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Presidential Candidates Prepare for Final Debate; Possible Debate Strategies Examined; Interview with Congresswoman Ben Ray Lujan of New Mexico. Aired 8-8:30a ET

Aired October 19, 2016 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[08:00:00]

ANNOUNCER: This is NEW DAY with Chris Cuomo and Alisyn Camerota.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: It's NEW DAY, but it's debate night. Good morning, everyone. Welcome to your NEW DAY. The final presidential debate between Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton is now 13 hours away. Can Trump turn around his poll numbers? And how much time will be spent on the claim of a rigged election versus the accusations of unwanted advances against Trump?

CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: Now, there's no question Trump comes in with a lot of baggage, but Clinton has her own challenges. What we've been seeing in these stolen e-mails, she's going to have to answer for some of the questions that are raised. Now you have this undercover video suggesting a Democratic operative may have been inciting violence at Trump rallies. She's going to have to answer for that tonight. This is the final stretch, 20 days until Election Day. We begin our coverage with CNN's Manu Raju live in Vegas. Manu?

MANU RAJU, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hey, Chris. Now poll after poll has Donald Trump losing in key battleground states, including a new poll from Arizona in that traditionally red state, Clinton now up five points according to this survey. So the question is tonight whether or not Donald Trump can reverse his downward slide.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

RAJU: Ahead of tonight's final debate, Donald Trump throwing a Hail Mary, going after Washington and intensifying his unfounded claim that the election is rigged.

TRUMP: They even want to try and rig the election at the polling booths.

RAJU: Even calling on his supporters to monitor polling places.

TRUMP: People are going to be watching on November 8th.

RAJU: And doubling down on his media conspiracy theories.

TRUMP: There's a voter fraud also with the media because say so poison the minds of people by writing false stories.

RAJU: The GOP nominee pledging to shakeup Washington.

TRUMP: It is time to drain the damn swamp.

RAJU: Now promising if elected he will push for term limits for members of Congress, a populist proposal that has yet to succeed.

TRUMP: Decades of political failure and special interest collusion must and will finally come to an end.

RAJU: Trump opting not to respond to President Obama, who ridiculed the billionaire's voter fraud accusations.

BARACK OBAMA, (D) PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: You start whining before the game is even over, if whenever things are going badly for you and you lose you start blaming somebody else, then you don't have what it takes to be in this job.

RAJU: Instead announcing that he's bringing Obama's Kenyan-born half- brother Malik, a Trump supporter, to tonight's debate.

Trump and Hillary Clinton head into tonight's final debate with looming controversies. Undercover videos released Tuesday produced by discredited conservative activist James O'Keefe suggest it was Democratic operatives working for the Clinton campaign instigating violence at some Trump rallies.

HARRY REID, (D-NV) SENATE MINORITY LEADER: It is not hard to get some of these -- to pop off.

RAJU: Both the DNC and the Clinton campaign deny any involvement. And those on the tape deny any of the proposed schemes ever took place.

Meanwhile, Trump is facing accusations from at least nine women who say he made unwanted advances without their consent.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: These are people who are trapped. Put his hands under somebody's skirt on an airplane.

RAJU: Trump rejects those claims, but Senate Democratic leader Harry Reid blasting Trump's behavior.

REID: It is kind of a sickness.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

RAJU: Now, Clinton has been off the trail for several days and actually preparing for this debate, leading the campaign trail for her surrogates. The question is, how does Hillary Clinton address all those allegations and other revelations from the WikiLeaks e-mails? Because, Chris, as we know the Clinton campaign has really just not addressed those issues in meaningful way in the last several days, Chris.

CUOMO: True. So let's see what we'll get from people representing those two different points of view. Manu, thank you very much. We have CNN political commentators for us, former New York congressman Rick Lazio. He ran against Hillary Clinton back in 2000 for the New York Senate. And Symone Sanders, former national press secretary for Bernie Sanders, now a Clinton supporter.

One of the things that will come up tonight regardless of topics, you're going to have character, you're going to have what each candidate has been bringing that is worthy of criticism. Top of the list for Trump will be what Chris Wallace decides to do with the allegations of these women. And certainly what Trump himself has been saying about a rigged election. Not the media being unfair to him. That's one thing. Do you believe that he has a real case to make that the election -- this election, is rigged?

