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Trump Calls For Justice Ginsburg To Resign; Ginsburg Calls Trump A "Faker" In CNN Interview; Who Will Be Trump's VP?; Philando Castile's Death Probe Reveals Contradictions; Police Chief: Officers Administered CPR On Castile Immediately; Trump U Instructor Describes Sales Role But Won't Discuss Real Estate Background. Aired 7:30-8a ET
Aired July 13, 2016 - 07:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[07:31:00] CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: Donald Trump calling for Supreme Court Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg to resign because she criticized him in several interviews. That is one of several big issues going on in the campaign right now. Let's discuss with a man who knows, Sam Clovis, national co-chairman and chief policy adviser of the Trump campaign. Sam, thanks for being here with us this morning.
SAM CLOVIS, NATIONAL CO-CHAIR AND CHIEF POLICY ADVISER, TRUMP CAMPAIGN: It's always great to see you.
CUOMO: Is that the right move, calling for a Supreme Court Justice to resign?
CLOVIS: Well, I'm not sure it's exactly the direction you go but I think you have to put a placeholder out there that says that hey, what you did was so out of character for Supreme Court Justices that perhaps you can't show the impartiality that you're supposed to show when you're sitting on the bench.
Now we all know that people -- you said earlier, Chris, and rightfully so, that everybody has political bias. It's a dog and pony show when we go through confirmation. We all know that these -- and sometimes we're surprised by the bias that appears on the court, but I think we should not have been surprised at Justice Ginsburg. She has always been a firebrand and even from her confirmation days, and I remember those hearings, going through that process and listening to what she had to say. I thought it was fascinating.
CUOMO: Let me ask you this. The veepstakes --
CLOVIS: Right.
CUOMO: Are you going to help me out here this morning? I can't believe that Donald Trump is ever uncertain about what he wants in any situation. So is this a deal where he knows who he wants and you guys are pushing back against him to want somebody else or you've got mixed minds here?
CLOVIS: I think there may be some -- you know, everybody has their favorites in the veepstakes. You know, I think that -- and everybody, you know, gets the opportunity to make an input and once your input is made you leave it to the boss to decide. And I think that we're all -- we're eagerly anticipating his decision and I'm excited. I think whoever it comes out to be is going to add to the campaign, is going to add to our ticket, and I think this is a fascinating experience.
But I also think that, you know, think about what we're talking about right now. Every outlet, every cable outlet, every news outlet in America is talking about this very issue today, so we're gaining -- earning media from this.
CUOMO: I know.
CLOVIS: This is a really --
CUOMO: You're playing me, Sam. You're playing me.
CLOVIS: Yes, well --
CUOMO: You're playing me on this.
CLOVIS: I'll tell you what -- I'll tell you what, Chris, you know, you got to take a lick. We're a Spartan outfit and we run a Spartancampaign and so we got to get it where we can.
CUOMO: All right, well, it's working, it's working. I hate it, but it's working. I hate that you're stringing me out, but it's working for you. Let me ask you something about something that's decidedly more serious.
CLOVIS: Right.
CUOMO: The situation that's going on in Dallas --
CLOVIS: Right.
CUOMO: -- two beats on that. The first one is Trump says I'm squarely behind the police and you would hope that everybody is squarely behind the police, but that's not the question. The question is, how do you balance the interests of humanity here between securing the respect for your police and also securing the right to the people that they do police?
CLOVIS: Right.
CUOMO: Why would he pick a side in this?
[07:35:00] CLOVIS: I don't think he's necessarily picking a side. I think what he's looking at is offering up support for the people in blue around this country. I think that this is -- it's very much an important part of this. I don't think there's any question.
I know Mr. Trump -- there's no question in his mind that he thinks about these issues that took place in Baton Rouge, in St. Paul as absolutely tragic and uncalled for and unnecessary violence and confrontation. But I think that he has been a strong supporter of the law enforcement people in this country for a long time. I want to add one thing, Chris --
CUOMO: Please.
CLOVIS: -- and I think it's very important here. This whole issue -- I've heard some talk today on your show and other shows this morning, but I think it's very important and this is where we have to start. One, these are local issues. These have to be dealt with at the local community level, and if we spent more time building community I think we would have a much better and much more secure operation in that aspect.
