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Clinton & Sanders to Face Off in CNN Debate Tonight; Trump Campaign Manager Won't Be Prosecuted; Protestors Clash with Trump Supporters in Pittsburgh. Aired 6-6:30a ET

Aired April 14, 2016 - 06:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We can't just show up at election time and think that's enough.

[05:58:26] SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (D-VT), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: The crises are so severe. Little step by little step is not enough.

CLINTON: Our diversity is a strength. Not a weakness.

SANDERS: It is time to think boldly. It is time to think big.

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Who's the most popular? Donald Trump.

SEN. TED CRUZ (R-TX), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: The last three weeks, he's lost over and over again.

TRUMP: It's a rigged system, folks.

REINCE PRIEBUS, RNC CHAIR: Rules are not being changed in order to benefit anybody.

CRUZ: The odds are looking more and more likely that he can't get a majority.

TRUMP: These are the most dishonest people.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: The Golden State Warriors, they did it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's official. Number 73. The greatest regular season in NBA history.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ANNOUNCER: This is NEW DAY with Chris Cuomo, Alisyn Camerota and Michaela Pereira.

CUOMO: Wow. Look at that. Good morning and welcome to your NEW DAY. It's Thursday, April 14, 6 a.m. in the east. We are in Brooklyn at the famous Navy Yard, site of tonight's CNN Democratic debate. We're outside on the water, wind blowing, simply because. Michaela, a.k.a. the sane one, in the studio. The stakes could not be higher for Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders

just five days before the primary here in New York. Both campaigns believe this is their moment. As a result, the tone has changed, not in a good way. We have the inside scoop for you on what you're going to hear tonight.

CAMEROTA: Meanwhile, big news out of the Trump camp. Trump's campaign manager will not be prosecuted for grabbing that reporter's arm, as we've all seen on video. This as Trump's war with the RNC heats up. And Ted Cruz last night accusing Trump staff of acting like thugs.

We've got this race covered from every angle. So let's begin with our senior Washington correspondent, Joe Johns. He's inside the debate hall here in Brooklyn. What do we expect, Joe?

JOE JOHNS, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Alisyn.

Big stage, big moment, big city. This is where it all happens tonight as the candidates prepare for a face-off with everything on the line in Brooklyn.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CLINTON: I am so glad to be back in the Bronx.

JOHNS (voice-over): Rivals Hillary Clinton and Senator Bernie Sanders both hosting dueling New York rallies ahead of tonight's CNN Democratic presidential debate.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Bernie! Bernie! Bernie!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Bernie! Bernie! Bernie!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Bernie! Bernie! Bernie!

JOHNS: Sanders revving up a massive crowd estimated by organizers to be above 27,000 in Washington Square Park. Sanders receiving a rock star welcome with celebrities before he aggressively went after Secretary Clinton.

SANDERS: Our differences with Secretary Clinton go beyond how we raise money. It goes to an issue which the media doesn't cover. That is our disastrous trade policies, which are costing us millions of jobs.

JOHNS: Clinton making the case to voters in the Bronx, urging them to back her over Sanders.

CLINTON: I was honored to be your senator for eight years, and if you will give me the honor of your vote on Tuesday, we will continue to make life better.

JOHNS: And keeping her attacks on the Republican hopefuls.

CLINTON: One of them denigrates New York values. Mr. Trump wants to set Americans against each other. He wants to build walls. I want us to build bridges.

JOHNS: Tonight's high-stakes debate comes as the heated war of words between Sanders and Clinton intensifies.

SANDERS: I have my doubts about what kind of president she would make.

JOHNS: And accusations from the Sanders campaign that the primary process is weighted in favor of Clinton.

JANE SANDERS, BERNIE SANDERS'S WIFE: It's not a democratic way to carry out an election.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

JOHNS: The candidates also spent Wednesday talking about a number of large endorsements they got; as well, reaching out to organized labor, Hillary Clinton meeting with Al Sharpton's National Action Network. Bernie Sanders expected to be there today.

Chris, to you.

CUOMO: Joe Johns, thank you very much.

