Return to Transcripts main page
New Day
Trump Wins Big in Indiana, Cruz Drops Out; Sanders Wins Indiana. Aired 6-6:30a ET
Aired May 04, 2016 - 06:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We had a tremendous victory.
[05:58:36] SEN. TED CRUZ (R-TX), FORMER PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE; We are suspending our campaign.
TRUMP: I guess he's down to one. I don't know. If there a second?
CRUZ: Donald will betray his supporters, and I don't think we deserve that.
TRUMP: Ted Cruz, I don't know if he likes me, but he is one hell of a competitor.
HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE; We have got to stay focused. We know how to do this, my friends.
SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (D-VT), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Secretary Clinton thinks that this campaign is over. I've got some bad news for her.
CLINTON: A lot of politicians make a lot of promises to you that they couldn't keep. I'm not going to do that.
SANDERS: I think we can pull off one of the great political upsets in the history of the United States.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ANNOUNCER: This is NEW DAY with Chris Cuomo and Alisyn Camerota.
ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning, everyone. And what a morning it is. Welcome to your NEW DAY. It's Wednesday, May 4, 6 a.m. in the east. Chris is on assignment. John Berman joins me here.
Up first, a historic and game-changing night in the 2016 race. Donald Trump wins big in Indiana, forcing Senator Ted Cruz to abruptly drop out of the race. The Republican Party chairman now declaring Trump, quote, "will be the presumptive nominee."
Trump and Hillary Clinton now all but certain to face-off this November. On the Democratic side Bernie Sanders keeps his momentum alive with an upset in Indiana, Sanders declaring the primary fight is far from over. Clinton's delegate lead remains insurmountable. We have the 2016 race covered the way only CNN can. Let's begin with
John Berman with last night's results and the delegate score card. Explain it all to us, John.
JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Yes. Good morning, Alisyn.
Big wins for Donald Trump, and also Bernie Sanders won, as well. But look at Trump's margin here. Nearly 17 points. He beat Ted Cruz. Cruz out. Donald Trump now will be the presumptive nominee.
On the Democratic side, Bernie Sanders won by about five points in this race. The Clinton campaign very eager to point out that Hillary Clinton only campaigned in Indiana one day over the last week.
What does this mean in terms of delegates? Well, Bernie Sanders won more, 43 to Hillary Clinton's 38, but he nets only five delegates, not really enough to chip into Hillary Clinton's huge delegate lead.
On the Republican side, a clean sweep for Donald Trump. We're saying right now he wins at least 51 of the delegates, Ted Cruz and John Kasich with zero. Do not be surprised when we tell you later today that Donald Trump has won all 57 delegates in Indiana. That brings Donald Trump's number to 1,053.
Getting ever closer to the 1,237 he needs to officially clinch the nomination. But remember, Ted Cruz, he's out. Now, his only remaining challenger, John Kasich, actually running fourth now in a two-man race. We don't have Marco Rubio. He'd be right here, ahead of John Kasich in the delegate race right now.
As for the Democrats, Hillary Clinton stands at 2,217. You know, nearly 800 delegates more than Bernie Sanders. She needs about 180, 184 technically, to clinch the nomination. Sanders, again, not chipping in by the number he needs so far.
What about raw votes in terms of what has been cast in this election so far? Look at this: Hillary Clinton at 12,400,000 votes, more than 3 million more than Bernie Sanders. The Clinton campaign loves to cite that number.
As for Donald Trump just under 11 million total votes right now, way over Ted Cruz, his nearest competitor. Donald Trump on target to receive more votes in terms of the popular vote than any nominee, Republican nominee in history. He's already got more than Mitt Romney did in all of 2012 -- Alisyn.
CAMEROTA: Incredible numbers, John. Thanks so much for explaining all of that.
The head of the Republican Party declaring Trump will be the presumptive nominee. Ted Cruz abruptly dropping out of the race, just one week after announcing Carly Fiorina as his running mate.
CNN political reporter Sara Murray joins us with more. What a night, Sara.
SARA MURRAY, CNN POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Alisyn.
