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New Day

Embassy Attack Retaliation; Temperatures Drop in Northeast; Armed Occupation at Oregon Wildlife Refuge. Aired 8:30-9a ET

Aired January 04, 2016 - 08:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[08:30:00] ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: Some shootings will be. If you make sure that there are universal background checks -

MARC LAMONT HILL, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: A whole bunch of them.

CAMEROTA: Some shootings would be stopped by that. You wouldn't give everyone a gun who ends up getting their hands on it and so maybe you could prevent a handful of shootings.

BEN FERGUSON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, and -

CAMEROTA: Maybe you could prevent dozens, hundreds.

FERGUSON: And I would say - I would say, show me the data that correlates with that to - this idea that people that are going to go out and kill people or break laws are somehow going to gun shows and getting these guns there, the facts do not back that up. They're buying them on the black market illegally anyway. Many of these people, already convicted felons, have lost the right to own a gun. That's my whole point about what the president's doing.

HILL: Yes.

FERGUSON: This is a feel good moment for him and his legacy that's not actually going to make us safer.

CAMEROTA: OK.

FERGUSON: If you want to deal with this issue, the president should say, I'm going to take executive action on mental health issues and work with Congress, instead of going around Congress. Also, he can check a box with his legacy to say, I did something.

CAMEROTA: Yes. OK. We're going to leave it there because obviously we could talk about this for hours.

HILL: Oh, Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: Ben, Marc, thank you. But, Marc, you're going to be happy to hear this next thing.

FERGUSON: Thanks.

CAMEROTA: There's a special programming note to tell you about because this Thursday at 8:00 p.m., President Obama will join Anderson Cooper for an exclusive live town hall event about guns in America, where all of these issues and questions are sure to come up. Among other things, he will discuss the executive action on guns that he's expected to announce this week. He will also take questions from a live studio audience about this. A town hall on guns in America with President Obama, moderated by Anderson Cooper this Thursday night, 8:00 p.m., only on CNN.

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: Elsewhere in the world, tensions between Saudi Arabia and Iran have reached a tipping point. The Saudis deciding to cut ties with more countries following suit. What does that mean for the two biggest Persian Gulf players, and how will the rift impact the U.S.? Answers ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:35:12] MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN ANCHOR: So breaking news this morning, more countries cutting ties with Iran after protesters attacked the Saudi embassy in Tehran. The United Arab Emirates downgrading their diplomatic relations after Bahrain and Saudi Arabia severed ties with Iran. Iranian diplomats have been told they have 48 hours to leave the kingdom. The embassy attack in retaliation for Saudi Arabia's execution of 47 prisoners, including a revered Shiite Muslim cleric who was critical of the Saudi government.

Joining us now to discuss all of this and the ramifications of it all is CNN chief international correspondent and host of CNNI's "AMANPOUR," Christiane Amanpour.

Happy New Year to you, my love. Really great to have you.

I think context and understanding of what went on here is really important. We've watched how these protests have erupted pretty much around sectarian lines. We've seen Sunni countries, the UAE and Bahrain applauding Saudi Arabia for killing what they call the terrorists. Meanwhile, Iran and other Shia nations in the region, like Yemen, Lebanon, Iraq, they condemned the killing of what they call the peaceful dissident. Give us some context to who this cleric was and why he was so significant.

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, here's the context of who the cleric was. He is an anti-monarchy activist. Look, he's a Shiite. He has been an activist for the right of the Shiites in Saudi Arabia who, as you know, are a minority and have been clamped down upon by the majority Sunni kingdom of Saudi Arabia. So these people, along with the whole other Arab Spring protesters during 2011, did rise up, did want to have more rights, did want to jump on that Arab Spring bandwagon and they were pushed down.

This man was one of their leaders. However, he has always claimed that he never advocated violence. And to whit (ph), the United States, Europe, the U.N., all have condemned his execution.

It happened, very cleverly from the Saudi perspective, along with actual convicted terrorists.

