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FBI To Question Hillary Clinton In E-Mail Probe; Paul Ryan: "Not Ready" To Back Trump As Nominee; Trump Tweets Picture With Taco Bowl On Cinco De Mayo. Aired 7:30-8a ET

Aired May 06, 2016 - 07:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[07:32:00]ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN HOST: Well, the FBI interviewing some of Hillary Clinton's closest State Department aides about whether classified material was on her private e-mail server. That investigation is reportedly winding down, according to some U.S. officials who have spoken to CNN, and there is no apparent evidence, so far, of any criminal wrongdoing.

Still, could the e-mail controversy hurt Hillary Clinton in the general election? Joining us now is CNN's senior political commentator, David Axelrod, former senior adviser to President Obama. Hi, David.

DAVID AXELROD, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Hey, how are you?

CAMEROTA: Doing well. So, if it turns out that there was no criminal wrongdoing, does that rob the Republicans and Donald Trump of one line of attack or do they just keep going at it?

AXELROD: Well, obviously, if there were a finding of criminal wrongdoing that would be a very live issue for the general election. It feels to me like this is sort of baked in the cake right now. I don't think that if it goes along, as Evan Perez reported, and they find no action to be taken on this, I think you move on from there. I don't think this is going to be determinative in the general election.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN HOST: How about having to answer questions to the FBI? Hillary Clinton will answer questions and she said she's open to answering questions.

AXELROD: Right.

BERMAN: Yet, if you're running a campaign, how do you stage manage that moment?

AXELROD: Well, I think that that is the question. Look, I don't think anybody, from the beginning of this, thought that they would have an investigation of this and not, ultimately, ask her some questions. So, it's not exactly news that they're going to talk her but it could be a news event.

And so, my guess is that they're going to try and do this at a private location at a time unbeknownst to any of us and get it over with.

CAMEROTA: I mean, it's very good news for the campaign that it's not just this interminable fishing expedition. I mean, some people didn't know when this was going to end. Was it going to last through the whole general? So, this timing seems to be working in her favor if they find nothing.

AXELROD: Yes, especially if, as was reported, they're going to come to some conclusion in the next few weeks. That would be perfect for her to get this out of the way before the convention -- before the full brunt of the general election campaign. So, if it works out as reported this is good news for her, bad news for Donald Trump and the Republicans.

BERMAN: Can I ask you what the other big news in the last 24 hours. Paul, I think, coming out and saying he is not yet ready to support Donald Trump. It's a huge wow, but is it just a wow or is it a wow and it will have lasting, lingering effects that could hurt the Trump campaign?

AXELROD: Well look, I think it underscores what is the reality of the case. There are a lot of Republicans who are fundamentally uncomfortable with Donald Trump. Paul Ryan's positions are completely out of step with Donald Trump on trade, on immigration reform, on the Muslim ban, on deficit reduction and entitlements.

[07:35:00] On the whole range of issues that Trump has been campaigning on, and totally, Paul Ryan is the exponent of the politics of addition. Let's reach out, let's try and broaden the party. And there are a lot of Republicans in his camp.

He also speaks for conservatives who are suspicious of Trump, and their suspicions were increased the other day when he said my opposition to the minimum wage may be a thing of the past. This is exactly what they fear.

This is what both conservatives and some Democrats fear, which is that he is a shapeshifter and that he'll have a general election profile that is completely out of step with conservatism of the party. So, Ryan is carving out his own turf. He's thinking about not just November, but past November, and maybe to 2020 when, if Trump loses, he could emerge as the nominee of the Republican Party.

CAMEROTA: So, does that whole landscape that you've just described, going on on the Republican side, give Hillary Clinton an opportunity to reach across the aisle and say if you happen to be one of those Republicans that is deeply uncomfortable with who Donald Trump is, I'm the candidate for you? Or, has her move to the left during the primary made that sort of an impossible argument?

