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Dallas Police: Killer Planned Larger Attack; Hundreds Arrested in Protests Over Police Shootings. Aired 6-6:30a ET

Aired July 11, 2016 - 06:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This suspect had been practicing explosive detonations. We're convinced that this suspect had other plans.

[05:58:34] HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESUMPTIVE PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: This is deeply troubling, and it should worry every single American.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: When the officers are the ones that are hurting us, who do we call?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Justice will be served in Minnesota.

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESUMPTIVE PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: Racial divisions have gotten worse, not better.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No! No! No! No!

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: This is not how we want our communities to operate.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ANNOUNCER: This is NEW DAY with Chris Cuomo and Alisyn Camerota.

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning. Welcome to your NEW DAY. It's Monday, July 11, 6 a.m. in the East. Alisyn off. Poppy Harlow here. And in the spirit of needing good news, let's just start with that. Congratulations on the baby.

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: Thank you.

CUOMO: You're back to work. She's good and sleeping through the night, true?

HARLOW: Can you believe it? Three months old, sleeping through the night. Gurgling and cooing, and all those adorable things.

CUOMO: Unfair. I have a 6-year-old in my bed every night. We will discuss what you're doing differently.

HARLOW: These things are cyclical. I think I had a good week. Let's see if it lasts.

CUOMO: Good. It will. HARLOW: I'll be back with you.

CUOMO: It is. It's good to have you here, good to have some good news.

Now, let's get to Dallas. We now know it could have been much worse. There's no question. The murder of five police officers hangs over that city and this nation like a pall, but the city's police chief now says the killer was planning a larger attack. We have details of this former military madman's plot ahead.

HARLOW: Meantime, hundreds arrested in protests across this country over the weekend over back-to-back police killings of black men. The national debate on race and justice certainly reaching a tipping point.

We have it covered the only way this network can. Let begin with Victor Blackwell live for us this morning in Dallas.

Good morning, Victor.

VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN ANCHOR: Poppy, good morning to you.

The focus across the city today, healing. There is a vigil planned later today to pray for the families of those five officers killed and the survivors who made it out, but also we're learning from the police investigation as they relief [SIC] -- release some details here about just how much carnage the shooter was planning to inflict.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CHIEF DAVID BROWN, DALLAS POLICE DEPARTMENT: We're convinced that this suspect had other plans and thought that what he was doing was righteous.

BLACKWELL (voice-over): Dallas Police Chief David Brown telling CNN the killer was plotting larger scale attacks.

BROWN: He was going to make us pay for what he sees as law enforcement's efforts to punish people of color.

BLACKWELL: Bomb-making materials and a journal found inside the home of the deranged gunman suggest he was practicing detonations and aiming for larger targets.

BROWN: The materials was such that it was large enough to have devastating effects throughout our city and our north Texas area.

BLACKWELL: Police say the killer told them why he did it during a standoff, saying he was seeking revenge for the shooting deaths of two African-American men last week. Cornered in a parking garage, negotiations with the killer lasted about two hours.

BROWNS: He just basically lied to us, playing games, laughing at us, singing, asking how many did he get and that he wanted to kill some more and that there were bombs there. BLACKWELL: Officers ultimately using a robot armed with a bomb to end

the gunman's life, a first for law enforcement in the U.S.

At the scene, an ominous message written in the shooter's own blood on the walls near his body. The initials "R.B.," a message police are still trying to decipher.

This as we're learning more about the five officers whose lives were cut short protecting a peaceful protest.

VALERIE ZAMARRIPA, SLAIN OFFICER'S MOTHER: No, not my baby. Not my Patrick.

BLACKWELL: Thirty-two-year-old Patrick Zamarripa, the engaged father of two, was a Navy veteran and just weeks away from his 33rd birthday. His family says his dream was to become a police officer.

LAURA ZAMARRIPA, SLAIN OFFICER'S SISTER: My brother loved his country and his community. I just can't wrap my mind around it. It's just so unreal.

RICK ZAMARRIPA, SLAIN OFFICER'S FATHER: Since day one, since he was born, he was a hero. He was my little hero. And he's a big hero -- he's a big hero now.

BLACKWELL: Those who did survive the ambush, like Shetamia Taylor, are grateful to be alive. The Dallas mother protected her four sons when shots rang out. She was hit in the leg as officers were shot in front of her. Taylor thanking police for their heroism in the hail of bullets.