They had told us that the inside set was not available for this morning's show. Another major development in the campaign.

So Bernie Sanders is certainly striking back at the political -- thanks, Joe. Now you tell me. So he's been going at the political establishment but in a different way, urging bold action, especially for New Yorkers and young ones.

So we went to this big event he had at the famous Washington Square Park here in New York; and we got to talk to the senator just moments before he took the stage in what may have been his most important rally to date. Here's a sample.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

B. SANDERS: We, in this critical moment in American history, need a vision to address the many crisis [SIC] that we face. It is time to think big. It's time to think boldly. It's time to make this country to become what I think most of us know it can become.

CUOMO: In the crowd tonight, the people were saying the status quo is not enough; incremental change is not enough. Why?

B. SANDERS: Because the crises are so severe that just moving along little step by little step is not enough.

Look, we've got a middle class that's been declining for 30 years. We have grotesque levels of income and wealth inequality. We have a campaign finance system which is corrupt. We have a criminal justice system which is broken. We have climate change, which is threatening the existence of the very planet, this very planet if we don't transform our energy system. Those are issues of unbelievable consequence. We need bold action now.

CUOMO: The pushback is that progress is incremental, and perfection can be the enemy of progress.

B. SANDERS: That's not what the debate is about, Chris. The debate is about whether we're going to have millions of people starting to exercise their democratic power, stand up and fight back to a political system, which is now controlled by a small number of wealthy campaign contributors.

That's really what it's about. Do we go along with the same old, same old establishment politics and establishment economics? Or do we revitalize American democracy, bring millions of people into the process, and start doing what the American people want and not what big money interests want?

CUOMO: The message matters, but so does the man. Bernie Sanders is from Brooklyn. To be in Washington Square Park, which I know you came to and came through as a kid, as a teen.

B. SANDERS: Yes, yes.

CUOMO: To be here tonight with tens of thousands of young people shouting your name, believing in you, what does it mean, from where you came from and where you are tonight in the same place?

B. SANDERS: I grew up in Brooklyn in a there-and-a-half-room rent- controlled apartment from a family did not have a lot of money. Standing here tonight with the support of so many thousands of people is a very humbling experience. It's a very, very moving experience, and I'm going to do everything that I can to make sure that I do not let these people down.

CUOMO: They say they want to win here in New York. Polls are trending down. Some still have you between 8 and 13 down. Do you think you can win in New York?

B. SANDERS: I do. I think, as I've said many times before, we do well when the voter turnout is high. So if there is a large voter turnout, if a lot of working-class people who traditionally might not vote get involved in this campaign, if young people who maybe have never voted before get involved in this campaign and come out and vote, and yes, I think they can win.

CUOMO: Last question. The big test is next Tuesday. The test before the test is tomorrow night, the big debate. There's been a lot of hot talk. What do you expect on that stage tomorrow night? What's going to be different?

B. SANDERS: I think it will be a good debate in which Secretary Clinton and I discuss the very strong differences of opinion that we have about how we go forward in this country, and if that takes place I will be very happy. And I'm confident that the vision that I am bringing forth is a vision that will be supported by the vast majority of the people in New York.

CUOMO: It will be different than what we've been hearing the last few days?

B. SANDERS: Well, I'll tell you about it tomorrow.

CUOMO: Senator, thank you very much. Good luck tomorrow night.

B. SANDERS: Thanks.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CUOMO: All right. Let's bring in our people to discuss: CNN political analyst and host of "The David Gregory Show" podcast -- creative -- David Gregory. Washington bureau chief...

DAVID GREGORY, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: You didn't see that coming.

CUOMO: Whoa, look at you. Nice. Avatar.

We also have Jackie Kucinich and CNN politics executive editor, Mark Preston. Good to see you all out here this morning. When I figure out how to open this thermos, we will have coffee.

So last night Bernie picked this site on purpose, the Sanders campaign, not just logistics. The Washington Square Park arch is a famous New York monument. On it is inscribed, "Let us raise a standard that the wise and honest can repair to." And he said that that is meaningful to him. That's what this campaign is about, David, that we need a new standard of action; that revolution doesn't mean hostility towards government in his words, it's that there has to be huge change. Can he make that happen?

