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Poll of Polls: Clinton, Sanders Tied in Iowa; Cruz-Trump Feud Gets Ugly; Americans Freed in Iran Swap Now in Germany; Clinton, Sanders Spar Over Wall Street. Aired 7-7:30a ET

Aired January 18, 2016 - 07:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I just can't wait to see him again.

[07:00:03] BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Engaging directly with the Iranian government on a sustained basis for the first time in decades has created a unique opportunity.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The only criminal charge that Cosby has ever faced might soon fall apart.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. Cosby gave up one of the most valuable rights we possess, the right against self-incrimination.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ANNOUNCER: This is NEW DAY with Chris Cuomo, Alisyn Camerota, and Michaela Pereira.

MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN ANCHOR: I'm assuming they sped up the camera on the clouds.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Ominous sky. Either that or everything's about to end.

PEREIRA: Welcome back to your NEW DAY. Chris and Alisyn, as you can tell, are off. Poppy Harlow and John Berman join me. Up first, Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders going from cordial to combative during last night's Democratic debate, the two butting heads over Obamacare, big banks, and gun control.

BERMAN: Why so tense? Because it's so close. Especially in a first voting state, Iowa. This is the latest CNN poll of polls there. Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders tied.

CNN's Phil Mattingly joins us now with the highlights and the lowlights of last night's debate.

Phil, what did you see?

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Last night serving more or less as the final argument, if you will, the last Democratic debate before the voters take place in Iowa, before the votes even in New Hampshire. And what you saw is a number of Democrats, three, but two that everybody's focused on, that are recognizing that not only is there a compressed calendar, but also a very tight race. (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MATTINGLY (voice-over): The gloves...

SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (I-VT), DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I think Secretary Clinton knows that what she says is very disingenuous.

MATTINGLY: ... are off.

HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I'm not sure whether we're talking about the plan you just introduced tonight or we're talking about the plan you introduced nine times in the Congress.

MATTINGLY: Just weeks before the first votes are cast, Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders putting an exclamation point on a week of sharp sparring on Sunday night.

CLINTON: The authorities convinced regulators to make those decisions.

SANDERS: Let me give you an example of how corrupt.

MATTINGLY: Clinton at one point in campaign unwilling to even mention Sanders' name, now targeting the Vermont senator's record on guns and how he'll pay for his healthcare plan.

CLINTON: I have made it clear, based on Senator Sanders' own record, that he has voted with the NRA, with the gun lobby, numerous times.

MATTINGLY: Sanders moving to blunt both criticisms.

SANDERS: What her campaign was saying of Bernie Sanders, who has fought for universal health care for my entire life, he wants to end Medicare, end Medicaid, end the children's health insurance program. That is nonsense.

MATTINGLY: Shifting on guns, a day before the debate.

SANDERS: What I said is I would relook at it. We are going to relook at it, and I will support stronger provisions.

MATTINGLY: And releasing his singer-payer healthcare plan just hours before taking the stage. Clinton criticizing Sanders for the taxes required to pay for the proposal and its shift away from President Obama's signature achievement.

CLINTON: There are things we can do to improve it, but to tear it up and start over again, pushing our country back into that kind of a contentious debate, I think is the wrong direction.

SANDERS: We're not going to tear up the Affordable Care Act. I helped write it. But we are going to move on top of that to a Medicaid for all system.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Andrea.

SANDERS: A little bit more in taxes, do away with private health insurance premiums. It's a pretty good deal.

MATTINGLY: Sanders going on offense against Clinton's corporate ties.

SANDERS: You've received over $600,000 in speaking fees from Goldman Sachs in one year.

MATTINGLY: Clinton defending not just her stance on Wall Street reform but President Obama's, as well.

CLINTON: But he's criticized President Obama for taking donations from Wall Street. And President Obama has led our country out of the Great Recession. President Obama's work to push through the Dodd- Frank Bill and then to sign it was one of the most important regulatory schemes we've had since the 1930s. So I'm going to defend Dodd-Frank, and I'm going to defend President Obama.

MATTINGLY: Sanders definitely turning a question on Bill Clinton's personal life into one of his best moments of the night.

SANDERS: We've been through this. Yes, his behavior was deplorable. Have I ever once said a word about that issue? No, I have not. I'm going to debate Secretary Clinton and Governor O'Malley on the issues facing the American people, not Bill Clinton's personal behavior.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MATTINGLY: The sharpening attacks last night, really underscoring the urgency of the moment for both, for Hillary Clinton looking at Iowa, watching a lead evaporate, trying to capitalize on that moment. For Bernie Sanders, really trying to take his movement, aspirational up to this point, and actually turn it into votes.