SHETAMIA TAYLOR, DALLAS SHOOTING VICTIM: It hurt. Of course I'm thankful that my babies are OK, but somebody's dad, husband isn't.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BLACKWELL: We've learned that President Obama and Vice President Joe Biden will be arriving tomorrow morning for that city-wide memorial. We've also learned recently that former president George W. Bush and former first lady Laura Bush will be in attendance at that memorial. They live here in Dallas, and the former president will also speak at that memorial -- Poppy.

HARLOW: Quite a sight it will be, honoring the fallen. Victor Blackwell live for us in Dallas. Thanks so much.

More than 300 people were arrested over the weekend protesting police shooting deaths of two black men, one in Louisiana, one in Minnesota just in the last week. Nearly 50 of those arrests in Baton Rouge after police officers locked up a very prominent Black Lives Matter activist for 17 hours.

Let's go straight to Nick Valencia. He's live for us this morning with more in Baton Rouge -- Nick.

NICK VALENCIA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Poppy. Police here are on heightened alert. I think it's safe to say all

across the country they are.

But demonstrations here in Baton Rouge entered their fifth straight day. But the largest crowds we saw were over the weekend as police tell CNN organizers have come in from out of state to protest.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Whose street?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Our street!

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Our street!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Our street!

VALENCIA (voice-over): Protests over police-involved shootings growing louder and more widespread. Thousands taking to the streets over the weekend...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Black lives matter!

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Black lives matter!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Black lives matter!

VALENCIA: ... in cities across the country. The demonstrations mostly peaceful.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Look at this.

VALENCIA: In Atlanta, nearly 10,000 protesters shut down major highways, the standoff ending with few arrests.

But elsewhere, violent clashes between heavily-armed police and protesters led to over 300 arrests. In Baton Rouge, police in full riot gear arresting over 100 protesters...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is private property.

VALENCIA: ... and storming onto people's front lawns.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, no, no, no, no!

VALENCIA: Thousands on social media sharing this photo of a young woman, stoic as officers rush towards her. Activist DeRay McKesson was among those arrested Saturday night.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Don't fight me. Don't fight me. Don't fight me.

DERAY MCKESSON, BLACK LIVES MATTER: I'm under arrest, y'all.

VALENCIA: McKesson, a prominent face of the Black Lives Matter movement, was released 17 hours later.

MCKESSON: I remain disappointed in the Baton Rouge police, who continue to provoke protesters.

VALENCIA: In St. Paul, Minnesota, Saturday night, protesters throwing rocks and Molotov cocktails at officers from a freeway overpass after shutting it down, according to police.

CHIEF TODD ADELL, ST. PAUL POLICE: It's certainly not life threatening, but they're significant enough to go to the hospital.

VALENCIA: One officer suffering a broken vertebrae after a 25-pound rock was dropped on his head.

ADELL: I'm absolutely disgusted by the acts of some.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

VALENCIA: the shooting death of Alton Sterling, that black man who died at the hands of two police officers, is still very fresh. Police warn that that is the kindling for the chaos, and they expect more demonstrations to happen later today -- Chris.

CUOMO: All right, Nick. Thank you very much.

Let's talk about what is hanging over this entire situation. We know the pain. We know why we're dealing with it. The question is, how do we deal with it? We have a good group of men to talk to you about this right now. CNN law enforcement analyst and retired NYPD detective, Harry Houck; CNN political commentator and professor at Morehouse College, Marc Lamont Hill; and former NYPD chief of department, Philip Banks.

Chief, let me start with you. You know what the issues are. We know what the sophisticated problems are with policing different communities. We know how we get to these points of protest. When you think about changes that make a difference in terms of what happens in use of force situations, what comes to the top of your list?

PHILIP BANKS, FORMER NYPD CHIEF OF DEPARTMENT: Well, the first thing we have to look at, I think, is that these protesters who are protesting, they're not protesting these specific instances.

What I believe that the majority of them are protesting, what they consider to be the injustices that has taken place in the criminal justice system for a long, long period of time. So some of the changes I think that law enforcement should take a look at, out of the 90 -- in my opinion, 99 percent of the good cops, are they silenced by what I consider to be the negative police culture that prohibits them from coming forth and speaking ahead?

CUOMO: What's your answer to that?

BANKS: And I think that it is. I think it's a strong culture, and I think that it takes a lot of good cops, who want to speak out about some of the injustices that's actually putting a big, big negative blanket over law enforcement. They want to come out, and they're looking for something that they can come out on. And I think that we should look at that first and see, how do we support those officers from within? Because the true changes are going to come when law enforcement disciplines themselves.