AXELROD: Well, you know, she's been helped in that regard because Sen. Sanders has been to the left of her. In that sense, he's been defining her as more moderate. I think that there are some - I don't think there are going to be a lot of prominent Republicans who step forward and say I'm for Hillary Clinton, but I think there are a lot --

CAMEROTA: But, behind the scenes. AXELROD: Well, I think that, first of all, their absence of support for Trump is going to be debilitating to him. Remember, he now has to go out and raise money, you know. His days as a self-funder are over. I was in town here with a group of people in the financial community. I saw virtually no support for him in a room in which you'd expect a rush of support for the Republican nominee, just because they're very distrustful of Donald Trump. So --

CAMEROTA: And are those people going to support Hillary Clinton?

AXELROD: Well, I --

BERMAN: Because the Clinton campaign is leaking like left, right, and center. They're going after Jeb Bush supporters. They want to think that these people are gettable, but are they?

AXELROD: You look at -- I think it's going to be tough. You look at her numbers among Republicans in, for example, the CNN poll, and they're very, very negative, just as her numbers among Democrats are very strong. But I do think it helps her with independent voters and some fall-away Republicans. You have to say she's in a very strong position.

And Ryan, speaking out as he did, does not help Trump's cause in terms of trying to bring Republicans, who are reluctant, into the tent.

BERMAN: You know, it strikes me that Hillary Clinton has clearly made a decision now that she's on to the general election. I mean, she's really barely talking about Bernie Sanders at all. You know, she's been in California, she's campaigned a little bit in Kentucky and West Virginia, but not focusing on these primary states.

How does this look for her this month, particularly if she does continue to lose a few of these states, which she very well might?

AXELROD: Well John, I remember when Iwas working for Barack Obama in 2008 and we had fairly clinched the nomination in early May but there were a series of primaries, among them Kentucky and West Virginia, in which she beat the hell out of us. And it was -- you know, it didn't impede, ultimately, the mission but it was a source of minor embarrassment on those days that the perspective nominee --

And, you know, it gave a chance for people, like us around this table -- I include myself in that now -- to say well, you know, Obama has weakness with white working-class voters and so on. It all turned out not to mean very much in the general election but, no doubt, there'll be some chatter because Bernie Sanders is going to run up some wins this month.

CAMEROTA: David Axelrod, great to see you.

AXELROD: Always good to see you guys.

CAMEROTA: Thanks so much for being here. Well, Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton are at odds, as you know, on most issues. The economy, no exception. So which candidate has the right solutions to get the economy humming along? We will compare their plans and see how they stack up when NEW DAY returns.

[07:39:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:43:00] CAMEROTA: Donald Trump says when comparing his economic plan to that of his likely Democratic opponent, Hillary Clinton, there is no comparison. So, we thought we'd take up that challenge and try to compare what both are proposing.

Rana Foroohar is here to help us. She is CNN's global economic analyst. Also, assistant managing editor for "TIME" magazine. Hi, Rana, great to have you here.

RANA FOROOHAR, CNN GLOBAL ECONOMIC ANALYST: Thanks for having me.

CAMEROTA: OK, so let's look. Let's start with the Trump economic plan --

FOROOHAR: OK.

CAMEROTA: -- and see what he is proposing. Here are some of the tenets of it. Eliminate national debt in eight years. That would be nice. Impose tariffs on countries not trading "fairly" with the U.S. End trade deals like NAFTA. And, he's open to raising the minimum wage. What jumps out at you?

FOROOHAR: Yes. Well, the trade is the most interesting part of this. A lot of what he's proposing is either a bad idea or impossible. I mean, tariffs -- slapping tariffs penalizes everybody. It makes stuff more expensive. It tends to create trade wars.

CAMEROTA: But he says it's not a fair, level playing field.

FOROOHAR: It's true it's not a level playing field. Tariffs are not the way to fix that, though. You've basically got to bring countries like China -- a lot of the emerging markets -- into the WTO and really make them play by those same rules and there's a lot of ways to do that, but tariffs are not the way.

What I do think Donald Trump is hitting on, though, is this sense on Main Street that the rules of the game portrayed really haven't' benefitted a lot of people, and that's an important point.

CAMEROTA: OK, let's look at what Hillary Clinton has proposed on her economic plan. She says that she is going to raise the minimum wage to $12 or maybe even above, to $15. Tighten tax code, close tax loopholes. Make tax incentives to encourage training, corporate profit-sharing. And, appoint more Wall Street regulators and prosecute firms that play outside of the lines. What do you see here?