The other part of it is there has to be some form of standardization across our policing in this country. I'm normally not one ever to go that far but I think, because of my own experiences working in Homeland Security and working with law enforcement across this country for the past 15 years, this is one of those things that I think is very important and we probably ought to address it.
CUOMO: Well look, there's no question about it but the local is often affected by the national --
CLOVIS: Right, right.
CUOMO: -- and this is certainly something we see that spreads across the country in a way that it's more than just a local issue, but I take your point to where change starts. But it also is about the tone that he sets as the leader, all right, and that's why I asked you about taking a side.
And I also want to ask you about his claim that he has heard of people calling for moments of silence for the murderer. Where is he getting that, Sam? We are trying to find any proof of that anywhere and if there is no proof, what is to worry about is that it is once again him calling on an image that is a very dangerous image for his own, I guess, perceived sense of momentum in a situation.
It's kind of like the 9/11 celebrations that he believes he saw, you know. Now he says he hears people calling for a moment of silence for a murderer. Have you heard that, Sam?
CLOVIS: Well, I have seen reported that we have seen some very interesting moments dealing with this tragic tragedy and --
CUOMO: But calling for a moment of silence?
CLOVIS: Well, it depends on the context, I guess, Chris. And frankly, I've had my nose buried in other issues. I'm not dodging your question --
CUOMO: Sam, you're dodging it, you're dodging it. You're doing it artfully, but you're dodging it. Context, my eye. Either you've seen --
CLOVIS: Yes, I don't --
CUOMO: -- if they were calling for a moment of silence or you haven't.
CLOVIS: I personally have not. I've seen moments where I've seen -- in some of these demonstrations I've seen there is a reverence paid to the shooter that is really -- it's startling. And I think that that is -- when you have a person who purposefully and with intent murders five police officers that's terrible and I don't think you should celebrate that in any way, shape, or form.
CUOMO: No question about it.
CLOVIS: And we see -- and we have -- unfortunately, we have seen that type of thing take place and I think that that's very much a tragic issue.
CUOMO: I know, and we both know what matters here.
CLOVIS: Yes.
CUOMO: In the worst of situations people often are at their worst, but we demand from our leaders that they be at their best. That's what we need right now. Sam Clovis, thank you for joining me, as always. I hope that I get a quick call from you a little ahead of when the V.P. announcement comes, as well. I wouldn't mind -- I wouldn't mind that, Sam.
CLOVIS: (Laughing) Well, OK, Chris. I'm sure I'll see you next week in Cleveland.
CUOMO: Absolutely. Dinner on me if you give me a little bit of an advance. Appreciate it.
CLOVIS: All right, you bet, bud.
POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: I believe he said "OK, Chris" so you'll have that breaking news right here on NEW DAY. All right, coming up, contradictions emerging in the investigation into Philando Castile's death. His family demanding answers. Now their lawyer, Judge Glenda Hatchett, is talking to us about all it next, here.
[07:39:15] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[07:42:40] HARLOW: This morning, a family demanding answers as the probe into the shooting death of Philando Castile draws major inconsistencies. The new controversy centers around when Castile was given medical aid after he was shot repeatedly by police.
I want to bring in the attorney for the Castile family, Judge Glenda Hatchett. Thank you so much for joining me, and I understand that you are looking at filing, potentially, multiple lawsuits. At this point, what is the family looking for? What is justice in the family's eyes?
GLENDA HATCHETT, THE HATCHETT FIRM, ATTORNEY FOR PHILANDO CASTILE'S FAMILY: Well, I'm going to be dealing with the civil side, Poppy, and thank you very much for having me this morning. But I am going to be watching very carefully what happens in terms of criminal charges being brought, prosecuting the officer involved and, absolutely, looking at what happened, you know. Was there a delay? There's a question about whether he was taken to the closest trauma center. There are a lot of unanswered questions.
And one of the things that you all had seen and know about me is that I will always be very transparent. In what I am able to know and share, I will be very open. The problem is that we are just beginning this investigation and rather than to speculate I always want to be able to come to you with what I know definitively. But there are some concerns. There's concerns about the basis of the police stop, to begin with. The actions --
HARLOW: So, let's begin with that. Let's begin with that --
HATCHETT: OK.
