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Trump & Clinton Escalate Attacks on Each Other; Sanders: Democratic Convention Could Be 'Messy'; Officials: DNA Samples Taken from Victims' Families; Interview with Rep. Jim Jordan; Bill Cosby Set to Appear in Court Today. Aired 7-7:30a ET

Aired May 24, 2016 - 07:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL EDITOR: -- through bags of human remains.

[07:00:03] ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: New questions about what may have brought down EgyptAir Flight 804.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The race out at sea continues.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It may not be until we get those black boxes that we get real answers.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is what I say. No justice, no peace.

CAMEROTA: Baltimore Police Officer Edward Nero found not guilty on all charges.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We've got five more cases. Wait and see what happens.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ANNOUNCER: This is NEW DAY with Chris Cuomo and Alisyn Camerota.

CAMEROTA: Good morning, everyone. Welcome to your NEW DAY.

Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton attacking, taking their attacks to new levels. Clinton taking aim at Trump's business record, releasing a new ad framing him as a greedy developer. Trump, meanwhile, targeting Bill Clinton in a new Instagram video, calling him out for past sexual assault allegations.

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: It all just gets a big "yuck," doesn't it?

Now, there's also a situation for Hillary Clinton coming from the left, within her own party. Bernie Sanders says the Democratic convention could be messy. This as he is pushing the party to adopt a more progressive agenda.

Well, he just got a huge break and a huge setback. We're going to tell you about them both this morning. We have the 2016 race covered the way only CNN can. Let's begin with Phil Mattingly joining us now -- Phil. PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Now, Chris, this is a crucial

moment for both the Clinton and Trump campaigns, and campaign advisers are willing to acknowledge it. This is the time when you define your opponent in the race. It's what Barack Obama did so effectively in 2012. It's what Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump are trying to do with their respective attacks now. But for those attacks, they're looking to the past.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We are going to unify the Democratic Party and stop Donald Trump.

MATTINGLY (voice-over): This morning, Hillary Clinton taking a new line of attack against Donald Trump. Her campaign painting Trump as a greedy billionaire in a new ad.

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE (via phone): I sort of hope that happens, because then people like me would go in and buy.

MATTINGLY: Harkening back to Trump's controversial comments before the 2008 housing market collapse.

TRUMP: If there is a bubble burst, as they call it, you know, you can make a lot of money.

MATTINGLY: Clinton swiping at the presumptive nominee on multiple fronts before a union crowd Monday, issuing a warning about Trump's four bankruptcies surrounding his casino holdings.

CLINTON: He could bankrupt America like he's bankrupted his companies.

MATTINGLY: And sticking with another tried and true assault, Trump's temperament.

CLINTON: The last thing we need is a bully in the pulpit.

MATTINGLY: All as the billionaire continues to hound Bill Clinton's past infidelity, sending one of his top advisors to swipe at Hillary Clinton.

ED BROOKOVER, DONALD TRUMP SENIOR ADVISOR: She overregulates. She overtaxes. She overpromises and doesn't deliver.

MATTINGLY: The hostility spreading with both candidates, facing record high negatives in the most recent polls, but Trump is getting new support from Capitol Hill in the form of Tennessee Senator Bob Corker.

SEN. BOB CORKER (R), TENNESSEE: His approach to foreign policy is something I want to hear more about. I heard more about it today, and I appreciated that.

MATTINGLY: Though Corker is still downplaying talk that he may be high on Trump's V.P. list. CORKER: I'm not angling for any job. I think the best way to not end

up in a position like those is to angle for it, but I have no indication whatsoever that I was even being considered.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MATTINGLY: So the intrigue continues over who Donald Trump's running mate may be. And Donald Trump heading back on the campaign trail today targeting New Mexico. A West Coast swing, even those he's already the presumptive nominee. Trump and his advisers maintaining he's going to stay on the trail in the weeks ahead -- Chris.