One thing very clear. This is just getting started. Those attacks only going to heat up in the days ahead, John.

BERMAN: Two weeks of attacks. All right. Thanks so much.

Let's bring in Jennifer Granholm, former governor of Michigan, a senior adviser to the pro-Hillary super PAC, Correct the Record; and Anna Galland, executive director of MoveOn.org, which just introduced Bernie Sanders.

Governor, let me start with you. I was taken with that debate on health care. Bernie Sanders released his Medicare-for-all plan just before the debate. Hillary -- Hillary Clinton came out in the debate and essentially said, the problem is, it's not politically expedient. Her argument is pragmatism versus purity. Has she become, governor, the candidate of not change?

[06:05:26] JENNIFER GRANHOLM, SENIOR ADVISOR, CORRECT THE RECORD: Well, no, she says she's a progressive who likes to get things done. She's somebody who understands the political environment that we are living in. And that while it would be great to, you know, have the perfect health care plan for all Democrats, we also know that we have a health care plan that the president worked really hard to get, and that we're going to build on that progress. So it's not about not -- it's not about staying the same. It is about

making progress, but building on the foundation that President Obama has laid, and not eliminating that foundation altogether.

BERMAN: So, Anna, for Bernie Sanders supporters, you know, where have you been the last eight years? Do you really think a single-payer healthcare plan has anything above a zero percent chance of passing?

ANNA GALLAND, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, MOVEON.ORG: I mean, look, MoveOn members and others -- you know, many others in the Democratic Party and across the country worked incredibly hard to pass the Affordable Care Act. We're incredibly proud of it.

And I think everyone would agree that, you know, corporate special interests, including big insurers and others still have too much power in our system, and that we need to be having a robust debate about how to do more to make health care more affordable and more accessible to most Americans.

And that is exactly what Bernie Sanders is trying to talk about and why he had such a great night last night, because he's talking about corporate special interests, talking about big money in our politics, and he's talking about what more we can do to make this country work for everyone.

BERMAN: Do you think that plan, the Medicare-for-all plan, has any chance of being law in the next four years, Anna?

GALLAND: I think that what we're talking about is -- first of all, I should say, it is incredibly inspiring that we are having a debate with one of the two national political parties about how to do more to make our health care system work better, about how we could expand Medicare, which is a system that works so well for so many Americans, to even more folks. That's incredibly inspiring. Bernie Sanders is bringing that conversation to the center of our national debate.

And again, he had an incredibly strong night last night. He's rising in the polls in Iowa and New Hampshire, because he's talk -- he's taking on that kind of conversation. That's the right conversation for us to have, and I think people are going to respond to it, as we saw last night and as we're seeing out there in the field.

BERMAN: Governor, what's wrong with being inspiring? Because look, if you look at voters in Iowa right now, Bernie Sanders is doing great with young voters. Bernie Sanders is doing great in Iowa with first- time caucus goers. These are the types of people you want to inspire.

GRANHOLM: Absolutely. You want to inspire people, but you also want to be realistic with them. It's not really very fair to set them up in believing that all of this massive change is going to happen when, in fact, it has to go through a Congress that is not 100 percent, but overwhelmingly opposed to that idea.

It's not really fair to them to suggest that you can get that through when it's not real. But what is real is the foundation that the president has laid, and

what Hillary Clinton is saying is, yes, we want to get health care to more people, and yes, we've got to make it more affordable, and yes, we have to make some changes to the Affordable Care Act to tweak it and make it better, but it's really -- I just think it's, you know, you're setting those young people who want to be inspired up for a great disappointment if, in fact, he's elected and is faced with the same type of Congress, which everybody projects he would be.

BERMAN: Anna, let me jump in here. Hillary Clinton last night, Anna, went to great ends to compare herself to President Obama, to say she really is the candidate to carry on the Obama legacy. From your point of view, which of the two candidates, Hillary Clinton or Bernie Sanders, which has the agenda that is more in line with the president's?

GALLAND: You know, I should say, first of all, it was so wonderful to see a full stage of candidates talking about the issues in deep and substantive ways. There was such a contrast with the entire Republican field.

Within that, I think that people are very fired up, and the reason that our members voted overwhelmingly to support Bernie Sanders, because he is...

BERMAN: I think we just lost Anna right there.