HARLOW: -- and then let's gone on to the aid rendered in the aftermath of it --
HATCHETT: Sure.
HARLOW: -- because the attorney for the officer who shot and killed Philando Castile, Officer Yanez --the attorney, Tom Kelly, says that this had nothing to do with race. He says it had everything to do with the presence of a gun indicating, he's saying, that there was cause, he's arguing, for shooting Mr. Castile. Also, the Associated Press --
HATCHETT: Right.
HARLOW: -- is reporting that that attorney said that the officer believed he, Castile, was a possible match for a robbery suspect, indicating there was more a reason there, saying, to pull him over than a broken taillight. You say to that?
[07:45:00] HATCHETT: And I will say that the audiotape that was released has not been authenticated by the police department so I don't know what was on that tape. And again, I'm going to be very careful not to respond without actually knowing what's on the tape. But let's just say for a moment that that tape is authentic in the sense that the description was a broad nose. That's what's been widely reported. Well, that's a description that fits a lot of African -American men.
And even if he stopped him -- even if he stopped him thinking that he was a suspect and a felon, this is a man who was complying. He had a permit to carry a gun. He had a valid driver's license. He had car insurance. This man had never been charged with a felony and somehow from that, Poppy, we find someone who is dead when he is in the act of complying and reaching for the documentation that the officers asked for. And so you can't have it all ways.
HARLOW: Now, the family --
HATCHETT: Deadly force can --
HARLOW: I just want to also get to the aid rendered because that's really important here, as well. The family says --
HATCHETT: It is very important.
HARLOW: The family says aid wasn't rendered and they told the governor, Mark Dayton, that aid wasn't rendered and the focus was on helping the police officer, not Castile. The neighboring police department, the Roseville Police Department, takes issue with that. Here's what they say.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RICK MATHWIG, CHIEF OF POLICE, ROSEVILLE, MINNESOTA: Our officers didn't know who had shot whom. It was a chaotic affair. There was a lot of things going on that they had to work through. And by 9:10 p.m. -- so, three minutes after they arrived they started to perform CPR on Mr. Castile. So, four Roseville officers using an AED had performed CPR on Mr. Castile until they were relieved by St. Paul fire paramedics because St. Paul fire handles the medical emergencies in the city of Falcon Heights.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARLOW: What can you tell us about that? What they've told you?
MATTHEWS: We're still waiting for the official reports, Poppy, and so until we have those and we thoroughly review those -- but there have been questions. Ms. Castile has raised the question why wasn't he taken to a closer trauma center, was aid sufficiently rendered, and we will be looking at that very, very closely.
HARLOW: And I know that President Obama did call Castile's mother yesterday and you said that --
HATCHETT: He did.
HARLOW: -- they've been holding up exceptionally well given the circumstances.
HATCHETT: Exceptionally well.
HARLOW: But please keep us posted.
HATCHETT: She is a very strong person. I will. She is a very strong person and has been remarkable through every phase of this and has a lot of family support.
HARLOW: Thanks.
HATCHETT: And so, absolutely, I will keep you posted. Thank you.
HARLOW: Thank you very much, Judge Hatchett, representing the Castile family there in Minneapolis. We appreciate it. Thank you -- Chris.
HATCHETT: Thank you.
CUOMO: All right, let's bounce back to the election, Poppy. The Trump University fraud case is back in court. The big question is, is this judge going to release Trump's video deposition? CNN sits down with one of the Trump University'sinstructors.
DREW GRIFFIN, CNN SENIOR INVESTIGATOR CORRESPONDENT: We can't find her broker's license anywhere, OK. And I have no idea what homes you built in Atlanta, Georgia. Did you build homes in Georgia?
JAMES HARRIS, FORMER INSTRUCTOR, TRUMP UNIVERSITY: I'm not prepared to answer those questions today.
CUOMO: That's just the beginning. Hear what else he had to say, next on NEW DAY.
