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Large Warehouse Fire Closes N.J. Schools; 46 Correctional Officers Charged In Drug Trafficking Sting; Sanders: I Will Not Take Advice From Henry Kissinger; Ripple Effect Of Oil Plunge. Aired 7:30- 8a ET

Aired February 12, 2016 - 07:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[07:31:21] ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN HOST: We do have some breaking news to bring you right now. An out of control industrial park fire closing public schools and a major roadway through Hillsboro Township, New Jersey. Look at the pictures. You can see the billowing smoke. It is visible from several surrounding counties. This fire began Thursday afternoon and crews have been struggling to put it out since but they are struggling because of these freezing temperatures and strong winds. No injuries reported. It is unclear what is causing this fire.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN HOST: South Korean officials say talks with the U.S. on deploying a missile defense system could begin as early as next week. This is in response to North Korea's rocket launch and nuclear test that drew international condemnation. Seoul, in South Korea, has now cut power to a factory park run jointly with Pyongyang. They first suspended operations at the complex this week. The North responded by (ph) expelling South Korean workers.

CAMEROTA: 46 current and former correctional officers rounded up in an undercover sting at nine prisons across Georgia. The guards allegedly smuggling contrabands like liquor, tobacco, and cell phones into cell blocks for cash. Inmates then used the illegal cell phones to commit crimes including money laundering and identity theft.

All right, so Hillary Clinton sparring with Bernie Sanders in this high stakes debate last night. So there were some very heated exchanges. Who won those? Let's bring in Mark Preston, the executive editor for CNN politics and Jackie Kucinich, senior politics editor for "The Daily Beast". Great to see both of you guys this morning. I know you were up late so we didn't have to. Mark, let me start with you. There was a moment in which Hillary Clinton embraced President Obama as she has been doing more on the campaign trail and she says that Bernie Sanders has been too critical of the president, so watch this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: The kind of criticism that we've heard from Senator Sanders about our president, I expect from Republicans. I do not expect from someone running for the Democratic nomination to succeed President Obama.

SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (D-VT), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: That is -- madam secretary, that is a low blow. The last I heard, a United States senator had the right to disagree with the president, including the president who has done such an extraordinary job.

One of us ran against Barack Obama. I was not that candidate.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMEROTA: All right, Mark, what did you think? Who won that one?

MARK PRESTON, CNN POLITICS EXECUTIVE EDITOR: Well, certainly if Hillary Clinton is trying to get the African-American vote in massive numbers, I think that she won that exchange but there is something to say about what Bernie Sanders is relaying back to her. As a United States senator, you have to disagree with your president sometimes. Now in this democratic primary, there is this battle right now of the wills over the next couple weeks and as Hillary Clinton is really trying to create this firewall on March 1, embracing President Obama is not a bad strategy because a lot of these states have large African-American populations. Look, she did it on purpose. I think that she won the exchange, but I think Bernie Sanders is also trying to go for a little bit of a fringe electorate as well to pull them in and that's really the grassroots.

BERMAN: Jackie, your take?

JACKIE KUCINICH, SENIOR POLITICS EDITOR, THE DAILY BEAST: I agree with Mark. But I do think that there is a risk in this strategy, of course, in the general, if she makes it, if she ends up being the nominee. Because you can imagine, Republicans are just hitting their DVRs and recording every time she ties herself to Obama to play for independents that might not be as keen on the president right now.

BERMAN: She's got to get there, though. Right now it's all about getting to the general election. Let's look at another exchange again. It deals with this issue going forward when you're looking at more diverse states and a different type of population and they both talked about the issue of criminal justice reform. Let's listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[07:35:01] SANDERS: At the end of my first term as president, we will not have more people in jail than any other country. We will invest in education and jobs for our kids, not incarceration and more jails.

CLINTON: It's going to be my responsibility to make sure we move forward to solve these problems that are now out in the open. Nobody can deny them. So we're going to enforce the law, we're going to change policing practices, we're going to change incarceration practices, but we're also going to emphasize education, jobs, and housing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: Jackie, you get the first bite in this time. Who won?