Governor, let me go to you, but I'm going to have to ask you to be nice. Since we lost your opponent here, the one supporting Bernie Sanders, Governor Granholm...

GRANHOLM: I was so nice.

BERMAN: So talk about the Obama legacy right now. Hillary Clinton, why it is so important for her to now say that she's the candidate -- despite the fact that they fought pretty hard in 2008, that she's the one to carry on the Obama legacy?

GRANHOLM: Well, I mean, she obviously served in his administration, and they share a deep personal affection, but also, a great affinity on values. And she understands what it's like to work in Washington and how incredibly hard he has fought, despite the obstructionists in Congress, to be able to move an agenda forward.

[07:10:08] And when she talks about him having pulled this country up from that huge recession, when she talks about him having saved the U.S. auto industry and put in place this health care strategy despite the obstructionists in Congress, who have voted over 50 times to repeal it, she just doesn't want to see that repeal vote, essentially, go through, when you want to rip up the Affordable Care Act and put something else in place that really does not have a chance of getting through this Congress in reality. So anyway, she's supporting that president.

BERMAN: Anna -- Anna, you clawed your way back on our monitor right now. Again, Hillary Clinton or Bernie Sanders, who's the most like President Obama?

GALLAND: So, look, I was saying, when the big banks clearly cut me off, I was saying that I think that -- I think that all the candidates on that stage are putting forth a vision for America which is in such stark contrast to what you see on the GOP side, so that's worth noting.

I think Bernie Sanders is talking about corporate special interests. He's talking about taking on the big banks, about reforming our democracy to make it work for everyone. That vision is inspiring. It's right. It's what a broad, progressive movement of Americans want desperately to see happen in this country. And that's why he's rising in the polls in New Hampshire and Iowa and why MoveOn members and others are so strongly behind him.

BERMAN: All right. Two weeks from today first voting in Iowa. Anna Galland, Governor Jennifer Granholm, thanks so much for being with us. We really appreciate it -- Michaela.

PEREIRA: You didn't let the tech bugaboos get you. Well done, J.B.

All right. As for the Republicans, the Donald Trump/Ted Cruz feud reaching a new level. Both candidates making a big push to core voters in New Hampshire and Iowa with those caucuses just two weeks away. Jim Acosta is live in Lynchburg, Virginia, where Trump begins his day -- Jim.

JIM ACOSTA, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Michaela.

Two weeks and counting to the Iowa caucuses. Donald Trump and Ted Cruz are still waging their war of words. Trump will be delivering a speech here at Liberty University in Virginia later this morning, targeting evangelical voters, who are crucial to winning Iowa and the GOP nomination. It's also the voting bloc Ted Cruz is counting on, so it's no surprise that Trump and Cruz, who are leading in the polls in Iowa, are on the attack. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: He's a nasty guy. Nobody likes him. Nobody in Congress likes him.

SEN. TED CRUZ (R-TX), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: That formulation didn't come from me. It came from Donald Trump.

He explained that his views were that he was very pro-choice. He supported partial birth abortion. He was open to gay marriage, and his explanation for all of that, he said, "I'm a New Yorker."

TRUMP: How are you going to be president about if you don't know about a $1 million loan from Goldman Sachs, and you said it's something you don't know about? Now he doesn't know that he was a Canadian citizen? I mean, that's, in a way, maybe worse than all of the other things we're talking about.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: Now, here at Liberty University, which was founded by Christian conservatives, they will be listening to Donald Trump's words very carefully.

Trump told CNN's "STATE OF THE UNION" over the weekend that he has a, quote, "great relationship with God." He also said in Iowa, when we were with the candidate on Friday, that he thinks his relationship with evangelical voters is, quote, "terrific."

So they'll be watching his words and listening to his words very closely later on this morning here at Liberty University.

Also, I should mention, Poppy, later on this week, Donald Trump will be in Tulsa, Oklahoma, he'll be at Oral Roberts university. Another opportunity for Donald Trump to talk to evangelical voters out there -- Poppy.

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: Something he certainly needs, especially in Iowa. Thank you so much, Jim Acosta, live for us this morning.

Also, three Americans long-held in Iran released in that prisoner swap over the weekend. They are now at a U.S. military hospital in Germany. Among them is "Washington Post" journalist Jason Rezaian. This as the United States adds additional sanctions on Iran, despite lifting those international economic sanctions over the weekend.