PEREIRA: Right. AMANPOUR: So they lumped them all in together and did this.

PEREIRA: But -

AMANPOUR: Now, from the Iranian perspective, storming an embassy is totally wrong, totally against international law, and that's why people are really angry about that.

PEREIRA: But how could the - it be seen as anything other than a provocation by the part of Saudi Arabia, given what is going on in the region?

AMANPOUR: Well, precisely. What's going on in the region has revolved around these two axis, basically Iran representing the Shiite and Saudi Arabia representing the Sunnis in the region, in the Islamic world. We know that the Sunnis are the overwhelming majority, about 85 percent of the world's Muslims are Sunnis. The rest to mostly Shiites. But Shiism really is Iran, it's Saudi - it's, rather, Afghanistan and Iraq. That's where the majority of the world's Shiites are. The rest of the Islamic world is Sunni.

And you've had these historic tensions between Saudi Arabia and Iran that go back decades. You've had severing of ties before. And particularly Saudi Arabia is really angry about Iran right now because it doesn't like the nuclear deal that Iran struck with the United States and the rest of the world powers.

PEREIRA: Right. Right.

AMANPOUR: It doesn't want to think that Iran is gaining its international credibility, gaining its international heavyweight and coming back into the community of nations, especially on the oil producing front. And Saudi Arabia worries that Iran will continue to push its interests, supporting Shiite majorities in its country, in Bahrain and elsewhere.

So these historic, you know, tensions -

PEREIRA: Right.

AMANPOUR: And not to mention the fact that both sides, both Iran and Saudi Arabia, are on different sides of the Syria civil war, the Yemen civil war and what's going on in Iraq as well.

PEREIRA: Well, then you throw in America in all of this. How does it stand for America? Because America, obviously an ally of Saudi Arabia, often criticized of sort of favorable response to Saudi Arabian actions, but also working with Iran on this nuclear deal. How does it stand - how does it all shake out for the U.S.?

AMANPOUR: Well, the U.S. is a little bit, you know, between a rock and a hard place. Obviously it's condemned the execution, but it's also condemned the tensions, the storming of the embassy in Tehran, and is trying to get all sides to calm tensions. We're not quite clear how and who and what forces will be those who mediate, if it's possible.

PEREIRA: Yes.

AMANPOUR: The Russian state media has said that Russia will try to mediate between Iran and Saudi Arabia. But the U.S. - here's - there's a fact right now. The United States has gathered Saudi Arabia, Iran and all the interested parties in this Syria conflict. We've had the Vienna talks, right? They were meant to all come together, all exert influence on all those who they could, and try to stop this war and move it towards a political resolution. Well, it hasn't really worked out.

PEREIRA: Right.

AMANPOUR: You know, the fighting has continued. So there's only a limited amount the United States can do.

PEREIRA: Yes.

AMANPOUR: But, you know, this is - this is a very bad situation for the Middle East in general, to have these two power centers pitted against each other.

[08:40:15] PEREIRA: Right. We're so appreciative to you for the context. We'll talk about this more, I'm sure, in the coming days and weeks. Thanks so much, Christiane. Good to see you.

Alisyn.

AMANPOUR: Thanks, Michaela.

CAMEROTA: OK, Michaela.

Protesters reportedly packing plenty of fire power and vowing to stand their ground at a federal wildlife refuge in Oregon. CNN just spoke with the group's leader. What's their next move?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PEREIRA: All right, here we go with the five things to know for your NEW DAY.

At number one, four weeks until the Iowa caucuses. Donald Trump, Ted Cruz, the rest of the candidates beginning that final push before the first votes are cast in the 2016 presidential race.

President Obama meeting with Attorney General Lynch this afternoon, putting the finishing touches on his new gun control executive orders. The president plans to unveil those new measures as early as tomorrow.

The United Arab Emirates downgrading diplomatic relations with Iran after Bahrain and Saudi Arabia severed ties. Tensions boiling over after Iranian protesters stormed the Saudi embassy in Tehran in the wake of a prominent Shiite cleric's execution.