RICK LAZIO, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Only if you think you're going to lose. So I think he needs to pivot off that very quickly. If he wants to make the point that the media has been unfair to him, he has things to cite. He wants to talk about some of what got released today that there looks like there may have been a Clinton operative that was inciting violence at those rallies, that that may be evidence.

[08:05:06] But I would -- if I was him I would say, hey, we found out that during the primary debate, that there was a leak of a question at a town hall meeting. That's an example of a the media --

CUOMO: Doesn't mean the whole race is rigged.

LAZIO: No, but if I'm him, I'm going to --

CUOMO: Touch and go.

LAZIO: Yes, touch and go, and pivot off. And then he needs to stay -- he needs to do two things I think, number, one which is going to be difficult, he needs to juice his supporters enough to get them to the polls because he's got such a bad ground game, and that's a couple of points advantage to Clinton. And number two he needs to come across as being presidential enough so that people who are on the fence will trust him. Those are two very difficult things to manage, in my view.

CUOMO: Problem with B.S., you dig the hole, that's the B.S., now you want to fill it in, it never quite looks the same. Clinton is going to have to deal with that. She'll play to an advantage here about the rigged thing and it being another unsubstantiated claim by Trump. But then you have this video. One of her people, Kramer ran that outfit, he subcontracted out, they worked with the DNC, and they were trying to provoke people or at least training people to do it. That looks dirty.

SYMONE SANDERS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Look, I think we don't necessarily know what exactly Chris Wallace is going to say about this tonight at the debate. But I think Secretary Clinton will be ready. You know, I think Donald Trump is going to come out and he's going to spontaneously combust tonight. And when he looks absolutely crazy and Secretary Clinton just stands there and looks calm, cool, and collected, I think that makes the difference to the voters. CUOMO: What if he doesn't, and Wallace says, what are you people

paying for in this DNC? These are your people, Clinton, and they're doing this shady stuff. How does this not make you current?

SANDERS: Well then I think Secretary Clinton's answer to that is clearly that, look, I have ran a very -- I've run a straight-laced campaign. We're out here talking about the issues that are important to the voters. And the Democratic National Committee, our party has had some issues, but what party hasn't? But we are in the process of expanding our party. We have worked to build up not just, you know, the building in D.C., but all across this country and we're running an expansion program.

Do we have some things we need to clean up all across the board? Which party doesn't. I'm sure the Republican Party should not be the one to cast the first stone there. But I think she has to pivot and bring it right back to the issues. And this is about who can govern. Who on -- when they take office in January, will have a plan, a 100- day plan and far into their administration to keep America on the right track and take it to the next level, and that's Secretary Clinton.

LAZIO: There's two things if I'm Trump I'm pushing on. Number one, the American people don't trust Hillary Clinton, and so I'd be hammering away at that over and over again to reinforce it.

The second thing is, two out of three Americans believe we're on the wrong track. This is seven years into an expansion. The jobs that are being created are poor jobs. They're not keeping up with their rent. And 20 million American families are paying more than 50 percent of their income for housing. You've got a 50 year low in terms of home ownership. You've got more people falling behind, more people in part-time jobs, more people paying higher amounts for their health care premiums as opposed to the -- what was promised to them through the Affordable Care Act.

If I'm Trump, I'm going on a rip about the economy and the people being left behind. I'm positioning myself as the change agent, as somebody who's not going to have scandal after scandal in the White House. This is what you'll get with Hillary --

CUOMO: You lose high ground on that one point, because, you know, you're right the numbers are what they are. We've never seen nominees for the two parties be as low in the personal estimate as they are right now. That's why, you know, your former man Bernie Sanders got so much surprising momentum because he didn't have that trust problem.

LAZIO: Right. He had a message by the way.

CUOMO: That's true.

SANDERS: And I think -- I think --

CUOMO: But your guy has a trust problem. He says you can't trust her, nobody's --

LAZIO: He's not my guy.

CUOMO: Yes, yes, Trump comes up and says you can't trust her.

LAZIO: Right.

CUOMO: He doesn't have any high ground there.

SANDERS: You can't trust Donald Trump either.

