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Gary Johnson Running As Libertarian In 2016; Trump & Clinton In Tight Battleground Races; Could A Third-Party Candidate Win?; Can The GOP Unite Behind Donald Trump?; Kim Jong Un Elevated To Chairman Of Workers' Party; Trump Slams Washington Post Columnist Over Rubio, Ryan Comments. Aired 7:30-8a ET

Aired May 10, 2016 - 07:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[07:29:00] GARY JOHNSON, LIBERTARIAN, FORMER NEW MEXICO GOVERNOR: -- poll at about 30 percent right now, but Mickey's not on the ballot in all 50 states, so where is that voice? Where is the voice of 50 percent of Americans today that are declaring themselves as independent?

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: Does Sanders have more rightful claim to that voice than you do?

JOHNSON: Well, but he's not going to be the third party. You know, I want to make a pitch to everybody watching this to get on the Website isidewith.com. Get on the Website isidewith.com political quiz.

Take the quiz. At the end of the quiz you get paired with the presidential candidate most in line with your views. I think you should find out who you're most in line with and then knock yourself out supporting that candidate.

Interestingly, the next candidate that I side with, outside of myself, is Bernie Sanders. So obviously, Bernie and I have a whole -- but, I sided with Bernie 73 percent of the time. When it comes to economics we come to a T in the road. I go one way, he goes the other. But on the social side of Bernie, I get it. I mean, it's really very libertarian.

CUOMO: Gary Johnson, former governor of New Mexico.

JOHNSON: Chris, thank you so much.

CUOMO: Great to have you.

JOHNSON: Great to be with you. Thank you, thank you, thank you.

CUOMO: Good luck going forward and I appreciate you making the case to the viewers of NEW DAY -- J.B.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: All right, thanks, Chris. So what could a Gary Johnson run mean for the 2016 presidential race? We'll discuss that and other big headlines with Michael Smerconish. That's next.

[07:31:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:34:00] BERMAN: All right, just in. Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton neck-and-neck in brand new polls out of key swing states today. Does that mean a third-party candidate could swing the race one way or another?

Let's discuss with CNN political commentator and host of CNN's "SMERCONISH", Michael Smerconish. You know, Michael, these polls just came out from Quinnipiac. Let me rattle them off right now. In Florida, Hillary Clinton up a near one point. In Ohio, Donald Trump up four points. And in Pennsylvania, Hillary Clinton up one.

[07:35:00] We spoke to Gary Johnson, you know, likely libertarian candidate for president right now. Four years ago, in 2012, he got one percent in the polls. People might say oh, you know, he's nowhere, he's nowhere. But if compare the one percent to the margin, right now, between Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump in key swing states you start to see, Michael, how he could play a role here.

MICHAEL SMERCONISH, CNN HOST, "SMERCONISH": Well, you make a good observation, John, and I think something that's changed in the last four years, which you made reference to in the last segment, are the incredibly high negatives of both presumptive nominees.

That's a situation that we didn't have four years ago. You didn't have Mitt Romney being disapproved of by so many people within his own party, nor the same for incumbent Barack Obama. So, therein lies the opportunity for Gary Johnson. He made reference to the record-high number of Independents. Gallop said, in January, that it's 42 percent.

And I can tell you -- I had him on my radio program yesterday and independents melted down the phone lines, eager to share their desire to vote for him. But here's the question. Can he get in the polls, because if he can't get in the polls he can't document that he's at 15 percent in order to get on the debate stage? And if he's not on the debate stage, he's nowhere.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: So Michael, beyond Gary Johnson, do you think there are conversations happening in the secret back halls of Washington where party leaders are trying to come up with some other candidate -- a third-party candidate to inject into the race?

SMERCONISH: I believe those conversations are taking place, and I also believe that they're fruitless. On my program on CNN on Saturday, I had Peter Ackerman, the successful businessman who has spent more time and more money on this issue than anyone else in the country.

He's the individual who was behind that campaign four years ago called "Americans Elect" and he assured me that too many deadlines are looming. That's it's impractical for anyone else to get on all 50 ballots.

CUOMO: We keep hearing that, Michael.

SMERCONISH: You could get on some.

CUOMO: We keep hearing that. That there are infrastructure issues in terms of getting on the ballot at this point -- the money, the time. You would have to co-opt an existing line, like the libertarian line, that is already set up for. But look, a lot of that is speculative at this point, especially with what's going on in the GOP.

Let me ask you. What do you think about the state of play in that party and whether or not this third-party thing is going to keep bubbling up? Do you think what we're hearing from Trump right now about wanting to reach out to Ryan and wanting to give new economic ideas that show his flexibility -- are those compatible? Are they moving it in the right way?