CUOMO: Now, these issues that the chief points out, put some meat on the bones of that for us, Marc. What do you think these issues are that need to be addressed?

MARC LAMONT HILL, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, one, I think, again, is a culture of silence. What we call the blue wall of silence. There has to be a space where officers can come out and speak.

But I think, first, let's take a quick step back and say I think we have to reject the "99 percent of cops are good" argument. Not because they're bad, not because it's not true, but because it ignores the fact that there's a systemic problem. It's just like we don't have a problem saying the school system is broken. We don't have to defend it quickly and say, "Hey, but all the teachers are good."

HARRY HOUCK, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: It might be true.

CUOMO: Teachers don't get attacked and killed in response to what seems is a systemic problem. That's why you err on the side of saying, let's not forget, this is a good thing we're getting, not a bad thing.

HILL: I understand that as a rhetorical move. I'm saying, intellectually, we also have to never lose sight of the fact that we're not blaming individual officers. We're talking about a system that's dysfunctional.

So how do we switch the system? Part of that is changing the laws. Part of that is creating a mechanism of oversight so that, for example, when a police officer does do something bad, we have a space to see -- to not have other police investigate them but instead we have civilian review boards. We have citizen review boards. These types of things actually give us the kind of transparency that we need.

CUOMO: How real is it that, if you were on the job and you knew a guy was dirty, you would be worried about coming forward, because what if it's not, you know, a clean situation? What if it comes back on you? You know, you need your brothers and sisters within the force to support yourselves.

HOUCK: Well, it's an issue, but there's -- when I was in internal affairs, we had this thing that was called the action desk. Believe it or not, I think about over half the calls we got were from other police officers, making allegations on police officers doing bad things on the street.

But let's -- listen, Chris, this isn't a one-sided argument here. OK? We're talking about three different things here, all about the police department. But facts have got to matter.

If we want to make some changes here in what's going on, the police have already recognized the fact that we have some issues that we've got to deal with, all right? Now, the black community has got to also understand that they have issues they have to deal with, all right? This is not a one-way street here.

Now, you've got police officers. You've got the Ferguson effect that we're dealing with today. It's because police officers are second- guessed right away. We had these -- the incident in Louisiana and in Minneapolis. OK? We don't know what happened there, OK, especially what happened in Minneapolis. The investigation is still going on.

But to come out with the rhetoric that the police officers were racist when there's no evidence to indicate that racism was involved, that has got -- has got to stop, all right? If that doesn't stop and this thing about the disparity of blacks and whites in jails, that's got to stop, because I got statistics right here which will prove me right.

[06:10:21] In New York City alone, OK, blacks are 23 percent -- they make up...

CUOMO: Of the population.

HOUCK: Right, of the population. Seventy-five percent of all shootings, 70 percent of all robberies, and 60 percent of all violent crimes, all right. The whites, only 3 percent.

Now, that is why there were more blacks in jail than there are whites.

HILL: But that's -- OK.

HOUCK: Let me just finish here. And then you go, all right?

So we look at that statistic. All right. They turn it around, you know, the racial demagogues out there, turn it around that the blacks are being picked on. It's not so. So the facts and these statistics, all right, have to be addressed, and you've got to understand them.

CUOMO: Right. But both can be true. You wind up dealing with a community more because of socioeconomics and criminality. But the question still remains, Marc, of how you deal with that community.

HILL: Right. Can I respond to Harry? Because he...

CUOMO: Please.

HILL: OK.

CUOMO: And I'm coming to you, next.

HILL: There's a couple things there. First, Harry talked about the idea of people immediately second-guessing the police. The police should be second-guessed. They're public servants, and we're the public. We should be second-guessing them. Just like we should second-guess our politicians.

CUOMO: He's saying don't automatically infer an assumption of racism.

HILL: That's not what he said. But -- and we have to make that distinction. Right?

HOUCK: Right.

HILL: We have to make the distinction, because police should be subject to scrutiny. But so long, police have not been, and because police have not been, sometimes at this point police are frustrated when you say -- when you don't take their word as gospel right away.

And with camera phone technology, witness technology, we see they're not always telling the truth.