KUCINICH: You know, when I was talking to go voters in New Hampshire, you heard a lot of young people talking about how much they liked Bernie Sanders' take on criminal justice. However, again, Hillary Clinton is taking the more pragmatic approach. So we'll have is to see at the end of the day but it certainly -- I think it may have been a draw.

CAMEROTA: Mark, I mean, bring down incarceration rates. That's a wonderful plan. I think they both agree on that. But who won in that exchange?

PRESTON: I think Jackie's right. Look, it's a draw. The question is, how do you get there and how do you stop situations like Ferguson or Baltimore or what have you? It's obviously a bigger problem when it comes to the drug war right now and how incarceration rates are a lot higher for African-Americans in particular. It's also the whole idea of income in equality. If you noticed in last night's debate, almost every answer that Bernie Sanders had had to do with income in equality, so income inequality leads to over-policing, leads to more incarceration rates -- look, they're fighting for the liberal base. In the end, that was a draw.

CAMEROTA: OK. During debates, sometimes the specter of someone hangs or hovers over the stage. And last night it was Henry Kissinger. Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CLINTON: Well, I know journalists have asked who you do listen to on foreign policy and we have yet to know who that is.

SANDERS: Well, it ain't Henry Kissinger, that's for sure.

CLINTON: That's fine. That's fine.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMEROTA: OK, there had been a Henry Kissinger reference before that as well with Sanders saying that he would never take any foreign policy advice from Henry Kissinger. Mark, who won that one?

PRESTON: Well look, Bernie Sanders' support is coming from young people. I don't know how many young people know who Henry Kissinger is. So was Bernie Sanders trying to reach out and try to grab some of those older voters that have supported Hillary Clinton? Look, it was an interesting moment. It's something for us to talk about and really, what he was trying to do was to say that Hillary Clinton's foreign policy is flawed and it comes down to judgment. That was his key word for judgment.

BERMAN: This isn't the first time we've heard them argue about the Iraq war, Jackie, but this seemed to be an argument about Vietnam all of a sudden on the debate stage.

KUCINICH: Yes. You can imagine there was a lot of Googling going on last night. And I would not be surprised if you hear this brought up in the Republican debate as a way to show maybe this Democratic field is out of touch and not talking about things that matter to this generation.

CAMEROTA: But I mean Mark, wasn't the point that Bernie Sanders was trying to make is that, he thinks Hillary Clinton is too hawkish and by invoking Henry Kissinger, that's sort of short hand?

PRESTON: Oh, no doubt about it. Again, a dog whistle in many ways to older liberal voters who look back at Vietnam or remember Vietnam and say, we don't want to go through this quagmire again. And quite frankly, what he was doing was trying to link Vietnam to her vote on Iraq without specifically saying Iraq in that moment.

BERMAN: Jackie, last thought on the give and take.

KUCINICH: You know, never a dull one. But I think if you supported Bernie Sanders, you came out of that debate supporting Bernie Sanders. And the same for Hillary supporters. I don't know that anyone really got the edge out of last night.

CAMEROTA: All right. Mark, Jackie, great to get your snap analysis this morning. Great to see you guys.

KUCINICH: Thank you.

BERMAN: All right. Oil prices. They are plunging. Is the relief at the gas pump all good news? We're going to discuss the ripple effect on the markets and the economy, the big effects. That's next.

[07:42:48] Investors bracing for another rocky ride on Wall Street today. The Dow Jones Industrial Average, NASDAQ, and S&P 500 all dropping over these crashing oil prices. Today, Asian markets closing lower with a huge drop in Tokyo. Right now, the European markets are higher. So what is the ripple effect of all this volatility to all of our 401(k)'s and the economy? Let's break it down with Donald Luskin. He's the chief investment officer at Trend Macrolytics, LLC, and our own Christine Romans, CNN's chief business correspondent. Great to have both of you here. Donald, let me start with you. Can you just take us through, what is causing this drop in oil prices and what could turn it around?

