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New Day
John Kasich Interview; Remembering Justice Antonin Scalia. Aired 8:30-9a ET
Aired February 19, 2016 - 08:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[08:31:19] CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: All right, joining us right now is the governor of Ohio, Republican Presidential Candidate John Kasich.
Governor, it's good of you to be with us this morning. Appreciate it.
GOV. JOHN KASICH (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Thank you very much. Thank you very much.
CUOMO: What is your message to Republican voters about what happens if Donald Trump is the nominee of the GOP? What happens in the general election?
KASICH: I don't have any message about anybody else, Chris. I'm not talking about Donald Trump this morning. Voters are going to have a vote here and then we're going to move on to a bunch of other states. And my message is that, you know, I've been a person who's not been in the establishment lane or the anti-establishment lane, but I do make the establishment nervous because I've been a change agent and I've been able to, in Washington, balance budgets, cut taxes and get in a position where we had job growth and better lives for everybody. And also, in Ohio, we've gone from a loss of 350,000 jobs to a gain over 400,000. And the formula's always the same, common sense regulations, lower taxes and fiscal responsibility. If you do that, you get economic growth and that's what we need in America for our families, our communities and our country.
CUOMO: Well, governor, as you know, this election is very much become a point of contrast, and that's why I was giving you the opportunity because of the presumption with Trump right now in the polls. But I understand you making your own message. And let me ask you this, you say I was considered a change agent when I was in Washington, D.C. Compromise is a bad word in the primary right now. What do you want to tell people about that? About how it actually works once you get elected and you have to go to Washington, D.C., and make things happen?
KASICH: Yes. Well, we don't have a parliamentary system. We've got - we don't - we're not like England. We have to work together. I mean if we want to solve the problems of the border, Social Security, wage growth, balancing budgets, if we want to do these things, you can't do it with just one party. You've got to have some other people working and participating. And, look, I mean, what we have to realize here is, if you take a look at Mr. Trump's votes, so, you know, if he gets 30 percent, that means 70 percent are not for him.
And it isn't my job to have to talk about who is or what he is or what his plans are. I'm a true believer. I think I've got to, you know, sell what I'm about, and either people buy it or they don't. You know, I had these - I had these two little girls come on the bus with their parents last night and I - one of them was like eight and the other one was like nine. And one of them says to me, actually says to me, she says, how can you stay so positive when everything is so negative? I almost, you know, fell down when I heard that out of the mouth of a - of a nine or a 10 year old.
Look, it's not worth it to be engaged in demolition derby for me. I don't want to be in demolition derby. If that's what it takes, I'm going home to Ohio, OK? But we'll see what happens here in the next couple weeks, Chris.
CUOMO: So in terms of what matters to you, I think we got a good look at it, as somebody who's known you a very long time. You're out on the trail. You're holding your on event. A young man gets up and starts talking about how hard it is. And you get exposed to a lot of that on the trail. People don't understand just how much humanity you come into contact, how many people are hurting and how the candidate has to process that and help in those situations.
I want to play this for people and I want you to tell me what was going through your mind as you met and embraced this young man.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A man who was like my second dad, he killed himself. And then a few months later, my parents got a divorce. And then a few months later, my dad lost his job. But - and I was in a really dark place for a long time. I was pretty depressed. But I found hope and I found it in the Lord and in my friends. And now I've found it in my presidential candidate that I support. And I'd really appreciate one of those hugs you've been talking about.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[08:35:17] CUOMO: Now, gov, it's not just giving the hug. It's, what is in you when you're hearing that young man? He affected you. Tell people why.
KASICH: You know, Chris, it's been happening. You know, I had a woman pleading with me about the problem with epilepsy just a night - you know, the day before yesterday. I had a guy drive from New York to talk to me about his son's illness. I've had - I mean, I don't - I don't need to over think this. It's just that I've become convinced that a lot of people out across our country who are lonely. I don't know - I don't know why they feel comfortable to do it. What was going through my mind is, this is happening again. And it has not been unusual for me to see. And, you know, yesterday morning I - I was at - a lady who came with a therapy dog to see me and she's - she is fighting alcoholism. And I took her in the back room and asked her what she wanted to do? And she needs to let the people who are - who could help her to be able to be in a position to give her a chance because they might be saving her life. I asked her if she'd been to 12 steps. She said she had been. And I told her to ask the Lord to help her to give her strength.