Now to Harry's second point, which is that in Ferguson we immediately jumped up and said this is racism without any evidence of racism, we did an investigation, the Ferguson police department. I talk about this in my new book. And there is considerable evidence of racism in Ferguson. So it isn't true that there was no evidence of racism. There are racist e-mails, racist phone calls, racist practices.

CUOMO: He's saying in this specific incident.

(CROSSTALK)

HOUCK: Three e-mails, I believe, that were racist, correct?

HILL: Harry, there's only 40 -- Harry, there's only like a hundred...

HOUCK: It doesn't matter.

CUOMO: Hold it, hold it. Hold on. Guys, guys, guys.

HILL: Harry's still on national TV and just said that black people are prone to criminality. I want to be able to respond to that.

HOUCK: Well, they are.

HILL: You think black people are prone to criminality?

HOUCK: The statistics...

HILL: You don't mean that. I'm going to give you a chance to correct that. You don't mean that black people are prone to criminality.

HOUCK: What does this say? What does this say?

HILL: I don't know what that says, but I know...

HOUCK: The chief can back me up, because he's come...

HILL: He's not going to stand on national TV and say black people are prone to criminality.

HOUCK: I am telling you 75 percent of all shootings are blacks.

HILL: I'm hoping you just don't know...

HOUCK: Seventy-five percent of shootings. What you're doing is you're incorporating something else I'm saying into your narrative. That's what you do. CUOMO: Harry, Marc, hold on one second. Hold on.

BANKS: Points I'd like to make. First of all...

CUOMO: Chief, make your points.

BANKS: First of all, I'm not going to point to blacks prone to crime, because I don't believe it. It's not true. That's the first thing. The second thing is I have a slight difference in...

HILL: It's racist.

HOUCK: It is not racist.

HILL: To say that black people are prone to criminality...

HOUCK: That's not what I said. I said 75 percent of the shootings that occur in New York City are done by blacks. All right.

CUOMO: All right, guys.

HOUCK: And you keep on talking about this disproportionate amount...

HILL: OK, can I -- but you also...

HOUCK: ... of whites and blacks in jails. This is why.

HILL: Because it is disproportional, Harry.

HOUCK: No, it's not.

CUOMO: All right. Guys, seriously. Seriously.

HILLS: How about we don't yell? And let me...

CUOMO: That's exactly what I'm going to say.

HOUCK: OK.

CUOMO: These -- this is a conversation that is not always easy to have. You're going to have clashes of perspective. But we all know this, all right? If you do not have this conversation the right way, you do not move forward. You can discuss the difference between saying an entire race is prone to criminality, which I know is not what you mean, and that statistically...

HILL: That's what I was trying to correct.

HOUCK: But that's not what I meant.

HILL: And that's why I said, I don't think you meant that.

HOUCK: But Marc, that's not what I meant.

CUOMO: You've got to -- we need to give people some space right now and need to think about... HILL: Yes, but also -- yes, but Chris, we're also on national

television, and you can't say things like that.

CUOMO: I know, but the way we do it is different.

HOUCK: Look at the numbers, though, Marc.

CUOMO: All right.

HILL: Can we try just...

CUOMO: No.

HOUCK: You don't want to pay attention to those numbers.

HILL: We have to address those numbers.

CUOMO: We know the numbers are a function of a disproportionate level of criminality within the population that's represented.

HILL: Numbers are also dishonest. Because there are other dimensions.

HOUCK: They're not dishonest. They're true.

HILL: They're not true.

CUOMO: Let's take one step at a time.

HOUCK: It's your interpretation, which is wrong.

HILL: First of all, my interpretation, Harry, Googling some numbers is different than talking to me.

HOUCK: No, no, no, no, no, no, no.

HILL: First of all -- first of all...

HOUCK: I didn't Google numbers. This came from the NYPD. These are NYPD numbers.

HILL: Oh, when then they must be true.

HOUCK: Yes, they are.

HILL: Well, then they must be true.

HOUCK: Captain (UNINTELLIGIBLE) for four years.

CUOMO: How you discuss it matters also. Let me get to the chief. We're going to have lots of conversations on this. This is just a first step.

BANKS: This is a point of reference that I'd just like to point out to Harry. When you point to these racial demagogues, quote unquote racial demagogues, one thing that you should take into consideration, a lot of times the media is flocking to a couple of individuals that may or may not be speaking for the African-American community.

The second thing is that, if you look at that incident that took place in Baltimore, it took a year before that video was released. And you had 11 -- you had (UNINTELLIGIBLE) officers who had -- did not fire their weapons, but filed reports stating something other than the facts.

