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Rubio Questions Trump's Readiness To Lead; Would Florida Loss Doom Rubio's Campaign; Heated Insults Fly At Republican Debate; Romney Team Looks At Blocking Trump At Convention; All Republicans Commit to Supporting GOP Nominee; E-Mail Saga Surrounds Clinton's Campaign; Rivals Pounce Over Trump University Lawsuit, Fact-Checking "Trump University" Claims. Aired 7:30-8a ET

Aired March 04, 2016 - 07:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[07:31:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. MARCO RUBIO (R-FL), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: If Donald Trump is the Republican nominee we are going to have a party that's divided. We're going to have a party that has to somehow justify to itself why it's voting for this man.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN HOST: Marco Rubio actually said last night he would support Donald Trump as the nominee. Odd, given what he was saying about him the rest of the night. Once, Rubio's message was ignore the insults. Last night, it was ignore anything but the insults.

So, after just one Super Tuesday win and with low poll numbers in his own home state, what does the path forward look like for team Rubio? Let's ask one of his senior advisors, Jason Roe. Jason, good to have you this morning. The change is stark, and obvious, and ugly. What do you think it gets you to attack the person in the Donald Trump?

JASON ROE, SENIOR ADVISOR TO SEN. MARCO RUBIO: Well, I just think last night was embarrassing for the country, that Donald Trump has taken this process to the gutter the way he has. At some point we've just got to stand up and say enough is enough. I've said before that I wouldn't tolerate this behavior in my 6-year-old. Last night I couldn't tolerate my 6-year-old watching that debate. I had to send him into the other room because it had gotten so bad.

CUOMO: I'm with you on that.

ROE: We just -- it really is.

CUOMO: I'm with you on that. I couldn't let my kid watch it either. But my question to you is you have to own some of this responsibility, don't you? Your man brought up the hands. Your man has changed tone talking about personal things that he used to ignore and condemn. Now, he's owning the strategy as much as anybody. ROE: Well, I think we have to stop blaming everyone else for Donald Trump's behavior. I think we need to stop making excuses for where he's taken this process.

CUOMO: Even when you -- even when you echo it?

ROE: What Marco did --

CUOMO: But, then why copy it?

ROE: What you're referring to was -- what you're referring to is Marco having a little bit of fun on the stump at Trump's expense. Standing on the debate stage with the entire world looking at the four candidates and sizing up who should be leader of the free world is a much different situation. That is a time when we should be having a substantive discussion about policy and the direction of our country.

And the reality is the media is complicit in this, too, because every time somebody says something snarky and entertaining, that's what gets the clip. But when we talk about substantive stuff it gets ignored, and Donald Trump continues to manipulate the media to drag all the attention his direction, and it's one of the reasons that we are where we are today in this process.

CUOMO: Well, fair criticism to a point. You noticed last night who they were using as an example of when you test Donald Trump, right? Not their own morning show -- mine. That's why he hasn't been on for two months. You saw Alisyn ask a tough question, you saw me ask a tough question. She was just giving me a look when I said my show. I had to cover myself there for a second.

So, what was the point in that? We ask those questions. The question is whether or not you want them. The senator was on today -- that's great. He's turned down a lot of invitations also. So, you've got a point about the media, but not all candidates are the same -- not all media is the same and that's why you saw CNN mentioned so much last night.

There has been a shift. The point is why? Do you believe the strategy now is let's do what we have to to keep him down -- Trump -- so we can get to a convention?

ROE: Well, I think, going back to the media on this, this process is supposed to be a vetting of the candidates and I don't think there's been a thorough vetting of the candidates. And so, at some point it becomes the other campaign's responsibility to point out the shortcomings of the other candidates in terms of policy, character, and some of the other things.

CUOMO: Your shortcomings in the policy. You were calling out the shortcomings in his hands. I mean, you do have to own that part.

ROE: Again, that's --

CUOMO: And Iunderstand why you would do it -- I just want you to own it. ROE: That's fun on the stump. Well, I own it, but it's -- I own the fun-on-the-stump dynamic of it. Not standing and having a debate for two hours that is talking about the direction of the country. It's a much different setting, a much different environment, and the reality is that we haven't been able to have really substantive discussions because anytime you try to have one, Donald Trump immediately defaults to insulting and attacking anyone that he disagrees with.

CUOMO: I'll tell you what --

ROE: He was challenged multiple times last night to offer policy prescriptions --

CUOMO: True, true.

ROE: -- and every time he turned to the attacks.