I - look, this is - I - you know, I didn't expect to be doing this, but I can do it. I've done it, you know, for a lot of years now where people tell me certain things, and it's a privilege. And I - I called a friend of mine - you know, a great guy of faith. Somebody who played a pivotal role in my life and in helping me after my parents' death and I said, why is this happening? He said, shut up, don't worry about it and we'll think about it in a year.
CUOMO: Hey, you know -
KASICH: That's probably the right way to think about it.
CUOMO: It's always better to feel than to think when it comes to empathy in a lot of situations. You think that's what's - that's what we need more of? Let's keep it positive, instead of saying that's what's missing. You think that's what we need more of?
KASICH: Yes -
CUOMO: More humility, more vulnerability, more sweetness as strength, because that is really in short supply right now, especially in this race.
KASICH: Yes. Well, if you think about your dad, who was admired very much, Mario Cuomo, the former governor of New York, and he would go make these speeches at these commencements and they would publish them in the paper and I would read them. And he painted a picture of the way that America could be, about us coming together, about communities and families and - and, you know, look, I think we got to get the jobs going. We need conservative principles, Chris, to be able to get the economy moving again. But once that happens, you know, I know, most of our viewers know that the glue that holds America together are the relationships that we have where we live. We're not going to have somebody riding in, in a white stallion to fix education, fight drugs. We've got to do it right where we live. And all of us have to live a life a little bit bigger than ourselves.
I think this is probably why I'm doing better. Maybe I was supposed to have an opportunity to talk about these things. I don't know, Chris, but I'm having a great time. But without the policy changes that we need to get this country moving again, the rest of those things become much more difficult to do. So my philosophy is, economic growth, economic growth, economic growth, and then leave no one behind. And that means that we come together as a community to do the things that we want to do that allows us to reunite again.
CUOMO: Well, as we've all learned, often what you believe most deeply is something that's worth losing for, not just figuring out what it takes to win.
Governor Kasich, good luck to you out there and thank you for being with us on NEW DAY today.
KASICH: Good to talk to you. Thank you for the interview this morning. Thank you very much.
CUOMO: Always, gov.
Mic.
MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN ANCHOR: Thoughtful conversation there.
Saying good-bye to a Supreme Court justice. Ceremonies beginning today for Antonin Scalia. We are going to hear ahead some personal stories on his life and looking forward to his legacy, coming up.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[08:43:09] PEREIRA: All right, here we go with the five things to know on a Friday.
The next two contests in the 2016 race just hours away. Donald Trump, Jeb Bush, John Kasich delivering closing arguments at CNN's town hall last night. Trump toning things down a bit after calling the pope disgraceful for questioning his faith.
A nail biter, meanwhile, for the Democrats in Nevada. Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton both throwing increasingly bitter jabs ahead of tomorrow's caucuses there.
The U.S. launching air strikes on an ISIS base in Libya. The operative behind two deadly attacks in Tunisia was the target. Intelligence indicating that foreign fighters were planning an attack.
In less than an hour's time, a private ceremony will be held inside the Supreme Court for late Justice Antonin Scalia. His body will lie in repose today ahead of his funeral tomorrow.
Caught on video, a tour helicopter, oh my goodness, crashing near Pearl Harbor. Five people aboard, four of them were quickly rescued. The NTSB is investigating the cause.
For more on the five things to know, be sure to visit newdaycnn.com.
John.
JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: All right, Sunday night, three teams of CNN anchors test their knowledge on all things presidential. The CNN quiz show "Road to the White House," watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: This year people want change.
BERMAN: Change we can believe in.
COOPER: Not more of the same.
KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: Who - what, what?
JAKE TAPPER, CNN ANCHOR: We're going to win the quiz show. S.E. CUPP, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Yes.
VAN JONES, CNN POLITICAL CONTRIBUTOR: This guy's won 97 times.
COOPER: Given the smirk on your face, I think you feel pretty good, don't you there, John Berman?