That's what people are talking about. They're not talking about any specific instances. What they're saying is that government and law enforcement had the opportunity to clean up the injustices that had been taking place in the criminal justice system, the biases and the racism, for decades and decades. It has not happened, and those need to be addressed.

It does not mean that there aren't a lot of good cops. It does not mean that law enforcement does not serve all communities well. It means that changes have to be made, talks have to be stopped, and action needs to be taking place. End of -- end -- bottom story. And I think that that's the issue that we need to address.

HOUCK: Chief, do you think that police departments are systemically racist?

BANKS: I think that there's a lot of systemic -- well, I'll give you one example.

HOUCK: Systemic, and the true definition of "systemic."

BANKS: I run into that question...

HOUCK: It means everybody is.

HILL: We know what it means. That's not what it means.

HOUCK: It does.

HILL: No, it does not. Harry, you can't just make up words and define them. Systemic does not mean...

HOUCK: You do.

HILL: No, I don't.

CUOMO: Hold on. Guys, you have to be able to talk to each other.

HOUCK: All throughout. Systemic.

CUOMO: Let the chief finish, and then we're going to continue this conversation another time. Go ahead, Chief.

BANKS: I think the intent of the racism that takes place in law enforcement is greatly overstated, but it doesn't mean that it doesn't exist.

And one point of example I will give you is this. Is that the New York City Police Department, which I think would be the most valued company, and that's why I'm a big, big supporter of it, we always stated that we stopped people where the criminals took -- where the crime took place at. So subsequently, you're going to have more stops in African-American communities.

CUOMO: Right.

BANKS: But if you looked at where we did our checkpoints, our vehicle checkpoints, we did them primarily in African-American, Latino communities.

CUOMO: Right.

BANKS: Now, is that saying that they drank more than others?

So what happens is that, when you present that data, then you say, well, hold on, maybe we're doing things that we're not intentionally aware of.

CUOMO: Right.

BANKS: I think what protesters are saying is, let's all take a look, because there are problems. A problem doesn't mean that you're all bad. It doesn't mean that you're all good. It means that there are problems that have to be taken. And if we sit down and we kill a rhetoric, and we have some intelligent conversation, we can make a change for the better for all.

CUOMO: And look, we know each other very well. Chief, you and I are getting, you know, to know each other better now. You're going to be part of our conversation. We've got to take a breath, even when something that's said is completely wrong. We've got to deal with each other the right way.

I'm not in the business of lecturing you guys. I have you here because I need you here. This is the first step of the conversation we've got to keep having. Thank you for starting it today, all right?

I know there's a lot more that needs to be said. I do. I've lived this for a long time, as well. But let's just take one step at a time, all right?

Marc is going to give it to me in the break.

Coming up in our next hour, we're going to talk to Dallas police for the latest on the investigation. And in our 8 a.m. hour, we're going to talk with retired tennis star James Blake. You remember what happened to him with the cops? He has a take on what the challenges are that black men today, even when they're famous -- Poppy.

HARLOW: Chris, such an important conversation. A change for the better for all, as someone said on my show last night. We owe it to our children. We certainly do.

We're going to continue this conversation throughout the show and also talk about the two presumptive nominees, Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump, addressing the American people in the wake of what has happened in the last week. Are they doing enough, though, to really unify this country? What more could they do? What more must they do? That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[06:21:56] TRUMP: A brutal attack on our police force is an attack on our country and an attack on our families.

CLINTON: There is too much violence, too much hate, too much senseless killing, too many people dead who shouldn't be.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: There they are, Donald Trump, Hillary Clinton, both the presumptive nominees. One of them will be the next president. Are they doing enough right now? Are they doing enough at all to bring this extremely divided nation together?

Let's talk about all of it. David Gregory is with us, CNN political analyst and host of "The David Gregory" podcast; and CNN political commentator and political anchor of Time Warner Cable News, Errol Louis. Thank you, gentlemen, both for being here.

I thought it was interesting over the weekend President Obama said this nation is not as divided as it may appear right now. We heard from Donald Trump, urging his supporters to stand in solidarity with law enforcement, talking about the force between civilization and total chaos. And then we heard from Hillary Clinton, saying we need more love and more kindness.

David Gregory, to you -- to you first: given the state of the electorate right now, which of those messages hits home for people?