[07:48:25] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[07:52:00] CUOMO: A California judge is going to decide today whether to release Donald Trump's video deposition in the Trump University fraud case. Trump was recorded answering questions about Trump University as part of a lawsuit. Now, it's just one of the suits that alleged, despite promises, Trump University was not a university. The school did not teach Donald Trump's real estate secrets and teachers and mentors were neither real estate experts nor handpicked by Donald Trump.
This morning, you're going to hear from one of those so-called experts. Decide for yourself. CNN senior investigative correspondent, Drew Griffin, invited the man who helped bring in the money for Trump University to chat, and he did. Drew, thank you.
GRIFFIN: Thanks, Chris. James Harris is his name. He claims to be a real expert and for Trump University. He claims he was one of the best salesmen there. The real estate seminar business for Trump raked in an estimated $40 million from people who thought they would be taught Donald Trump's real estate secrets. James Harris is one of the people who sold them on that dream.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
HARRIS: We were bringing in the money.
GRIFFIN: A lot of it.
HARRIS: A lot of money.
GRIFFIN: Were you -- you said you were the top guy? Were you the top guy?
HARRIS: I don't know if I was, I just know I'm really good at what I do.
GRIFFIN: You've said you were the top guy.
HARRIS: OK, so maybe I was the top guy. I don't really know if I was or not. I just know that my numbers were one of the -- from week, to week, to week, my numbers were in the top one or two. GRIFFIN: James Harris' job was to get people to believe they, too, could be as successful at real estate as Donald Trump and to reel them in, sign them up, get them to pay as much as $34,000 on the promise that the next seminar, the next class would teach them all they would need to know.
What do you know about real estate?
HARRIS: Real estate is a very wide, huge business. I got involved in real estate, personally myself, in the 90's.
GRIFFIN: And if you attended a James Harris, Trump University seminar you would hear a lot more about Harris' claims of success and experience in real estate, claims made in this verbatim transcript of a Trump seminar he gave in San Bernardino, California.
Do you remember when you said this? "I'm a former licensed agent broker. At 29, I became the top one percent broker in the country. I build homes in Atlanta, Georgia and Iused to live in Beverly Hills."
HARRIS: Yes, if I said those things they are true. I did live in Beverly Hills and I --
GRIFFIN: We have no record of you ever living in Beverly Hills.
HARRIS: OK, well --
GRIFFIN: We can't find your broker's license anywhere.
HARRIS: OK.
GRIFFIN: And I have no idea what homes you built in Atlanta, Georgia. Did you build homes in Georgia?
HARRIS: I'm not prepared to answer those questions today.
GRIFFIN: This is part of your pitch. Is any of that true?
HARRIS: Again, I'm not going to answer those questions because I haven't seen that.
GRIFFIN: Well, you certainly know what you've done in your life.
HARRIS: Well, I don't know if I -- I don't know where that's coming from. I don't know --
GRIFFIN: This is a transcript submitted in court --
HARRIS: I've never seen it. I don't know what --
GRIFFIN: -- out of the taped --
HARRIS: I don't know if that's a court document.
GRIFFIN: -- presentation that you gave --
HARRIS: I don't know if that's a court document or not.
GRIFFIN: -- in San Bernardino, California.
HARRIS: I've never seen it.
GRIFFIN: It's a court document.
HARRIS: OK.
GRIFFIN: Well, what do you know about real estate?
HARRIS: Again, I'm not prepared to answer those questions today. This is about Trump University.
BOB GUILLO, FORMER STUDENT, TRUMP UNIVERSITY: He kept walking up and down the aisle flashing his Rolex in our faces.
GRIFFIN: Bob Guillo was one of James Harris' students. He is part of a lawsuit trying to get back his $34,000. He says the school was a fraud, so was his teacher.
GUILLO: He bragged that he had dinner with Donald Trump.
GRIFFIN: Did you ever have dinner with him?
HARRIS: I never had dinner with him.
GRIFFIN: Hmm, Bob Guillo was in one of your conferences and you said you'd just had dinner with Donald Trump at one of your speaking engagements.
HARRIS: I don't have any recollection of that.
GRIFFIN: James Harris admits his main job wasn't to teach real estate, it was to sell real estate seminars, always with the goal of hooking his audience into buying more classes.
