions how it's the case that a couple weeks after this even president Clinton -- excuse me, President Obama could go on television and not be able to answer whether this was a terrorist attack.

CUOMO: Three people were recommended to be dismissed because of the ARB. Did you interview them? Are they before the committee?

POMPEO: I'm not at liberty to talk about all of the folks that we've spoken to nor the folks that we'll speak to after this Thursday. A lot of the media seems to think this investigation ends today. It does not. We'll bring many, many more folks before our committee, before we write our report. But remember, with respect to the Accountability Review Board, not a single person lost a single paycheck and we have four Americans killed. Accountability for what happened that night still has not occurred.

CUOMO: But you won't tell us whether or not you took the time to interview the three people that were told to be dismissed?

POMPEO: We've interviewed dozens and dozens of people. Chris. We'll continue your investigation. We'll pursue the facts wherever they lead us. And we'll write a report that I'm confident the American people will see as providing fidelity and important information in order to reduce the risk that something like this could ever happen again here in the United States.

[08:10:09] CUOMO: It's interesting you keep using the word "fidelity" because obviously a lot about this is the intentionality of it, right. You are saying fidelity, that this is the faithful, earnest look at the questions. The reason I ask is when you have someone like Podliska come out, he was attached to the select committee, yes?

POMPEO: I never met Mr. Podliska. It sounds like he was a staff person for our committee for a short time, that's correct.

CUOMO: Here's why I'm asking you about how we got here, because if this isn't about politics. If this is about just finding the truth, why would somebody somehow connected to the committee put out a hit document about an interview with me with another committee member saying it wasn't six hours. It's five and a half. And it's wrong to say she talked about the threat. It's wrong to say that this. It's wrong to say this committee ever had any access to. It is wrong to say that anyone connected to the committee ever said this is political. That is all not true. Why spend the time putting out a political hit piece on something you say isn't political?

POMPEO: Chris, I can assure you. I served in the army for quite a time. I know what mission is. This community has been focused on its mission since May of 2014. I regret that the Democrats on the committee haven't lifted a finger to help us get to the facts. We had four Americans murdered and our objective was when we started, will be today, and it will be after today, to get answers for the American people. You set this piece up saying there will be a winner today. I

think you're right. I think you meant Secretary Clinton or the committee. The winner today will be the American people. I'm confident of that. And we'll write a report and I think the American people will be proud of the work that we do on that as well.

CUOMO: What do you make of the suggestion of a poll that says 72 percent of people say it is about politics and raise the question of why it's received more attention than any other act of terror in the United States, including 9/11, by a very large amount?

POMPEO: There's been a lot of spent by Secretary Clinton super PAC --

CUOMO: What does that have to do with the question?

POMPEO: Because your question was what America answered on some 400 or 500 person poll. There have been a lot of efforts to influence what the American people think. Our committee has not done that. Our committee has worked diligently. You see this morning I wouldn't answer your question about a detail of the work that we've done. That's because we've endeavored to do our work in a way that is professional, earnest, complete, and we'll keep doing that.

CUOMO: Good. Thank you being tested about how we got here today. We all look forward to hearing what is discovered that is new and that helps the American people understand the situation better than they have been able to up to this date. Appreciate you being on, Congressman.

POMPEO: You're most welcome. Thank you, Chris.

CUOMO: All right, so we're going to cover this soup to nuts. Stay with CNN for complete coverage of the Benghazi hearing. It's going to start at 9:30 eastern. They may question Clinton for up to 10 hours. And whatever it is we'll be here. Alisyn?

CAMEROTA: We do have some breaking news now about Clinton's challengers on the Republican side. Dr. Ben Carson trumping Donald Trump. In a new Quinnipiac poll out of Iowa Carson beating Trump 28 to 20 percent in Iowa. Is this the beginning of trend? CNN's Athena Jones helping us break down the numbers live from D.C. So this is the first time in this pivotal state that Carson has leapfrogged Trump?

ATHENA JONES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's right. Good morning, Alisyn. This is a big deal. It is too soon to say if it is a trend, but we've been talking about how Trump has been leading in national polls for 100 days. But this is a state by state competition. And Iowa is the first state to make a choice in the Republican race next year so this is important.

Ben Carson out on top there at 28 percent to Trump's 20 percent. Carson has gained seven points and Trump has lost seven in the last month. This is Carson's best showing in Iowa so far. And we know he's drawing a lot of his support from women and from white evangelical voters.

Another interesting data point here is that when people were asked which candidate they definitely would not support, 30 percent said Donald Trump. You can see that Jeb Bush is not too far behind him. So this may be worse news in a way for Bush because he's tied at sixth in this poll down at just five percent.

But Trump also doesn't do well when it comes to favorability. You can see in the next poll graphic that Carson has 84 percent favorable rating, just 10 percent unfavorable. Trump is way down there at 53 percent favorable and 43 percent unfavorable, which is the highest number we're seeing in that poll.