What a night indeed. Donald Trump called it an unbelievable victory, which may be the first understatement of his campaign, nearly a year after he announced his presidential bid and rocked the Republican race. He's knocked Ted Cruz out of the running and now claims the mantel of presumptive Republican nominee.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CRUZ: The voters chose another path.
MURRAY (voice-over): Indiana marks the end of the road for Ted Cruz.
CRUZ: We are suspending our campaign.
MURRAY: And a major victory for Donald Trump, as he becomes the Republican Party's presumptive nominee.
TRUMP: What Ted did is a -- really, a very brave thing to do. We want to bring unity to the Republican Party.
MURRAY: After months of battling it out with the RNC...
TRUMP: It's all a rigged system.
It's really a disgusting system.
MURRAY: ... the billionaire finally getting a message of support from the very top, party chairman Reince Priebus tweeting, "Trump will be the presumptive nominee. We all need to unite and focus on defeating Hillary Clinton."
Now there's only one other candidate refusing to leave the race.
GOV. JOHN KASICH (R-OH), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I love California.
MURRAY: John Kasich's chief strategist tweeting, "Until someone has 1,237 bound delegates, there is no presumptive nominee. California, here we come."
But Trump is largely ignoring the Ohio governor and now focusing squarely on the general election.
TRUMP: We're going after Hillary Clinton. She will not be a great president. She will not be a good president. She will be a poor president.
MURRAY: Trump solidifying his position at the top just hours after this litany of attacks from Cruz.
CRUZ: This man is a pathological liar. Donald Trump is a serial philanderer. The man is utterly amoral. Donald is a bully.
MURRAY: After a rough and tumble day on the trail, Trump adopted a friendlier tone in his victory speech.
TRUMP: I don't know if he likes me or if he doesn't like me, but he is one hell of a competitor. He is a tough, smart guy.
MURRAY: But if Trump was hoping for an endorsement, he may have a long wait.
CRUZ: I am not suspending our fight for liberty. Our movement will continue.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
MURRAY: Now, this relationship with Ted Cruz may be a tough one to mend during the course of the campaign. Donald Trump attacked not only Ted Cruz's wife but also his father. But as for now, Trump has bigger challenges, like uniting the Republican Party.
Back to you guys.
BERMAN: All right. Sara Murray, thank you so much.
On the subject of uniting the Republican Party, Reince Priebus, the Republican Party chair, he will be on NEW DAY in a little bit. He says Donald Trump will be the presumptive nominee. How much is he willing to help the Trump campaign going forward? Just some of the key questions we will put to the Republican Party chair.
On the Democratic side, Bernie Sanders keeping hope alive after pulling off a win in Indiana, but Hillary Clinton's delegate lead, really all but insurmountable. What is the next step in this primary battle?
CNN senior Washington correspondent Joe Johns is live in Washington with the latest.
Good morning, Joe.
JOE JOHNS, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, John.
A lot of buzz right now. The headline is, it was a big night for Bernie Sanders. It keeps his campaign on the trail, though the numbers in the race for the nomination continue to work against him.
And for her part, Hillary Clinton's campaign was pledging to stump for votes in every state left on the primary calendar, her to they're also gaming out her message for a general election campaign.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SANDERS: I understand that Secretary Clinton thinks that this campaign is over. I've got some bad news for her.
JOHNS (voice-over): Bernie Sanders pulling off a stunning upset victory in Indiana over Democratic front-runner Hillary Clinton.
SANDERS: We understand -- and I do not deny it for one second -- that we have an uphill battle in front of us, but I think we have a path to a victory, although it is a narrow path.
JOHNS: That path mathematically impossible without swaying some of Clinton's 513 super delegates to his side.
SANDERS (via phone): Super delegates are supporting Clinton in states that we have won landslide victories. I think that's wrong.
JOHNS: But Clinton is looking past Indiana.
CLINTON: I'm really focused on moving into the general election, and I think that's where we have to be, because we're going to have a tough campaign against a candidate who will literally say or do anything.
