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GOP Presidential Candidate Campaign in Iowa; Interview with Donald Trump; Donald Trump's Comments on Bill Clinton Discussed; Former President Clinton Stumping for Hillary; Saudi Arabia Kicks Out Iranian Diplomats; Obama to Tighten Firearms Restrictions. Aired 8- 8:30a ET

Aired January 04, 2016 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[08:00:00] ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: Frontrunner Donald Trump starting out 2016 on the attack. You'll hear more from Chris' conversation with Trump that was earlier on NEW DAY. That's in just a moment. But first, let's go to Athena Jones. She's live in New Hampshire for us. What's the latest on the trail, Athena?

ATHENA JONES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Alisyn. Today does kick off a new phase in the campaign. The holidays are over. More voters are paying closer attention. We've seen these candidates span out, ramp up their activity. And in some cases, it's already gotten more heated and more personal on the campaign trail.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JONES: Just four weeks from the first contest in the 2016 presidential election.

DONALD TRUMP, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: If we win Iowa, I think we're going to win everything after that.

JONES: GOP candidates scrambling to build momentum ahead of the high-stakes Iowa caucuses. And this morning, the launch of Donald Trump's first campaign ad, touting his controversial platform.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That's why he's calling for a temporary shutdown of Muslims entering the United States, until we can figure out what's going on. He'll quickly cut the head off ISIS and take their oil.

JEB BUSH, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Donald Trump, I don't believe, is going to be the party's nominee. If he is, he's going to get crushed by Hillary Clinton.

JONES: As Jeb Bush grapples with dwindling poll numbers, Trump leads the pack, accusing his biggest Iowa rival Ted Cruz of copying his immigration plan.

TRUMP: He said, we will build a wall, the first time I've ever heard him saying it. and I'm the one who came up with him.

JONES: Trump slamming Cruz on religion in the battle over evangelical voters. TRUMP: Cuba generally speaking is a Catholic country, and you

don't equate evangelicals with Cuba.

BILL CLINTON, FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT: She's the best qualified person for the job.

JONES: And as President Clinton readies to hit the campaign trail, Trump taking digs at Secretary Clinton, drudging up her husband's past, tweeting Saturday, "I hope Bill Clinton starts talking about women's issues so that voters can see what a hypocrite he is, and how Hillary abused those women." And Sunday night, tweeting, "The worst thing Hillary can do is have her husband campaign for her. Just watch."

After appearing in this terror propaganda video, Trump pointing the finger back at his Democratic rival in front of a crowd in Biloxi.

TRUMP: Hillary Clinton created ISIS with Obama.

JONES: Shrugging off what critics say is his anti-Muslim rhetoric.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

JONES: So we're likely to hear more of the same from Trump at his rally tonight. Meanwhile, Marco Rubio, who was hoping to become the anti-Trump alternative for GOP voters, he's set to speak here at any minute. He'll be making the case that he'll be strongest on national security. So a lot of action in New Hampshire and in Iowa in the weeks to come. We'll be following it all. Chris?

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: All right, Athena, thank you very much.

So let's get to the one-on-one with Donald Trump. We wanted to drill down a little bit deeper on a couple things, as opposed to throwing out tons of topics. Maybe deeper helps a little bit more than general. So what about the executive orders coming up on gun laws? What should be done? And what about what's relevant and not relevant about Bill Clinton? Here's what he had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TRUMP: I want to see what he says. I want to see why he couldn't get this approved by Congress. Why can't he go in and get this approved? You do have to ask that question, because why can't you, if something is seemingly cut and dry, as you'd like to say it is, why can't the system work the way it was supposed to be, you know, the way it was supposed to be working or the way it was designed? I mean, why isn't he getting the Republicans and Democrats together and doing something? Instead he keeps signing executive orders. He doesn't meet with people. He doesn't like people, I guess.

(LAUGHTER)

TRUMP: Maybe they could come up with some kind of a plan. But don't you think you should do this with Congress and the -- I don't think he works very hard at it, OK?

CUOMO: You say you're going to make America great again. Is part of making us great again getting back into the weeds with Bill Clinton and his sex life? That seems to be a big point of emphasis for you now. Why are you doing that?

TRUMP: Only because I was mentioned during the course of the debate nine times. None of the other candidates, Republican candidates, were mentioned at all. The last person that Hillary Clinton wants to run against, and I know this for a fact, because, as you know, I know many people on the Clinton side. I know people on both sides.