And there is one more set of numbers I want to highlight here. Take a look at the candidates standing with white evangelical voters. This is a key group when it comes to Republican caucus goers in Iowa. The last few caucus winners, Rick Santorum and Mike, Huckabee had big appeal with white evangelicals, and you can see that Carson leads Trump by 19 points with that group. And it's because of the importance of these white evangelical voters that Carson is making comments like this one. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[08:15:00] DONALD TRUMP, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: So I'm a good Christian, OK? Remember that.

(APPLAUSE)

And I told you about Christmas. And I guarantee, if I become president we're going to be saying "merry Christmas" at every store. The "happy holiday", you can leave that over in the corner.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ATHENA JONES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That was Trump yesterday in Iowa, a clear attempt to appeal to those folks who feel like there is a war on the word "Christmas".

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: All right, Athena. The question is, how well does it work? Team Trump will push back and say, among black evangelicals, he's actually doing very well. So, there will be more polls and debates to come.

President Obama is going to meet today with the prime minister of Pakistan. This is a big deal. They are expected to discuss American troop levels in Afghanistan, along with nuclear arms in the Middle East.

The prime minister is expected to tell the president he will not accept limits on the use of small tactical nukes. There are fears that kind of resistance could lead to a nuclear arms race in the region, especially following the Iran deal.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: Secretary of State John Kerry meeting in Berlin this morning with Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. Kerry heads to Vienna and the Middle East next, hoping to negotiate an end to that wave of deadly violence between Palestinians and Israelis.

Just this morning, police shot and apprehended two attackers who stabbed an Israeli civilian west of Jerusalem after trying to board a bus full of children.

CUOMO: Breaking overnight, a man confesses to shooting a 4-year- old girl in New Mexico all because of road rage.

CNN's Ana Cabrera live with the latest -- Ana.

ANA CABRERA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Chris.

Authorities say it was an anonymous tip that ultimately led them to their suspect. They say he was cooperative when taken in for questioning yesterday afternoon, and then an arrest coming more than 24 hours after that fatal road rage encounter that's left a family shattered.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CABRERA (voice-over): Breaking overnight, the lengthy manhunt in New Mexico ends with an arrest in that heartbreaking road rage that left 4-year-old Lilly Garcia dead.

VERONICA GARCIA, MOTHER OF Lilly GARCIA: She just grabbed your heart. The first ten minutes you met her, she would grab your heart. And she's going to -- she's going to be missed by a lot of people.

CABRERA: Now, 32-year-old Tony Torrez is in police custody, thanks to an anonymous tip. Police say Torrez confessed to killing Lilly on westbound Interstate 40 in Albuquerque Tuesday afternoon.

GORDEN EDEN, ALBUQUERQUE POLICE CHIEF: This should have never happened. This is a complete disrespect of human life.

CABRERA: The deadly encountering unfolding over two miles. Two vehicles cutting each other off on the highway. The drivers exchanging words. Moments later, shots ringing out. Torrez pulling out a gun and opening fire on the red truck Lilly's father Alan was driving.

CALLER: I'm not sure what's going on. There's a red Ford F-150 in the center median. And it looks like some sort of medical emergency. It's not an accident, but there's an adult holding what looks like an unresponsive child.

CABRERA: A fatal gunshot to the head striking Lilly, who was in the car next to her 7-year-old brother, picked up from her second day of school.

OPERATOR: The caller is advising his daughter is breathing.

OFFICER: 10-4, and that was the one with the head injury?

OPERATOR: That's 10-4.

CABRERA: Lilly was rushed to the hospital where she was later pronounced dead.

GOV. SUSANA MARTINEZ (R), NEW MEXICO: I just can't express how sad it is to know that something as simple as going down the freeway, and your child dies because of road rage.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CABRERA: Now, Torres is accused of murder, child abuse and about a half dozen other charges. He's been held on $650,000 cash only bond.

In the meantime, the community is really rallying around Lilly's family. They raised tens of thousands on a Go Fund Me page. And businesses have reached out, offering services to help with Lilly's funeral -- Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: They will need all of that emotional and financial support. Thanks so much, Ana.

Well, now that Joe Biden has bowed out. What does it mean for Hillary Clinton? And what does it mean for Donald Trump? And the other big names? We'll explain the ripple effect, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CAMEROTA: About one hour from now, Hillary Clinton will testify before the House Benghazi Committee. Clinton has said the Republican- led committee is just a political crusade to try to bring down her poll numbers.

There are new CNN polling numbers to show this morning. It finds that 72 percent of Americans think the investigation is political. Yet, they also are not satisfied with how she's dealt with Benghazi.

David Axelrod joins us now. He's a CNN senior political commentator and former senior adviser to President Obama.

David, great to see you this morning.

DAVID AXELROD, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Good to see you.

CAMEROTA: So, what does Hillary Clinton need to do during this testimony today?