CUOMO: All right, Phil, appreciate it.

So if you like your conventions nice and tidy, Bernie Sanders has a message for you. When Democrats gather in Philadelphia this summer, things could be, quote, "messy," unquote.

Meantime, Hillary Clinton rejecting an offer to debate Sanders before the final Super Tuesday primaries in two weeks. What will that mean to the electorate in California and beyond?

CNN's senior Washington correspondent Joe Johns live in D.C. With more. Good morning, Joe.

JOE JOHNS, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: good morning, Chris.

Bernie Sanders really giving establishment Democrats who want unity even more to worry about this morning. It was in an interview with the Associated Press, responding to a question about the potential for a messy Democratic convention. Sanders basically saying if that happens, so be it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (D-VT), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: So what? Democracy is messy. Every day of my life is messy. But if you want everything to be quiet and orderly and allows just things to proceed without vigorous debate, that is not what democracy is about.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

JOHNS: The Sanders campaign also attacking Hillary Clinton for not agreeing to participate in a debate in advance of the California primary, suggesting it's an insult to the voters of the state.

The Democratic Party continuing to try to get some kind of a peace deal between the two campaigns, allowing Sanders to appoint roughly one-third of the people to serve on the party's platform committee.

[07:05:12] Now, the Clinton campaign is clearly looking more and more like it's all-in on the effort to focus on Donald Trump and the general election. Though the former secretary of state is expected to compete hard in the remaining primary states, especially California.

CNN reporting last night that she'll have surrogates on a media blitz today, hammering Trump in battleground states on his business record when the housing bubble burst -- Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: OK, Joe. Thanks so much for all of that.

We want to talk about it now with our next guest, Bernie Sanders campaign manager Jeff Weaver. Good morning, Jeff.

JEFF WEAVER, BERNIE SANDERS CAMPAIGN MANAGER: Good morning, Alisyn. How are you?

CAMEROTA: Doing well. So when Senator Sanders predicts that the convention on the Democratic side could be, quote, "messy," what does he mean?

WEAVER: Well, I think what he means is that there are going to be a number of votes taken at the convention, if we can't get, you know, the platform planks that the senator supports in the platform during the committee process, if we can't get the electoral reform that the senator is advocating, then, of course, those things would have to go to the floor for votes during the convention.

CAMEROTA: And if that were to happen, the scenario that you lay out, and you say things get messy, do you fear that that could be misinterpreted somehow by Sanders supporters as sort of condoning an aggressive action of any kind?

WEAVER: No. Absolutely not. Look, there's a process that goes on at the Democratic convention. There's a committee process, and then if you don't prevail in the committee process you can go to the floor in many cases, and have the delegates as a whole vote on your proposals, and that's just the way the process works.

So I think -- what the senator was referring to is that, you know, he intends to press his case for a progressive agenda within the Democratic Party, press his case for electoral reform, which brings in millions of more into the Democratic Party and makes the party stronger. And there's a process for doing that at the convention.

CAMEROTA: Yes, I mean, what I'm asking if he doesn't -- if it doesn't go his way, what does messy look like to you?

WEAVER: Well, I just think there's votes. We're just going to have votes on the floor of the convention. That's all.

CAMEROTA: OK.

WEAVER: You know, there'll be debate and there will be votes. Which is not -- you don't often see that anymore in modern conventions. But in fact, that's really what conventions are about, for parties to do the business of the party.

CAMEROTA: Let's talk about the unprecedented concession that Senator Sanders has gotten from the DNC chair, Debbie Wasserman Schultz, who has given him five seats at the platform drafting table. Is that a victory?

WEAVER: It absolutely is a victory, Alisyn. You know, millions of people have supported Senator Sanders and his call for transforming America to deal with this rigged economy and a corrupt campaign finance system. And it is gratifying to know that the voices of those millions of people are being heard, within -- by some at Democratic Party and that they're adopting a much more inclusive attitude toward Senator Sanders and his millions and millions of supporters.