CUOMO: They were at your wedding.

TRUMP: I'm a businessman. I got along with everybody. I did well. Nobody did it better than me. I got along with everybody. And it was my obligation to my company and my family and myself to get along with Clinton and get along with every person that I needed to get along with.

CUOMO: It sounds like your morality shifts based on your motivation to people.

TRUMP: No, no. As one of the magazines recently said, Trump was -- I guess I'm not now because I'm supposed to be a politician but it's a bad name, being a politician, it's a little bit of a bad name to me, frankly, but I guess that's what I am. But when I was a businessman, they said I was a great businessman, a world-class businessman. I got along with Clinton and I got along with everybody. I got along with Harry Reid. I got along with everybody.

[08:05:07] CUOMO: Right. But I'm saying leadership is about consistency.

TRUMP: When I said --

CUOMO: You said it in your book "The Art of the Deal." In your most recent book, too, you talk about the consistency needed in leadership. One minute you said -- not one minute. Years ago, you said Monica Lewinsky, they shouldn't have chased after her like this. Bill Clinton's sex life shouldn't be an issue. Now you're saying it's one of the main issues. How is the voter supposed to see for that?

TRUMP: I tried to help him a little bit because it was important for me as secretary of state, as a senator, to have all these people on my side. I needed votes for things. I got many things done. I needed votes. And I would have these people on my side. So I wasn't going to get involved in the Monica Lewinsky thing, and I wouldn't get involved in it now.

CUOMO: You're bringing it up.

TRUMP: I don't really care about Monica Lewinsky other than I think Hillary was an enabler and a lot of things happened that were obviously very seedy. He was impeached for heaven's sake. He was impeached over this.

CUOMO: But that was a political process. The Senate wound up not going along with it. He wound up being one of the most popular presidents.

TRUMP: In one of the cases there was like a massive fine. I think his law degree was even taken away. He wasn't able to practice law. So obviously it was a big thing. But I would always stick up -- as a businessman, I would always stick up for various people, whether they were friends or not, because in many cases I needed them, I needed their votes to get things done.

CUOMO: So what you're saying is that back then when you needed them, you were OK with what Bill Clinton was doing. But now that you want to take votes from his wife, you're not OK with what he was doing?

TRUMP: You have to understand, they called me sexist. And all of a sudden --

CUOMO: They called you that because of what you said about women.

TRUMP: She comes out and starts going -- the reason that happened, Chris, it was very simple. The reason that happened is because I'm doing very well in the polls. In some polls, I'm beating her. I think I'm going to beat her easily if I get the nomination.

CUOMO: I understand. But you have to remember, the reason it happened is because of what you said during the first debate about women and how you went at it with Megyn Kelly and what you said about Carly Fiorina.

TRUMP: What did I do with Megyn Kelly? She asked me a totally inappropriate first question and I fought her. If a male asked me that same question, I would have hit him just as hard.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CAMEROTA: All right, a lot to dissect. Joining us this morning to react to Chris' interview with Donald Trump, Trump supporter, CNN political commentator and former Reagan White House political director Jeffrey Lord, and Jeb Bush supporter and CNN political commentator Ana Navarro. Great to see both of you. Ana, what did you hear this morning from Donald Trump that jumped out at you?

ANA NAVARRO, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: That last section about Bill Clinton and having been a defender of Bill Clinton and saying let's not get into the issues then, and doing what he's doing now, I actually thought was rather amusing and refreshingly transparent. He basically said, look, that was then. When I was a businessman, I behaved like a businessman. I sucked up to these people because I needed their support and I needed their vote. Now that I'm running, now that I'm a politician, I'm behaving like a politician. And I thought it was, frankly, blunt, honest, and refreshing. It almost made me chuckle. A first from Donald Trump. CAMEROTA: But he did more, Jeffrey, than just suck up to

politicians. He supported Bill Clinton. He said the GOP going after him was silly and it was ridiculous, and they shouldn't have gone after his sex life. In fact, just this past June, the day after Donald Trump announced he was getting into this race, he was on a different morning show, and he talked about how Bill Clinton is one of his favorite past presidents. Watch this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Of the four, who is the best?

TRUMP: Well --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Bush 41, Clinton, Bush 43, or Obama?

TRUMP: I would really say Clinton probably. I would have to say Clinton.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why?