CUOMO: You've got nine women out there that he's calling liars, now their corroborating claims, the "People" magazine woman, he said look at her, why would I pick her. He talks about --

LAZIO: But Chris, if I'm Trump I'm not getting into the weeds about that.

CUOMO: When he says you can't trust her --

SANDERS: I don't think Donald Trump can ignore that conversation tonight. And furthermore, for him to make the case that, you know, the housing is bad, the economy is bad, you know I think there are people in this country who identify that they have, you know, gotten ahead a little bit in the last eight years with President Obama. When President Obama came to the White House, America was in a ditch that the Republican party had driven it into.

And we can make the cases that home ownership, that was because these Wall Street executives brought America to the brink of disaster. So I think we can -- there's this two sides to that economy argument that they can have tonight. But I definitely think Donald Trump won't be able to escape the conversation about the allegations of sexual assault, his temperament, and his disparaging comments about women, that is something that's going to be on the table.

[08:10:00] CUOMO: But you think with everything on the line tonight, because this is the last chance, you think he won't be able to keep it together? Now I know, look, I keep getting hit with the stick with people who say when has he held it together, when has he held it together. The first 20 minutes of that last debate he just went straight negative on Clinton, didn't say anything too nuts, you know, about her, just stuck to what the status quo is, and, didn't do anything about himself. But do you think that's a given that he can be like that?

LAZIO: I'm not sure, Chris. I mean, he has disappointed his supporters I think time and time again in terms of staying on message. He's got a message that he can bring the game. He can -- he could do well, he's got the potential to do well tonight. Although I have to say it's the last time people are going to see him. They've got 19 more days of campaigning after that, but this is the last major event that people are going to tune in to see these two candidates. So it's critical for him to really stay on message, in my view, of being a change agent, addressing the economy, talking about what he'll do, and then putting Clinton on the defense in terms of what she's done with foreign policy, are we better off now than we were when she was secretary -- when she came in as secretary of state. The debt, which is one of the subjects now, we've got $10 trillion more of debt than we had when -- than when Barack Obama took office. There are things if he's got the knowledge he can say to go out there and make people comfortable, that he knows the issues, and that he can be the president, and he gets what people are thinking about.

CUOMO: Are you more for Trump or against Clinton?

LAZIO: I -- I am, personally, I am discouraged about this campaign on both sides. I look at both of them, and I don't know how we got here.

CUOMO: Do you know who you're going to vote for?$,

LAZIO: Yes, I'm going to probably write somebody in. That's what I'm going to end up doing. I'm going to vote. I encourage everybody to vote. Don't leave that to somebody else. But in my case, I just have never been a Trump supporter. I've always felt like his lack of civility and his lack of depth was a big problem in terms of being president. And in terms of Hillary, I not only disagree with her on the issues, but I am really appalled by the constant scandals and her fact that she's always seeming like she's on the margins on the ethics.

CUOMO: You're in less worse mode --

LAZIO: Yes.

CUOMO: Any chance you write in Sanders, Sanders?

SANDERS: There is no chance I write in Sanders. I'm voting for Secretary Clinton. And I'm encouraging everybody out there to one, not only go to the polls and vote for president, but vote down ballot because those are the races that really affect folks. And there's Congress folks on the ballot, they're county comptroller people on the ballot, and those are people that affect your direct lives, and we need those people.

LAZIO: And they deserve to have a vote.

CUOMO: Wouldn't it be nice if we had a conversation like this on the stage tonight?

(LAUGHTER)

CUOMO: But we probably won't. Symone, thank you very much. Rick, as always.

All right, so we want you to stay with CNN for live coverage of tonight's debate. It's going to begin at 4:00 p.m. eastern. The debate is tonight, 9:00 p.m. right here on CNN. Alisyn?

CAMEROTA: I don't know if you've mentioned this, but in just hours the final presidential debate will be happening.

(LAUGHTER)

CAMEROTA: What does Hillary Clinton need to say about those hacked e- mails as well as the other issues that are going to come up tonight, like the economy? We talk about her strategy, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:16:40] ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: The debate has not yet begun but it's already tense. According to a "New York Times" report, the families of both Clinton and Trump will not shake hands or cross paths when they enter the debate hall. The report claims that the Clinton campaign wanted to prevent a potential ambush by any of Trump's guests.

