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Sen. Susan Collins On The Fence About Trump; Baton Rouge Officers "Targeted And Assassinated"; Nation On Edge After Police Killings; Trump Campaign Manager denies Melania Speech Lifted; Interview with Sen. Shelley Moore Capito. Aired 7:30-8a ET

Aired July 19, 2016 - 07:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:33:00] ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: Not all Republicans are on board with Donald Trump. In fact, Republican Sen. Susan Collins says she is still on the fence about the nominee. So will she vote for the still-presumptive GOP nominee or, ultimately, shun her party and cast a ballot for Hillary Clinton?

Let's bring in CNN special correspondent, Jamie Gangel. She joins us with her sit-down interview with Sen. Collins. Hi, Jamie.

JAMIE GANGEL, CNN SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning. So, we asked her to talk about his temperament and judgment, which she has a lot of concerns about. We asked about whether she might really vote for Hillary Clinton and who she thinks is going to win. But we started by asking her just why she is so troubled with Donald Trump.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SEN. SUSAN COLLINS (R), MAINE: I've been concerned about Donald Trump's comments on everyone from John McCain, who's a true war hero, which was one of his first comments, to his comments on the American judge of Mexican heritage, and that was very troubling to me. So, there have been other comments, as well, that I felt have been demeaning of women, of people with disabilities, and those have caused me to take a step back.

GANGEL: Is there a possibility you won't vote for him?

COLLINS: I haven't decided what I'm going to do in the fall and, fortunately, there's quite a bit of time left for me to decide. It will be interesting to see what Donald Trump says at this convention. Whether he can be more inclusive, whether he can reach out to people and groups whom he has insulted, and I hope that he can and that he will.

There are some things that Donald Trump has said that I completely agree with. For example, his focus on jobs and relieving the stagnation of wages in this country. The fact that there have been some poorly negotiated trade agreements that have processed good manufacturing jobs in my state and others. On those issues I think he's on the right track, but there are other areas where I disagree with him. GANGEL: You were quoted in an interview saying that it was possible -- that you were leaving the door open that you might vote for Hillary Clinton. You then went on to say it's very unlikely, but is the door open that you would vote for Hillary Clinton?

COLLINS: Well look, I have always supported the nominee of my party my entire life and it is extremely unlikely that I would vote for Hillary Clinton.

GANGEL: But?

COLLINS: But I'mnot completely closing the door but it is extremely unlikely. It is more likely that I would decide to write in a candidate or choose another approach. But again, I haven't ruled out voting for Donald Trump. We still have a ways to go and I do believe in redemption, and there is chance that he will make amends, start acting more presidential, and come up with a positive agenda for our country.

GANGEL: We've had a series of incidents where African-American men have been killed by police, most recently in Minnesota and Baton Rouge. Now we've had police officers killed in Dallas and, this week, Baton Rouge. What is your take on the state of race relations and the tension that we're all feeling right now?

COLLINS: It seems like America is on edge and this cycle of violence has to end, and all of us have to unite toward that goal. There's never an excuse for attacking or killing law enforcement officers who put their lives on the line every day. Who leave their homes and their loved ones don't know whether they will return at night.

I was also influenced by a speech that Sen. Tim Scott, one of two African-Americans in the Senate, gave on the Senate floor. He is a conservative Republican and he talked about his experience of being stopped nine times by police in one year when he was driving.

He described being given a hard time by the Capitol police as he tried to enter the chamber, despite the fact that he was wearing his pin signifying that he was a member of Congress. And it was such an eloquent and poignant speech, and truly a call for action.

GANGEL: The last question -- forecast for me. Give me a prediction who's going to win in November?

COLLINS: The prediction I will make is that it will be very close.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CAMEROTA: Very interesting.

GANGEL: She won't say Donald Trump.

CAMEROTA: Right. I mean, she's probably right in terms of her prediction that it will be very close.

GANGEL: Very close. CAMEROTA: But it was fascinating to listen to her. Many Republicans who may have had some misgivings were placated by the pick of Mike Pence as vice president. What does she think?