HARRIS: I was told to promote and sell the Trump University packages and the programs that they were offering, and that's what I did. They had to pay a fee to come to further their training at the next event, so it was -- you know, it went from event, to event, to event.
GRIFFIN: Is that step-by-step, as it's been described? Upsell, by upsell, by upsell?
HARRIS: Kind of, sort of, yes. It's a little upsell from, you know, well, if you pay this amount we're going to teach you this much. If you pay this amount, we're going to go further with you.
GRIFFIN: Here's an email you wrote. "I just spoke to Austin and Irene, the older retired couple who had to pull the $30,000 balance for the gold and she said it's done and should be in Monday, so that will be another $35K. We will easily have another $100K hit by Friday. Yahoo!"
Your associate, Brian, responds, "We've always been a dangerous team, brother man. These peeps don't have a chance against us (smiley face)."
HARRIS: That's called sales.
GRIFFIN: Is that called ripping off an old couple --
HARRIS: Absolutely not.
GRIFFIN: -- named Austin and Irene
HARRIS: Absolutely not.
GRIFFIN: -- of $30,000?
HARRIS: Again, I never saw that email but that is sales. That's a typical sales email between two sales people working on a -- working on a deal. I don't know if those people had the money or not. They could have -- they could have been putting up their last dollar, I don't know. All I know is that --
GRIFFIN: Do you care?
HARRIS: Of course, we care, but I was doing my job. We did our job.
GRIFFIN: Regardless of if they could afford it or not?
HARRIS: Regardless if they could afford it or not. I didn't know if they could afford it or not. That was not my position. That was not my job. Other people did that. I don't know if they could afford it or not. We were told to show them all the ways that they could afford it and could come up with the finances to get into the business, period, end of story.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GRIFFIN: Chris, did Donald Trump even know James Harris? The answer seems to be no. Trump couldn't recall a single name of his live events instructors when he was asked under oath, even the self- described salesman who claims he was Trump's number one.
As for James Harris, he has moved on to a new venture posting easy money work-from-home videos on the internet. And, yes, he is touting his success at Trump University as one of the reasons you can continue to trust him -- Chris.
HARLOW: You had all of us silent watching that entire thing, Drew, and I kept asking myself why did JamesHarris talk? Why did he talk to you?
GRIFFIN: You know, he is all over the internet. He calls himself "Uncle Jim" and he likes to sell this idea that you could make so much money from home. I think the guy just has a huge ego. He didn't understand what was about to be happening in that CNN interview and many of us thought he would just get up and walk out. He stayed there and he answered the questions, sort of.
HARLOW: We just think of the people -- the $35,000 -- that couple, and how many more.
CUOMO: You asked all the right questions, all the rights questions. And often, some of the best answers are the questions that they can't answer or won't answer. Drew Griffin, thank you very much, and we know there's a lot more reporting to be done there so we'll stay with you.
All right, there's a lot of news this morning. Let's get right to it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I have spoken at too many memorials, I've hugged too many families.
DAVID BROWN, POLICE CHIEF, DALLAS POLICE DEPARTMENT: These five men gave their lives.
OBAMA: We ask the police to do too much and we ask too little of ourselves.
GEORGE W. BUSH, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We are grief- stricken, heartbroken, and forever grateful.
HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESUMPTIVE PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: These tragedies tear at our soul.
DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESUMPTIVE REPUBLICAN NOMINEE: I am the law and order candidate.
REP. PAUL RYAN (R), HOUSE SPEAKER: It is either Donald Trump or Hillary Clinton.
SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (I-VT), FORMER PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Hillary Clinton will make an outstanding president.
TRUMP: Bernie Sanders' people, they're going to be voting for Trump.
CLINTON: We are joining forces.
RYAN: I'm just as anxious as the rest of you are on who the V.P. pick is.
TRUMP: I don't know whether he's going to be vice president. Who the hell knows?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANNOUNCER: This is NEW DAY with Chris Cuomo and Alisyn Camerota.
CUOMO: Good morning, welcome to your NEW DAY. It is Wednesday, July 13th, 8:00 in the east. Alisyn is off. Poppy Harlow and I are here for you and we're talking about Dallas this morning.