DONALD LUSKIN, CIO, TREND MACROLYTICS: What's causing this drop in oil prices is fracking. We've had a productivity revolution in exploring for and extracting oil from the planet. It's equivalent to the invention of transistors and integrated circuits 50 years ago. It's an absolutely incredible industrial revolution. Oil prices have collapsed with no drop in demand at all. This is simply a productivity revolution, a supply side revolution. It's all technology.

CAMEROTA: OK, Christine, this is what we had hoped would happen. Less dependence on foreign oil, more domestic production. So what's the problem?

CHRISTINE ROMANS: The problem is the world is awash in oil. There is so much oil out there it is everywhere. And the banks that have bankrolled some of these technologies and are now looking at some of those investments and saying, uh-oh, the crashing price of oil means oil producers are losing money. But look for consumers. Let's be very clear here. It's hundreds of dollars of extra money in their wallets every year. Hundreds of dollars. The last political season, I can remember all these promises about $2 gas. $2.50 gas. Well it's here. It's here.

CAMEROTA: Sometimes even lower.

ROMANS: You've got some people calling for -- I saw $1.11 in Oklahoma City this week. So it's very cheap. So for someone who is filling up their tank every week, it acts like a tax cut. For someone who's watching their 401(k), it looks like -- it hurts because the stock market is taking a hit with it.

ROMANS: OK, so Donald, that's the silver lining. Do you agree with that?

[07:44:51] LUSKIN: Yes. Well, kind of. It's very nice to have part of your essential gasoline budget cut so you can reallocate the money to other things. The problem is, it's not really a tax cut because it doesn't give consumers more money to spend. It just allows you to spend it in different places. So in terms of overall economic growth and really getting America growing again, it actually doesn't make any difference.

CAMEROTA: But Donald, is there a larger consequence? Are you concerned -- so there's more money in our wallets because if we're not spending $4 on gas per gallon, then there's more money in our wallets, but what about the larger international ripple effect?

LUSKIN: The international ripple effects are really terrible wild cards in this deck. We have to remember, America's a major oil producing country, but we certainly are a minority producer worldwide. We're up against oil-producing giants like Russia and Saudi Arabia. These are whole countries that are basically just oil companies organized as countries. And in the case of Russia, they've got 2,600 nuclear weapons. So if their pain and agony, if oil goes down to 10, you got a guy like Vladimir Putin needs to prop up his popularity in the polls, god knows what could happen. That's the worst case scenario.

ROMANS: So petro-politics are just fascinating, especially in an election year. When you think about this, you've Saudi Arabia and ally the United States, pumping crude, pumping crude, pumping crude, trying to keep its market share while the U.S. has all of these energy producers that are still, have made these investments, are still trying to pump all of this oil. The politics of cheap oil are so fascinating and when you hear people talk about $20 crude or the fact that there's really no floor here at this level, the actual barrel that the crude is in costs more than the commodity inside of it. Imagine how crazy that is and how quickly this has happened. This 20 month oil crash, you've gone from more than $100 a barrel down to the 20s. It's just been such a precipitous decline and I'm sure there have been people making money all along the way and there have been probably speculators who've been pushing on the gas, pun intended. But when it turns out, if it turns out, it could be just as volatile.

CAMEROTA: So Donald, to come full circle here, this is what we wanted. We wanted to be able to rely on domestic production. So what is the answer in terms of the instability?

LUSKIN: The instability is mostly financial. Christine had hit on it originally. When oil was expensive, over $100, oil companies were able to borrow money in the bond market and from banks, and leverage loans -- they just developed these great technologies like fracking. The problem is, oil got so cheap so fast, they did their job too well, now they can't repay the loans. So now here in the U.S., we have very real issues of bank stability. So it starts being that little whiff of 2008. So we have to get through the financial aspects of this. That just takes time. That's capitalism. But two or three years from now, oil can be trading permanently, under $20, we'll never run out of oil, that's the great thing about fracking. There's shale everywhere. Our great grandchildren will always have oil. That changes everything for the world economy. Unfortunately, we have to have a banking crisis and a recession first. But it's going to be great in the long term.

CAMEROTA: Wow. Christine, ten seconds. Do you agree with that assessment?

ROMANS: Oh my gosh, I don't want to have a banking crisis. I want them to figure out how not to have a banking crisis.

LUSKING: Well nobody wants a banking crisis.

ROMANS: I'm hoping this part of the economy is a smaller hiccup than the housing crisis was and the comparisons to 2008 are overblown.

CAMEROTA: All right, thanks so much for both of your expertise. I don't know whether to be happy or devastated.

ROMANS: Fill up.

CAMEROTA: There you go. Thanks so much. Let's get over to John.

BERMAN: All right. Bernie Sanders blasting Hillary Clinton for praising Henry Kissinger, calling Henry Kissinger one of the most destructive secretaries of state in modern history. So, who cares about Henry Kissinger right now? We'll discuss, coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[07:52:30] CLINTON: I am a staunch supporter of President Obama's principle accomplishment, namely the accordable care act.

I think under president Obama we have seen a lot of advances.

I strongly support the president's executive actions.

I understand what President Obama inherited. I don't think he gets the credit he deserves.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: That was Hillary Clinton. She made one thing very clear during last night's debate, she stands with President Obama. She mentioned his name 21 times on stage. It might have been 21 million if she had her way. The question is, will this help her as much as needs it to as she moves forward in this election? We have Bill Press joining us right now. He's the author of a now very discussed book called "Buyers Remorse: How Obama Let Progressives Down". It's a book with a blurb from Bernie Sanders on the back. He's also a Bernie Sanders supporter. With us also, Hilary Rosen, democratic strategist, and a Hillary Clinton supporter. Guys, thank you so much for being with us. You know, there were two primaries last night that were very interesting. The Obama primary and sort of the Kissinger caucus which we'll get to at the end of this. But Hilary, on the Obama primary -- Hillary Clinton really seems to be wanting to surround herself with as much of the Obama aura as she can heading into Nevada and South Carolina.

HILARY ROSEN, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Well look, there's no question that Republicans are going to try and hang president Obama around the Democrats throat with dissatisfaction in the general so she might as well get all she can out of it in the primary. President Obama's extremely popular among Democrats. And here's the facts -- like Bill's book, you know, Bernie Sanders, one would assume he agrees with what Bill wrote in his book, and Bernie said last night, haven't you ever disagreed with the president? But that's not the issue. What he's done actually is say that the president has not been a good leader. He hasn't disagreed with him on policy. He's disagreed with him on a lot of style and bigger-picture issues. Hasn't been a good leader. Says he'd be better on race relations than president Obama. These are some pretty big divides that he himself created.

BERMAN: Bill --

BILL PRESS, AUTHOR, BUYERS REMORSE: HOW OBAMA LET PROGRESSIVES DOWN: Well, I have to say first of all, on the race relations, that question was asked, President Obama said some African-Americans, I recall, the way the question was asked, some African-Americans even said that they've been disappointed in President Obama -- whoever asked the question, Gwen or Judy -- would you kind of work to improve them? The question first went to Secretary Clinton. She said she would and then Bernie said he would. So I think both of them said they would continue --

ROSEN: No, no, no. He said he'd be better.

[07:55:08] PRESS: -- if I may, on race relations. But secondly, on President Obama, I think, look -- he has been a good president. I praise in my book all the good things he's done. Bernie Sanders has disagreed with him on issues. He hasn't taken him on personally at all. He disagreed with him on TPP, but you know what, almost every Democrat in congress did and now Hillary Clinton does. Hillary Clinton last night said she disagrees with him on this roundup and deportation program that President Obama has under way right now. So in this country, criticizing the president is still OK.

BERMAN: It's certainly alowed under the constitution. The question is, is it the right thing to do in a Democratic primary? Your book, it's called "Buyer's Remorse: How Obama Let Progressives Down", which indicates you think that Obama let progressives down. Do you think Bernie Sanders thinks that President Obama let progressives down?

PRESS: I do not speak for Bernie Sanders, right? I speak for my book. Senator Sanders was good enough to write a blurb for the book in which all he says is -- it doesn't even talk about President Obama. It says, the next president, him or her, should do everything they can to rally people behind the progressive agenda and get it passed. Harmless, says nothing at all about President Obama.

BERMAN: So Hilary, there's one thing I know, however much you argue about what he did for progressives or not did for progressives, President Obama, there's one thing I do know about President Obama is he will not be president after January 19 next year. He will be in the past. So how is surrounding yourself in President Obama, how does that make the case for Hillary Clinton about what she'll do for the future? Bernie Sanders talks a lot about the future. Isn't this inherently backwards looking by Hillary Clinton?

ROSEN: Well, there's two pieces here. The first is, she's sending a signal that the accomplishments of the Obama administration, things like passing health care reform, things like doing banking reform, that there's work to do and that that's going to be her approach. What Sanders is trying to sell, and more power to him, is those things haven't -- don't have the impact we need. We need to start over, start fresh, and think bigger. So what she's embracing, really, is, not just the past of President Obama, but she's trying to convince people that she has the level of experience, thoughtfulness and legislative strategy to actually get things done, whereas, Sanders, in my view, is really good at explaining the problems. I think he's much better at talking about the problems in this country and she's actually much better at talking about the solutions. And maybe if the rhetoric between the two of them joined, we'd be in a united Democratic party.

BERMAN: Let's take one more minute, because it would be remiss if we didn't talk at least one more minute about Henry Kissinger in the 2016 presidential race. Bill Press, explain to me the Henry Kissinger moment. I know Hillary Clinton has said that she likes Henry Kissinger, has talked to Henry Kissinger, but what do you get out of attacking Hillary Clinton or going after, attack is a strong word -- on the issue of Henry Kissinger in 2016 when it's been an awful long time, 40 years since he was secretary of state?

PRESS: First of all, I thought that was the weirdest part of the whole debate. The fact that the two of them spent so much time talking about a man most people think is probably dead. Right? And you know, what Senator Sanders, I believe, was trying to do, was say judgment counts. Right? You voted against the Iraq war and you even now support -- or talked to this guy whom we remember for Cambodia and for Vietnam.

BERMAN: You say we remember. I got to tell you, all voters -- many of the voters for Bernie Sanders don't remember. The kids don't remember.

PRESS: No, that's the point. And then the other thing, I was just surprised that Secretary Clinton spent so much time basically embracing Henry Kissinger. Most Democrats either never heard of him or hate him. Not a good figure I think to embrace.

BERMAN: Bill Press, Hilary Rosen, great to have you with us this morning. Thank you so much.

ROSEN: I agree with Bill, by the way.

BERMAN: All right. Thanks guys, appreciate it. So what is your take on this? Tweet us @newday or post your comment on facebook.com/newday. There iss a lot of news this morning. Let's get right to it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CLINTON: The kind of criticism that we've heard from Senator Sanders about our president, I expect from Republicans.

SANDERS: Madam secretary, that is a low blow.

Let's not insult the intelligence of the American people. People aren't dumb. Why in god's name does Wall Street make huge campaign contributions?

CLINTON: Once I'm in the White House, we will have enough political capital.

SANDERS: Secretary Clinton, you're not in the White House yet.

SEN. MARCO RUBIO (R-FL), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: There is no one left in the Republican field who has more experience than I have.

SEN. TED CRUZ (R-TX), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Don't listen to any of the campaign rhetoric.

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I won't use foul language. I'm just not going to do it.

GOV. JOHN KASICH (R-OH), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: How are you going to bring people together when all you're doing is trashing somebody else?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is NEW DAY with Chris Cuomo, Alisyn Camerota, and Michaela Pereira.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMEROTA: A chilly sunrise over Manhattan there. It's going to be a cold weekend. Good morning, everyone. Welcome to your NEW DAY. It's Friday, February 12, 8:00 in the East --