FOROOHAR: So, Hillary Clinton is right to be focusing on the tax code. That's where a lot of action is in terms of creating the right incentives for the financial system, for wages, for companies to do the right thing and take long-term positions. I think she's probably going to get criticism from Trump around Wall Street still. I mean, she is somebody that wants to work within the existing Dodd-Frank framework -- strengthen it. But, you know, she's taken a lot of flack for her relationships with Wall Street donors.

[07:45:00] I think that Trump is actually going to try and run to the left of her economically, in some ways.

CAMEROTA: Is that what --

FOROOHAR: It's a sort of bizarro thing. You can hardly imagine it. But his position around trade, being very anti-free trade, really talking up how bad of a deal NAFTA was, which was negotiated in the 90's by her husband. That's something that's going to put him really to the left of her.

CAMEROTA: So then, how do both of these play on Wall Street where they'll be looking for donors?

FOROOHAR: Well, I think that, first of all, Trump is certainly a creature of Wall Street. I mean, he may say he's not but he's done some of the most highly-leveraged commercial real estate deals ever. I mean, I don't believe that. But he will be talking in a populous way about Clinton's relationships with donors. He'll say I'm not taking money. He will make people feel like can we trust what Hillary Clinton is saying? That'll be his strategy.

Hillary will say look, we can't just worry about breaking up the big banks. We've got to look at the financial system as a whole. She'll try and put out a more nuanced message about reform. Whether or not that resonates with the voters, though, as viscerally as that sort of Trump trade message does is a big question.

CAMEROTA: Is there any way to tell which one of these is better for the economy?

FOROOHAR: I think Hillary Clinton's is definitely more realistic, you know. It's something that can be done. The tax code is where the action is in terms of tweaking it, making it favor savers and equity more than debt. Closing loopholes that allow companies like Apple to offshore a lot of money and issue debt here to pay back shareholders. That's something that we can do. Hopefully, she'll have a Congress that will work with her if she's president.

CAMEROTA: I mean, in terms of the tax code, Donald Trump has said something unusual for a conservative, as well, where he has said that he's open and, in fact, encouraging raising taxes on the wealthiest, himself included.

FOROOHAR: He is. He's talked about cap gains and the fact that people that make money from basically making money and having investments should have to pay higher rates. That's something a lot of rich people, Warren Buffett and many others, have talked about and it's certainly a good idea. But you need much broader tax reform than that to really fix the system.

CAMEROTA: People say that their top concern this election is the economy --

FOROOHAR: Yes.

CAMEROTA: -- and jobs.

FOROOHAR: Yes.

CAMEROTA: And Donald Trump has made it his overarching theme that he will bring back jobs to this country.

FOROOHAR: Yes.

CAMEROTA: Have you heard specifics in terms of how that would happen?

FOROOHAR: No, not at all, and that's what I think is interesting about the way he's become so popular with a lot of working people and middle-class people living in this country. He's giving the right rhetoric. He's touching something in people's felt experience, which is that globalization, the current system of capitalism, isn't maybe working for them as well as it might.

But his plans are not going to get us the jobs. He's not going to renegotiate trade deals with China and bring back jobs enmasse to the U.S. There are ways --

CAMEROTA: Why not?

FOROOHAR: Because, you know -- I mean, the Chinese have got their own agenda and, frankly, it's a very difficult political time for them right now. There is no way Xi Jinping is going to roll over and let Donald Trump say what the next trade deal is going to look like. He's dealing with social unrest in his own country. It's just not politically going to happen.

So, he's touching something in the felt experience is important, but I think Hillary Clinton has a much more realistic plan for how to go about fixing some of these things.

CAMEROTA: Rana Foroohar, thanks so much for making it understandable.

FOROOHAR: Thank you.

CAMEROTA: Let's get over to John.

BERMAN: All right, Alisyn. Donald Trump says he loves Hispanics but he's facing backlash over this picture that he tweeted, showing him in a taco bowl. What are his chances of getting Latino support in November?