[07:35:16]

CUOMO: I understand where you're coming from on that level. I just want to make this very clear because we're in a very critical point right now. The senator is invited on NEW DAY every day -- certainly every week -- to make the case. I want you to know that opportunity exists, Jason. The senator knows it. Please pass it along, as well. And it extends to you, as well.

ROE: Then you wouldn't be able to have me on, Chris.

CUOMO: Well, I'll have you on. I don't usually like to have men that are that much better looking than me on the show, but for you, I'll make an exception. What is this convention plan? What do you think might happen if you can make it to a convention? Let's say you don't get the 1,237, which doing that math looks very likely at this point. But, you do have enough to keep Trump from getting to 1,237. What could happen at a convention and how are you planning for it?

ROE: Well, I think every campaign has a responsibility to plan for the contingencies there. As you mentioned, you need 1,237 delegates to get the nomination. I think Donald Trump is at 298. Marco's somewhere around 100. We've got four states voting on Saturday. That's another 150 delegates. So, there is a long way to go in this thing. We're only about 15 states in out of the 50 plus states and territories that will be involved in this process so we've got to prepare for that.

I think what happens over the next 10 states prior to Florida on March 15th -- what happens in Florida, I think, really will shake this out in a serious way and we're going to find out who the true alternative to Donald Trump is. And we may end up having to take this disaster of a process all the way to convention. And really, at the end of the day, I think from our perspective is about our country.

This is not just about Marco Rubio. As a country, are we really going to consider nominating somebody like Donald Trump to be the leader of the free world? And, I think the same people are going to stand up at some point and enough. CUOMO: Two last questions. One is easy, one is hard. If you don't win in Florida are you still going to go on, and explain how Marco Rubio and you, and your whole campaign, can feel the things that you do about Donald Trump, as expressed last night and every day out on the hustings, and then say but I'll support him as the nominee?

ROE: Well, I think at the end of the day as obscene as Donald Trump is as a candidate, the policies of Hillary Clinton and her agenda are even more obscene. And so, I think it's, frankly, a Hobson's choice when we get to it. But with this is about is our country and the policies. The continuation of the Obama administration's policies are, frankly, even more dangerous to the country and our well-being than Donald Trump's antics and behavior.

CUOMO: And you'll stay in even if you don't win Florida?

ROE: I think it's not just Florida. I think it's the 10 states before and where we are in the delegate count that will really determine the path forward. So I think there's a lot of stuff that we have to consider about moving forward.

CUOMO: Jason Roe, thank you for coming on NEW DAY and answering the questions. Look forward to seeing you again.

ROE: Good seeing you again.

CUOMO: Mic --

MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN HOST: All right, there was plenty of fire exchanged in last night's debate. Trump, Cruz, Rubio, Kasich -- who were the winners, who were the losers? We'll get into that next.

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[07:42:09]

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN HOST: Republican front-runner Donald Trump taking heat from all sides at a fiery debate. Marco Rubio and Ted Cruz hitting him on everything from his policy ideas to his failed businesses.

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TED CRUZ (R-TX), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: You know, Marco's dad started as a bartender. My dad started washing dishes. And, yet, you know how many Americans wanted those jobs? Roughly 300 applied. Donald hired 17.

RUBIO: You argue that you're here to fight on behalf of the American worker, but when you have chances to help the American workers, you're making your clothes overseas and you're hiring your workers from overseas.

(END VIDEO CLIP) CAMEROTA: All right, joining us now to talk about all of this is CNN political commentator and host of CNN's "SMERCONISH", Michael Smerconish. Good morning, Michael.

MICHAEL SMERCONISH, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Good morning.

CAMEROTA: How do you describe what you watched last night?

SMERCONISH: Victory for Hillary. I think that the GOP brand is really suffering in this process. Alisyn, I'm reminded of the fact that after 2012 -- after the Romney loss -- you'll recall that Reince Priebus commissioned the so-called autopsy of what had gone wrong. And one of the major impacts of the autopsy was to try and rein in the debates. There had been more than 20 debates in the last cycle. They thought that the brand had been harmed, in large measure, because of some of the audience reaction.

And I think that the brand was really injured last night. I am mindful of the fact that Republican turnout thus far exceeds the Democratic turnout. I think there's an enthusiasm issue on the Democratic side of the aisle. But the behavior on that stage last night, I think, comes back to haunt them in the fall.

CAMEROTA: I know that you often watch with your trusty whiteboard and you have arrows going up, and arrows going down, and arrows going to the side of who's up, who's down at any moment. Was there a winner last night?