CAMEROTA: OK. So now that you have those seats at the table, beyond winning the presidency, which, of course, is Senator Sanders's goal, what else does Senator Sanders want?

WEAVER: Well, in addition to that, we want to have a -- as progressive a platform as possible for the Democratic Party going forward. So that the message that Senator Sanders has articulated during this campaign, which has resonated with so many people, young people, with independents, with working-class people, that that becomes the position of the Democratic Party.

We also want to ensure that in the future, for future contests, we open up the nominating process with more open primaries, with more same-day registration and other changes that will make it more likely that more people will participate. That's what we want. We want to open up the Democratic Party for new people, new blood, new ideas, new energy, and create a much bigger and more successful party.

CAMEROTA: Secretary Clinton is now 82 delegates shy of the Democratic magic number of 2,383. It looks like she's going to be able to get there. I know that Senator Sanders has been saying that he believes that he might still be able to get more pledged delegates, but what -- when you look at that 82 number, what do you think his chances are?

WEAVER: Well, the problem with the 82 number, Alisyn, is that includes super delegates. Super delegates haven't voted yet. They don't vote until the convention. Essentially, what you're doing is you're making an extrapolation based on a poll of super delegates. It's just like if you took a poll today in California and said "X" percent of people are going to vote for this candidate or that candidate and then assign delegates to them on your chart, it's no different intellectually. So let's see how the super delegates vote when we get to the convention.

CAMEROTA: Well, it's interesting that you say that, Jeff, because they are polled frequently. It wasn't that they made a decision ten months ago and have to stick by it. Their poll -- their temperature is taken regularly, and it doesn't seem that any are flipping.

WEAVER: So are people in California. Their polls -- their polls are being taken, believe me. Quite a few taken in California. So we have pretty up-to-date information about how voters are going to vote in a number of states and have throughout the process.

[07:10:08] But CNN doesn't use those polls to put up projections of pledged delegates; however, they seem comfortable doing it with super delegates.

CAMEROTA: So what you're -- what are you suggesting, that California is going to go for Bernie? WEAVER: Well, I think he's working very hard out there. I think

we're fighting to win in California. There's no doubt about it.

CAMEROTA: I mean, even when you take out the super delegates -- and I don't know if we have a graphic of this -- but she's still far ahead in the pledged delegates. I mean, she's at, I believe, 1,776. He's at 1,491. So you're saying he's going to close that gap?

WEAVER: Absolutely, the gap could be closed. There's 475 delegates in California alone. We have a number of other states that are coming up, like the District of Columbia, Puerto Rico, the Virgin Islands. So there's a lot of delegates out there still, Alisyn. And the senator is fighting for every single one of them, and he is going to close the gap substantially on the secretary.

CAMEROTA: OK. So if he closes the gap, just take me through the scenario. So he closes the gap. Let's say in your scenario, your optimistic scenario, and he gets more pledges. Then what happens?

WEAVER: Well, let me go to the convention and make the case. You know, and even if he doesn't surpass the secretary, but substantially closes the margin. All of the polling is consistent now. Bernie Sanders is a much stronger candidate against Donald Trump than is Secretary Clinton. That's just sort of at this point almost unrefuted in terms of any credible polling.

CAMEROTA: The polls say that, but you're saying that, even if he doesn't surpass her in pledged delegates, then at the convention, there's still going to be a fight, if she's won super delegates and pledged delegates?

WEAVER: Well, it's not -- it's not -- I wouldn't describe it as a fight. But look, there are super delegates. We can discuss the merit of super delegates, but they are part of the current process. But their job is to make an independent assessment of whether -- which candidate can best take on the Republicans in the fall. That's their -- that's their role in the current -- under the current rules.

