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Cruz & Kasich Team Up to Stop Trump; CNN Crew Goes to Frontline of Boko Haram Fight; Sanders Shrugs Off Lewinsky Attacks Against Clinton; Charles Koch: Clinton Might Be Better Than GOP Nominee; Interview with Clinton Campaign's Kristina Schake. Aired 7:30-8a ET
Aired April 25, 2016 - 07:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[07:30:00] MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN ANCHOR: The search continues for hundreds of missing schoolgirls kidnapped by Boko Haram in Nigeria two years ago. Up next, we have a CNN exclusive for you. We're going to take you to the front lines as military patrols scour hostile territory looking for those missing girls.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[07:34:00] CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: All right, if I wrote it up and submitted it to Hollywood they'd say that can't happen, Cuomo, get back to your job. But yes, Ted Cruz and John Kasich are teaming up in a stop Trump movement of their own making. How? Coordinating efforts in upcoming primaries in Indiana, New Mexico, Oregon to try to prevent Trump from reaching that magic number -- the majority of delegates, 1,237.
Will it work? What's it about? John Avlon, CNN political analyst, editor in chief of The Daily Beast here to break it down. It is great to have you.
JOHN AVLON, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: You, too, my man.
CUOMO: If I had called you. Very often we talk. We're actually friends. And if I were like, I'll tell you what's going to happen, they're going to team you, you would have been like oh, Chris, I've got to go. The office is on fire.
AVLON: Yes. I think you're smoking something. I'm very uncomfortable right now. But this is happening, right? This is the long-planned collusion between candidates who previously had no time for each other.
CUOMO: All right, so this isn't in effect yet but tomorrow is a big day. Now, it was suggested hey, you know, from here on out they're all winner-take-all's and that's how we'll get to 1,237. That's what Trump was saying. Not really, though, it's complicated, right?
AVLON: That's right. It's the Facebook status, it's complicated. But the one thing about it is it's mostly proportional without getting in the weeds on individual states.
CUOMO: But that's why strategy like this might work because it's not actually winner-take-all. You can peel off.
AVLON: Correct. And look, tomorrow's sort of the zombie effect of the slumbering, some might say dead, northeastern Republican. In most of these states Trump's got a strong lead which is creating that urgency but Kasich's in second, not Cruz. That's a total reversal of the dynamic most of this cycle.
CUOMO: All right, so here we go. This is what you say this is really about.
AVLON: Yes.
CUOMO: Why is Indiana so important?
AVLON: Indiana's the key to understanding all this. This is Ted Cruz's last stand. He feels this is a state that should be good for Cruz. It is a red state. Yes, they've elected Democratic senators in the past but he feels with a strong evangelical contingent that he should be able to pick up Indiana or at least stop Donald Trump's momentum, but only if Kasich drops out.
CUOMO: Why? Let's take a look at the numbers.
AVLON: Let's take a look at this.
CUOMO: All right.
AVLON: So, let's look at the numbers here. Think about the Republican Party as being at warlord status. There's no clear leader. You've got a couple of warring leaders. What we have here is, essentially, a non-aggression pact between Cruz and Kasich saying look, you pull out of Indiana, Kasich. Give me, Ted Cruz, a better chance to succeed and I'll cede some other states for you. Let's look what happens now.
CUOMO: Now how -- why do we know that this happens?
AVLON: Well, that's what polling shows. If you take out John Kasich, all of a sudden that spread goes to two, a statistical dead heat. And this is what Cruz needs in addition to the governor of Indiana, Mike Pence, should be a Cruz guy on paper. He's been keeping it cool, staying on the sidelines. It will be interesting to see whether he gets nudged into the game.
CUOMO: How did he fair after all of the reaction laws to the gay marriage decision and religious freedom laws?
AVLON: He backtracked for a number of different reasons. Kind of the dynamic we saw in Georgia where big business comes in and says uh-uh. Don't muddy up our state's reputation here.
CUOMO: But he's still strong there.
AVLON: He is strong there. He is a culture warrior. He has also got a background in right-wing talk radio. He should be a Cruz guy -- has not endorsed him. CUOMO: All right, now this is what Kasich gets. Now, to be clear, this is a problem for Cruz. Cruz has been saying I'm going to win. This convention's a joke. We can't get to a convention. Kasich has been saying for weeks and weeks, I know, whatever the numbers are they are. I know Rubio's still beating me and he's not even in the race.
AVLON: Right.
CUOMO: He's home fishing. But, if I get to the convention I'm good. So this is what he gets.
AVLON: Right.
CUOMO: So, here's the two states that, essentially, are the trade for Indiana in this non-aggression pact between Cruz and Kasich. Oregon, not likely a Republican state in the fall, but a very good state potentially for John Kasich. And New Mexica, which previously the Cruz campaign had been making noise that they were in a strong position to succeed.