SMERCONISH: Probably not. I think that Ted Cruz had a particularly good evening. I think that John Kasich continues to distinguish himself as being the lone adult on that stage. But, that core constituency for Donald Trump is so locked in -- and Chris made reference to this earlier this morning -- that I just don't think that it matters.

I mean, yesterday Mitt Romney delivered a stunning set of remarks. It was an incredible 20-minute takedown of Donald Trump, but he was the wrong messenger and it came too late. I don't know that anything alters the landscape right now.

And, if you'll indulge me, I think that the real issue is whether they're going to try and defeat Donald Trump in the upcoming primaries and caucuses, or concede that they can't do that, and instead, concentrate all of the energies on thwarting him in Cleveland. And that's what Gov. Romney seemed to be suggesting yesterday.

CAMEROTA: Well, he's back at it this morning. Just moments ago, Mitt Romney was on another morning show and he talked again about his strategy to attempt to take down Donald Trump. Listen to this, Michael.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MITT ROMNEY, FORMER GOV. OF MASSACHUSETTS: Well, there's no question I'm going to do everything within the normal political bounds to make sure that we don't nominate Donald Trump. I think he would be terribly unfit for office. I don't think he has the temperament to be president. And so, I want to see one of the other three become the nominee.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMEROTA: But, Michael, here's the rub. Donald Trump supporters don't care what Mitt Romney says. In fact, it only energizes them and makes them even more certain in their conviction that Donald Trump is right because they think that Mitt Romney represents everything that they don't like about the GOP.

SMERCONISH: Totally agreed. He's the embodiment of everything that has motivated the Trump constituency thus far. But, Gov. Romney's got an idea that is worthy of consideration. Yesterday, he said in his remarks that Marco Rubio should win Florida, and he hopes that John Kasich wins Ohio in the same way that Ted Cruz won Texas.

[07:46:28] What he's really saying, I think, is gentlemen, win your own states. Cobble together a collection of other states so that Donald Trump can't get to the magic number of 1,237, and let's decide this in Cleveland. He did not expressly say it, and last night they had the opportunity to adopt that line, and they didn't. And I think that by the time they wake up and realize that perhaps that Romney path is the only way that Trump doesn't become the GOP nominee, it will be too late.

CAMEROTA: You make such a good point because at the end of the debate last night they were asked, again, to reiterate their pledge, if they would, that they will support whoever the nominee is. And after calling Trump all the things that they have called him -- I mean, during the course of this election, a con artist, a flip-flopper, a liar, unfit for office -- they all said yes, they would support the nominee. How is that going to work?

SMERCONISH: There's no credibility. How do you call Donald Trump a con man one day and then fast-forward a couple of months and stand on the dais in Cleveland and put your arms raised in the air together? You know, this morning I've been doing some thinking and some research. What is the most recent comparison where one Republican candidate went after another, and then came around to support him?

The worst I can think of is 1980. George Herbert Walker Bush says Ronald Reagan's trickle-down theories are voodoo economics. Voodoo economics is nothing compared to the kind of sniping that has gone on in this campaign thus far.

CAMEROTA: Michael, could we look at the other side of the aisle for a moment --

SMERCONISH: Yes.

CAMEROTA: -- because this weekend is, of course, another Democratic debate. And there's been some news this week about Hillary Clinton and her e-mail -- the e-mail scandal. The guy -- the top I.T. guy -- her staffer who set up the private server has been given immunity. He can now talk to the FBI. How do you think this plays this weekend and beyond?

SMERCONISH: So, as an attorney, I'm totally cognizant of the fact that because he's given immunity does not necessarily mean that there was anything unlawful here. It's an investigative tool. But to your question, I think Bernie Sanders is making a mistake. He's making a mistake in not talking about her "damn e-mails". A federal judge, a week ago, appointed by Bill Clinton, said there's a "reasonable suspicion that the public's right to know for Freedom of Information Act requests has been thwarted."

Why Bernie Sanders doesn't raise this as an issue of transparency, or lack of transparency, is beyond me because that's the same issue he's talking about with big money when he talks about the 501(c)(4)'s and how we don't know who's standing behind all these enormous contributions and ads, and so forth.

He should make the same point about her e-mails because, Alisyn, you know what the internals show about her honesty and trustworthy numbers. They're horrific, even among Democrats. And he needs to exploit that or he can't win.

CAMEROTA: Michael Smerconish, always great to talk to you. Thank you.

SMERCONISH: You, too.