GREGORY: Well, if he can do a couple of things. The kind of enthusiasm that he was able to demonstrate last night, with what was estimated to be 20-plus thousand, 27,000 people coming up...

CUOMO: Sounds right.

GREGORY: ... is tremendous. And it shows how much of a movement politician he is, how much he has become and the unprecedented nature of the insurgency within the Democratic Party that he is responsible for. But he's got to get Democrats to come out in big numbers. Hillary Clinton still has a tremendous advantage there, particularly in a big, diverse state like New York.

So the big test, the debate tonight, but really next Tuesday is about can he grow from where he is? The converted, those people who are showing up for Bernie Sanders, they're not the test. It is other Democrats, the independents who have been at base of support and can't come out because it is a closed primary, he's got to show that he is able to actually grow, and we're not necessarily seeing that, despite the enthusiasm we saw last night.

CAMEROTA: Let's talk about that split screen last night. So he had 27,000 in Washington Square Park. Hillary Clinton also had a rally. It was at a community center. It was 1,300. Enthusiastic, but certainly a fraction of what he had. So what does that say what's going to happen in the primary on Tuesday? Is it just independence that you have to rely on? Or does that mean that the polls that right now suggest that she's leading by something like 12 percent, that we could be in for another upset.

JACKIE KUCINICH, "THE DAILY BEAST": You know, the thing that struck me, I was at Hillary Clinton's rally last night, and the thing that struck me, all the voters I spoke to told me that they were long-time Hillary voters. They had made up their mind. They'd followed her for years.

And they liked the fact -- they liked her as senator, and now they like the fact that she wants to be -- she's running for president again. So these are people who are routine voters. They will go to the polls. So she's got a bunch of sure bets there in the Bronx and throughout the state and particularly with minority voters.

I was talking to a young African-American man last night, who told me that Bernie Sanders isn't speaking to issues that African-Americans can really relate to. These aspirational kind of big ideas, he said, you know, it's about kitchen-table issues for us. It's about these incremental steps, because these pie-in-the-sky, his words, ideas, It's just too much right now. It's something that might not be attainable, where they need goals that are attainable and pragmatic. And that's what Hillary Clinton is offering them.

[06:10:01] CUOMO: Preston, it seems like the criticism for Clinton is up 2 million votes. She's up 200-plus delegates. They're doing well. The math is in their favor. It's that they haven't been able to make the adjustment to deal with the emotion, that usually if you're the front runner, people want you more, right, by definition, and it doesn't seem that she is winning the passion campaign.

PRESTON: She is not -- first of all, she's not inspirational in the way that Bernie Sanders is, which I think has caught all of us sitting here by surprise. Who would have thought a man in his 70s would be drawing 27,000 out to a park last night? And you were there. Twenty thousand were probably, you know, somewhere between the ages of 18 and 25.

So Hillary Clinton herself will acknowledge herself she's not a very good campaigner. You know, her whole argument is that she's a leader and that she knows how to enact policy.

Bernie Sanders, on the other side, while he is behind in the delegate count and while she is the leader, I think he's important in the race for a couple of things for Democrats.

One is you kind of need that inspirational character to try to get your base energized at this point. And for those who want Bernie Sanders out of the race at this point, in many ways, that's a mistake. If you go back to 2008 and look at the fight between Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton, it was very important for the Democratic Party and certainly very important for Barack Obama when he went into the general election, because you saw a Democratic base that was energized, that didn't have a falloff in the summer.

CAMEROTA: So David, what happens tonight? Are both of these candidates coming to this debate sort of loaded for bear, they want a knockout punch? Or do they elevate the tone? What are we expecting?

GREGORY: Well, I think it's very different. I think Bernie Sanders has a real shot here. He got something that he needed. He had a rough patch with the "Daily News" interview, which the Clinton campaign done, that he didn't have enough command detail, even on his signature issue, like how you would break up the banks, if that's what you want to do. So we have two different visions of that. So there will be more specifics.