TRUMP: There was a little spirit. He could -- frankly, had he not met Monica, had he not met Paula, had he not met various and sundry somewhat beautiful women, he would have had a much better deal going.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMEROTA: Jeffrey, that does not sound like how he is now framing Bill Clinton as an abuser of women.

JEFFREY LORD, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: One of two things here. Art Laffer who was a Reagan adviser and one of the godfathers of Reaganomics said that he voted for President Clinton twice because he thought he was essentially keeping Reaganomics ongoing, which certainly a lot conservatives or Reagan supporters in the day felt about President Clinton strictly in terms of his economic policy.

But in terms of the rest of it, look, it's the other side that began this whole meme of the war on women. This is something they brought up in that context. Hillary Clinton herself, if you remember the so-called mattress girl from Columbia University who carried this mattress around everywhere she went as a sign that she'd been raped, Hillary Clinton put out a statement praising her and all of this kind of thing.

[08:10:05] CAMEROTA: Hillary Clinton is against sexual assault, what does that have to do with the fact that Donald Trump supported Bill Clinton and dismissed his past sex life with women as being irrelevant?

LORD: Yes, but we're in a culture, Alisyn, right now where rape is considered to be a very big deal. President Obama went on -- if you remember, we had Todd Akin --

NAVARRO: It is a very big deal, Jeffrey. It's not considered to be a very big deal. Rape is a very big deal.

CAMEROTA: Well, exactly. I'm in total agreement, Ana. My point is when Todd Akin was out there talking about legitimate rape the whole world came down on him. I did, justifiably. President Obama went on Jay Leno's show and said rape is rape. It's a crime.

CAMEROTA: So why did Donald Trump in June support Bill Clinton?

LORD: -- not getting the same treatment as the Cosby accusers. Why not?

CAMEROTA: Why did Donald Trump support Bill Clinton and laugh it off in June? That was six months ago.

NAVARRO: Donald Trump -- let me tell you this, Donald Trump has changed his mind on so many things. Whether it's single payer, whether it's guns, whether it's, you know, his view of Obama, his view of Clinton, his view of Hillary. You name it, he's changed his view, and it hasn't had an effect with him. He has been able to get away with it.

Why is he doing this? First of all, because we're talking about it. Donald Trump is a master at staying in the headlines, at maintaining himself in the press, getting free media. Second of all, because it hits a nerve with some people in the Republican base. They like to see a candidate who is going to bring it to Hillary, who is not afraid of not being politically correct.

And, you know, third of all, because whenever you hit Donald Trump, he will hit you back. Do I like it? Not a little bit. I'm not interested in reading or hearing about Donald Trump's divorces or Donald Trump's personal life. I'm not interested in Hillary Clinton being called an enabler for her husband's faux pas and her husband's problems and issues with women. I think that a lot of women are going to find that troubling. But Donald Trump is not thinking long term. He's thinking, how do I win the primary now? And it strikes a nerve. Some people in the Republican base, like what he's saying.

LORD: It does show a willingness to fight back, and I think that underlies it. Not just on this issue but a lot of issues.

CUOMO: Strength is often exhibited in different ways. Sometimes restraint is strength. Sometimes tact is strength. And what you do winds up being examined. You can change a tax policy. You can change about guns. People's feelings change about things as they get older, at least we would hope they would. But not morality issues. Morality is different, Jeffrey. That would be my strategic concern here for team Trump that you're on is that he's not saying, I feel differently about potential rape allegations now than I used to. That's not going to wash, certainly not in Iowa and with a big part of the country. Don't you have to own what's right and wrong in your heart and not just jump to what's convenient?

LORD: Chris, are you suggesting to me that Donald Trump has ever said rape is a good thing? CAMEROTA: He laughed it off. Whenever you talk about Bill

Clinton's past, however you want to frame it, he laughed it off in June, and now he's saying that he's one of the biggest --

CUOMO: And no is the answer to your question. I'm not saying he's joking about rape.

NAVARRO: Chris, Chris --

CUOMO: I'm saying that he's showing a political convenience that may make you question whether or not you can depend on him on core issue going forward.

NAVARRO: Chris --

LORD: Let me --

NAVARRO: Chris, this cuts both ways, though. And everyone who is running for office feels basically the same way. Just a few years ago, Bill and Hillary were at Donald Trump's wedding. Now they call him disgusting. Now Hillary Clinton goes after him. They're running against each other. Things change when you're running against each other when you're in an election.

LORD: Exactly.