And a quick programming note. This Sunday on "PARTS UNKNOWN" at 9:00 p.m., Anthony Bourdain journeys to the Greek island of Naxos. I don't even know if I'm saying that right but I still want to go there to get an authentic taste of the Greek good life. Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think there was sending over a villager to go the Army. Basically, a good reason for everyone to let some steam out.

ANTHONY BOURDAIN, HOST, "PARTS UNKNOWN": Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Lamb, beef?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is lamb, this is pork, and this is (INAUDIBLE).

BOURDAIN: And the famous potatoes, of course.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And the famous potatoes. This is called aroshna (ph) which is a traditional natural style of pork.

BOURDAIN: Oh, good sauce. Is that tomato and peppers?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Wine, tomato sauce, pepper, and garlic.

BOURDAIN: So, you make wine?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I make wine, yes. I make a good wine.

BOURDAIN: Born here.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, not born here. I came to Naxos when I was 22 years old.

BOURDAIN: From?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Athens.

BOURDAIN: Athens. A very different life here.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I believe here you live every moment of your life. Yes, you feel really the freedom.

BOURDAIN: (LAUGHTER).

(END VIDEOTAPE)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:53:00] BERMAN: The battle for minority voters, specifically Latinos, could go a long to deciding whether Donald Trump or his Democratic opponent land in the White House. Trump has called for millions of immigrants to be deported, so can Trump land Latino voters?

Joining us now, Rudy Fernandez, former special assistant to President George W. Bush and former RNC staffer, and the Rev. Samuel Rodriguez, president of the National Hispanic Leadership Conference. Gentlemen, thanks so much for being with us.

Rudy, I want to start with you. Could you ever vote for Donald Trump? RUDY FERNANDEZ, FORMER SPECIAL ASSISTANT TO PRESIDENT GEORGE W. BUSH: No, never, and the moment that really crystalized this for me, John, was few months ago when that "New York Times" reporter was essentially trampled on and taken to the ground forcefully at a Trump rally.

It crystalized for me the fact that if Trump has demonstrated anything during this campaign, it is the fact that when faces the slightest criticism or the slightest disagreement, he tries to destroy his opponent. He does the character assassination, he attacks the person, he belittles the person. He's shown, frankly, dictatorial tendencies.

My ancestors came from Cuba. Dictatorial tendencies are things that you've got take seriously and we cannot turn over our nuclear stockpile, the power of the NSA, and all the powers that come to the executive to someone like Donald Trump. I think he would try to exceed executive power in unprecedented ways, and for that reason I cannot support him.

And I've supported -- let me make it clear. I've been a Republican my entire life. I worked for the Bush-Cheney campaign, in the Bush White House, at the RNC. This will be the very first time that I don't support a Republican candidate, but you've got to put our country first.

BERMAN: Now Reverend, I know you feel differently, but let me just throw up some numbers here to show you because if there are people out there, like Rudy, this is a problem, right? If you look at the Latino vote in some key states here, it makes up 22 percent of eligible voters in Arizona, 18 percent in Florida, 19 percent in Nevada, 14 percent in Colorado, 10 percent in Illinois.

[07:55:00] What do you tell the Latino voters to make them comfortable with Trump?

REV. SAMUEL RODRIGUEZ, PRESIDENT, NATIONAL HISPANIC LEADERSHIP CONFERENCE: I'm a pastor. Donald Trump needs nothing less than a miracle. How about this? A miracle on steroids. Using his words, a large, big, massive miracle --

BERMAN: On steroids.

RODRIGUEZ: -- on steroids, I kid you not. He has -- no one's beyond redemption. That's my argument, you know. I disagree, wholeheartedly, with his rhetoric, his rhetorical demagoguery on immigration, and on a plethora of other issues. He has to redeem the narrative with the Latino community.

It's not the Latino community like Rudy would agree. It's in favor of amnesty. But the whole hyperbole that the majority of immigrants are rapists and murderers, you're done, you know. Exacerbated by in my first week I begin the process of deporting 11 million people. Hey, good luck with that, Donald. It's just not going to happen.

So, he needs the Latino vote. Twenty-seven percent, Mitt Romney. That's what Mitt Romney acquired -- 27 percent. I was working back with Karl Rove back in the day when 44 percent voted for George W. Bush and we were looking at 50 percent, inevitably, before 2010. Well, that ship sailed.