TAPPER: I've heard that Berman won.
CUPP: He won, but you weren't there.
TAPPER: Right. I've never lost.
CUPP: Ah, for the record, winning.
TAPPER: Winning! Our moto is winning. That's what we're going to bring to the quiz show.
CUPP: Exactly.
COOPER: John King.
TAPPER: John's a smart guy. He's better with walls than with people.
JOHN KING, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: The King-Jones ticket.
JONES: No mercy.
KING: Tapper, S.E. Cupp, I mean, follow the money.
CUPP: Save it. Save it.
KING: So Berman's won, what, three times?
JONES: I don't know if it's true. I just keep hearing that Berman's a (EXPLETIVE DELETED).
[08:45:01] BERMAN: Where's the beef, Jake Tapper?
BOLDUAN: Where is the beef, John King?
BERMAN: Senator -
BOLDUAN: You ain't no John Berman.
BERMAN: That's right.
COOPER: Oh, now they're just being cruel.
KING: I'm John King.
JONES: And I'm Van Jones.
TAPPER: I'm Jake Tapper.
CUPP: And I'm S.E. Cupp. BERMAN: I'm John Berman.
BOLDUAN: I'm Kate Bolduan.
EVERYONE: And we approve this message.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Sort of.
(END VIDEOCLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PEREIRA: A private ceremony will get underway shortly at the Supreme Court to honor the late Justice Antonin Scalia. Joining us to discuss his life, his legacy, are Justice Scalia's dear friend, Professor Bryan Garner who teaches law at Southern Methodist University and co- authored two books with Justice Scalia. Also joining us, CNN senior legal analyst Jeffrey Toobin.
Gentlemen, it is such a beautiful thing to be able to remember somebody's life at a time like this. I know it's very hard for the family to lose someone and his colleagues, but I think it's important, also, to celebrate the life.
Professor Garner, you were traveling with Justice Scalia recently on a trip to Asia. Talk to me about this friend of yours, and your final memories of him.
BRYAN GARNER, PROFESSOR, SMU DEDMAN SCHOOL OF LAW: Well, we spent two of his last three weeks together in Asia, in Singapore and Hong Kong. He was a wonderfully companionable friend. He was in his personal life as in his professional life, he was relentlessly logical. He loved is a Socratic dialogue, counter arguments and - arguments and counter arguments and seeing things through to their logical conclusion.
[08:50:10] I think he was a cross between Samuel Johnson, the great 18th century thinker, and Socrates.
PEREIRA: Wow.
GARNER: He did not like fuzzy thinking. He - and he was that way in personal life as well as professional.
PEREIRA: Which I'm sure would make it a challenge to co-author books with him.
GARNER: Oh.
PEREIRA: Jeffrey, let's talk about the impact that this man and this mind had on the court system in America. What will you -- do you think the legal legacy will be of Justice Scalia?
JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Well, I think, frankly, that's up for grabs, Michaela. It depends on who succeeds him at the Supreme Court. If a Democrat succeeds in getting a nominee, that would be a fifth Democratic vote on the Supreme Court and I think that would diminish Justice Scalia's legacy a great deal.
He was a very conservative voice, he believed in a school of interpretation called originalism, meaning the Constitution should be interpreted as it originally was understood by the framers. A lot of Democrats believe in what they call the living Constitution, that it - that the meaning changes over time.
That's why the fight over his succession is so important, because it's about ideas and about what the Constitution means in people's real lives, and that's just up for grabs.
PEREIRA: Jeffrey, what do you think people -- not people, what do you think he would make of this struggle about how his successor is named and the process that is - they're taking right now?
TOOBIN: I don't think he would like it. I don't think any of the justices like how political -- how politically the court is viewed, but I think he would also understand that these are big issues. They're very important. It's very consequential.
You know, this -- we talk about the Supreme Court in terms of abstractions. You know, is abortion going to be legal in many states in the United States? You know, is it legal to discriminate against gay people in the United States? That's what these fights are about. It's not just abstractions. And Justice Scalia was at the heart of these disputes for 30 years and we should remember that...
GARNER: We should remember that his confirmation was 98 to 0.
PEREIRA: Yes.
TOOBIN: Right.