NAVARRO: I think part of what he's trying to do, Donald Trump, is draw out Bill Clinton. I think it is going to take restraint for Bill Clinton, who gets sensitive when people attack his wife, who is very defensive of Hillary, to maintain his restraint and not enter the ring with Donald Trump. I believe he's not going to do it this time. That was something he had trouble with in 2008, but I think Bill has learned his lesson. I think this is a long-term problem for Republicans, focusing on this issue. And I want to focus on how Hillary was as secretary of state, her management skills, her legislative history. I don't want to focus on these issues dealing with her husband from 20 years ago.

CAMEROTA: OK, it will be interesting to see how Bill Clinton responds to all of this. Ana, thank you, Jeffrey, thank you. Great to talk to both of you.

LORD: Thanks, guys.

CAMEROTA: Michaela?

MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN ANCHOR: All right, so as we were just talking about there, Hillary Clinton is going to use her not secret weapon, her husband, out on the campaign trail. Former president Bill Clinton about to make his first solo stop out there for her.

[08:15:00] Let's bring in CNN senior political correspondent Brianna Keilar, joining us live from Nashua, New Hampshire.

What do you think is going to look like, especially with some of this conversation going on, with pundits on TV? BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes. That's

really the big question. Is he going to address this? We don't expect that he's going to, but Bill Clinton will be headlining two events here in New Hampshire today.

The first is here at the National Community College. The second will be a little later in the day at Exeter. And this also comes one day after Hillary Clinton was campaigning here in the granite state, where she had one of the more contentious moments that she's had out on the campaign trail. G.O.P. state lawmaker heckling her about, yes, Bill Clinton's past improprieties. And here's how she responded.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Right back there, this man right there in -- here we go, right there. You are very rude, and I'm not ever going to call on you. Thank you.

(APPLAUSE)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: But these issues that Donald Trump is making about Bill Clinton's past aside, he's very popular. His standing, his approval rating, stands nationally at about 60 percent. So he's trying to bring some of his popularity here to New Hampshire for his wife.

And this is also a state that, I think you can say, has a place in his heart. It is what gave him a key second place finish back in 1992. Really sort of salvaging his chances for the presidency and, ultimately, of course, he was successful. But Hillary Clinton having a really tough time here in New Hampshire. It's been the toughest race against Bernie Sanders.

She and Bernie Sanders have been going back and forth in the polls since this summer. Very close. Bill Clinton is trying to help -- guys?

CAMEROTA: OK, Brianna, thanks so much for all of that. We do want to get to some breaking news right now, because the United Arab Emirates downgrading diplomatic ties with Iran this morning. The move follows Bahrain and Saudi Arabia who severed ties with Iran after an attack on the Saudi embassy in Tehran.

Tensions between the countries boiling over after Iranian protester storm the Saudi Embassy in Tehran in the wake of a prominent Shiite cleric's execution.

CNN's international diplomatic editor Nic Robertson following the very latest for us from London.

Nic?

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: There is a lot in play here. We've just heard from Bahrain. They are also cutting diplomatic ties with Iran. That's kind of no surprise because Bahrain has really become a sort of a smaller cousin to Saudi Arabia recently, particularly since the Arab Spring.

But what has happened over the weekend, you have the two major powers in the gulf region, Iran and Saudi Arabia, escalating tensions, already fighting a proxy war in Yemen. They are already fighting a proxy in Syria. The United States for one was hoping that they could at least work out a peace deal that was on the table and that was being worked on in Yemen. That's fallen by the wayside. The cease fire has collapsed over the weekend. Syria, the same deal.

Peace talks coming up. The chances of securing peace there now seem unlikely. What has happened? The Saudis pulled out all their diplomats from Tehran over the weekend after their embassy was torched. They blamed -- the Saudis blamed provocation by the Iranian leadership saying that the Iranians are trying to escalate tension in the region. They've given Iranian diplomats in Saudi Arabia 48 hours to get out of the country. The Iranians for their part say that Saudi Arabia is escalating this because of domestic tensions inside Saudi Arabia.

And it all came about after Saudi Arabia executed an outspoken Shiite cleric who supporters say that he was calling for the peaceful overthrow of the Saudi Royal family in Saudi Arabia. The Saudis, however, say that he was fermenting terrorism within the country. And this is the reason why he was executed. It shows a tough new line by the relatively new king in Saudi Arabia, escalate tensions, dangerous time, powerful countries in the gulf.

Back to you.

CUOMO: Nic, thank you very much.