Susana Martinez, Republican governor of the state -- but this is a swing state in a general election, potentially. So these are states that have a center right hue that John Kasich feels he can really pick up on and then it's on the convention.
CUOMO: You think he'll win either of these states?
AVLON: Well again, you've got a proportional situation but he is in a better position looking at the composition of those two states to marshal up his delegates and remember, it's all a game of keep away for these cats for Donald Trump. If you can get it a convention you stay alive. Trump's got to basically run the table outside those three states in order to exceed the 1,237.
CUOMO: He had to basically run the table anyway. We had him in high 50's, maybe into 60 percent he had to win each time, which he hasn't done almost at all, so why do this?
AVLON: Well, first of all --
CUOMO: It makes you look very weak, doesn't it?
AVLON: Well, these are all people negotiating from weakness. This is a high stakes game of poker right now and there's a lot of bluffing going on. But, Donald Trump's set to have a very strong night tomorrow night in these northeast primaries. Kasich may be in an accumulation of delegates way. But it's really a question of whatever those margins are, can they stop them?
Trump can still exceed the magic 1,237 without Indiana, Oregon, and New Mexico, but he's got to basically run all the other states on the table. If they can keep the game of keepaway then it's on the convention and it's going to be a fascinating fight where every delegate counts.
CUOMO: How big a role will -- Jeb Bush doesn't really have that many but Rubio does -- delegates that were supposed to be for him. How much sway would he have in where those delegates go at the convention?
AVLON: Here's what's fascinating, Chris. If this goes to a contested convention --
CUOMO: He's got like 170, by the way.
AVLON: Yes.
CUOMO: That's why we're bringing it up.
AVLON: He's got more than John Kasich right now --
CUOMO: Right, right.
AVLON: -- as you just said. So, all of a sudden Rubio comes back from the dead as a potential player. If there's some horse-trading going on and they can control those delegates --
CUOMO: Rubio -- we're going to have to start putting him in again --
AVLON: Yes.
CUOMO: -- because he's got 170 or so.
AVLON: Because he's the ghost in the machine here. And then you're going to have 50-odd delegates who are undeclared from Pennsylvania, no matter what. Every delegate matters if Trump falls short of 1,237.
CUOMO: Chance that Trump brings back Rubio at the end, gets his 170, gets to 1,237, he becomes VP?
AVLON: Non-zero.
CUOMO: Non-zero. Avlon, that was weak. Very good. Thank you very much for having you here. So, the question is what do you think? Do you think this is going to work? Was it a good idea? Let us know. Tweet us @NewDay. Post your comment on facebook.com/NewDay. Alisyn --
[07:40:00] ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: All right, well the intense search continues for hundreds of missing schoolgirls kidnapped by Boko Haram in Nigeria two years ago. In a CNN exclusive, what the Nigerian military is doing to find the girls. Can they be rescued? Stay tuned for that.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[07:43:00] PEREIRA: To a CNN exclusive now. Senior international correspondent Nima Elbagir goes to the frontlines in the fight against Boko Haram and the search for those missing 200 Nigerian schoolgirls. Along with Nigerian forces, she and her crew infiltrate a forest the terror group has called home. Dangerous terrain littered with improvised bombs. Nima joins us now live from London. Incredible access.
NIMA ELBAGIR, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, it has been two years, Michaela, and you saw that it really is still very much an uphill battle for them to get infiltration into these areas. But also, to get any kind of information as to the girl's current whereabouts. Take a look at this.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ELBAGIR: Monday market in Maiduguri. Two men showing absolute panic, both suspected terrorists, quickly they say, subdued. Normality returns but it gives you a sense of the tension here. As Boko Haram have lost their territorial footprint, or much of it, they're growing increasingly reliant on unleashing waves of suicide bombers into the heart of Maiduguri and beyond.
[07:45:00] In a city on edge no one is above suspicion. Maiduguri is at the heart of the Nigerian army's campaign to retake Boko Haram territory under Operation Lafiya Dole, peace by any means, spread out across the country's vast northeast. The road to the Sambisa Forest, or what's been cleared so far, relentless heat bears down on our heavily armored convoy.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Delta four, Alpha four. And from all the boys be very vigilant. Over.
ELBAGIR: Soft sand, ideal hiding holes for IEDs. The scouts in the lead car directing our convoy on and off the track. Two years ago when we visited Chibok after the mass abduction of the Chibok schoolgirls, parents described to us how they followed the trail of their daughters to the front gates -- to the entry point -- of the Sambisa Forest and were unable to move any further. This is the Sambisa.
The Nigerian government has been able to stop clawing back territory here from Boko Haram. But the Sambisa fortress -- the territory right in the center -- that is still where they're moving towards. And this is where some of the Chibok girls are believed to still be held.