Joining us now to discuss this and the issue is Democratic Congressman Ben Ray Lujan. He is the chairman of the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee and a Hillary Clinton supporter.

Congressman, thanks so much for being here.

REP. BEN RAY LUJAN (D), NEW MEXICO: Good morning, Alisyn. Great to be with you this morning.

CAMEROTA: OK. We know a couple of other bits of background stage craft that are happening that I want to bounce off you.

We understand that Reince Priebus has been played by -- wait a second. I know this. In the Trump camp -- hold on a second, Reince Priebus is playing the moderator Chris Wallace. And here's an interesting one, Chris Christie has been playing Hillary Clinton. That's an interesting image.

But what all on this suggests is that Trump is preparing better than he did for say the first one. He is actually doing some mock debates. One of the issues that will come up is the economy. Voters so far in the polls say they trust Donald Trump more than Hillary Clinton on the economy.

What's she going to say tonight about that?

LUJAN: Well, Alisyn, it is a matter of which Donald Trump shows up tonight. The damage really has been done.

But there's going to be a clear contrast on the economy when it comes to Secretary Clinton and Donald Trump. I'm sure Donald Trump's going to be asked and asked again why he has not paid any taxes unlike people all across the country hard-working blue collar folks like the family that I was raised in.

Secretary Clinton has committed her life to making sure that she's able to make a difference for people, for families, for children. And you contrast that to the bigotry and ugliness that we're seeing from Donald Trump and that's going to spill right into the economic --

CAMEROTA: But what about jobs? I mean I hear what you're saying, and you're trying to, you know, cast the past aspersion on Donald Trump which is fair. However what she's going to say about how she's going to create jobs?

LUJAN: Well, Secretary Clinton has leaned in to a strong job creation package starting with a robust investment in infrastructure. You contrast that with what Donald Trump has said, which is he'll put the full faith and credit of the United States on ride out the debt the way that he has with every other business transaction he's been engaged in.

The American people do not want to see that. No one wants to see the full faith and credit of the United States put on the line and that's going to lead to a negative job creation in the red to the positive side we'll see from Secretary Clinton, in addition to the investment with education and job training which is critically needed all across the country.

CAMEROTA: Congressman, let's talk about some of the challenges for her tonight. There have been-mails released that are certainly embarrassing but one of these e-mails came from a FOIA request and it basically shows the State Department, Patrick Kennedy, undersecretary, trying to get the FBI to downgrade a classification of one of Hillary Clinton's e-mails. It was about Benghazi and he wanted it to be declassified instead of classified.

How is she going to approach that tonight? What's she going to say to voters?

LUJAN: Well, Alisyn, I agree with President Barack Obama that there's no credibility associated with that assertion. And number two, let's not forget that these e-mails came from hacked from a foreign state entity namely the Russians that's been identified by the Department of Homeland Security and the FBI.

CAMEROTA: Well, hold on one second, Congressman. This one is from an actual Freedom of Information Act request.

[08:20:02] This isn't part of the WikiLeaks dumb that I'm talking about. This exchange between the FBI and the State Department where the FBI released it as part of their reports, and it showed that the -- it appeared to show, that the State Department was asking for a favor and wanted one of her e-mails involving Benghazi not to be classified.

LUJAN: Well, again, whether we're talking about the e-mails that came from the FOIA request or the other e-mails, President Obama I think said it be. And he said that there was no credibility associated with this assertion and that's what we're seeing with this one.

CAMEROTA: But I mean they -- they -- the state department and the FBI agreed that this one did happen. This one did happen. I mean, they both said there was no quid pro quo, but it did happen that Patrick Kennedy was asking for a reclassification of an e-mail.

LUJAN: Look, again, I think President Obama, who's closer to the intelligence than anything that I've been briefed on said it best that the assertions here clearly show that there's no wrongdoing.

But look, there should never be questions asked associated with these types of things and that's where I am on this. Again, with President Barack Obama's response, I think he provided the clarity that was need associated with the concerns with this particular e-mail.

CAMEROTA: OK, about the WikiLeaks e-mail, there are these -- look, anybody -- if anybody's e-mails were ever to be released they would be embarrassing. These are no different. It does show some of the top Clinton aides around her really struggling with sort of her messaging, particularly about the e-mails, and whether or not she could genuinely apologize. And you hear John Podesta and Neera Tanden, two of her advisers, trying to say why isn't she doing this more forcefully? Why isn't she just saying I'm sorry?