SMERCONISH: Hey, Chris, I think the most important thing relative to the Ryan-Trump relationship is that brand new Quinnipiac survey that you just released. If I'm Speaker Ryan and I'm looking at those Ohio, Pennsylvania, and Florida numbers, I'm saying hey, I better approach this guy with kid gloves because he can win.

And by the way, take a look at those numbers because something that we haven't said that I think bears underscoring is that Bernie Sanders continues to run, even stronger than Hillary, against the Republican.

BERMAN: You make a great point on the Paul Ryan issue. Not yet could become yet very, very quickly if Trump becomes more popular than Congress, which you know, in some ways he already is. I mean, that's a reality Ryan has to face.

You were asking are these conversations happening. I know they are. Bill Kristol, the editor of "The Weekly Standard" was here yesterday. He talked to Mitt Romney over the weekend, trying to push Romney into the race. I'm not sure that's going to happen. Bill Kristol puts the chances at 50-50 that there will be a third-party candidate.

CAMEROTA: That's high, that's high.

BERMAN: But when he says third-party what he really means is another Republican, Michael, getting in the race and running against Donald Trump. He doesn't mean a third-party like Gary Johnson, and there is a difference there and they could have different effects on this race.

SMERCONISH: Well, here's something else, I think, to focus on. So, if the race is as close as the new survey suggests, what if a Gary Johnson or what if another Republican should get into the race and get on additional ballots, not to win but to deny 270 to Trump and to Hillary and push it into the House of Representatives?

See, I think that's a part of the Republican strategy among some, where they say we would rather have a Republican House makes this determination than the electorate.

CAMEROTA: And then what happens, Michael? What, then, does the House decide to do?

SMERCONISH: Chaos, because presumably -- BERMAN: Each state gets one vote. It's, you know --

SMERCONISH: -- it's --

CAMEROTA: So that's the scenario some are hoping for?

SMERCONISH: Yes, and every state --

CUOMO: Well, you'd then wind up being the party that took it from the people.

SMERCONISH: We would get the civics lesson -- well, we would get a civics lesson for the ages, but what I'm saying is that Republicans who are displeased with Trump as their nominee would rather have this Republican-controlled House make the call. Look, it's still pie in the sky but we're exploring the range of options and I think this is on the table.

CAMEROTA: All right, Michael Smerconish, fascinating to think of all of the different possibilities. Thanks so much for being here.

BERMAN: We want to know your take --

SMERCONISH: See you, guys.

BERMAN: -- if you have an opinion on this, a conspiracy theory, or if you are among the legions of Gary Johnson fans who just want to populate our Twitter feed, tweet us @NewDay or post a comment on facebook.com/NewDay.

[07:40:00] CUOMO: He has climbed, former Gov. Gary Johnson, the seven highest peaks on the seven continents.

CAMEROTA: Wow.

BERMAN: The guy is no joke. I mean, the guy is incredibly fit.

CUOMO: He has run a 100-mile race. He is going to do the 3,000-mile bike race that goes all the way from North to --

CAMEROTA: He's got my vote for some things.

BERMAN: Is he vowing to do that even if he gets president because we're not going to have enough time.

CUOMO: He said -- he actually said to me, unless I am president, I'm doing this bike race.

CAMEROTA: Wow.

CUOMO: So, it's going to be a tough choice for Johnson come November. North Korean leader Kim Jong Un getting a new title. What does this mean? We have a live report from inside North Korea, next.

Also, a programming note. A special "AC360" town hall tomorrow night. Everybody's talking about it. We're going to show you what the problem is with opioid addiction. Dr. Sanjay Gupta joining Anderson Cooper for "PRESCRIPTION ADDICTION MADE IN AMERICA". That's Wednesday night, 9:00 p.m. eastern, right here on CNN. Really important for families.

[07:41:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:45:00] CUOMO: North Korean leader Kim Jong Un presiding over a massive parade today at the end of the nation's first workers' party congress in nearly four decades. Now -- during which Kim elevated to party chairman in a four-day event.

We have CNN correspondent Will Ripley, among only a handful of journalists granted access to the rare political event. He joins us now from Pyongyang. Will, what was it like?

WILL RIPLEY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, it was surreal. First of all, we didn't think we were going to get access on the last day because we'd been pushing for it since the first day on Friday of the Congress when we could only stand across the street and shoot exteriors of the building. Then, our only source of informationthroughout the weekend was state T.V.

So when they put us on this bus, we went through a 90-minute security check with some very tough looking North Korean security service officers. I thought well, something might be up and then, sure enough, we were driven to the building where they were holding the party congress. Marched right in and moments later onto the stages.

The supreme leader of this country, Kim Jong Un, his top party leadership -- and they announced that he is now the chairman. Now, technically, this is a promotion but it's hard to think how somebody with absolute power could become even more powerful. But it's ceremonial and it indicates that he firmly has a grip on this country right now and its 24 million people.