Back in Maiduguri, the operations fears the commander. Major General Leo Irabor tells us he's proud of his men, but they are in need of more international support. Irabor is tasked with both following the girls' 2-year-old trail and waging war against Boko Haram's brutal insurgency. The commander allowed us to join his men moving east towards the Boko Haram frontlines to see for ourself.
Boko Haram do, indeed, appear to have been pushed back but their presence lingers. Everywhere you look, scenes of devastation. All the way throughout our journey cross-country we've seen village after abandonedvillages devastated, destroyed. What Boko Haram couldn't loot they attempted to burn to the ground, and people are still too afraid to come back to their homes.
But the hope is that the longer the Nigerian military maintain their hold on the territory up here, the more people's confidence will grow. The more willing they'll be to return and reclaim their lives and their homes. Nima Elbagir, CNN, Northeast Nigeria.
(END VIDEOTAPE) PEREIRA: Nima, so important for us to see what you are telling us about. Those images are so powerful, so stark. What can you tell us about what U.S. intelligence is doing to assist in finding the girls?
ELBAGIR: Well, we also got to see what they don't have. And in spite of the fact that U.S. intelligence is playing a huge role. Their surveillance reconnaissance flights, one of which flew overhead when we were there -- they are providing that intelligence that is being followed up on the ground. But the issue is how it's being followed up on the ground. There's no thermal imaging.
There are none of the more advanced means that would be brought to play in the U.S., or even in Europe in this kind of situation. And they're dealing with all of that while faced with the reality of Boko Haram, now since its alliance with ISIS, is evolving very rapidly. The IEDs -- that wasn't something we say two years and now pretty much every single track is heavily sown with these explosive devices.
That reality is what's making this search so difficult. But, of course, for the families, they don't want to hear that. They just want to hear that their daughters are being searched for and that, hopefully, one day they will come home, Michaela.
PEREIRA: It must be infuriating and so painful for them. Nima, incredible reporting. Thank you so much for that.
ELBAGIR: Thank you.
CUOMO: So, the Democratic side of the race has its own intrigue of prominent Bernier Sanders dropping Monica Lewinsky's name on the campaign trail. Is it fair to bring up Lewinsky all these years later? Clinton's team responds next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[07:53:00] ROSARIO DAWSON, ACTRESS: We are, literally, under attack for not just supporting the other candidate. Now, I'm with Monica Lewinsky with this. Bullying is bad. She's, actually, dedicated her life now to talking about that. And now, as a campaign strategy, we are being bullied.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CAMEROTA: All right, that was Bernie Sanders supporter, actress Rosario Dawson, invoking the name Monica Lewinsky at a weekend rally for Sanders. Here's how Sanders, then, explained it to Jake Tapper.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JAKE TAPPER, CNN CHIEF WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: Yes or no, should your surrogates be talking about Monica Lewinsky?
SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (I-VT), DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I have no idea in what context Rosario was talking about her, but I would hope that all of our people focus on the real issues facing working people and the massive level of income and wealth inequality that we have.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CAMEROTA: All right, let's bring in deputy communications director for the Clinton campaign, Kristina Schake. Kristina, thanks so much for being here.
KRISTINA SCHAKE, DEPUTY COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR AT HILLARY FOR AMERICA: Hi.
CAMEROTA: So, you heard Rosario Dawson there. She wasn't invoking Monica Lewinsky in reference to Bill Clinton. She was saying that Monica Lewinsky has now made her second act about how she was bullied and she was shamed. And Rosario Dawson said that some of the Sanders supporters feel the same way. Is that out of balance?
SCHAKE: You know, we'll let Sen. Sanders speak for his surrogates. I think that Sen. Sanders said in that clip, and Hillary agrees, we really want to get back to talking about the issues on this campaign.
CAMEROTA: Are you happy with how he responded there? Basically, he did pivot away from saying -- he didn't say Rosario Dawson shouldn't have said that. He didn't say Monica Lewinsky should never be invoked by a Democrat. He just sort of said let's talk about income inequality. So, should he have gone further?
SCHAKE: You know what? We'll let him decide what's appropriate for him and for his surrogates to say in this campaign. I think that Sen. Sanders and Hillary have both been really proud to run campaigns based on the issues and talking about concerns of voters today, very different than what's happening on the Republican side.
I think we saw in New York it got a little bit more negative. I think Sen. Sanders (sic) was in a tough position here in her home state where she is really strong because people know how she really delivered for them as a senator. And so, he got a little bit more negative here and I think his surrogates did, too. But Hillary's really hoping that we get back to the issues that voters care about.