Our CNN senior international correspondent, Frederik Pleitgen, at Rasmussen (ph) Air Base in Germany this morning with the latest.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

FRED PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, it's being evaluated right now, Poppy. In the military hospital here at Landstuhl. And what's going on, is they're going to be evaluated both physically, as well as psychologically, as well. Because of course, those long months of detention there in Iran is something that would take their toll.

The Evin Prison in Tehran is one that is notorious for very tough detention conditions. However, "The Washington Post" manager -- managing editors have already managed to speak to Jason Rezaian. They asked him how he's doing after having been evacuated there from Tehran. He said, quote, "Doing a hell of a lot better than I was 48 hours ago."

He also said he was in good spirits but also said that it was the solitary confinement that he was in for parts of his detention that really were the toughest for him.

Now what's been going on over the past couple of hours is that they were flown out of Iran on a Swiss plane, taken to Geneva, then taken to the Landstuhl Medical Facility, where as I said, medical tests are going to happen.

However, the other thing, and that's probably almost as important, they are going to be reunited with their loved ones, with their friends and family. Remember, there were also a lot of supporters in the U.S. who kept their cases in the public light.

So now Jason Rezaian, Amir Hekmati and Saeed Abedini are meeting their family members, their friends here. Some of them are already here, so certainly some very emotional scenes here at Landstuhl, Poppy.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HARLOW: No question. And we heard from Abedini's wife over the weekend how ecstatic she is for her husband to come home, father of two.

All right. Coming up in just moments, we will speak live with the brother of the freed "Washington Post" reporter, Jason Rezaian. Ali Rezaian will be with us.

Also, in our 8 a.m. hour, right at 8 a.m. Eastern, we will have an interview with Secretary of State John Kerry.

BERMAN: All right. A search operation underway in Iraq for three U.S. contractors reportedly kidnapped in Baghdad. Iraqi security officials tell CNN that the American contractors were taken by a group of gunman and whisked away in a convoy. Two members of the Iraqi parliament tell Reuters the Americans were invited to a private event before the abduction. The U.S. State Department is now working with Iraqi authorities to locate these missing Americans.

PEREIRA: Some breaking news from Turkey this morning. At least one person is dead after a mortar shell hit a Turkish school in the town of Killith (ph), just six miles from the Syrian border. Officials there say a school employee was killed. A seventh grade student and two others were injured. There has been so far no claim of responsibility.

And this video, it is hard to believe. Look. Look at this. An Australian woman is nearly flattened by an out-of-control car. She's walking inside a mini mart when the car plows through the window. The woman vanishes from view. The fumes rush from the engine. She gets up slowly. She walks away.

What is amazing is that she suffered only minor cuts. Three other people inside the car, I should note, were injured. But look at this again. Wow. She gets up, she walks away, just a few cuts.

Investigators in Sydney still do not know why that driver lost control of the car. No one died.

PEREIRA: I wonder after this situation is when your legs go to jelly completely and you just sort of fall over.

BERMAN: She looked like she was going to go do her shopping.

PEREIRA: I know. Shock happens to us in different ways. Right?

HARLOW: What a miracle. BERMAN: All right. The first voting in the 2016 presidential race

just around the corner. Hillary Clinton hoping to emerge from Iowa with that victory that alluded her 8 years ago. Has she sealed the deal? We're going to speak to one of the men who beat her eight years ago. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SANDERS: In terms of polling, guess what? We are running ahead of Secretary Clinton in terms of taking on my good friend, Donald Trump.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: That was Senator Bernie Sanders during last night's debate, touting the close Democratic race in early voting states, pointing at those polls, happy about some of those polls. Hillary Clinton holding the lead nationwide by a wide margin. Still, though, not a sure bet.

Let's bring in CNN senior political commentator and former senior adviser to President Obama, David Axelrod.

You went through it in 2008. We're going through it again in Iowa. Hillary's team telling me last night on my show, "We're confident about Iowa. We're confident about Iowa." But how can you be so confident when you look at these numbers and when you look at the enthusiasm, especially in the young voters?

DAVID AXELROD, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, they're not confident about Iowa. That was pretty clear last night, because Hillary was very aggressive in challenging Senator Sanders in a way she hadn't been in previous debates.

But I think they have some level of confidence, because the organization that they built there.

You know, back in 2008, Barack Obama won not just because he had enthusiasm, but because he built the most extensive organization that that state had ever seen in a presidential caucus, starting the previous March. The Clinton forces learned that lesson, and they've built a very, very strong organization there.