GARNER: And that in those days, it was much less political. We wrote about this in our book, "Reading Law," that when judges take it upon themselves to amend the Constitution themselves, then the entire court becomes politicized. And if judges hold themselves to having words mean pretty much what they meant when they were -- when they took affect, but applied to the modern world...
PEREIRA: Okay.
GARNER: ... not in some simple Simon way, but applied to the modern world as the closest analog, then judges are much less political. But if you allow judges to amend the Constitution every couple of years, then it becomes highly a politicized process.
PEREIRA: We're looking at some of your photos. Hold on - we're looking at some of the photos of your time together with the justice, and I know that he took umbrage of you calling him Professor Justice Scalia. He preferred his nickname, Nino. What a joyful face he has. We can see it right there. I'm sure there's going to be more pictures shown over the course of the memorial and the funeral tomorrow, which I know -- I understand, Professor, you'll be attending.
Jeffrey Toobin, Professor, thank you so much for helping us remember this terrific man and a powerhouse on our Supreme Court. Thanks for joining us today.
GARNER: Thank you, Michaela.
PEREIRA: We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: LAPD Officer Deon Joseph patrols one of the toughest neighborhoods in America. Now, he grew up thinking police were the problem in minority communities. Then, he still decided to become a cop. CNN's Sara Sidner has the story for you.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
OFFICER DEON SANDERS, LAPD: Hey, guys. How are you doing? Happy birthday. My man acting right? You know I got you, I got you.
SARA SIDNER, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Deon Joseph has a story for every corner of this 50-block mass of humanity known as Skid Row. Population, far too many.
JOSEPH: Those are the people I need our government to - our judges to come off the bench and take a walk with me, please, and help these people.
He's suffering from internal bleeding.
: When I first got there, you'd have people walking into the station with their intestines hanging out, their arms broken backwards, black eyes and they didn't even want a police report. They just wanted to hide from their attackers.
Do you know the name of the person that hurt you?
SIDNER: The workplace Joseph chose is infamous for its homeless population.
JOSEPH: Are you a veteran, sir?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, sir.
JOSEPH: I got a friend who works Veteran's Affairs. He will take you off the streets today, if you want it.
SIDNER (on camera): Why do you keep going back to a place where you yourself describe it as Dante's Inferno, Armageddon?
JOSEPH: It's my upbringing. My parents never gave up on people, I don't give up on people.
SIDNER (voice-over): His parents fostered 41 children and Officer Joseph found his calling here. This is year 18 on one of the hardest beats at the LAPD, surrounded by the mentally ill, the hopelessly addicted, their pushers and the downtrodden.
JOSEPH: Hello, sweetheart. UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi. How are you? Always a blessing.
JOSEPH: How are you doing? All right, you keeping that man in line?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. How are you all?
When I first met him, me and my kids got here from Georgia and we were homeless.
SIDNER: Until Officer Joseph walked by, he found them housing and offered tough love.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My fiance, he put him in prison and by him putting him in prison saved his life.
SIDNER (on camera): So, you're not mad at him?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, my, I love this man. You hear about the negative. You don't ever hear about the positive. He's a wonderful man.
SIDNER: You're crying. Why are you crying?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Because he's an awesome man.
JOSPEH: Let's just do something that's real, and that's what I need more than anything, before I retire.
SIDNER: But you can't retire from family, and that's exactly how Joseph sees the people society forgot.
JOSEPH: How are you?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm okay, how are you?
JOSEPH: Good to see you, sweetie
SIDNER (voice-over): Sara Sidner, CNN, Los Angeles.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PEREIRA: I've met him. He is an incredible individual. He is, and his twin brother is also in the LAPD. They're a powerhouse, the two of them.
BERMAN: Big shoulders, literally and figuratively on that man.
CUOMO: Yes.
PEREIRA: I hope he doesn't retire for some time.
CUOMO: I love it. A guy so big but his biggest muscle is his heart.
PEREIRA: His heart, absolutely. We love heart.
Time for NEWSROOM with Carol Costello who is live from the U.S. Supreme Court. Hi, Carol.
CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: Yes, it's a nice way to end the show. You guys have a great day. Thank you.