We also want to tell you this morning about a massive manhunt underway in Israel. Authorities searching for a gunman, who killed two people, wounded eight others at a bar in Tel Aviv on Friday. Police have identified the suspect as Nashat Melhem. The Israeli Arab man's uncle tells CNN, the family recognized him from surveillance footage and immediately contacted police.

PEREIRA: A deadly earthquake rock Northeast India overnight, killing at least five people, injuring dozens more. Those numbers are expected to rise. Rescue efforts are being hampered this morning by powering communications outages. The 6.8-magnitude quake damage buildings across the region. We're told it could be felt in parts of Bangladesh, Bhutan and Myanmar.

CAMEROTA: All right. Hold off on those retirement plans. No one won last night's $334 million Powerball jackpot. That means the next drawing Wednesday night could be worth $400 million. Now your odds of winning the big prize are about 1 in 300 million. But let's ignore that for the moment. The largest Powerball jackpot ever is $590 million. It was won by an 84-year-old Florida woman in 2013, who was allowed by another customer to cut the line.

[08:20:05] PEREIRA: That's going to be a tough pill to swallow.

CAMEROTA: That's great. PEREIRA: Oh, can you imagine?

CAMEROTA: That's great. Aren't we doing a poll?

PEREIRA: Well, we are now. Fellows, let's get that organized, yes.

CAMEROTA: What's going on?

PEREIRA: Nothing. Nothing from anybody. We're the only ones.

(CROSSTALK)

CUOMO: Will that make you less likely to let someone cut in front of you to buy a Powerball.

CAMEROTA: No, I would still let somebody. It was fate. She was supposed to win it, I believe.

PEREIRA: Exactly.

CAMEROTA: I don't know what you did with the money, but I will try to find out.

CUOMO: Are you buying what Camerota is saying right now? Or do you think that you'd be more off when you get a kick in the pants than a quick seat to the register. That's a question for you.

President Obama is about to take executive action to push for tighter gun control. What do we know about what he wants to do? And will it make a difference? Answers ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CAMEROTA: President Obama's anticipated executive action on gun control is getting praise from Democrats and harsh criticism from Republicans. The president has been calling for stricter gun control for years but has been unable to get any legislation through Congress. So what now?

Let's bring in CNN political commentator and professor at Morehouse College Marc Lamont Hill and CNN political comments and host of the "Ben Ferguson Show," Ben Ferguson.

Gentleman, thanks so much for being here.

MARC LAMONT HILL, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Good morning.

CAMEROTA: Happy New Year to both of you.

BEN FERGUSON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Happy New Year.

HILL: Happy New Year.

CAMEROTA: OK, let me tell you what CNN has learned about what the president will be announcing this week. Here's what we know. He aims to close the, quote, "gun show loophole," which allows some dealers to sell without a license or conducting background checks, and includes new funding for government agencies to enforce existing laws.

Ben, what's so radical about these two things?

[08:24:57] FERGUSON: It's not -- I don't have a problem, for example, with more funding to go after people that are breaking the law with guns. I think the problem is the way he's selling this. He's implying that, somehow, this is going to stop mass shootings when we know that not one of these mass shootings would have been stopped with this executive action, if he would have done this on his first day in office seven years ago.

This is a push for gun control in the name of we're going to stop mass shootings. That is not the reality here. And we're also not dealing with the real issue and that is mental health. And that's the part that I think is the most frustrating. There is an appetite from conservatives to deal with mental health and guns and, yet, he's not even looking at that. He's simply trying to build on his legacy of, I'm the guy that's going to be tough on guns. This is not a national security issue. This is not a issue that is going to keep us safer.

And I should be able to inherit a gun from a family member without having to go through paperwork with the government or trade with an uncle or a cousin. That's the majority of people that trade guns. It's usually within a family. This is not an issue.

CAMEROTA: Right. I mean, yes, Ben, you're in the minority on that one because, let me just pull up a poll. The latest Quinnipiac poll, this is from last month, would you support or oppose a law requiring background checks on people buying guns at gun shows or online. This is the "gun show loophole." 89 percent of the country supports closing the "gun show loophole."

So that's what he's basing this on.

HILL: Exactly.

CAMEROTA: You know, Marc -

(CROSSTALK)

FERGUSON: Well --

CAMEROTA: OK, go ahead, Ben, you respond to that.