JOHNS: Fund-raising on the back of Donald Trump's triumphant night, tweeting "Donald Trump is the presumptive nominee. Chip in now if you agree we can't let him become president."
As some Democrats criticize Sanders, saying he is impeding the Democratic path to the White House by prolonging the Democratic primary, the senator making his case to CNN's Dana Bash last night.
DANA BASH, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: Staying in this race, aren't you effectively making it harder for the Democrats?
SANDERS: Well, you've already conceded the race for me, and I don't accept that concession. We are in this race to win.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
JOHNS: After the big night in Indiana, both campaigns have events that are scheduled later in the day. Hillary Clinton expected to speak here in Washington, D.C., this evening at a reception marking Asian-Pacific American Heritage Month. Bernie Sanders continues his campaign swing through the state of Kentucky with an event in Lexington this evening.
John and Alisyn, back to you.
CAMEROTA: Joe, thank you very much.
We have so much to discuss. Let's bring in our panel: CNN political analyst and host of "The David Gregory Show" podcast, David Gregory; Washington bureau chief for the "Daily Beast" Jackie Kucinich; and CNN national political reporter Maeve Reston.
Guys, 11 months ago, this wild ride started when Donald Trump came onto the national stage with this crazy, some people thought in the media, announcement, and here we are.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Predictable.
CAMEROTA: The media did not predict this. They thought it was started as a vanity project; it's now a reality. So what a remarkable day, David.
DAVID GREGORY, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: An incredible day and incredible accomplishment for Donald Trump, who is the ultimate outsider in an outsider year, in an anti-establishment year.
What he's done is remarkable. It was a very accomplished Republican field that he simply blew away, and capping it off in Indiana.
And he now controls the Republican Party as the presumptive nominee as an incredibly divisive figure, huge negatives, toxic policy proposals.
Remember, this is still a candidate who believes that Barack Obama, the president of the United States, was not born in America. He is a birther. He says that President Bush, Republican president, lied to the country about Iraq. He wants to ban Muslims from the country. He wants to mass deport 12 million illegal immigrants. It's quite a mix in our Republican nominee for the country.
BERMAN: United States history. Right? The first non-politician since Dwight Eisenhower, the first business person since Wendell Willkie. You know,Jackie, we're waking up this morning pretending like it's a normal Wednesday. But it's not. Right? I mean, this is history.
The question what the hell happens now? Right? I mean, Reince Priebus last night put out a tweet saying, "Donald Trump will be the presumptive GOP nominee. We all need to be united and focus on defeating Hillary Clinton." But just because Reince Priebus tweets it doesn't make it so.
JACKIE KUCINICH, WASHINGTON BUREAU CHIEF, "THE DAILY BEAST": Reince Priebus' tweets in general haven't really held a lot of weight this cycle. I mean, he's called for comedy -- he's called for lots of things. I don't think -- I think he just lost any shred of power he really had in the party, because now there's a presumptive nominee.
And to David's point, all the divisiveness, that's just inside the Republican Party. When you looked at Twitter last night, there were several prominent Republicans saying either they were switching parties or they were done with the Republican Party. One that I saw was burning his registration card.
So there is some real discontent within that party, and so it will be interesting to watch how and if Donald Trump can unite them before even going forward into a general.
CAMEROTA: We have some examples of that. Some people tweeting out. I mean, these are well-known conservatives. Talk radio host Steve Dietz says, "Well, there's goes my time as a Republican. Will be changing our party affiliation tomorrow. Frankly, I feel relieved to do it. Free, even."
And then there was Ben Howe says, "If Cruz concedes tonight, let's -- I'm no longer a Republican. If he endorses Trump, I'm running for president in 2020."
BERMAN: Let me show you Mark Seltzer, who everyone knows as the speech writer and consigliere of John McCain. He says, "The GOP is going to nominate for president a guy who reads 'The National Enquirer' and thinks it's on the level?" But the key thing is the hash tag here: #ImWithHer. He's going to vote for Hillary Clinton.