[07:55:00] CAMEROTA: Let's talk about something else interesting that happened this weekend, and that is that Charles Koch, one of the Koch brothers -- one of the most high-profile conservative Republican donors -- millionaire -- billionaire -- basically said that he could imagine voting for Hillary Clinton over Trump or Cruz because of the rhetoric that they've used. Let me play his own words for you.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JONATHAN KARL, CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT, ABC NEWS: So is it possible another Clinton could be better than another Republican next time around?
CHARLES KOCH, CEO, KOCH INDUSTRIES: It's possible, it's possible.
KARL: You couldn't see yourself supporting Hillary Clinton, could you?
KOCH: Well, we would have to believe her actions would be quite different than her rhetoric. Let me put it that way. But on some of the Republican candidates before we could support them we'd have to believe their actions will be quite different than the rhetoric we've heard so far.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CAMEROTA: OK, in response to that, Hillary Clinton then tweeted this out. She said, "Not interested in endorsements from people who deny climate science and try to make it harder for people to vote." Did she miss an opportunity here? Was this an opportunity to say well, if Charles Koch wants to vote for me, I'll take any Republicans who are disgusted by what's going on in the GOP? I'll take any Republican votes.
SCHAKE: Well, Hillary really believes the Koch brothers have been a destructive force in American politics. This is a family that has supported conservative candidates who don't even believe climate change exists, and really fought to stop the progressive agenda in this country. So, she certainly doesn't welcome their support, as you saw in the tweet yesterday.
But I think this just really speaks to the disarray on the Republican side and how unhappy people are with their choices. Unlike on the Democratic side where Hillary has received more than 10 million votes, has won commanding leads in states like Texas and Ohio and Florida. Things that are really going to matter in the general election. She's ahead by 240 delegates and so she has a commanding lead in this race. I think the comments that he made just speaks to the disarray on the other side.
CAMEROTA: Speaking of the general election, it seems as though Hillary Clinton has now turned her focus there. She seems to be pivoting there, not talking as much as about Bernie Sanders, talking more about Donald Trump. Yesterday, she put out a new campaign ad. This one -- she's trying to use Trump's own words against him, so let's watch this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: A total and complete shutdown of Muslims entering the United States.
HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: One of my personal heroines, Maya Angelou, said when someone shows you who they are, believe them.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CAMEROTA: OK, so is that the strategy moving forward? That now she just focuses on Donald Trump?
SCHAKE: No, Hillary is solidly focused on the primaries. We have five important contests tomorrow. She's campaigning in every state. But, you know, she's the only candidate that's been calling out Donald Trump from the very beginning.
When he made his announcement last summer and referred to Mexicans as rapists, she was the candidate who came out and said this is hateful rhetoric and has no place in our politics. So we've seen, over the last week, Donald Trump's charting to try to moderate his opinions and this is an ad from our campaign to remind people to believe him for who he is.
CAMEROTA: Kristina Schake, thanks so much for being here.
SCHAKE: Thank you.
CAMEROTA: All right, we're following a lot of news, including Ted Cruz and John Kasich teaming up, they say, to stop Donald Trump. Let's get right to it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Cruz and Kasich have no path to victory.
CAMEROTA: Ted Cruz and John Kasich team up to try to deny Donald Trump the Republican nomination.
SEN. TED CRUZ (R-TX), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Do we want to be behind a campaign that is based on yelling and screaming?
GOV. JOHN KASICH (R-OH), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I ain't getting out, just so you all know.
TRUMP: I don't want to be too presidential yet.
CLINTON: You have to ask yourself what really is at stake in this election.
SANDERS: We're going to fight for every last vote.
TRUMP: It's a phony business, this politics.
CUOMO: President Obama sending 250 additional special operations forces to Syria.
BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: These terrorists are doing everything in their power to strike our cities and kill our citizens, so we need to do everything in our power to stop them.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The news of Prince's death has been a shock.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Emotional tributes unfolding as the world mourns a musical icon.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANNOUNCER: This is NEW DAY with Chris Cuomo, Alisyn Camerota, and Michaela Pereira.
CUOMO: Well, let's take a quick moment. Nice to have you back. CAMEROTA: Thank you.
CUOMO: We missed you.
CAMEROTA: Thank you, guys. Nice to be here.
PEREIRA: Nice vacation?
CUOMO: Need you back.
CAMEROTA: I ate my way through Rome.
PEREIRA: Well done.
CAMEROTA: And was very, very happy to eat pasta three times a day, and gelato, as well.
CUOMO: And this is a big week. You're back and you know --
PEREIRA: This is my last week on NEW DAY.
CUOMO: Some come, some go, as we say good morning to you.
PEREIRA: He's staying right here.
CUOMO: I know, I know. All right, we'll talk about that later. Enough of that. We've got plenty of breaking news for you. A stunning twist in the Republican race. Listen to this. Ted Cruz and John Kasich -- remember how they keep going at each other? Not so much anymore. They're teaming up to stop Donald Trump. They've agreed to be frenemies.