Obviously, Wolf Blitzer will push on specifics, but he gets a shot at the title here. He has all this enthusiasm, and he gets all this oxygen to try to wound her and try to -- try to reach new voters who have not been -- turn out more Democratic voters whom he'll need.

Look, I think that the Clinton campaign has been irritated enough by what Sanders represents that she may want to try to take him down in a couple of areas, but I think most of the night she wants to spend pivoting away from Sanders and saying that this is essentially over, and she wants to focus on Republicans.

CUOMO: Tricky -- tricky play, though. Right, Jackie? Because if you go at Sanders, what are you saying, don't hope? Don't aspire?

KUCINICH: Right.

CUOMO: Don't dream? You know, that's been the tricky part, you know. Don't hold people's hopes out? Tricky.

Also, Mark is right, that crowd last night, definitively very young. Who knows how many will come out to vote, not to kill the hope myself. But he also got something yesterday that's huge, especially in New York state. He got the Transit Workers Local 100 Union. I know that sounds like inside politics. It isn't. It's 60,000 people that are exactly what he's talking about. That doesn't happen a lot in New York state. You know, unions are very smart about how they go to it. How big a deal is that?

KUCINICH: It is a big deal, particularly at the time that it happens. Because Hillary Clinton has had a lot of unions endorse her. However, the timing of this sort of -- it reemphasizes Bernie Sanders's message: "I'm for the workers. I'm for the people. I'm not for corporations." This spat he's had with Verizon is another thing that has really sort of...

CUOMO: He has the head of Verizon coming after him yesterday.

KUCINICH: Yes, exactly. And so that is good for Bernie Sanders. That bolsters his campaign.

CAMEROTA: All right, panel, stick around. We have a lot to talk about on the other side, as well, also some developments with Trump, et cetera.

CUOMO: Also, this morning a little surprise for you coming up on NEW DAY. Bernie Sanders' wife, Jane, is going to join us, live in the 8 a.m. hour. CAMEROTA: All right. So we are just hours away now from the main

event. Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders face-to-face in a CNN Democratic presidential debate right here in Brooklyn. Tune in tonight at 9 p.m. Eastern only on CNN.

CUOMO: We also have the Republican side to cover. Donald Trump's war with the RNC is definitely reaching a boiling point. He has one less thing to worry about, though, this morning. Sources telling CNN that his campaign manager will not be charged with assaulting a reporter.

Senator Ted Cruz was getting personal at the CNN town hall last night, he and his wife and daughters by his side. So let's go to CNN's Sara Murray, live to Pittsburgh with more -- Sara.

SARA MURRAY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Chris.

It's a different kind of victory this morning for the Trump campaign finding out that they no longer have to worry about these charges against their campaign manager.

And it couldn't come at a better moment. The campaign at this moment staffing up. They're trying to do a little more D.C. outreach and pivot to trying out a more traditional campaign.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MURRAY (voice-over): Sources confirm to CNN Trump's campaign manager will not be prosecuted for battery, following this altercation with former Breitbart reporter Michelle Fields back in March. Fields, who could seek defamation charges against Corey Lewandowski, tweeting, "Office of prosecutor asked two weeks ago if I'd be OK with an apology from Corey. I said yes, but haven't heard back about it."

[06:15:18] On the campaign trail, tense moments outside a Trump rally in Pittsburgh, as hundreds of angry protestors clashed with Trump supporters. Police in riot gear tried to keep the peace.

Inside, the frontrunner intensifying his war with the GOP.

TRUMP: The Republican system is a rigged system, folks.

MURRAY: And doubling down on claims his party is conspiring to block him from the nomination.

TRUMP: The bosses and the establishment and the people that shouldn't have this power took all of the power away from the voters.

MURRAY: Republican Party Chairman Reince Priebus firing back.

REINCE PRIEBUS, REPUBLICAN PARTY CHAIRMAN: The rules are not being changed in order to injure or benefit anybody. They are what they are.

MURRAY: At CNN's town hall, Trump's main rival, Ted Cruz, railing against Trump tactics and accusing his supporters of threatening delegates. CRUZ: They're acting like union boss thugs.