Do you think congressman, tonight, that Hillary Clinton will take one more pass at saying I'm sorry about the e-mails?

LUJAN: Alisyn, clearly what I've seen is pertaining to the emails, Secretary Clinton said she was sorry and that she said she would not do that again. And you compare and contrast with Donald Trump who can't say sorry about anything or take anything back, that speaks to the character of our candidates today, and that's why I'm so supportive of Secretary Clinton.

Look, with the back and forth between staff, they are always going to chat. I know that Secretary Clinton is a good person and a sincere person. And that's why we saw that apology. But again, we should not forget that these came from hacked e-mails, and nobody should be aiding and abetting foreign state entities like the Russians when they're trying to enter American politics and our democracy.

CAMEROTA: Congressman, I want to ask you about a plan that Donald Trump has announced saying that if he were elected president, he would want congressional term limits. He would want all of you limited to six years there on Capitol Hill. You would be out in other words. You were elected -- you were elected in 2009, and you've been there already for seven years. What do you think of that plan of his?

LUJAN: Well, Alisyn, the people's house is exactly that. It's the people's house. And every two years, the American people decide who's going to stay and who's not going to. And I trust the American people more than I trust Donald Trump.

CAMEROTA: All right. Congressman Ben Ray Lujan, we will be looking forward obviously to watching tonight. Thanks so much for helping us preview it.

LUJAN: Thank you.

CAMEROTA: Let's go to Chris.

CUOMO: All right. We've got some new poll numbers and they're painting a not so good picture for Donald Trump on the electoral map. What can he do in the debate to reverse the reality? We get the bottom line next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:27:29] CUOMO: This is it, the third and final presidential debate. The last time you will get t| see Trump and Clinton on equal footing. What needs to happen tonight, how about it affect the conversation?

Let's get the bottom line from CNN politics executive editor, Mark Preston.

So, what could happen tonight that could change the state of play?

MARK PRESTON, CNN POLITICS EXECUTIVE EDITOR: Well, can Donald Trump get right back to the basics, Chris? Can he start talking about the issues? Can he talk about how he's going to govern?

Can he move beyond the allegations of sexual harassment? If Hillary Clinton brings it up, can Donald Trump pivot away from that? Can he talk about the e-mail controversy in a way that is understandable to the American public?

If he's able to do all that, then Donald Trump could have a good night.

At the same time, Hillary Clinton, can she really talk about how her credentials are need at this time? You know, in this state that we're in not only her, in the U.S., but, you know, broadly, globally, you know, can she talk about his temperament and make that hammer home quite frankly, make that hammer home with the voters and, try to, you know, cast him as someone who's unstable?

And quite frankly, can they both explain that they are the right ones to govern at this time, that they can work in Washington and that they can bring change to Washington?

CAMEROTA: Mark, very quickly, here are the stated topics for tonight -- debt and entitlements, immigration, economy, Supreme Court, foreign hot spots, fitness to be president. So, that's what the moderator Chris Wallace wants to talk about. How much time do you think will be talking about -- will spent -- will be spent talking about that versus say controversies?

CUOMO: Well, fitness, yes--

(CROSSTALK)

CAMEROTA: Yes.

PRESTON: Right, I mean, who knows? Quite frankly, Barack Obama's half-brother is going to be in the audience tonight again, something that's bizarre, something that we would have never seen in previous debates. Who knows what's going to happen at the top?

I suspect, though, Donald Trump is going to come out swinging and set the tone. Hillary Clinton if she is, is, is playing this right, a tie for her is a win so you would expect her to be a little bit more reserved. But if she would -- if he really starts battering their, then it could get ugly early.

CUOMO: What's a bigger factor tonight? Nine women, the coordination of the accounts now "People" magazine coming out to kind of take on Donald Trump's assertion that all these women are like? Latest video from Project Veritas and a Democratic operative saying we're trying to bait violence at Trump rallies and the stuff in the WikiLeaks e-mail?

PRESTON: Right, which are terrible stories to Hillary Clinton. The problem with that, Chris, as we know is that Donald Trump seems to be clouding his own message.