CUOMO: It is that he has almost supernatural powers. What do you think the political play is here?

RIPLEY: Well, the political play is that there's been a lot of turmoil since he took power because in Korean society hierarchy is everything. His father, Kim Jong Il, was in the public eye for 20 years before he became the leader.

Kim Jong Un -- people only knew about him for one year before his father died unexpectedly. He rose to power. He had his uncle executed because his uncle was believed to be conspiring against him. A lot of upper-level officials were purged, which means they were either executed or sent away from Pyongyang.

So this is, in essence, a demonstration, both domestically and to the world, that he's in control. That's why you saw the H-bomb test in January, the satellite launch in February, and just last month those four attempted missile launches, as well. CUOMO: He's got nukes on the noggin, right? He says he wants to increase the potential and the number of weapons in that regard. We do know that they recently tried to launch three ballistic missiles off their east coast. The attempts were unsuccessful but it keeps reminding of how little it would take for North Korea to be a threat, specifically to Japan and South Korea. Tell us about that.

RIPLEY: Well, because their technology is developing far more rapidly than anybody expected, and there is even indication South Korean intelligence, the U.S. think tank 38-North -- there's a lot of concern that North Korea could, at any moment, order yet another nuclear test.

Each test gives them a lot of valuable intelligence. Each failed missile test -- they learn about the missile's operating systems, they learn how to perfect the technology. So this country is investing billions of dollars.

This is an impoverished country that has trouble generating electricity, even here in the capital. People only have it for a few hours a day. Out in the places we're not allowed to see, who knows how much, if any, power they have?

There are difficulties with the food supply, and yet the investment in this nuclear weapons development is a key priority of Kim Jong Un, even though he says he also wants to turn around the economy. But when he's getting sanctioned so heavily -- his country's diplomatically isolated. People won't trade. How do you grow the economy while also pushing forward with this goal of developing nukes?

But, he thinks it's the only way that he'll keep this country as it is, as a sovereign state. And his people, at least openly, say that they stand by him and we saw that example of that this weekend, including this massive torchlight parade that is happening right now in Pyongyang. These are teenagers who have been practicing for months to get every move perfect so they can impress their leader.

CUOMO: Will Ripley, thank you very much for the reporting from North Korea. Appreciate it -- Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: OK, Chris, Donald Trump, again, lashing out at the media. We heard it right here on NEW DAY yesterday. Up next, we have another journalist in Trump's crosshairs. What she has to say about his latest attack. That's next.

[07:49:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:52:00] BERMAN: It has been a constant theme throughout Donald Trump's 11-month campaign. His alleged disdain for the media. We saw it again yesterday -- Chris' interview with Trump right here on NEW DAY. Trump claims to disdain the same media attention that he constantly seeks.

Let's talk about it. We're joined now by Jennifer Rubin. She writes the "Right Turn" blog for "The Washington Post" and has been a recent Trump target. Also with us, Jeffrey Lord, CNN political commentator and a Donald Trump supporter.

Jennifer, I want to start with you. Donald Trump doesn't like you and we know that because he said so here yesterday on NEW DAY, completely unprompted. Let's listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: You have a lightweight -- a real -- a real dope.

CUOMO: Mr. Trump, they say you have to --

TRUMP: You have a lightweight named Jennifer Rubin who spoke about -- I didn't speak to Rubio. Well, I have spoken to Rubio. And then she said I never spoke to Ryan. Well, I have spoken to Ryan. And either she's living in a time warp or something --

CUOMO: All right.

TRUMP: -- if you watch her.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: Yes, you know, among the issues that hadn't been discussed in that interview before that moment were either Marco Rubio or Jennifer Rubin, and it came up right there. Your response?

JENNIFER RUBIN, RIGHT TURN BLOG, WASHINGTON POST: Well, first of all, what I said was absolutely correct and he is lying again. I said that he hadn't spoken to Ryan after the New York primary. Ryan, again, confirmed that that was the case. This conversation that Trump claims happened, didn't.

And he also claimed, falsely, that he's been having conversations with Rubio about the vice presidency. Once again, Rubio denied anything like that happening, yesterday. So, the specific issue he was lying about -- why he brought this up is because, I think, two things.

One, he uses the press to deflect substantive questions. Chris, when you began that interview yesterday, you started with a really tough question and he spent about eight minutes complaining that you hadn't complimented him on his recent wins.

He uses this as a way because, as you pointed out earlier in the hour, he doesn't have steady, comfortable, substantive answers to policy questions. He deflects and he fends his --

CUOMO: Well Jennifer, there's one other reason he does it. There's another reason he does it and I'll direct to this Jeffery because he'll echo it immediately. He does it because it works. Jeffrey, when he says hey, you were unfair to me. He said a couple of times, in that interview, things that he has to know aren't true about our reporting here on this show where he was like hey, you misstated my tax thing.