Well, I spoke yesterday to the chairman of the Republican Party in Colorado. Trump supporters put out his home address, put out his phone numbers. He got thousands of phone calls. He got death threats. Trump supporters were telling his supporters to go to their house and bring their guns.

Look, violence doesn't belong in democracy, and the Trump campaign encourages it over and over again.

MURRAY: And on a lighter note, Cruz's wife shared how the couple met.

HEIDI CRUZ, WIFE OF TED CRUZ: It really was love at first sight.

MURRAY: But it was their 5 and 8-year-old daughters that stole the show.

T. CRUZ: Caroline's Daddy-daughter picnic at school, which featured all the dads running and playing games, and...

CAROLINE CRUZ, TED CRUZ'S DAUGHTER: My favorite.

T. CRUZ: ... your favorite was that she got to dress up Daddy in, like, this pink boa and these, like, big goofy-looking underwear and...

C. CRUZ: And that's why I had on the videotape the whole time.

T. CRUZ: Uh-oh.

C. CRUZ: And now -- and now it's a class video that they're sending out to all the parents.

T. CRUZ: Oh really?

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MURRAY: A pretty cute moment there.

Now, we know the Democrats are going to be together on CNN's debate tonight, but we are also going to see all the Republicans together in the same place. Donald Trump, John Kasich and Ted Cruz are all expected to speak tonight at a Republican dinner in New York. So watch out for that.

Back to you guys.

CAMEROTA: OK, Sara. Will do. Thanks so much for that.

We just told you that Donald Trump's campaign manager, Corey Lewandowski, off the hook for grabbing that female reporter's arm. So what does this and Trump's war with the GOP mean for his campaign? Our panel will be here to discuss. We will be right back, live from Brooklyn's Navy Yard, right after this very quick break.

CUOMO: First, huddle for warmth.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:21:56] CAMEROTA: Team Trump no doubt breathing a sigh of relief this morning with word that prosecutors will not charge campaign manager, Corey Lewandowski, with battery after that incident with a female reporter last month in Florida.

So let's bring back our panel: David Gregory, Mark Preston and Jackie Kucinich.

So David, Michelle Fields was the reporter who showed pictures of what she said were bruises after Corey Lewandowski grabbed her, and she tried to prosecute. Now, that's not going to happen. And she tweeted out last night, "For those asking, office of the prosecutor asked two weeks ago if I'd

be OK with an apology from Corey Lewandowski. I said, yes but haven't heard back about it."

So does this go away now? Is there any residual effect from this whole episode?

GREGORY: You know, you can't erase these things, but I think largely, yes. I mean, I think certainly a distraction, at least if not worse, in terms of how it was handled. And it would probably be appropriate to apologize, to put it behind them.

I think Trump supporters will look and say, "Look, he's a guy who was loyal, stuck with his guy. Law enforcement was involved and made a judgment here, and now we can get on to other things about the delegate fight and really focusing on winning here in New York.

You know, the thing that Trump, I think, has been hurt by self- inflicted wounds, and in fact, there were two weeks leading up to Wisconsin, a big loss, and then two weeks before New York. So he's been in this kind of vacuum where he's been hurting a little bit. He can do himself a lot of good by winning big here.

CUOMO: Also, he's been a one-man show in a team game. Right? And now you're seeing how it's made manifest, when you get into these tight situations, especially if you go to a convention.

Now, not because of what happened with Michelle Fields, and of course, Lewandowski says he didn't grab her arm, you know, that this was about something else that happened. An allegation. Now no prosecution.

However, Manafort is in. This guy from the Walker campaign is in. He was a campaign manager. They've made changes there, whether they're next to Lewandowski or on top of Lewandowski, it depends on who you talk to.

But these guys are also very interesting, too. He's not bringing in guys who are mandated to change the system. These are deep-rooted system back-room dealers. What does that mean for the image of the team? KUCINICH: This is exactly what he needed. Donald Trump prides

himself on hiring the right people, putting the right people in place so he can get things done and he can win, right? That's how he presents himself. So that's -- that's what he's saying, someone like Paul Manafort or Rick Wiley, who used to be Scott Walker's campaign manager. That's what he says they will do. Rick Wiley also worked at the RNC, so he knows the inner workings of that. And that clearly has been a problem for Donald Trump.