Like I said, we can debate whether those rules should are changed. I think there's obviously rule -- room for those rules to be changed. But currently speaking, how you get around that is you get 2,383 in pledged delegates, which the secretary is not going to do by the time we get to the convention. She will not have 2,383 pledged Sanders; nor will Senator Sanders.

So it's going to be up to the super delegates to make a decision about who is best able to take on Donald Trump and the Republicans in the fall.

CAMEROTA: We'll be watching it every day. Jeffery, thanks so much for being on.

WEAVER: Glad to be here. Thank you.

CAMEROTA: Let's get to Chris. CUOMO: We have some breaking news for you. New questions surfacing this morning about what may have caused EgyptAir Flight 804 to crash. Forensic officials in Egypt are examining human remains for clues as to the underwater search for the black boxes ramps up.

CNN's Nic Robertson is live in Alexandria, Egypt, with the breaking details -- Nic.

ROBERTSON: Yes, Chris. What we have from officials at the morgue is they've now received 15 bags, they say, containing human remains. They describe these pieces as all being small. They're trying to put them together.

They also have the families of the victims right now providing DNA samples for identification of all the people onboard the aircraft to figure out precisely who they have recovered so far. It is a difficult process. When asked this question, has this provided any information about what brought this plane down? An official at the morgue said it is too soon to say whether an explosion brought down the plane. That's what officials at the morgue are saying from what they're able to examine at the moment.

We know that the pressure is on out at sea to recover the black boxes, to locate the black boxes, even. The recovery effort of debris and human remains continues, but most important for the investigation will be getting to those black boxes. And on site out there is a French ship that has a -- an acoustic detector, which should be able to pick up the pings emitted from the transmitters that are on the black boxes that help locate the black boxes on the seafloor. And we're beginning to get more details about how deep the sea is out there, about 3,000 meters. That's what we're beginning to learn right now -- Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: We certainly hope that they can detect those pinging -- that pinging soon. Nic, thank you for the update.

All right. Long lines at the nation's airports leading to a shake-up at the TSA. The agency's top security chief, Kelly Hoggan, removed from his position. Hoggan faced blistering criticism at a congressional hearing last month. Lawmakers questioning a $90,000 bonus he received even though security checkpoint lines at airports were getting longer on his watch.

CUOMO: Bill Cosby heads back to court in just hours for a key hearing in a criminal sexual assault case involving a former Temple University employee. It's a case that attorneys for the 78-year-old comedian have tried desperately to have thrown out. This morning Cosby could be face-to-face with his accusers.

CNN's Jean Casarez is live outside the courthouse in Norristown, Pennsylvania -- Jean.

JEAN CASAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Chris.

You know, there are cases all around the country right now against Bill Cosby, but this one is different, because those cases are civil, and the resolution can be money, paid out to accusers. But this is a criminal court, and if found guilty, Bill Cosby faces prison.

[07:15:14] Now, this is a really important hearing today, because it is a preliminary hearing. It binds the case over for a trial or not. And Bill Cosby is required to attend, according to Pennsylvania law.

And the most important piece of evidence is going to be the statement in 2005 of the accuser, Andrea Constand. She told police back then that in January or February of 2004, when she was director of operations at the women's basketball team at Temple University, Bill Cosby was her mentor.

And he invited her to his home to talk about her career. When she got there, she said that she told him she couldn't sleep at night, that she was restless. He went upstairs, came down. She says he brought two blue pills with him. Told her to drink wine, take the pills. They would relax her. At that point she said she became wobbling and uncontrollable. She said that she knew what was happening but couldn't stop Bill Cosby when he said she sexually assaulted her.

The second piece of evidence today important, Bill Cosby's statement to police from 2005. He says that any contact between he and Andrea Constand was consensual.

And finally the new evidence should be brought in today, which is that 2005 deposition in the civil case, which Bill Cosby admits, having seven prescriptions for Quaaludes for women he wanted to have sex with. And Alisyn, the big question is, will Andrea Constand be here? We've never seen her before. We've seen pictures of her, but will she be here to testify and confront Bill Cosby -- Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: All right, Jane. We'll be watching that case closely, as well. Thank you for the update.