MAEVE RESTON, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Amazing. After being on the road with Mark Seltzer during the McCain campaign, it's just amazing to try to accept that reality.
I think that what's so fascinating also last night is in Ted Cruz's speech, you saw all of that divisiveness. There was no word of -- you know, of reaching out to Donald Trump.
BERMAN: Didn't mention his name.
RESTON: He didn't mention his name. And after this incredible press conference yesterday where he called him a pathological liar, a serial philanderer. I mean, the idea that somehow Donald Trump is going to be able to cobble together now a coalition that would allow him to defeat Hillary Clinton is just an open question.
CAMEROTA: David, it was just a week ago that Ted Cruz named his running mate, Carly Fiorina. What was the precipitous -- what happened? I mean, he was saying that, even if he didn't win Indiana, he was going to go on, and he was going to deny Trump the 1,237. Then this precipitous suspension or dropping out last night?
GREGORY: You know, I go back to what I think is the bold stroke here in analysis of this race, which is Donald Trump is the ultimate anti- establishment figure in an anti-establishment year.
Ted Cruz had support that was way too narrow. If you look at all of these states beyond the evangelical Christians, his kind of core base within the Republican Party, he really didn't have much traction. I think he was arguing a lot of social issues in Indiana, when we see from the exit polls that the economy was the huge issue.
Donald Trump has been pitch perfect about a very clear message about economic malaise, people left out of even economic recovery. That's where he's been -- he's been so strong, and he was in Indiana again. The question is, where does he get the rest of the party to unite around him? On what issues? Right? Whether it's the economy. He's anti-trade. He bucks the Republican Party. On foreign affairs, he certainly does. On immigration, he does. Hard to see where he brings people together.
BERMAN: We should have a new poll out. We haven't talked about it yet this morning, but I'm pretty sure I'm not breaking the embargo, which actually says there's one issue right now where Donald Trump is leading Hillary Clinton, and it is the economy. Donald Trump is leading Hillary Clinton on the issue of the economy. The trade issue is one that played big in Indiana. It's one that Bernie Sanders is using against Hillary Clinton.
Is that something you see in the exit polls? You know, people worried about the economy, they voted for Donald Trump. I mean,, Jackie, is this -- you know,, can he keep it focused there and not on, you know, Ted Cruz's father, you know, being in a picture with Lee Harvey Oswald? I mean, there's the ridiculous and then there's, you know, the focus that voters want to see. KUCINICH: I don't think Donald Trump ditches the ridiculous. I don't
think it's in him to cast aside conspiracy theories, because that is -- it plays well to the people that like him. So I don't see that going away. Particularly the people that he's surrounded himself with. Sort of indulge in that sort of thing. He met with Ed Klein the other day, who writes Hillary Clinton fan fiction.
BERMAN: Conspiracy theories.
KUCINICH: Conspiracy theories. Yes. So there's that.
But the focus on the economy, that's why you see him co-opting Bernie Sanders's message in ways. He actually cites Bernie Sanders, and that will likely continue, as well.
RESTON: That's going to be his best hope of winning here. When we look at the general election matchups, Trump right now not doing so well against Hillary Clinton, and you have to start thinking about the map.
I mean, the fact that he has talked about immigration in such a toxic way, as David said. What does that mean? Does he write off Colorado, Nevada? How does he reach out to those Latino voters? Does the race just become fought, you know, in the Rust Belt, in those Midwest states that Republicans had hoped to turn for a long time, like Michigan, but have struggled?
GREGORY: And there's five or six states that you wonder, "Can he make a red state out of a blue state?" Twenty-four percent in Indiana said they would never vote for Donald Trump. Those are Republicans, 24 percent. Hillary Clinton faces that on the left, as well, who would never vote for Clinton who are Democrats. That number is likely to go down. That's going to be a key thing for Trump to attack.
CAMEROTA: Last night was painful for Ted Cruz and his supporters, and literally for his wife. There was this horrible moment where he was suspending his campaign, or dropping out, and he was hugging his dad. And Heidi Cruz was trying to get in on the hug, and he ended up accidentally sort of clocking her a couple of times with his hand.