CAMEROTA: Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders will square off in their next debate on Sunday night in Flint, Michigan. Anderson Cooper moderates this one. It's Sunday, as we said, 8:00 p.m. eastern only here on CNN.

CUOMO: So, how big a problem is Trump University for Trump's presidential bid? We have the man who is leading the fight in court. He is an attorney general. Let's test the case.

[07:50:00]

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[07:53:09]

CUOMO: Republican presidential front-runner, Donald Trump, facing tough critique in last night's debate over a lawsuit alleging Trump University was a fraud. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RUBIO: There's a difference between flexibility and telling people whatever you think you need to say to get them to do what you want them to do. And that's what Donald has done throughout his career.

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: That's not right.

RUBIO: Well, he did -- that's why Trump University is so relevant here. TRUMP: This is a case I could have settled very easily, but I don't settle cases very easily when I'm right. Ninety-eight percent approval rating.

RUBIO: That's false.

TRUMP: We have an A from the Better Business Bureau.

RUBIO: That's false.

TRUMP: We have a 98 percent approval rating of people who took the course.

RUBIO: That's false.

MEGYN KELLY, HOST, FOX NEWS: The rating from the Better Business Bureau was a D-. That's the last publicly available rating in 2010, and it was a result of the number of complaints they had received.

TRUMP: But, it was elevated to an A.

KELLY: Just --

TRUMP: It was elevated --

KELLY: That's never been publicly released.

TRUMP: It was elevated to an A. I could give it to you.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CUOMO: Trump wasting no time after that, tweeting out his Better Business Bureau A rating. This controversy is not going away. A judge just said that the case will move forward. Joining us now is the man bringing that case, New York's Attorney General Eric Schneiderman. Good to have you, sir.

ERIC SCHNEIDERMAN, ATTORNEY GENERAL, NEW YORK: Good to be here, Chris.

CUOMO: So, first of all, be our fact-checker. Who better than you? The rating of that company -- my research shows that it bounced around a lot. Saying it got an A rating -- is that a fair assessment?

SCHNEIDERMAN: No, it had a rating that went down. Trump University started in 2005. The New York State Education Department started going after them very quickly because you can't just put up a sign and say we're a university in New York.

CUOMO: There's no accreditation.

SCHNEIDERMAN: There was no accreditation. The teachers were not certified for anything. The curriculum wasn't approved. And so, they eventually changed their name to Trump Entrepreneur Initiative Institute as it was winding down in 2010, and it may be that the Trump Entrepreneurship Institute got a different rating. But, Trump University, as the fact-checkers have noted -- the last rating was something like a D.

CUOMO: And, is it true that he could have settled this very easily? Were you looking to give him a deal and he said no?

SCHNEIDERMAN: No. Obviously, the case didn't settle. There were discussions --

CUOMO: But, he's making it sound like he didn't want to settle. He wants to fight because he's right. Is that accurate?

SCHNEIDERMAN: He settles cases. When you're in court -- when you're dealing in the legal system, you can't make things up the way you can in a campaign. There are documented cases he has settled repeatedly. People negotiated to see if they could settle his one, and once we get closer to trial -- or, summary judgment on something here -- they may reopen the negotiations. But, he's not someone who doesn't settle cases. I'm not sure why people aren't just checking the records because it's publicly available.

CUOMO: So, attorney general, what have you got? What is the case against Trump University?

SCHNEIDERMAN: It's a pretty straightforward case. It's a bait and switch game. Mr. Trump's role was just as a pitchman and he did ads saying my hand-picked instructors will teach you my personal secrets. You just copy what I did and get rich.

The president of the university, Michael Sexton, has already testified Trump did not have anything to do with picking the instructors, and he had nothing to do with developing the curriculum. It wasn't his personal secrets. So, people were lured in with the idea they were going to learn from Mr. Trump.

And, in fact, they were hiring instructors -- because we've got the transcripts of the sessions. We've got the scripts they gave instructors. Hiring people who worked in retail, worked in fast food. Those were the instructors that were offered.

[07:56:10]

CUOMO: So, what makes this different than any kind of seminar where people buy in on the promise of getting better in some facet of their life and they pay for it, and it either does or doesn't give them some benefit?

SCHNEIDERMAN: Well, because you are allowed to run seminars but you're not allowed to commit fraud. If you tell people we are going to teach you Donald Trump's secrets and he's never had any part in writing the curriculum, that's fraud. You can't take money from people with false representation.