DAVID GREGORY, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, I think they both do, and I think that, in Trump's case, his tone has been a little bit more measured than we've seen him on other issues, particularly in response to the Orlando massacre. He is clearly making a statement about the importance of solidarity with law enforcement.

But I think it's really important for both of them to recognize that how they frame the conversation, how they speak about this becomes really important so that you don't have parts of the electorate from a political matter who just retreat to both sides.

This is such a difficult conversation to have, and to do it politically in the heat of a campaign, even more difficult.

They also have competition, frankly, which is they have the president of the United States, who is a powerful voice on -- on these matters, who is going to be lending that voice to this in the days and the weeks to come. So they're going to become part of that broader conversation and are going to try to find a way to fit in.

HARLOW: Errol, how do they do that when this number shows us that many Americans don't feel like either of these candidates are doing that? A Quinnipiac poll just came out a few weeks ago, which shows 61 percent of those surveyed think that this election has increased the level of hatred and prejudice in the United States. Sixty-one percent. And now you're asking the two presumptive nominees to dramatically differ their tone.

ERROL LOUIS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, it's -- it's not a hopeful time, I think. If you are expecting either of them to take the enormous political risk that would be involved in trying to resolve this very deep -- very deep-seated issue...

HARLOW: Is this about politics, Errol?

LOUIS: Well, you know, anybody who wants to try and pull something out and say, "This is bigger than politics" in an election season runs the risk of being judged right by history and wrong by the voters.

You know, we've come off multiple election cycles in which a very divided populace is trying to make up its mind; and candidates win by sort of drawing sharp contrasts and winning by 50 percent plus one. That's how George Bush won twice. That's how, frankly, Obama has won.

[06:25:11] HARLOW: Haven't we learned something since 1967, since the Kerner Report came out and said something that echoes so much of what we're feeling today, and that is that we are headed towards, it said, two separate Americas, one black, one white, and unequal?

LOUIS: Look, the truth of it, I think nobody denies. I mean, nobody watching this would deny it. I think most of the political players are -- understand the basic lay of the land.

For a politician, however, their question is, OK, how do I get from here to election day? And do I want to fall on my sword, sacrifice my political future, and say all the right things that might unify the country at the cost of losing the election?

HARLOW: All right. So let's talk about unity that we're seeing in the Democratic Party right now.

David Gregory, to you. We've just learned moments ago from the Sanders campaign that Bernie Sanders will join Hillary Clinton at a rally in New Hampshire tomorrow.

When you think back eight years ago to how President Obama, before he was elected, and Hillary Clinton were able to come together, how do you think we'll see Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton come together, given the fact that they've had some pretty tough words for one another?

GREGORY: Right, but we saw this eight years ago, as well. I mean, that's what campaigns are about. That will quickly melt away. I think for the Clinton team, they wanted this. They wanted it as soon as they could get it. It seemed a little bit strained, but that was the case, too, when she was getting out of the race.

HARLOW: Right. GREGORY: It took years for some of the Clinton folks and Obama folks to reconcile. So I think this is a very strong sign for her.

Don't forget: she's also been campaigning with Elizabeth Warren. So she's already had this very important bridge to more progressive Democrats. To campaign with her and campaign with Elizabeth Warren.

The level of enthusiasm, the level of support, I do think that Bernie Sanders will have something to say about that and how forcefully he endorses her and the extent to which he campaigns with her in the weeks and months ahead.

I think the impact that he wanted to have was on the platform at the convention. He's had a significant impact on that. You see her being pulled to the left more because of some of his popular positions, like on college tuition and the like.

But let's remember, back to your original point here, as well, that both of these candidates, on the issue of unity, both have very high negatives.

HARLOW: Right.

GREGORY: Both are seen as divisive figures. And whether it's the crime bill in the '90s or whether it's the issue of standing with the police, it's a very difficult line for a candidate to be able to walk, to be able to balance all the competing forces here. The legitimate claims of activists and those of the police, as well.

HARLOW: Yes, absolutely. And Bernie Sanders did get some of the things that -- that he wanted over the weekend, including Hillary Clinton and the party backing the $15 minimum wage. Not everything, but we'll watch a new step in this election coming tomorrow in New Hampshire.

Gentlemen, thank you both.

GREGORY: Thanks.

CUOMO: All right. So the attorney for the Minnesota police officer who shot and killed Philando Castile insists the deadly encounter had nothing to do with race. So why does he believe the officer opened fire? That's next on NEW DAY.

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