[06:15:11] First of all, God bless her for, you know, sort of taking it on the chin, so to speak, and not punching him back, which I -- might have involuntarily done, and it's just such a -- God, what a moment. I mean, for the supporters who were shocked that he was getting out.
RESTON: Heidi Cruz has had such a difficult time over the last couple of months. I mean, Donald Trump really targeted her, you know, tweeting that picture of his wife up against her. I mean, she's just had -- and she's been out on the campaign trail being one of the most effective surrogates for her husband. She actually did, you know, help warm him up a little bit. I mean, Ted Cruz was so disliked, and so it really was a painful moment to watch.
BERMAN: I've got to say, campaigns are soul-obliterating things. They are physically exhausting, emotionally exhausting, psychologically exhausting. I feel bad about picking on the Cruzes for that a little, but I mean...
CAMEROTA: I don't want to pick on them. I want to say that this is -- I mean, I don't want to use it as a metaphor, but it is.
BERMAN: To see that picture, I'm like, ah -- it's a rough night. It's rough night.
CAMEROTA: Horrible.
BERMAN: So Alisyn...
CAMEROTA: Panel, stick around. We have more to talk about, as you know.
Coming up in our next hour, Republican Party Chairman Reince Priebus joins us live here on NEW DAY. What does he say this morning?
BERMAN: Yes. Plus, our Wolf Blitzer will speak to the man that Reince Priebus says will be the presumptive Republican nominee. Donald Trump will be on "THE SITUATION ROOM," in "THE SITUATION ROOM," all around "THE SITUATION ROOM." The interview airs at 5 p.m. Eastern time right here on CNN.
CAMEROTA: Bernie Sanders vowing to stay in the race after beating Hillary Clinton in Indiana. Even though he was mathematically eliminated from reaching the delegate threshold. So how does he plan to win the nomination? We'll talk about that.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BERMAN: All right. Bernie Sanders hoping to turn his Indiana victory into some kind of momentum, but the math says it's essentially all but impossible for Bernie Sanders to catch Hillary Clinton in the delegate race. So where does this fight go from her here? Let's bring back our political panel: David Gregory, Jackie Kucinich, Maeve Reston.
Maeve, I'm going to start with you this time. Before we talk about how the math means that Bernie Sanders really can't win the nomination, let's give him credit for winning Indiana, which he did. So it means what?
RESTON: It means that he still has a lot of leverage as we head toward the convention system. You think about how far Bernie Sanders has drawn Hillary Clinton to the left in this race, even on a lot of her positions. He can continue to argue that he'll be able to flip super delegates, that he has this narrow path to victory. It's very hard to see that actually happening.
But I think he will have a lot of power to drive his agenda, particularly because of his support among young voters, who Hillary Clinton is going to need.
CAMEROTA: Jackie, it's so frustrating for his supporters, because he win these states, and then you hear the media the next day, "But he has no chance of becoming the nominee." And even he last night was explaining, once again, his path, how he thinks he can do it. So listen to this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SANDERS: I think that, as more and more delegates to the Democratic convention take a hard look at which candidate is generating the kind of enthusiasm, excitement, voter turnout that we need to make sure that somebody like a Donald Trump does not become president, I think you're going to see more and more delegates concluding that that candidate is Bernie Sanders.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CAMEROTA: OK. Can he bring more delegates to -- away from Hillary and to him?
KUCINICH: It's certainly hypothetical. It certain doesn't look like it. Haven't seen anyone do it yet. They've been talking about this for a while. No one has actually said, "I was with her and now I'm with him." That hasn't happened.
And when you talk to Democrats who are not, you know, on the Bernie Sanders or Hillary Clinton campaign, a lot of them will say that Hillary Clinton is their best shot, and now there's -- now there's a target. Now it's not Donald Trump or Ted Cruz. Now it's Donald Trump.