So, the appellate division in New York just upheld all of our claims going forward. We can proceed against him for fraud, for deceptive business practices. We have already gotten summary judgment that's he personally liable for unlawfully running an unlicensed university. The rest of our claims will now go forward. CUOMO: What is the exposure of his liability?

SCHNEIDERMAN: It's millions of dollars. Some of it we want for the state of New York because they broke all of our rules and regulations and were holding themselves out as a university when they weren't. And the other would be to collect money for the students -- the people who were ripped off who want their money back.

CUOMO: How many people were hurt in this and how badly were they hurt?

SCHNEIDERMAN: Oh, thousands of people and millions of dollars. A lot of these folks paid $20,000, $25,000, $35,000 -- not rich people. In fact, one of the most disturbing thing we found from the transcripts of the seminars is instructors telling people you can't do well in real estate unless you have a lot of credit. Call your credit card company and tell them to raise your line of credit. And then they can get some of these people to use that extra credit to buy more Trump seminars.

CUOMO: Now, is it a fair qualification of this that even if you make this case, this is a civil suit. This is about liability -- really comes down to money. It's not criminal. It's not like what could happen to Hillary Clinton. That's what you hear from the Trump camp that don't equate this problem with what's going on with Clinton. That's the FBI. That's criminal. This is something very different. It's just about money. It's just civil. Is that a fair comparison?

SCHNEIDERMAN: No, not at all. This is a case about fraud. If you're talking about someone who you're looking at to be president, I think the issue of credibility is very important and this is a case that is not even a complicated one. But, look, we -- Boston attorney general's office -- fraud. People who hold themselves out to be lawyers who aren't, people who hold themselves out to be doctors that aren't.

This is the equivalent of putting up a sign saying Trump Hospital, when it's not, and when the people in it aren't nurses and doctors. That's basically what he did. You can't commit fraud. It's not a light charge. It's a very serious charge for someone who wants the public trust to take a much more important role.

CUOMO: He has come at you personally -- Donald Trump. He says of course Schneiderman's coming after me. He got paid off by the lawyers that made donations to his campaigns and now he's helping them.

SCHNEIDERMAN: Yes, he has two theories. That's one. We looked up -- after he made his assertions we fact-checked. One lawyer in this very large law firm that was in one of the cases gave me $10,000 in the fall of 2010 when I was first running for A.G. And, at the same period of time, Donald Trump gave me $12,500. So, that's the contribution record. Obviously, you're not motivated by money, since he gave me more than anyone even tangentially related to the other side.

His other theory is that this is a conspiracy I worked up with President Obama based on the fact that we ran into each in Syracuse a few weeks before the case was filed. I assure you, President Obama and I have more important things to talk about than Mr. Trump.

And we certainly did in 2013 when I sued him. We had no idea he was going to run for president. This was not -- this was just a straight up fraud case. This was not a political thing at all. This was not based on any contributions. The evidence is overwhelming and, as I say, you can change your position in a campaign. Once you get under oath, once you're in a deposition, once you're in court, it's very hard to hide.

CUOMO: And he is on the witness list, right? He may be someone you can call?

SCHNEIDERMAN: He's on the witness list sooner in one of the California cases. But, yes, we have limited discovery allowed by the judge after the appellate decision -- the appellate court's decision this week. We're moving ahead aggressively.

CUOMO: All right. Mr. attorney general, thank you for being on NEW DAY and explaining the situation from your perspective.

SCHNEIDERMAN: Thank you.

CUOMO: What do you think about this? Does it matter to you in terms of the election, or on any level? Tweet us @NewDay or post your comment on facebook.com/NewDay. There are more about this Republican debate to tell you about from last night, so let's get to it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CRUZ: Count to 10, Donald. Count to 10.

TRUMP: Give me a break.

CRUZ: Count to 10.

RUBIO: And he's trying to con people into giving them their vote.

TRUMP: The people of Florida can't stand him. He couldn't get elected dog catcher.

CRUZ: Donald's record was one of repeatedly hiring illegal aliens.

TRUMP: In fact, this little guy has lied so much --

RUBIO: Here we go.

TRUMP: -- about my record.

RUBIO: Here we go.

JOHN KASICH (R-OH), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Let's stop fighting.

RUBIO: We are not going to turn over the conservative movement to someone who thinks the nuclear triad is a rock band from the 1980's. TRUMP: He referred to my hands. If they're small, something else must be small. I guarantee you there's no problem.

BERNIE SANDERS (D-VT), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: My opponent says well, Bernie's a nice guy, but he's not --