GANGEL: She doesn't know Mike Pence very well. She said she'd never worked with him. She is very respectful of him, but they are very different on a lot of issues so Mike Pence is not an influence with her vote. And I think what's most important is she's not only an important part of the Republican Party as the senator from Maine, but she represents a vote that Donald Trump has to get, and that's moderate Republican women. And so he has to win over her, but in winning over her, he has to win over a lot of voters like her.

CAMEROTA: Well, thanks so much, Jamie --

GANGEL: Sure.

[07:40:00] CAMEROTA: -- for sharing that interview. It was great to hear it. Thanks so much for being here. Well, another theme that we've been talking a lot about this week is, of course, the racial divide. The country is on edge with the racial tension, and this was before the shooting deaths of three officers in Baton Rouge. So up next, we talk to the former police chief in Baton Rouge about what's being done to prevent another tragedy.

[07:40:25] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:43:15] CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: Investigators in Baton Rouge are searching for a more developed motive and any other people who could have been involved with the ambush that killed three Baton Rouge police officers and injured three others.

Now, one official says there is no doubt that police officers were targeted and assassinated. Let's discuss with former Baton Rouge police chief, Jeff LeDuff. Chief, I'm sorry to have to be discussing this issuebut you know what, it warrants the attention. It didn't happen once, it happened twice. We're not suggesting there's any coordination between them other than what's in the air right now. What is your concern going forward?

JEFF LEDUFF, FORMER BATON ROUGE POLICE CHIEF: Well, I think that we have to really concentrate on the fact that we don't know what all the data is yet. We have to really dig down into this and make sure there is no connection. I think that we want to know everything that we can about each one of those shootings, both Dallas and Baton Rouge, because we have to prepare.

Is this a new phenomenon in our country? Is this -- is this something that we're going to have to face? And we have to get our officers ready for that. Law enforcement works off of muscle memory. Training -- repetitive training. I don't there's training for this right now. We now have to start developing a new model. I think we have to know what everybody's thinking about and how this came about. We really do, Chris.

CUOMO: So we have to do the investigation. You also have to deal with the context of what's going on --

LEDUFF: Yes.

CUOMO: -- in the country right now. I was down there in Baton Rouge. It's a good place, they're good people. I've been there many times. I've seen you come through hard times together and you're faced with them again. It was natural tragedy the last time, manmade this time, and people were scared that their police were targeted. They didn't like it, but they also didn't want to forget what happened the week prior to one of its citizens. How do you balance the two?

[07:45:00] LEDUFF: Well, I think that every life is important, Chris, and I was talking to some people yesterday. I understand that. I've seen everything that can die, die in our city and I'm tired of it. I think everyone's tired of it. And we have to have conversations -- real, holistic conversations to make people understand that it's not about one death or two deaths, it's about all of the deaths and what we can do as a community to make sure that moving forward that we're taking care of our people in a better way.

CUOMO: I hear you. That was supposed to be a message here at the GOP convention last night. Several people tried to touch on it. I want to play part of Sheriff Clark last night of Milwaukee and get your reaction.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DAVID CLARKE, SHERIFF, MILWAUKEE COUNTY, WISCONSIN: Ladies and gentlemen, I would like to make something very clear. Blue lives matter in America. What we witnessed in Ferguson, and Baltimore, and Baton Rouge was a collapse of the social order. So many of the actions of the occupying movement and Black Lives Matter transcends peaceful protest and violates the code of conduct we rely on. I call it anarchy.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CUOMO: Do you believe that Black Lives Matter is the problem here? That they are anarchists?

LEDUFF: You know, no, I don't think we have that -- what we have here is somebody who came from outside of our community. We have somebody who came in, drove 800 miles, came into our community not knowing any of us, and found a site where he saw a few officers congregated. And he took his energy, his emotion, his drama -- whatever it was in his life, he came here to hurt our people. And he did that in an unprecedented way.