AXELROD: I mean, I think she needs to answer questions thoroughly. But she needs to answer them in such a way that doesn't create new issue. She's said a lot on this subject before. And she needs to be consistent with the things she's said before.

And she needs to be -- I think she needs to acknowledge as she has in the past, that obviously, mistakes were made in Benghazi. And talk about what we can learn from those mistakes, which is really what these hearings should be about. I think Americans are wise in that they think the hearings are both political but there are some substantive issues that need to be explored here. CUOMO: The two go hand in hand whenever Congress is looking at

something, right? Of course, it's inherently political and motivated by aims and means that go to politics. But it doesn't mean that there's not something there to unearth.

I think the phrase we may hear most today from Hillary Clinton is "as I've said before."

Who is the onus on here, Axe? Is it on Clinton to justify herself? Or is it on the committee?

AXELROD: It's a really interesting question, because I think both of them are on the spot. She for obvious reasons.

The committee because of what Kevin McCarthy said in suggesting that the mission was to take her poll numbers down. Another Republican member chimed in on that same subject. And I think, Chris, while you're right that these things are inherently political.

[08:25:02] I don't think there is anybody on the planet who believes that 17 months later, we'd be still holding hearings on Benghazi if Hillary Clinton weren't a candidate for president.

CAMEROTA: Yes, I --

AXELROD: And so -- go ahead, Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: Well, this does in fact reflect on her campaign for president. And the reason I interrupted you is because we have polling about that, about how Americans think that they're connected.

The question was, does the way Hillary Clinton handled e-mail -- OK? So, that's what the Benghazi investigation has morphed into it -- an important indicator of her ability to serve as president? Yes, 54 percent of people say. That's up from March when only 46 believed yes.

So, this does have ramifications for her as a candidate?

AXELROD: There's no question about it. I mean, I'm not suggesting that they are on -- they're determined to, as McCarthy said, bring her poll numbers down. But that doesn't mean that these aren't -- there aren't some legitimate issues here. And how she handles them today will be important. She can put these things behind her in many ways today with a good, solid strong performance. If she unwittingly opens up new areas of the investigation, that would be a problematic.

CUOMO: Well, they keep pointing to the fact that they have emails and documents that nobody has ever had before. Congressman Pompeo (INAUDIBLE) fair to say that no way did any other body that looked at this had the facts for them. Do you think that's a fair comparison?

AXELROD: Well, they're going to have to -- you know, we'll find out today exactly what they have and what it amounts to. Is there a lot of smoke or is there something here? And I think that as I said earlier, as you suggested, the committee itself has to mind its P's and Q's here. Because if it appears they are trying to overblow facts or push this in a direction that isn't warranted by the facts, there is going to be a lot of blowback from that.

I think Democrats are in large numbers of the mind that is a wholly political exercise and are dismissive of it. There are some implications for the general election, how she answers these questions and particularly among independent voters and whether they feel she's been forthright. But if the committee oversteps, it's for her a free pass in some ways.

CAMEROTA: David, let's talk about Joe Biden and the big news yesterday he was not going run. He took the opportunity to announce he was not going to run for president to make what some considered a campaign speech. So let me play for you a little excerpt of that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOSEPH BIDEN, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I believe we have to end the divisive partisan politics ripping this country apart. And I think we can. It's mean-spirited. It is petty. And it's gone on for much too long.

I don't believe like some do that it's naive to talk to Republicans. I don't think we should look at Republicans as our enemies. They are opposition. They are not our enemies.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMEROTA: David, what did you think he was doing with that speech?

AXELROD: Well, I think you know what he was doing with that speech. Or that particular -- that was an obvious reference to what Hillary had said in the debate in which she listed the Republicans among her enemies. And it was an odd thing to do in the debate because the closing statement as all about building bridges and getting things to work better and bringing people together.

So, it was probably a poor choice on her part, although, as you remember, it played very well in a room full of Democrats. I think Biden was giving her a little poke.

Look, I think you're right, the speech, it was an announcement speech bracketed by the declaration of the non-candidacy. And, you know, clearly he wanted to run but couldn't find his way there and there wasn't room for him in the race. I think there is a level of frustration about that, because it's only natural for a guy been around as long as he has, who's done the things he's done, who's been a partner of the president, who's been a champion of the middle class to say, why her and not me.

And I think it's bubbling over in places and that was one of them in that speech.

CAMEROTA: David Axelrod, thanks so much. Great to get your insight before the Benghazi hearing today.

AXELROD: Good to be with you, guys. Good to see you.

CUOMO: Another big story this morning is the search of El Chapo. We're going to be telling you some stuff about that. But also front runner no more.

CAMEROTA: Hmm.

CUOMO: Donald Trump, look he's ahead big. But we're talking specifically about Iowa. You got Ben Carson has flipped the script on Trump and is now leading.

And guess what? We also have the undercard there GOP Lindsey Graham slamming both of them. And he joins us next to tell you why he must.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK