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GOP Wants Next President to Name Scalia Successor; George W. Bush Counterpunches Donald Trump; Taylor Swift Wins Best Album Again. Aired 6-6:30a ET

Aired February 16, 2016 - 06:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (I-VT), DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Do not obstruct. Obey the Constitution.

[05:58:40] SEN. MARCO RUBIO (R-FL), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We're not moving forward on a nominee until after the election.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What we're going to see is this be a major issue in the presidential election.

SEN. PATRICK LEAHY (D-VT), JUDICIARY COMMITTEE: This is the playbook we should follow. The Constitution of the United States.

GEORGE W. BUSH, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I came here for two reasons. One, because I care deeply about Jeb. And, two, because I care deeply about our country.

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Ted Cruz is the most dishonest guy.

G. BUSH: There seems to be a lot of name-calling going on.

TRUMP: I think he's an unstable guy.

G. BUSH: But I want to remind you: labels are for soup cans.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A night for the biggest stars in music to shine.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Energetic performances and powerful tributes.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ANNOUNCER: This is NEW DAY with Chris Cuomo, Alisyn Camerota and Michaela Pereira.

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning to you, our friends. It is your NEW DAY. It's Tuesday, February 16, 6 a.m. in the East. Alisyn getting the finishing touches on the tattoo, so John Berman joins us this morning. Mick wrote that line.

The White House is daring Republicans to reject a nominee to replace Justice Antonin Scalia with a top Democrat, calling it sabotage if they do and suggesting it will backfire on the GOP. MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN ANCHOR: This collision course in Washington

playing out as Republican rivals are at war with one another with everyone clamoring for the upper hand. Former president George W. Bush hitting the trail with his brother Jeb and firing back at Donald Trump's attacks in his campaign feud (ph).

Our senior Washington correspondent, Joe Johns, has the very latest for us from Washington.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOE JOHNS, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): This morning Senate Minority Leader Harry Reid taking aim at the Republican leadership for saying they will block anyone nominated by President Obama to succeed Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia. In an op-ed for the "Washington Post," Reid writes, "If my Republicans colleagues proceed down this reckless path, they should know that this act alone will define their time in the majority. Thinking otherwise is fantasy."

Reid and Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell have been trading jabs since the first news of Scalia's death, with members of the Judiciary Committee confirming party lines have been drawn.

LEAHY: The Republicans are talking about the Republican playbook. This is the playbook we should follow, the Constitution of the United States.

SEN. JEFF SESSIONS (R-AL), JUDICIARY COMMITTEE: President Obama has gotten two activists judges on the court. Capable, intelligent justices but share deeply his philosophy.

JOHNS: Reid and other Democrats are hoping the White House pick will be someone Republicans would ordinarily support. To point out the opposition is politically motivated because it's an election year.

ERIC SCHULTZ, WHITE HOUSE DEPUTY PRESS SECRETARY: The Constitution does not include exemptions for election years or for the president's last year in office. There's no exemptions for when a vacancy could tip the balance of the court.

JOHNS: The White House confirming the nomination process is already underway as the vacancy intensifies the presidential race. Ted Cruz, a member of the Senate Judiciary Committee, amplifying what he says is at stake with a new ad.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Life, marriage, religious liberty. The Second Amendment. We're just one Supreme Court justice away from losing them all.

JOHNS: The 2016 presidential hopefuls are digging their heels in on the issue that's now shaping the race.

RUBIO: Irrespective of what President Obama does, we're not moving forward on a nominee until after the election. HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Barack Obama is

president of the United States until January 20, 2017, whether the Republicans like it or not.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

JOHNS: We may get a window in the president's thinking about replacing Justice Scalia today when he talks to reporters in California. He has said he'll nominate someone in due time. Not clear what that means. Sources have told CNN one of the options may be nominating a so-called sacrificial lamb who might have no chance of getting confirmed but whose rejection by the Republican-controlled Senate could galvanize Democratic voters and increase turnout in November.

Back to you.

CUOMO: Joe Johns, thank you very much.

John Berman, do you accept this nomination?

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: I would be a sacrificial lamb.

CUOMO: Let's discuss. CNN political analyst and presidential campaign correspondent for "The New York Times," Maggie Haberman. And senior politics editor for "The Daily Beast," Jackie Kucinich.

All right, Maggie, let's do it this way. OK? I don't want to let you have your word. I don't want to do it, because politically, it is bad for me. I don't want to risk you giving us a nominee that we may have to appoint because of any process. I don't like it. I'm a Republican. I want to save it until afterwards. That's my position. What's wrong with that?

MAGGIE HABERMAN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, there is no precedent for there not being some kind of an appointment in an election year. We wrote about this in "The Times" today, No. 1.

No. 2, it's not just Mitch McConnell saying, "We are not going to let this go through." He is saying don't even bother. And then follow it up with American people deserve a say.

And so this goes to, I think, a deeper issue for Democrats. Democrats have argued Republicans for a long time have refused to acknowledge the president is actually the sitting president. We have a very long time until the election. That's why. It is certainly the Republicans' prerogative to say exactly what you just said. And we have seen it for the last couple of years, ever since the rules changed in the Senate.

I don't think -- it's not a surprise, given how partisan D.C. is now. This is not a shock, given what we have seen over many years. But I do think that it is a risk for Republicans for the reasons that we just heard. You can see the president appoint somebody who basically meets a bunch of demographic boxes, essentially, and who the Republicans look like they're bringing in-house by refusing to appoint, and that can help Democrats.

BERMAN: Democrats are taking great umbrage right now. But...

HABERMAN: The greatest of umbrage.

BERMAN: The greatest of umbrage, but Jackie, you know, Republicans are pointing to things that they have said in the past, such as this statement from Chuck Schumer.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. CHUCK SCHUMER (R-NY), JUDICIARY COMMITTEE: We cannot afford to see Justice Stevens replaced by another Roberts or Justice Ginsburg by another Alito. Given the track record of this president and the experience of obfuscation at hearings, with respect to the Supreme Court at least, I will recommend to my colleagues that we should not confirm any Bush nominee to the Supreme Court except in extraordinary circumstances.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[06:05:02] BERMAN: That was in 2007 with more than a year left on George W. Bush's term. Is this the silver bullet that Republicans need to say, "Aha, we don't have to do this"?

JACKIE KUCINICH, SENIOR POLITICS EDITOR, "THE DAILY BEAST": I, for one, am just shocked that, you know, Democrats would say something differently when there's a Republican president in office. That just shocks me to my core. No, I don't think it's a silver bullet. I think this will -- this will continue to be an issue. They will continue to fight this.

Because, you know, that is essentially they're going to say it doesn't matter. But I will say there is also political risk for Mitch McConnell if he does go forward. Because you have to imagine the base will never forgive the establishment Republicans if they go forward with a nominee. It looks like -- that, you know, Obama is getting something that he wants. I mean, I think it's plain and simple.

CUOMO: By why didn't -- this is what I don't get. They could have been in the same place politically, had they said, go ahead, nominate somebody. And then let's hold a hearing. And then they don't have a vote? They may have misplayed their hand here in the first 12 hours...

HABERMAN: That's right.

CUOMO: ... after the death of Antonin Scalia. The net result may end up being the same thing. I may be on team Jackie here, not team Maggie on the issue of the biggest political risk.

Jackie says -- Jackie says there's more of a risk in Republicans not standing in the way of the nomination. You say there's a great risk for them standing in the nomination. I think this is over. I think this is, you know, President Obama is not getting his Supreme Court pick by November. I think there's going to be a hearing. But I think there will be a hearing now, which is the change from

yesterday. But I think this is over. And the remaining question, Maggie, is what is the president going to do about this? How is he going to handle this? What kind of person will he nominate? Will he nominate somebody that will, as you say, embarrass the Republicans? Will he fight for that person every day until November? Is this how he wants to spend his last year in office?

HABERMAN: To your question about the great chasm. I actually think the two things can be true at the same time. And I think that this is absolutely true.

(CROSSTALK)

HABERMAN: Well, just a little bit. I am a little bit, too. That's all right. But I also think it is true that this is helpful to Democrats. There are reasons for both.

I do think this is not how President Obama wants to be spending the last year of his presidency, period. So I think, if we stipulate that. But we're going to know a lot more in the next couple days of what this is going to look like for him going forward and how he wants. He has given no indication what his time frame is. Only that he is going to fulfill his constitutional obligation between when he actually says something. And now what you're going to hear, I think, a lot from people like Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders, who are going to be filling in the other side of the page.

CUOMO: Here's why I think this is a worthy discussion. Even though it seems to come to a quick impasse. Jackie, I'll direct this to you. Isn't this an example of why the notion of being a renegade outsider sounds good but winds up immediately introducing an obstacle of process when you get down to Washington, D.C.? Isn't this an example of how saying, "When I get down there, I'm going to make things happen" is just yip yap if you don't know how to work the system.

KUCINICH: I don't know that it's true, because Mitch McConnell is a constitutionalist to his core. It seems like a political calculation on his part, because he knows how things work. And he, you know, he wrote the book in a lot of ways. So I don't know if this is -- if this is something about not being able to get things done. I think this is a choice at the end of the day.

BERMAN: I'm on team Jackie here, not team Chris. Because Ted Cruz is a central player in this, right? Ted Cruz is one of the first candidates, first Republicans in the Senate -- forget the candidates -- to come out and say, "I'm going to stand in the way of this." And he is the seminal outsider in the Senate, and he is now, in a way...

CUOMO: No, he's the seminal obstructionist in the Senate. I just think that...

BERMAN: I think there is a distinction without a difference in this case.

CUOMO: But I like my word, and I said it with such emphasis. What I'm saying is that you have these guys saying now, Maggie, and women in the race, saying, "When I get in there, I'm going to do it differently." This is how it works. This is the reality. They have the political will. They have the political desire. They get it done. There is no simply changing the system. This is going to be about how you make accommodations, when you can. Is this a demonstration of that?

HABERMAN: I think that, to John's point, I think that I'm a little more team Jonathan than team Chris. Going with the team motif this morning.

I don't...

CUOMO: Cuts deep, Maggie. Cuts deep.

HABERMAN: I'm not much for doing a fight (ph) like that.

I think that for Ted Cruz, who has been struggling to try to get a toehold against Donald Trump, especially post-New Hampshire and going into South Carolina, where it's a much more conservative state. I think you see Ted Cruz trying to say, "See, this is exactly the bedrock of my candidacy, is this is what I went to D.C. to do, is to stop this kind of thing. And I would be, you know, as strong or stronger than Mitch McConnell."

And what you're saying all the Republicans saying Mitch McConnell needs to hold strong. I think Mitch McConnell will hold strong. But I do think this gives Ted Cruz a chance to sort of reframe the race, both in terms of what he would do about D.C. but also say this is a very serious thing. And what he has done is...

CUOMO: Does Ted Cruz want to make it about culture?

HABERMAN: Absolutely.

CUOMO: It helps the short-term, hurts the GOP long-term?

HABERMAN: I think it certainly helps Ted Cruz in the short-term.

BERMAN: Ted Cruz has made it about culture, even before the death of Antonin Scalia.

[06:10:08] HABERMAN: Look at the ads he's running against Donald Trump right now. It's all about how Donald Trump has a liberal background.

CUOMO: Yes. The GOP had wanted to stay away from that. Yesterday, we heard Mel Martinez saying there are certain things the GOP doesn't want to talk about. Those are on the list.

BERMAN: Yes, well, none -- all these candidates, these Senate candidates in the swing states are siding with Mitch McConnell here. They're siding with the conservative side here, because they're worried about upsetting their base. It's too big of a risk for them.

CUOMO: All right. So Jackie Kucinich, I lost the debate, but I won overall, because we had a great segment on the show. Jackie, thank you very much. Maggie, thank you very much -- John.

PEREIRA: American people win.

CUOMO: A quick programming note for the rest of you. President Obama is going to hold a press conference this afternoon. He is expected to be asked about the heated battle over his Supreme Court nominee. CNN will have coverage of his news conference as he makes the case for working together at 4:30 Eastern.

PEREIRA: I just decided what the show will be when you guys are anchoring like this together, a bro-cast.

CUOMO: Bro-cast?

BERMAN: Hope it works out better than it did for Ted Cruz and Donald Trump.

PEREIRA: I know. Right? Don't let it go down in flames.

All right. We're moving on now to the 2016 race. The Bush brothers teaming up on the trail in South Carolina. Former President George W. Bush touting Jeb's experience and character, all while taking shots at Donald Trump without actually saying his name. This as the GOP war of words is escalating among rivals with Trump in the middle of it all.

CNN chief political correspondent Dana Bash live in Washington with more.

Hi, Dana.

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Hi, there. That's a bro-cast. This was a bro-rally last night, a big one. George W. brought a very different Jeb with him.

First of all, Jeb Bush shed his glasses, which I can tell you a lot of supporters who I've spoken to said contributed, they thought, to his struggle to project strength.

But most of all, Bush advisers got what one told me they were really looking for: the best news coverage Jeb Bush has gotten in months.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BASH (voice-over): George W. Bush drew a large crowd and a deep distinction between his brother and Donald Trump.

G. BUSH: Strength is not empty rhetoric. It is not bluster. It is not theatrics. Real strength, strength of purpose, comes from integrity and character. And in my experience, the strongest person usually isn't the loudest one in the room.

BASH: The 43rd president never uttered Trump's name, but he didn't have to.

G. BUSH: We do not need someone in the Oval Office who mirrors and inflames our anger and frustration. BASH: He spoke only a few hours after Trump doubled down on criticizing him for 9/11.

TRUMP: I've heard for years he kept the country safe after 9/11. What does that mean, after? What about during 9/11? I was there.

BASH: The former president recounted what it was like for him that horrific morning and segued to Jeb.

G. BUSH: He's got the backbone necessary to make the tough decisions on behalf of the American people.

BASH: George W. Bush energized not just the crowd but his brother, the candidate.

J. BUSH: I thought it was a little strange that a front-running candidate would attack the president of the United States, who did keep us safe. While he was building a reality TV show.

I can beat Hillary Clinton. I can promise you that.

BASH: Meanwhile Trump, the South Carolina front-runner, is waging all-out war, not just against Bush but Ted Cruz, closest to Trump in most polls.

TRUMP: Ted Cruz is the most dishonest guy I think I've ever met in politics. I think he's an unstable person. I really do.

CRUZ: Today, Donald Trump held a press conference where he apparently lost it.

BASH: Cruz is now stepping up his attacks on Trump, on the stump and in ads.

TRUMP: I am pro-choice in every respect.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: South Carolina cannot trust Donald Trump.

BASH: Cruz is taking incoming from two opponents calling him a liar.

TRUMP: I have never, ever met a person that lies more than Ted Cruz.

RUBIO: He's liked about my position on marriage.

CRUZ: Donald Trump and Marco Rubio both have the very same pattern. Whenever anyone points out their record, they simply start screaming, "Liar, liar, liar."

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BASH: And the name-calling is now happening nonstop on South Carolina airwaves right now. Negative TV ads from Ted Cruz's campaign, Mario Rubio's super PACs that support all of them. South Carolina voters -- John, you know this -- they have seen ugly politics before. But candidates for president calling each other liars, it's mudslinging at a new level. BERMAN: Yes. And there's still four days left. So imagine how bad

it can get from now. All right, Dana, thanks so much.

Some interesting travel plans for the president. He will visit Vietnam for the first time in May. The White House says the president met with Vietnam's prime minister during this week's California summit with Southeast Asian leaders and accepted an invitation to visit. He will be the third president to visit Vietnam since the end of the Vietnam War more than 40 years ago.

PEREIRA: Well, the stars are out in full force at the Grammys last night. Taylor Swift making history by winning Best Album, the first woman to win the top honor twice. The thrills ad surprises certainly did not end there. Have a look.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

[06:15:05] TAYLOR SWIFT, SINGER: Welcome to the 2016 Grammy Awards. But right now it's 1989.

PEREIRA: And Taylor Swift's year it was. The pop superstar snagging three Grammys, including coveted Album of the Year, at the 58th Grammy Awards.

SWIFT: To all the young women out there, some day when you get where you're going, you'll look around and you will know that it was you and the people who love you who put you there.

PEREIRA: Compton (ph) rapper and powerhouse Kendrick Lamar sweeping the rap categories.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And the Grammy goes to "To Pimp a Butterfly," Kendrick Lamar.

PEREIRA: Electrifying the audience with an explosive performance.

Dance hit "Uptown Funk" by Mark Ronson and Bruno Mars named Record of the Year. Ed Sheeran and Meghan Trainor riding high off their first Grammy wins.

MEGHAN TRAINOR, SINGER: My mom and dad for always believing in me. I love you so much. Thank you.

PEREIRA: And Adele falling short of vocal perfection when audio issues marred her performance.

The night peppered with earnest tributes. Lady Gaga channeling Ziggy Stardust in honor of the late David Bowie.

But many thought it was Broadway that stole the show. A live broadcast of the opening number of the hit musical "Hamilton" dazzling audiences and winning Best Musical Theater Album.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PEREIRA: That's the only way I'm going to be able to see that show was see it on the Grammys last night. Tickets are impossible to get.

CUOMO: Such a powerful...

PEREIRA: What a night. What a night.

CUOMO: Now, do you give Gaga more credit for the way she...

BERMAN: Lady Gaga to you.

CUOMO: Lady Gaga to me. Represented -- represented the dance moves...

PEREIRA: Oh, yes.

CUOMO: ... in addition.

PEREIRA: Absolutely. She threw herself into that role.

BERMAN: She was amazing.

CUOMO: She worked on that.

PEREIRA: She did.

CUOMO: She wanted to resemble him as much as possible.

PEREIRA: Kendrick Lamar. Some of our other favorites in there, obviously. Lady Gaga, you said. Adele. Adela had some struggles.

BERMAN: She blamed it on the audio equipment.

CUOMO: Uh-oh.

PEREIRA: Are you trying to say something about my girl Adele?

BERMAN: I'm just saying, you have to take personal responsibility.

CUOMO: It's going to get ugly early on this show.

PEREIRA: No, they had sound troubles last night. Yes, I will.

BERMAN: Yes, you will.

CUOMO: All right. You just saw Jeb Bush side by side -- she's going to beat you down in the break. I've got to get out of here. This is a new suit. The former president was there rallying voters in South Carolina. How did Bush 43 handle Trump's attacks, and can he save John Berman's life, ahead?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:21:43] BERMAN: All right. A sight not seen since 2004, George W. Bush on the campaign trail. This time he was in South Carolina, where Bush 43 trying to help his younger brother become Bush 45.

Let's bring back Dana Bash, Maggie Haberman, and Jackie Kucinich. You know, Maggie, he did not mention Donald Trump by name, but this speech from George W. Bush was all about Donald Trump.

HABERMAN: It was. I mean, it was very clear who he was talking about. Although I heard from one of George W. Bush's aides last night who said, you know, "He didn't mention Donald Trump, and you guys are making too much of this." We're not making too much of this. That's only who he could be talking about inflaming the party.

Let me rephrase that: He's not the only one. He could be talking about Ted Cruz, actually. He could be talking about a couple of people. But Donald Trump has dominated this race and has dominated Jeb Bush, frankly, throughout.

I thought that George W. Bush made a pretty compelling case about, certainly, the past of the party, where he thinks the party still should be. Whether it matters for his brother, I think, remains to be seen. But I think that it was about as effective a case as you're going to see.

However, I think if you had imagined a year ago when Jeb Bush was saying, "I'm my own man. This is not about my brother. This is not about my family," I would not have imagined this was going to be his closing week in South Carolina. It says something about where the race has gone.

CUOMO: Maggie, you're an ethnic. La familia. At the end of the day, you're always about where you come from. Let's let the people decide about what George W. Bush was saying in his remarks and whom he might be referring to. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

G. BUSH: Strength is not empty rhetoric. It is not bluster. It is not theatrics. Real strength, strength of purpose, comes from integrity and character. And in my experience, the strongest person usually isn't the loudest one in the room.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CUOMO: Jackie Kucinich, you first. What do you think of the impact and the context of the president's remarks?

KUCINICH: Well, you know, the Bushes are very popular in South Carolina. So this does seem like the right move going into these primaries.

The other thing that struck me, watching President Bush speak, is a kind of reminder how good he is on the stump versus how stilted Jeb still is. They're not -- it's not even close.

That said, there are a lot of warm feelings. Obviously, Barbara Bush definitely helped humanize Jeb a little bit in New Hampshire. But as Maggie says, it remains to be seen whether this works with South Carolina voters or not at the end of the day.

BERMAN: Well, in the departed, Dana, that question is "qui bono"? Who benefits here? Is it clear that Jeb Bush gets all the anti-Trump vote if "W" goes after Trump, or does Marco Rubio benefit? Or does having "W" campaign for him hurt Marco Rubio more than it hurts Donald Trump and help Jeb? There's a lot of different pieces at play here.

BASH: A lot of different pieces. And that's a good question. I think it's in large part why you not only heard the not-so-veiled allusions to Donald Trump. But also, when he was speaking about the pluses from his perspective about his brother, it was about experience. It was about strength. It's about, you know, that he was the governor of a southern state, contrasting him also, in that way, with Marco Rubio, who doesn't have that kind of experience, who is a first-term senator. So that was intentional too.

[06:25:05] And John, you covered George W. Bush when he was governor, when he was first running for president. And I covered his re- election campaign from the White House in 2004. It is such a reminder of the fact that, you know, when you are a politician there's that "it" factor that really can't be practiced. And Jackie is right. Just watching George W. Bush on the stage, the way he had the crowd, he has the it factor. He brought it out more than we have seen. His brother is more cerebral, is more thoughtful. Doesn't have that kind of "I want to wrap my arms around the audience" sensibility.

CUOMO: You know, maybe I'm a little blind to this personally. How does it work in your mind, the dynamic of the two brothers? The -- George W. comes out there: "Oh, he's better on the stump. Oh, he's a reminder of what Jeb may not be." But just by dint of their being siblings, it's not the same kind of competitiveness. Does the brother's superiority to the benefit of Jeb Bush in this instance, or do you think it's just straight contrast?

HABERMAN: I don't think it's straight contrast. I do think there is a benefit. In South Carolina, where the Bush family has been dominant in politics for the last 25 years. And that state was very crucial to their successes.

I thought that the joint interview that they did last night together on FOX News was a little less of a great visual. I think the -- and it's always very uncomfortable when you see people in these kind of joint interviews, with them sitting next to each other. I did think the contrast was terrific. I did think it was much better having George W. Bush as a surrogate. I thought he was very effective on the stump.

BERMAN: Let's listen to one bit of that interview, because it was interesting haring George W. Bush actually answer questions about the campaign with Sean Hannity last night. Let's listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEAN HANNITY, FOX NEWS HOST: We watched the attacks and the back and forth. They get you mad, they get you frustrated?

G. BUSH: No, it doesn't get me mad. I get puzzled sometimes. But no, I know Jeb can handle it. As a matter of fact, these campaigns need to be tough, because the job is tough. And we want to see who's got the ability to endure. If you wilt on the campaign trail, you'll darn sure wilt in the Oval Office.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: You have a good point, Maggie. One of the things that Frank Rooney, who covered George Bush in the year 2000, said is that George Bush always looked comfortable in his own skin and always looked like his suits fit just right. Jeb, he doesn't have that benefit sometimes. Jeb always seems to be doing a little bit of self- exploration there.

BASH: You know, that is -- if I could add that comment you just played to me was vintage George W. Bush about what we were talking about. That he's kind of dinging all of Jeb Bush's opponents.

He was clearly talking about Marco Rubio wilting on the campaign trail. If you wilt there, you can't -- you can't make it in the Oval Office. That was something that we heard behind the scenes from Bush officials after Marco Rubio's disastrous debate performance in New Hampshire. So you know, he -- he is subtle, but he's making his point very clearly about Jeb Bush's opponents.

CUOMO: You know, for all the talk about establishment, bad. Establishment, bad. First of all, you have to expect, Jackie, how George W. comes out and says, "I'm proud to wear the label 'establishment.' I know what built this kind of change in this country."

Also, South Carolina, what you're pointing to is contrast between the two siblings. Might it play differently in the south where that dedication to family and that understanding of heritage may play differently, especially and specifically the heritage of the Bush family when it can comes to politicking in that state?

KUCINICH: Absolutely. It could play -- I mean, again, the Bush family is very, very strong in South Carolina and in other parts of the south. So it's hard to think that this actually, you know, hurts Jeb Bush. It might, maybe, later down the line in those states.

But yes, I mean, to answer your question, I think that this is a net positive for Jeb at this point in the campaign.

CUOMO: You can't run away from your family. He has made the decision to now run dead straight dead toward them.

Dana, Jackie, Maggie, John, thank you very much for being here. The Republican presidential candidates are going to make their pitch directly to the voters in South Carolina. A CNN special event. A live town hall tomorrow and Thursday, both moderated by our man, Anderson Cooper.

Tomorrow, we'll have Carson, Rubio and Cruz on the stage. Not just able to go at each other. They're going to have to deal with real people and their problems. And Kasich, Bush and Trump on Thursday night. Join us. Both nights are at 8 p.m. Eastern only not on CNN.

PEREIRA: All right. Who's to blame for deadly airstrikes on two field hospitals in Syria. The group, Doctors without Borders, claim they were deliberate. We're live inside Syria next.

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