So, this is not one of our people. This is not an energy that's borne from without our community. I don't know if anybody in this community knew this man. I don't know if he spoke to anybody. I think he saw police cars, he saw opportunity, and he put those together and he took advantage of it.

CUOMO: What do you think the hope is for getting to a better place? How do we do it? LEDUFF: I think we get up this morning in Baton Rouge and we walk out of our house and we talk to somebody that we've never had a conversation with, that we've never seen before, that looks different than me. As an African-American man in this community I need to walk up to somebody who's maybe white, that's younger, and let's find out what our common ground is.

I think we spend too much time in our communities looking at our differences and what one has versus what one doesn't have. Let's spend time concentrating on our similarities and then we build those blocks. We have to heal in our community.

We've been through a lot. We survived Katrina, we've survived Gustav, we've survived a lot of things that's been pushed at us. And like you said earlier, Chris, they were -- they were natural, this is manmade. But we are a strong, resilient community. I love our people and we, too -- we're going to heal. I promise you this city will heal.

CUOMO: And we're going to watch because we need to see how communities come through situations like this. Chief, thank you for the words and appreciate you being on NEW DAY.

LEDUFF: Thank you, Chris.

CUOMO: All right. So, we're going to take break now. The Melania Trump speech controversy is getting worse. It shouldn't be that big a deal. Melania Trump's not running for anything. She did a good job. It was a good night for the GOP.

But now we're going to talk with a senator who's speaking at the RNC tonight about how the campaign responded, refused to acknowledge what's obvious to everybody, and then kind of compounded it. What does it mean for tonight, next.

[07:49:30] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:53:10] CAMEROTA: The Trump campaign denying any wrongdoing after Melania Trump's speech seems to have lifted parts from Michelle Obama's convention speech back in 2008. So, listen to the two speeches.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MICHELLE OBAMA, FIRST LADY: Barack and I were raised with so many of the same values.

MELANIA TRUMP, WIFE OF DONALD M. TRUMP: From a young age, my parents impressed on me the values --

OBAMA: You work hard for what you want in life.

TRUMP: -- that you work hard for what you want in life.

OBAMA: That your word is your bond. That you do what you say you're going to do.

TRUMP: That your word is your bond and you do what you say, and keep your promise.

OBAMA: That you treat people with dignity and respect, even if you don't know them and even if you don't agree with them.

TRUMP: That you treat people with respect.

OBAMA: Barack and I set out to build lives guided by these values and to pass them on to the next generation.

TRUMP: And we need to pass those lessons on to the many generations to follow.

OBAMA: -- because we want our children and all children in this nation to know --

TRUMP: -- because we want our children in this nation to know -- OBAMA: -- that the only limits and the height of your achievements is

the reach of your dreams and your willingness to work hard for them.

TRUMP: -- that the only limit to your achievements is the strength of your dreams and your willingness to work for them.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMEROTA: So, we want to bring in Sen. Shelley Moore Capito. She is speaking tonight. She represents West Virginia. She is counsel to Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell. Senator, thanks so much for being here.

SEN. SHELLEY MOORE CAPITO (R), WEST VIRGINIA: Thanks for being here. Good morning.

CAMEROTA: Great to have you. So, how do you think that happened? When you listen to that does it seem apparent to you that some of the lines were lifted from Michelle Obama's speech?

[07:55:00] CAPITO: Well, when they're juxtaposed like that I think it raises the question. And I think that Melania did a wonderful job last night delivering what --I don't think anybody can really appreciate how difficult that would be. And her purpose was to bring her husband more human, and family, and her experience as an immigrant, and I think she did that very well.

If, in fact, the staff work in this was shoddy, I think it should be admitted and moved on but I'll leave that to the campaign.

CAMEROTA: Well, that's not what the campaign has done this morning. This story would pass. As you point out, it was -- her speech was well-received inside the hall. People thought she really hit it out of the park.

CAPITO: Yes.