So this is a step in the right direction for the Trump campaign. Because this is what they were lacking. They didn't have any eyes and ears in Washington.

CAMEROTA: Mark, let's talk about whether or not delegates are being intimidated. Because there are all sorts of delegates saying that they are getting really frightening e-mails and such.

There's one aspiring delegate in Indiana. Let me read to you the e- mail. This is the Seventh District chairman, Tom Johns (ph). This is what he says he received, this e-mail: "Hi, Tom, you know traditional burial is polluting the planet. Tom, hope the family is well. Your name and info has given to me on a list that is about to go public. Good luck becoming a delegate. We are watching."

This is frightening. And these are sort of Mafia tactics. What's going on here?

PRESTON: Well, I think a couple things are going on here. One is you have a situation where the discourse in politics is not only gone in the gutter on the highest level.

We're seeing now supporters who are engaging in this kind of tactics and intimidation that we necessarily haven't seen, or if we -- if it did occur in the past it hasn't been to a level that we're seeing right now. You know, it's really unclear if that would ever happen. I mean, quite frankly.

But you do have to be worried about it in some respect. We saw Ted Cruz last night really try to seize it as a campaign issue...

CAMEROTA: I mean, he's saying -- Ted Cruz is saying these are the Trump people, of course, who are intimidating the possible delegates.

PRESTON: Correct.

But I don't think what's important is that this is not the kind of thing you say, look, certain people who we don't know about might be doing certain things. You have an obligation, if you are running a campaign, you stand up and you say, "Here is the deal. I don't support this. I don't want anybody even loosely in my name or even my supporters doing anything that is violent or intimidating. That's not how we do business in this campaign. That's not what we stand for."

You have an obligation and, certainly, an opportunity to try to tamp this down instead of playing -- you know, playing cute with this kind of stuff where it may be happening but you don't know about it. KUCINICH: That's what leaders, do, right?

CUOMO: Look, leaders set a tone, and then they have to be held to account for that tone, for that mandate.

I want to go back to this -- these Trump moves, though, for one -- one more second. Here's why. I don't think it's as simple as "I hire people that I need to hire to win." You said you're against this machine; you funded this machine. You're not going to allow this machine to exist anymore."

That's a big part of Trump's appeal. Just like Sanders is saying, "I'm not going to play this rich and poor thing anymore. I'm going to make changes."

He now hired two guys -- I don't know the Walker guy, as well. But Paul Manafort has a history of doing the kinds of things that Donald Trump says he won't have happen in government anymore. How does that play? Just I'm doing what I have to do, or is that a hypocrisy for people to have to reconcile?

KUCINICH: But his supporters want him to win. Right? And he...

CUOMO: But they want him to win because he said he's not going to allow this toxic...

KUCINICH: Do you actually -- but do you actually think that bringing Paul Manafort and Rick Wiley in is going to dispatch Trump supporters?

CUOMO: No.

KUCINICH: Nothing has done. So I don't really think it's...

GREGORY: I mean, I think, look -- what did Trump say about being a nice guy? He said, "Once I take a couple people out then I can be more presidential."

The idea that he is running very well against the establishment. But the idea that Donald Trump and New York City is not part of the New York City establishment is kind of laughable.

And in this case, too, he's got this inside game and an outside game. He's going to rail against the establishment. But he's going to bring in insiders to do what he has to do to win, and I think he's going to play both sides of that street.

CAMEROTA: Panel, thank you. Great to have you out here with us.

CUOMO: All right. So let's change to another big, big moment that came out the right way. It was show time again in L.A. Kobe Bryant had his last game last night, right? So you know, you figure you go out with a whimper; you came in with a roar? No, 60 points he put up last night. Kobe and his last game -- there he is with Shaq -- 60 points in his defy (ph). What a way to be remembered. The right way for the right guy. "The Bleacher Report" brings you that and another huge piece of history in basketball last night with the Warriors when we come back.

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