BERMAN: You know, I wanted to talk about a positive first, but I giveth and now I taketh away, David Gregory, because let's look at the math right now. Because if you look at the delegates. Bernie Sanders needs to win 101 percent of the remaining pledged delegates in order to clinch the nomination. That's because so many super delegates have lined up for Hillary Clinton. If he can't flip the super delegates, he can't win. It is now his only path to the nomination.
GREGORY: Again, I don't think this is about a path to the nomination. I think she's only certainly the nominee of the Democratic Party. But he does expose weaknesses that Hillary Clinton has. Indiana was a state that Barack Obama won in the general election in 2000.
BERMAN: Exposing weakness, good for the party at this point?
GREGORY: No. It's probably not good for the party and certainly not good from the point of view of Hillary Clinton and a lot of her supporters. But he has a constituency. He has a reason to run. And he has a lot of passion behind him. And he's got a message that still resonates, and he's got more momentum to be gained here before the primary calendar is done.
And by the way, he won Democrats last night, if I'm not mistaken. He won the Democrats in the state of Indiana, which is something he has not done in other contests. He's had to rely on independents and others. So again, it gives his supporters a lot of enthusiasm to keep on going.
CAMEROTA: Talk about those independents, because he won hugely last night with them. He got 72 percent in terms of exit polls in independents over her 28 percent. She needs independents to win. I mean, in November. So what does that say?
RESTON: I mean, she's -- and that shows how much she's going to need Bernie Sanders to really get behind her, if she ultimately does win the nomination.
Right now it's very difficult to look at the general election matchup and figure out exactly how this race might go, if it's Hillary Clinton versus Donald Trump. But she is definitely going to have to do more to appeal to independents at a time when she has been drawn so far to the left.
KUCINICH: You've also heard, Donald Trump already, his people already started saying that they're going to reach out to Bernie Sanders supporters, that they're going to reach out to these people who have been embracing this anti-establishment message and saying...
RESTON: Anti-trade.
KUCINICH: Anti-trade, exactly. So there are, in that Venn diagram there is some gray between the two. And they're banking on that.
GREGORY: Again, I think we have to focus on the number of those people who said they would never vote for Clinton within the Democratic Party. I think she'll have an easier time, although not completely easy time, building that bridge to Sanders' supporters than it looks like Trump is going to have to his retractors in the Republican Party.
[06:25:11] And that's going to be very important for her, because she'd rather be in her position relative to Donald Trump but she still faces a slog in terms of -- in terms of getting...
RESTON: And you don't know how many independents.
BERMAN: Look at the slog. Look at the calendar coming up over the next several weeks. West Virginia votes May 10, Kentucky and Oregon on the 17th. These were states where Bernie Sanders, you know, could and should do well. He may very well win the next three primaries.
GREGORY: Which gives him more momentum. But that 18 percent number said they definitely would not vote for her. These are Democrats saying they would not vote for her on the Republican side in Indiana, it was 24. So that's a little bit...
CAMEROTA: But David, what do you think about that theory, that Donald Trump, as the ultimate outsider, is reaching out to Bernie Sanders supporters? Can there be an exodus?
GREGORY: You know, I think we were all saying, I think we shouldn't be in the business of predicting impact, Trump's impact, because we've been wrong too many times before. But if our friend, Ron Brownstein, were here, he'd say a couple of things: One, that Barack Obama won among independents and still won the general. Two, if you look at the data, one of the daunting things for Trump is even if he wins all of the white male vote, as Mitt Romney did in 2012, he would need 58 percent of white women, which would be a tall order, given his standing right now with white women and women in general.
KUCINICH: Married women. Married women, Mitt Romney actually won in 2012.
RESTON: What we don't know is how many independents he could potentially bring in, turn out this fall. I think that's where we have to be really careful in predicting.
CAMEROTA: Panel, thank you. Great to have you guys here.
You can keep up with all of the latest political news on the new CNN Politics app. Download it for free at the app store. And it features the Indiana primary results and Sanders' fight to remain in the race, and Trump's new status as the GOP's presumptive nominee.
Well, the state of Arizona and the nation mourning the death of a Navy SEAL, killed by ISIS forces in Iraq. We have the tragic details on what happened, ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