CAMEROTA: Her delivery was great. And they could have fluffed this off and said the speechwriter made a mistake, we should acknowledge it and move on. But that's not what happened. And, in fact, the campaign manager, Paul Manafort, was on our program an hour ago and he denied it, and he wouldn't even acknowledge that a speechwriter might have made a mistake. Let me play that moment on NEW DAY for you.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PAUL MANAFORT, DONALD TRUMP CAMPAIGN CHAIRMAN: There's no cribbing of Michelle Obama's speech. These were common words and values that she cares about her family and things like that. I mean, she was speaking in front of 35 million people last night, she knew that. To think that she would be cribbing Michelle Obama's words is crazy. I mean, it's so -- I mean, this is, once again, an example of when a woman threatens Hillary Clinton, how she seeks out to demean her and take her down. It's not going to work.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMEROTA: He says the suggestion is crazy that that would have been lifted from Michelle Obama's speech, and that this is really about a woman threatening Hillary Clinton. What do you think of that response?

CAPITO: Well, I think you need to look at the crux of what she was look -- what she was talking about, love and family. Those are universal values and I think, you know, she probably wanted to express those. You know, I don't know the details of how the speech created. If there was a mistake there I think we're better served and Donald Trump's better served to just admit it and move on, but we'll see what happens. It's a shame this is now the story after she really did such a beautiful job, I think, last night.

CAMEROTA: And that is the story.

CAPITO: She was talking from her heart.

CAMEROTA: Yes, and the story is bigger than this, and that is how the campaign responds to trouble. When there's trouble, when there's a suggestion of something being sort of out of sorts, not quite right, they deny it and go after Hillary Clinton. Is Hillary Clinton threatened by Melania Trump? I mean, that was his suggestion.

CAPITO: Well, I can't imagine that that's really a part of what Americans are thinking about today. I think they're thinking about I know more about Donald Trump today because I've seen his wife express her journey into this country. How hard she's worked. How she values hard work. How she and her -- how Donald have built a family. I mean, that should be what we're talking about.

CAMEROTA: Tonight, you will be speaking.

CAPITO: Yes.

CAMEROTA: And you will be speaking about work, and hard work. Tell us -- explain to us why Donald Trump's message has so resonated with the people of your state, West Virginia.

CAPITO: Right. Well, West Virginia is made up of a lot of hardworking men and women and we've been pretty much kicked to the curb. Our energy industry, particularly our coal miners, are out of work. Our school systems are over budget. Our teachers are losing their jobs.

Our state's having terrible fiscal problems with no sense that the administration -- the Obama administration even cares, and Sec. Clinton says she's going to continue this. She's going to continue the legacy of President Obama and his economic policies into West Virginians. That is a major, major disappointment.

CAMEROTA: But what has Donald Trump said, specifically, about education, about coal miners?

CAPITO: You know what he says? He says he understands. He says we're going to change it. We're going to do something different. And the way he says it and the fact that he comes from business and not from a 25-year life of public service makes him a more credible candidate, I think, in the eyes of West Virginians. He just blew through the primary and I think we expect him to do that in the general. But it's really about not understanding working people and I think Donald Trump does.

CAMEROTA: And what do you think, specifically, he will do for your state?

CAPITO: Well, I think he's going to create policies that, number one, get government out of the way. The regulatory burden on average Americans is enormous. The regulations that the Obama administration's put forward has been, partially, the cause of why we see such massive unemployment, and dissatisfaction, and pessimism, and despair in my state and across the country.

And so I think that that, in and of itself -- he's created jobs himself. He's grown businesses, he's financed businesses. I think there's a lot of confidence in his ability to get people working again.

CAMEROTA: Senator Capito, thanks so much --

CAPITO: Thank you.

CAMEROTA: -- for being here on NEW DAY.

CAPITO: Yes.

CAMEROTA: We'll be watching with great interest tonight.

CAPITO: Have a good new day.

CAMEROTA: Thank you, you too. I like how you phrased that. Well done. We have much more on the issues surrounding Melania Trump's speech, as well as the response to it, so let's get to that.