Seemingly no end in sight to the armed occupation of a federal building in a national wildlife refuge in Oregon. Anti-government protesters angry over the treatment of two ranchers who report to prison today on arson charges.

Camille Cosby scheduled to testify Wednesday in a lawsuit brought by seven women who claim they were sexually assaulted by her husband, the - Bill - Bill Cosby. The wife of the comedian tried unsuccessfully to avoid being deposed.

For more on the five things to know, be sure to visit newdaycnn.com.

All right, to weather now. The potential for deadly flooding is threatening millions from Illinois all the way to Louisiana. Meanwhile, temperatures drop in the northeast. We're finally getting some of that winter weather every loves so much.

[08:45:07] Our meteorologist Jennifer Gray is looking at all of the forecasts. Look at that map. My word.

JENNIFER GRAY, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Yes. Better late than never.

PEREIRA: Yes.

GRAY: We are finally seeing winter return to the Northeast. In fact, temperatures with this latest push of cold air, finally getting below freezing in the New York City area. 29 degrees right now. Also getting a couple of flurries around the city, as well. It's not going to last too long. About two days, then milder air will start pushing in and temperatures will get back above normal.

So we will see temperatures back around 43 degrees by Wednesday. Look at D.C., you do enjoy a couple of cooler days, and the temperature is back at 44 degrees by the middle part of the week. We are still looking at flooding across the Midwest. We aren't going to see records shattered, or at least we shouldn't, but we are still going to see some flooding along the Mississippi River. We are going to see, for the next couple of weeks, it make its way down to the Mississippi area, even south Louisiana.

So Alisyn, over the next couple of weeks, we are going to still be watching it very, very closely.

CAMEROTA: Okay. We know you will be, Jennifer. Thanks so much for that update.

Well armed protesters in Oregon seizing a federal wildlife refuge. Next on NEW DAY, we'll hear from the leader of that group. What's their plan?

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[08:50:09] CAMEROTA: There's an impasse in rural Oregon where armed protesters are still in control of a building on a federal wildlife refuge. The group upset over the federal government's treatment of local ranchers. Authorities have yet to confront them, but schools in the area are shut down for the week.

So with the latest on the occupation, let's bring in CNN's Sara Sidner. She's live in Burns, Oregon. And Sara, we understand that you've just spoken with the leader of the group. What did you learn?

SARA SIDNER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's right. We basically asked, how long are they going to be here? What are they demanding from the government? They said they're demanding land rights. They feel like the government, the federal government in particular, has overstepped its bounds. How long are they going to be here? They said weeks, months, years, whatever it takes. And how will they defend themselves if the federal government comes and decides to try and raid the area they've taken over? Here's what they had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SIDNER: Is everybody armed that's with you?

AMMON BUNDY, ARMED MILITARY MEMBER: I don't know that everybody is. I know I have (ph) been carrying arms. So I don't feel like I'm an immediate threat. But I do feel that if we, as a people, and I'm talking about across America, if we are not armed, then those that are trying to take our rights will take advantage of that.

SIDNER: Are you willing to die for what you believe in here?

BUNDY: I don't know that I've ever acknowledged that, but I want you to understand that. I have six children. From the ages 13 to 11 months old. I have a beautiful wife. I have -- I love where I live. I have a business with close to 25 employees. I don't want to die.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SIDNER: Now initially, they came to this area. They are not from Oregon itself. They're from out of state. They came to the area because of a family called the Hammonds. A father and son who were ranchers who were basically taken to jail, sent to prison for arson, on arson charges. They say that what happened to them was unfair and they came here in their name. But the attorney for the Hammonds has said that, indeed, they do not speak for the Hammonds. The Hammonds are turning themselves in. They're going back to prison.