(CROSSTALK)

FERGUSON: It all depends on how you ask that question. Most people are in favor of background checks but we already have background checks. If you ask a question and polled the same people and said, do you think you should be able to inherit a gun from your grandfather without having to go through the government to check and fill out the paperwork, they would also say that.

(CROSSTALK)

CAMEROTA: Right. So this one is talking about gun shows.

FERGUSON: I think most people are --

(CROSSTALK)

CAMEROTA: Right, but this one was talking about gun shows.

(CROSSTALK)

But Mark, I want to get to you now, because two -- hold on --

HILL: A couple things, yes.

CAMEROTA: OK, go ahead.

HILL: OK, because those are competing claims. You can on the one hand want background checks and still want to inherit a gun from your grandfather. And the issue isn't whether you get the gun from your grandfather, it's whether or not your grandfather is giving a gun to someone who may have domestic violence background. Someone who may have a criminal background. Someone who may have mental health issues. I want to respond to everything that Ben said.

The first thing is the president has very much been adamant about wanting mental health checks. In fact, when he made the first announcement about this a year ago after the last tragic shooting and once again at the beginning of this year, he said mental health should be on the table. So that has not been an issue.

With regard to the gun show loophole, this doesn't actually close the gun show loophole. You can only close the gun show loophole through, you know, thorough congressional action. What you can do is make the loophole a little bit smaller by expanding the idea of what constitutes a gun dealer. In other words, more people will have to register as gun dealers and more people will need background checks. That's what the president is proposing.

The president has never suggests and most of us have never suggested that this will stop mass shootings. Yes, I admit that after a mass shooting, we tend to use it as a --

FERGUSON: Mark --

HILL: Let me finish, Ben.

FERGUSON: Mark, he's talked about this still in mass shootings.

(CROSSTALK)

HILL: Ben, just let me finish the point. You realize you're disagreeing with the wrong thing. I agree with you that after mass shootings, we tend to use that as an opportunity to talk about gun control. And, I'm saying, I agree with you that this would not stop a mass shooting. We agree on that so we don't have to argue on a point we agree on. What I'm saying, though, is that it doesn't negate the fact that this will stop shootings. It will make us safer.

And this isn't just about getting more people bureaucracy, it's not about taking away people's guns, it's about stopping a person with a history of domestic violence from killing their partner because that's the biggest chance that someone would get killed is with a gun.

(CROSSTALK)

FERGUSON: This is the false narrative that bothers me. We already have laws on the books that deal with the issues that you just describe. For example, as a family member, you are not allowed to give a gun -- let me finish, you are not allowed to give a gun to someone that is a convicted felon. If you have not committed a crime, it is OK for you to own a weapon. It's the problem that we had with these mass shootings.

We had people that had mental health warnings, but we do not have a law to deal with them. And so to act as if this legislation, or I should say this executive action and going around Congress, is somehow going to keep us safe, it's just a flat out lie. We already have...

(CROSSTALK)

HILL: Ben --

FERGUSON: ...the laws on the books to deal with people that are convicted felons and not getting a gun.

CAMEROTA: OK, go ahead, Marc.

HILL: Here's the flaw on that argument. You're saying that we already have a law that stops it. Laws don't stop people from breaking laws. That's like saying, well, killing is illegal so, you know, we should have problems --

(CROSSTALK)

CAMEROTA: Then why are we adding another one? You're making my point for me. Columbine, there was more than 100 laws.

(CROSSTALK)

CAMEROTA: Hold on, Ben. Hold on, Ben. You asked a question. Go ahead, Mark, answer it. So why do we need another one?

(CROSSTALK)

HILL: Let me answer your question, Ben. We're not adding more laws. We're adding more provisions so people don't get access to the gun. Laws punish people for breaking the law.

I'm saying -- let me finish, Ben, I'm saying that If we add a background check, then people don't get access to the guns as easily so they can't shoot people as easily. Yes, I'm all for laws that punish people for shooting people. I'm saying, prophylactically, let's engage this. Let's step in ahead of time and stop them from getting the gun.

CAMEROTA: OK, so, Ben -- FERGUSON: Again, not one of these shootings would have been

stopped by this law.

CAMEROTA: Yes, but you're talking about -- look, but now Ben, you are talking about mass shootings whereas what Mark is saying is that some shootings will be if you make sure that there are universal background checks, some shootings would be stopped by that. You wouldn't give everyone a gun who ends up getting their hands on it and so maybe you could prevent a handful of shootings.

(CROSSTALK)