Well, Veterans Affairs Secretary Bob McDonald taking heat after comparing wait times at V.A. hospitals to wait times at Disney theme parks, saying the amount of time you wait is not what's most important. One veterans group points out, quote, "People don't die while waiting to go on Space Mountain." A recent government report found nearly half of new veterans could not access care because V.A. staff failed to properly schedule appointments.

CUOMO: I don't know what the point of that statement is. There is absolutely no question that delays in treatment and appointments had adverse effects on veterans' health. I don't know why the V.A. and the government keeps doing this, that instead of saying, "Here's what we've done to fix the problems are as you say. We're going through it. They defend the status quo, and it works against them and against the veterans every damn time."

CAMEROTA: And you know, analogies like that just scream lack of sensitivity, which is not what all of the veterans want and need.

CUOMO: They do what all institutions do, whether they treat veterans or whether they, you know, treat prisoners. They protect themselves when they are attacked instead of thinking about what their real goal is. CAMEROTA: Right.

CUOMO: All right, so, it is no secret that Donald Trump is having a hard time getting the GOP to unite around him. A new poll out finds, though, he might be making some headway. We'll go into why, and what he needs to do next. Next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:22:07] CUOMO: Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton locked in a dead heat in two new national polls. Perhaps the most critical question now facing Republicans is whether Trump can get the party's most conservative members behind him and unite the GOP. How's he doing? Seems like he's making some headway.

Let's discuss what we've seen recently with Ohio Congressman Jim Jordan, chairman of the House Freedom Caucus and member of the House Judiciary Committee. The second committee, maybe even more important today, congressman, because of what's going on with the IRS head that I want to talk to you about, the case for impeachment.

First a little bit of politics in play. Where is your head right now? Are you more against Clinton or for Trump?

REP. JIM JORDAN (R), OHIO: I think it's both. I think Donald Trump is starting to unify the party, which is exactly what we have to do. I've said all along I'm for the nominee, I'm for Mr. Trump, but we also have to remember that, when you compare Mr. Trump's positions with Secretary Clinton's, there's a big difference. I mean, we saw this last week on the Second Amendment, where Mr. Trump is at the NRA, a big difference on the Second Amendment, big difference on the life issue between Mr. Trump and Secretary Clinton.

And probably the most telling thing is, when you think about Secretary Clinton, her record on Libya and what she told the American people after four Americans gave their life serving their country. The false information, the false narrative she told the American people where we learned last fall she said one thing to her family, one thing to the Egyptian prime minister, but yet, she told the taxpayers and the citizens and probably more importantly the families of those individuals who died for our country that night a completely different story, and that right there, I think should disqualify her from being commander in chief.

CUOMO: Congressman, why do you refuse to accept what came out the intelligence committees about the different stories being a version of different intelligence that was delivered at different times?

JORDAN: The intelligence may have changed, Chris, but her story didn't. What we know is at 10:08 the night of the attack, she said some have sought to justify this vicious behavior as a response to inflammatory material posted on the Internet. She was referencing and highlighting the video and the official statement of our government. Less than an hour later, she tells her daughter that terrorists killed two of our people that night, and the next day, she tells the Egyptian prime minister, "We know." Not "We think. We know." Let me finish. She said the next day the Egyptian prime minister, we know the video

had nothing to do with it. It was a planned attack not a protest. So privately her story didn't change; you're right. Publicly, her story didn't change either, but it was a completely different message.

So you cannot do -- and when she said to the families of the people who gave their life that we're going to get the guy who made this video again, attributing the motive to a video-inspired protest, completely wrong. So I've seen the evidence firsthand serving on the Benghazi committee. That right there is so wrong and such a contrast, I think, again, when you think about this election and why -- why we're supporting Mr. Trump.