So, Donald Trump needs to redeem the narrative with the Latino community. It begins with one, I screwed up, I messed up, mea culpa. Can you imagine Donald Trump saying I am sorry to the Hispanic- American electorate? It would require a miracle.

BERMAN: Well, let me ask you this. On the subject of redemption, let's put out the tweet. Let's show the tweet that he sent out yesterday. It was Cinco de Mayo and this is him. It says, "Happy Cinco de Mayo. The best taco bowls are made in Trump Tower Grill. I love Hispanics," is what he says. Is that the path to redemption -- taco bowls?

RODRIGUEZ: No. Seriously speaking, I think Donald Trump -- no, not taco bowls. He needs a conversation to say look, you know, I really messed up. I engaged in hyperbole -- rhetorical hyperbole. I was wrong.

The vast majority of Latinos, especially -- even the immigrants, even the undocumented immigrants are God-fearing, hard-working, wonderful people and we have to find a pathway for integration. It begins with that. Without that, Donald Trump will never occupy Pennsylvania Avenue.

BERMAN: So Rudy, he put out that tweet. There were many people, immediately, who were offended. There were many more people who were immediately confused. This morning, Donald Trump saying hey, it's great. Fifty-eight thousand people retweeted it. That must be a record. What was your reaction?

FERNANDEZ: Listen, it shows his lack of understanding for the issues and, frankly, for the Hispanic community, you know. It's demeaning in my opinion. Rev. Rodriguez is a good man, you know, and I worked with him when we were working for Bush-Cheney to elect them and then re- elect them. But I'll tell you, this goes far beyond Hispanic issues, you know.

Trump fails the three most important tests, in my opinion. He fails the knowledge test. I mean, you could only get a -- my 3-year-old son -- he may fall for the I'm going to negotiate great deals. Trust me, I'm going to get rid of the $19 trillion debt in eight years and without any explanation how. But, my 9-year-old girls -- they would see beyond that and they would want an explanation as to how you're going to do it.

This guy has shown very little knowledge about the issues that matter most. He shows a total disregard for Hispanics, for Muslims. He doesn't understand that when you attack all Muslims you are actually encouraging and helping ISIS recruit Jihadists. He is plain dangerous, and for that reason I can't support him.

Let me say this about Hillary Clinton, because I've been a huge critic of Hillary Clinton. But my differences, John, with Hillary Clinton are policy differences, you know? And we've had conservative presidents, we've had moderate presidents, we've had liberal presidents. As long as they respect the separation of powers, as long as they respect the U.S. Constitution, we'll survive.

BERMAN: Reverend --

FERNANDEZ: So, I'm going to focus on supporting the Republican congressional candidate, but I can't support Trump.

BERMAN: Let me ask you quickly. We have about 20 seconds left. If Marco Rubio or Mel Martinez -- Rudy's from Florida. I'm saying this for him. If someone like that were picked as Donald Trump's running mate, and I'm not saying they would say yes, but in an imaginary world where they absolutely say yes, would that him more acceptable, you think, to Latino voters?

RODRIGUEZ: Marco Rubio, potential game-changer. Listen, potential game-changer and you can't deny the fact. Marco Rubio can actually redeem the narrative, indeed.

BERMAN: Rudy, last word?

FERNANDEZ: Marco Rubio is a personal friend of mine. I would have loved to have supported him for president. But no, it wouldn't make a difference. The vice president -- this is not about the vice president. This is about who would sit at the big desk at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue.

BERMAN: You are a long way, wow, from supporting Donald Trump. Guys, thanks so much for being us. It was a really interesting discussion. I appreciate it.

RODRIGUEZ: Thank you.

BERMAN: We are following a lot of news this morning, including that fallout after House Speaker Paul Ryan said he is not ready to back Donald Trump. Let's get to it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Everybody's out and I'm the only one left. That's OK, right?

REP. PAUL RYAN (R), HOUSE SPEAKER: I hope to support our nominee, I'm just not there right now.

TRUMP: You know why it's #NeverTrump? Because I'm going to stop the gravy train.