So in a close race, that should make a difference, particularly in a caucus, which is organization-intensive.

BERMAN: You know, last night, as you were watching the debate, it was almost as if Bernie Sanders was the incumbent president, right? Hillary Clinton seemed to be turning all of this to make it issues about him.

Was she effective in that, David, and do you think he can sustain these questions being asked about him, his records, his proposals for the next two weeks?

AXELROD: I think it was mixed. I think on guns, she really hurt him, because he didn't have a very good answer. This has always been a problem for him, because he's running from the left, but on guns, his position is very much to the right of his base. And so she's bore in on that. He didn't have a very good answer to that.

I think it was more mixed on health care. Because it's very hard to suggest that Bernie Sanders doesn't want health care for everyone. And she threw a lot at him. And, you know, I think you can question his plan, but not his motives. Wherever she questions his motives, she gets in trouble. And when she questions his plans, she got a little bit into the weeds. So that was less so.

But on the whole, he was very much more on the defensive than he's been in previous debates. And he's going to have to do better.

The other point I would make is on foreign policy, she looks utterly comfortable, for obvious reasons. He does not. He can't -- he wants to get banks to billionaires as quickly as he can whenever that subject comes up.

But let's talk about banks and billionaires. Because it's interesting. If Bernie Sanders has run on one thing, it has been about bashing Wall Street on the big banks and talking about income inequality, right?

AXELROD: Yes.

HARLOW: But Hillary Clinton went after him last night by bringing up a bill that her own husband signed as president in 2000 and said, "You sided with Wall Street on this." Let's roll it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CLINTON: Senator Sanders, you're the only one on this stage that voted to deregulate the financial market in 2000, to take the cops off the street, to use Governor O'Malley's phrase, to make the SEC and the communities -- the commodities futures trading commission no longer able to regulate swaps and derivatives, which were one of the main cause of the collapse in '08.

So, there's plenty -- there's plenty problems that we all have to face together.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: Why do that, David, when she is someone who they pointed to, the other candidates on stage, as taking millions and millions of dollars in terms of paid speeches, before she was running from the big banks?

AXELROD: Well, she did that, because they pointed that out, and she needed a rejoinder.

What was surprising to me was that Senator Sanders didn't push back and say, "That was under your husband's administration, that bill." And I think he could have put her on the defensive. One of the things she's blessed with is an opponent in Bernie Sanders

who has been less enthusiastic than she in bringing the attack. The entire debate, she really embraced President Obama strongly. Because South Carolina is her firewall if she doesn't succeed in Iowa and New Hampshire. Her support among African-Americans there is essential. And so she made herself the champion of the Obama policies.

And Senator Sanders never mentioned that. It was eight years ago on the very -- on the very stage in South Carolina or in that state, in which she unleashed a brutal attack on Obama. Obama responded in kind.

But the history of their relationship, obviously, is a little bit more checkered than was presented last night. And yet, he didn't say any of those things. And you know, he seems reluctant, in part because she's quite popular, as he is. He seems reluctant to go after her, but I think it's also not her nature to bring those attacks. And he may have to up his game or he's going to get overrun in future contests.

BERMAN: David, you're an Obama guy. I mean, you were key to his election eight years ago, and as you say, Hillary Clinton tried to drape herself in the Obama legacy, more than we've ever seen last night on that stage. Will it work, you know, and what do the people in the White House think? You know, you've got their -- you've got their ear. What are they saying?

AXELROD: Well, I think that they probably think, that's fine if she wants to extol the virtues of this administration. I'm sure they quite agree with everything that she said about it.

And look, she was a partner with the president in the White House when she was a member of the cabinet. She was supportive of his program. She helped design some of them. And so, she has a right to make those claims.

But it is, you know, it's not, as I said, it's not an uncheckered history going back to 2008, and that's the nature of politics.

She is doing the smart thing. Barack Obama has a 90 percent approval rating among Democrats. She's doing the smart thing in embracing him. It's particularly so in these states with large African-American populations, where she has a huge lead over Bernie Sanders. And if she can hold that lead, she really can't be beaten in this race to the nomination.

BERMAN: David Axelrod, great to have you with us. Thanks so much.

AXELROD: Good to be with you guys.

BERMAN: Michaela.

PEREIRA: All right. Obviously, there's a whole lot of relief this morning for families of Americans released from captivity in Iran, including "The Washington Post's" Jason Rezaian. We're going to speak live with his brother about this incredible ordeal. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)