[07:55:00] He knows I didn't misstate these things. I was giving him the chance to clarify them. But it works for him to say that he is victimized. It works for him to say that whether it's a Rubin or a Cuomo, or whoever it is at the moment, they're against him. Why?

JEFFREY LORD, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Chris, back in -- if I may -- 1970, when I was a freshman in college, Spiro Agnew, then vice president of the United States, went to Des Moines, Iowa, gave, unbelievably in the day since there was no cable television, a nationally-televised speech in which he attacked the media. He called them nattering nabobs of negativism.

CUOMO: Nattering nabobs of negativism.

LORD: A great satire. Exactly, exactly. My point to you is Spiro Agnew's numbers went up. And this has been gospel in the Republican cannon (ph) ever since, to this day. You heard Ted Cruz do this the other day when he was about to get out the race and he went after Roger Ailes and Rupert Murdoch. Newt Gingrich did this on the stage of the debate the other day.

This is gospel that the media, writ large, is unfair. In Donald Trump's case, I can tell you. I talked to him two years ago and asked him about the perception Republicans don't fight back. He immediately launched into the media. That particular day the issue was Donald Sterling, the owner of the Los Angeles Clippers who made all those racist remarks.

And he said he had been on another show on another network. Had talked about this. Had given this sort of routine castigation of Sterling that everybody was giving. And then added, as he was going off, aside from which he's got the girlfriend from hell.

And suddenly, this was being played as his defense of Donald Sterling, which he wasn't -- whom he doesn't know in the first place. He said this is really dishonest. So all I'm saying is that Donald Trump personally thinks this about some of the media --

CAMEROTA: Yes.

LORD: -- and that he's more than open to, in his words, "exposing them" and --

CAMEROTA: Yes.

LORD: -- this is Republican gospel.

CAMEROTA: Well, Jennifer, I want to get back to the larger issue here about Trump going after journalists because we've all been in his crosshairs.

He makes it known when he doesn't like a particular line of questioning and calls you names. And, you know, it is our job to expose hypocrisy where we see it or expose untruths where we see them. Do you think that this has had a chilling effect on journalism?

RUBIN: Not at all. I think, in fact, you've seen much tougher questioning because I think there's been complaints, rightly so, from some of the Republican losers that he got extraordinary access. He got extraordinary time. That's what's so ironic about this as he has been given billions of free coverage hours on air and yet he still complains.

Let me pick up on something that Jeffrey said, though, which I think is important. That strategy works very nicely in a primary because the Republican electorate feels very strongly. It doesn't work, however, in a general election. Frankly --

BERMAN: But, Jennifer --

RUBIN: Let me finish please, Jeffrey (sic). Let me finish. When you do it in a general election people who aren't necessarily Republicans turn in and they see this guy whining about a reporter. They see him saying you didn't compliment me. He comes across as whiny, as immature, and I don't think it has the same effect with non- Republicans whose votes he's going to need.

BERMAN: What do you say about these new polls out today, though, Jennifer, right? Quinnipiac has new polls out of Pennsylvania, Ohio, and Florida.

RUBIN: And I got a new poll for you in the Miami Herald that he's down by 30 points in Florida, so we can play that game all day long, Jeffrey (sic).

BERMAN: OK. So, you don't buy these new polls that show him leading in Ohio, close in Pennsylvania, close in Florida?

RUBIN: No, I don't buy a poll that has 39 percent and 42 percent, with how many percent in undecided at this point. So I think we learned that lesson with early polls before. Listen, we'll see if it works or not. But, in fact, right now he has unfavorable ratings are sky high with women, with minorities. He's losing categories that Mitt Romney won -- married women, white women.

So he's going to have to do something to ingratiate himself with these groups and right now all he's doing is picking fights with other Republicans. His Republican support is down to about 84 percent, which is unheard of for the leader of a national party.

So I think his natural instinct, which is to lash out, which is to fight, which is to make stuff up, which is to throw around all kinds of accusations may work in one context. I'm not sure it works in a national context.

BERMAN: Right. All right guys, from these nabobs over here, thank you both for being us today. Really appreciate it.

CAMEROTA: We have to get back to nattering. We have a lot of news to cover. Let's get right to it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: I thought everything was fine and then I got blindsided.

REP. PAUL RYAN (R-WI), SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE: He's the nominee. I'll do whatever he wants.

HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: His rhetoric is not only reckless, it's dangerous.

TRUMP: She is playing the woman's card to the hilt.

CLINTON: I'm going to let him run his campaign however he chooses.

TRUMP: You watch the problems she'll have.

LORETTA LYNCH, ATTORNEY GENERAL: They created discrimination against transgender individuals.

GOV. PAT MCCRORY (R-NC): Fighting discrimination, which I support wholeheartedly.