CUOMO: Important point to make, although, again, it does seem as though you're saying you're supporting Trump because of what you feel about Hillary Clinton. And that's fine. You should be behind your party's nominee. No, I get it.

[07:25:13] JORDAN: It's always the case. There's always two people running for office, and the choice is between two people.

CUOMO: No, I get it. But usually, what you do is endorse this person and say, "I'm for this person."

JORDAN: And I have.

CUOMO: Have you endorsed Trump? I thought you said you support him, but you haven't endorsed him?

JORDAN: I've said -- I've said all along I support the Republican nominee, I support Mr. Trump, and that's who he's up against, is Hillary Clinton. And that's the choice. I've said that all along.

CUOMO: He has your official endorsement to keep the numbers...

JORDAN: I've said forever. Whoever wins this primary we should be for the Republican.

CUOMO: Good.

JORDAN: Because look at Secretary Clinton, the one on the other side. This is as simple as it gets.

CUOMO: Got you. I just want to keep it clear for the record, because we keep a tally of people who say they endorse Trump within the party so we can make a case for his progress in galvanizing the party.

You mentioned the Second Amendment. Are you comfortable with where Donald Trump is, for instance, on whether or not there should be guns in schools? Do you think you know his position?

JORDAN: I don't know his position on that. What I know is that he got the endorsement from a pretty good organization last week. What I do know is his record on the Second Amendment is much stronger than hers, frankly, based on that endorsement last week alone. It's much better. CUOMO: So the endorsement of the NRA is enough?

JORDAN: What I care about is the Second Amendment.

CUOMO: Right.

JORDAN: Part of our Bill of rights, part of our Constitution. That's what I care about. And he's much better on that issue than she is.

CUOMO: So you're not -- so you're not giving any concern about him going back and forth about whether he's for gun-free zones, whether that teachers or certain administrators in schools should have guns or not? He's gone back and forth. You're OK with that?

JORDAN: Look, Chris, there's never a candidate that I agree with on every single position throughout their entire career. I mean, we may have to go back to Ronald Reagan before I can think of a nominee. In fact, my first election I participated in, 1984, before we can see a nominee where I agreed with just about everything.

So that's always the case. There's going to be some of those concerns, but the point is, he is much stronger on issues I care about and, frankly, I think that he'll do a much better job of helping this country get back on the path it needs to get back on.

CUOMO: Make the case for why the IRS head should be impeached.

JORDAN: Three preservation orders, two subpoenas, John Koskinen allows documents to be destroyed, 422 backup tapes containing potentially 24,000 Lois Lerner e-mails, and he allows them to be destroyed with that -- with the two subpoenas in place.

And he knew about the problem with Lerner's hard drive four months before he told Congress. And he had ample time in between there where he actually testified in front of Congress and told us, "I will get you all of her e-mails," already knowing, already knowing that there was trouble with her hard drive and with her computer and waiting four months to tell us.

You did not -- any private citizen who's being audited by the IRS and allows documents to be destroyed and then waits months to tell the actors (ph) they're in big trouble. But somehow it's OK if it's John Koskinen. It's OK if the guy who was brought in by the president to clean up the IRS when, in fact, he's not done that in any way, shape or form.

CUOMO: Mr. Koskinen -- Mr. Koskinen has said he can't -- he hasn't had time to prepare. So we're going to have to wait and see what happens on that hearing. But one thing that we know absolutely is that, while all this is going on, that IRS isn't looking into any dark money from either party right now. So we're waiting for this to end so they can get back to their job of making sure the money is clean in politics.

Congressman, as always, a pleasure having you on NEW DAY. Thank you for making the case on the issues that matter. JORDAN: Thank you. Take care.

CUOMO: Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: OK, Chris, important Iraq news. The offensive to retake Fallujah intensifying today with the U.S. launching airstrikes. We will get an update and the military perspective on how it's going, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)