We do want to mention this, though. Out here, we're about 30 miles from town, and these folks, Ammon Bundy says, I don't understand why they closed down the schools. We're not being violent, we're not hurting anybody. But they certainly have arms. And there is someone posted in a tower just behind me, there's a couple of guys posted at the beginning of the property so that you can't just easily go down to the headquarters. But they say look, there is nobody is here, we're not hurting anyone, but we're going to stand our group.

Chris.

CUOMO: Well then that's the problem. If they stand their ground and it's not their ground, what happens when they're asked to vacate it? That's why the schools are closed.

All right. Sara, stay with us. Do me a favor. Let's bring in another journalist who is covering this story. Visited the compound yesterday. He is political reporter for the "Oregonian," Ian Kullgren,. Ian, thanks for joining us.

You went inside the compound. Let me get your take on the mood and motivation, you know. Part of what's going on now is how we define this. We did this the last time the Bundys popped up in the news. We wound up talking a lot with Clive and Bundy then about what he saw as violations of state sovereignty. What would you say the mood and motivation is inside that compound?

IAN KULLGREN, POLITICS REPORTER, THE ORGEONIAN: Well, I think the mood and motivations are very similar to what they were last time, really just sort of sparked by a different incident, you could say. They feel like the federal government has overstepped its boundaries here. You know, this is kind of the culmination of a lot of tension, I think, between this specific group of people and, you know, what they see as abuses with the federal government. I think it's important to note, to the best of my knowledge, no locals are actually inside the compound as well.

CUOMO: No locals are inside the compound, meaning what?

KULLGREN: No locals from the Burns area are inside the compound. As best I know, these are all people from out of state. They are from Nevada, like the Bundys. I talked to a man yesterday from Arizona who gave me a tour of the compound, who is friends with the Bundys. His ranch was -- is just next door to the Bundys, inside the Arizona line, or so he told me. So it seems to be a group of people who are not really from around here, who are mostly carrying this out.

CUOMO: All right. Helpful and complicates it a bit. Sara, you know, you and I spent time covering lots of different types of unrest recently. The word "thugs" was applied when you had black protesters and some of those protests got violent. We deal with what makes someone a terrorist, if they're using arms to send a frightening motivation to a government or a people. These people have been called "ranchers" thus far. How do you think they qualify?

[08:55:10] SIDNER: Well, here's the thing. So I asked them that question. I said, you're being called all sorts of different names online. The way African-Americans see it is that when they protest, if they are -certainly if they're armed and certainly if they took over a building, that this place would be crawling with police officers. That's their take. They've also been called, these folks here, the Bundys, "y'all Qaeda" and "vanilla ISIS." We've seen that all over the internet.

So I asked them about that. I said, what do you think about people saying that basically you're terrorists? And they said, no, we're patriots, we're simply trying to get the federal government to follow the Constitution. And so that's how they see themselves. How others people see them is different. And the way they're being treated, when you look at the difference between, for example, a protest with mostly African-Americans, is quite different.

I also do want to say though, where they are is different, as well. We are out 30 miles from anywhere. There's nothing around us but wilderness, Chris. And their point is, we're not interfering with anybody except for the federal government and we are going to stand our ground. How that is going to be responded to, we will wait and see. We do understand that they're going to set up a command center, the sheriff's department, the feds know about what's going on, but they have been here now for two days now, going on three, and have been holding this land here. Normally, they're off on the weekends. But you know, it is Monday and we're going to have to wait and see how the federal government and the FBI responds to this, Chris.

CUOMO: And Ian Kullgren, you have reported that they're saying they're going to be there for the long haul. They have been letting in reporters, at least you guys getting access to them. Let's see if it continues. It's always good to have communications with people, especially in a situation like this. Both of you stay safe. I know that there's not a big security presence there. We expect that to change. We believe the authorities are coming in. Sara, thank you very much. Ian, as well. Both of you, be safe.

So there is news on that front. Will there be a surrender this morning, as there's supposed to be? If not, what happens? A lot happening in the news cycle. So we're going to pick up with the "NEWSROOM" and Deb Feyerick in for Carol Costello right after this break. See you then.

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